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[Darkmakaimura]

So, me and my father took our doxie to the vets for her Bordetella injection today. She gets these once every 6 months or once a year. Anyways, first thing is the weigh his dog and she comes in at 31 pounds. Last she was weighed at 27, which itself is very heavy so I was a bit shocked to find out she gained even four more pounds!

Anyhow, they take her temperature and is shows at 103.6. The vet says that is high and they don't want to give her the injection (which is done through the nose, not an actual shot) until her temp goes down so they ask to wait 10 minutes. The vet comes back, takes the temp again and her temp reads at 104.

Vet says that's obviously not good and asks if we had blood work recently done because she may have diabetes. My dad, being a very stubborn and old, doesn't agree with her. I do mention that the dog was sick with HGE (I posted about this too when she had it here on GAF) and we took it to the vets. She had blood work done twice and the doctor said everything looked okay except that he saw an issue and suspected HGE. This was about 8 months or so ago. I mentioned about the dog likes to drink water a lot and occasionally urinates in the house which she says could also be signs of diabetes.

Anyhow, the vet is getting kind of aggravated and I don't blame her saying if it were her dog, she'd have her checked out. I agree but due to financial reasons, my dad nor I can afford any kind of treatment or checkup. If it were up to me, I would get it checked asap but again, I'm unable to. Anyhow, the doctor asks us to wait another 10 minutes to see once more if her temp will go down.

Ten minutes later, the vet comes back and checks her again and her temperature did drop down to 103 and they decide to go ahead and give her the Bordetella.

I'm kinda worried now about the dog. I love her very much but I really don't have a say in anything as the dog belongs to my dad. I don't doubt the vet's opinion because for one, she's gained weight and she's plain out fat and another, for the "scrap" food she is given. Something that's just on my mind since the world for my dad revolves around the dog. She's king of his palace.

 

[mollipen]

I'm kinda worried now about the dog. I love her very much but I really don't have a say in anything as the dog belongs to my dad. I don't doubt the vet's opinion because for one, she's gained weight and she's plain out fat and another, for the "scrap" food she is given. Something that's just on my mind since the world for my dad revolves around the dog. She's king of his palace.

Obviously it's easy for me to say this, not being in your place, but I'd be arguing as long as as hard as I could with my father until he either pays more attention to her weight or I die trying. If he does care about her as much as you say, then it's even worse for him to ignore potentially serious health issues.

I think you've just got to shove harsh realities in his face until he accepts them. Love isn't over-feeding an animal, feeding it food it shouldn't be having, ignoring the advice of vets, etc. Of course, as I say, I don't know your situation, so I don't know if that would make your dad even less likely to listen to reason. But, at the same time, he might be more willing to listen to you than to a "stranger".

 

[Old Gimlet Eyes]

Definitely need to get some blood work and a urinalysis ran on your dog. I know it can be pricey but try to work out a payment plan or apply for care credit if your vet accepts it. If the dog is diabetic, insulin isn't the cheapest to purchase, but it can go a long way in a small dog depending on dosage. Please work out a way to get this done ASAP.

No more people food either, unless you want to add pancreatitis to the issues you are treating. Strict low fat diet and no treats either. Ideally if diabetic, get a prescription diet like royal canin diabetic formula.

 

[Imbarkus]

Definitely need to get some blood work and a urinalysis ran on your dog. I know it can be pricey but try to work out a payment plan or apply for care credit if your vet accepts it. If the dog is diabetic, insulin isn't the cheapest to purchase, but it can go a long way in a small dog depending on dosage. Please work out a way to get this done ASAP.

My mom's pug just got diagnosed. You can buy the insulin over-the-counter at Wal-Mart, fairly cheaply.

The blood tests are an expense, but you really just do them at first until the dog's blood sugar is balanced. Ignoring this issue will cause further damage to the dog's various systems from blood sugar toxicity, either costing more or ending your father's relationship with this dog due to the dog's premature demise.

Once insulin tolerance has set in, "getting the dog in shape" may not cut it. Insulin tolerance takes years to develop, even in dogs. My first cat developed it, and we were not able to get it under control and he had a massive seizure or stroke.

I hope that little guy gets the care he needs.

 

[Bravocado]

I hope your pup is gonna be okay, OP.

This thread's title immediately made me sad, before even clicking on it.

 

[V_Arnold]

You gotta convince your dad to watch for this issue very carefully. I know its hard: feeding people food to dogs is never a good sign, and usually people who do that are hard to persuade, for one reason or another.

But at the end of the day, dogs are not beings solely born to facilitate our urges and beliefs, so I think your family owes her at least the chance for a healthy life Good luck trying to persuade him to get a blood test.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Obviously it's easy for me to say this, not being in your place, but I'd be arguing as long as as hard as I could with my father until he either pays more attention to her weight or I die trying. If he does care about her as much as you say, then it's even worse for him to ignore potentially serious health issues.

I think you've just got to shove harsh realities in his face until he accepts them. Love isn't over-feeding an animal, feeding it food it shouldn't be having, ignoring the advice of vets, etc. Of course, as I say, I don't know your situation, so I don't know if that would make your dad even less likely to listen to reason. But, at the same time, he might be more willing to listen to you than to a "stranger".

I agree with you and pretty much everyone else 100%, but my dad's difficult to talk to and it ends up in argument if I do. He's an old, stubborn, conservative and it's hard to get him to listen to anything reasonable. I definitely brought up about feeding the dog like he does with people food and he snapped at me. I'm even surprised the vet did not mention the weight because they usually do and that was when she was 27lbs. I nearly dropped when I heard she's now 31lbs. That is ridiculous.

 

[bender]

Blood work should not be that expensive. Don't be afraid to shop around between different vets. If you trust your vet and are worried, you should scrounge up the money to get the tests done.

That said, I'm fairly weary of most vets. Getting someone to do blood tests is an easy source of income as is over vaccinating our pets. Speaking of that, how often do you board or have your pup in daycare?

Regarding weight: How old is she? Have you tried controlling her weight since you first noticed she was overweight? What do you feed? How much do you feed? What are you doing for exercise?

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Blood work should not be that expensive. Don't be afraid to shop around between different vets. If you trust your vet and are worried, you should scrounge up the money to get the tests done.

How often do you board or have your pup in daycare? How old is she? Have you tried controlling her weight since you first noticed she was overweight? What do you feed? How much do you feed? What are you doing for exercise?

She's never been boarded or in daycare. My dad is retired. She is with him all the time. She's not even left alone in the house. If he has to go somewhere and I'm not around or I have to go with my dad, the dog comes with him/us. The only time she was never with either him or me was when we had to leave her overnight at the vets for IV treatment for the HGE. She will be 5 years old on April 6th.

Since her HGE, my dad took the doctor's recommendation and gave her Pro Plan weight management food.

 

[Lamiafusion]

Your thread is super relevant to me OP. My dog got into a pack of sugar free gum the other week and took her to the vet for blood work twice ($200 each time.) They found a fever and between that and the blood work they saw that she had pancreatitis which can be deadly for dogs if severe. Because of the pancreatiris, my dog will also have diabetes mellitus. She would probably be dead if I didn't happen to take her in.

That was just my experience recently...I don't know about your dog.

 

[bender]

She's never been boarded or in daycare. My dad is retired. She is with him all the time. She's not even left alone in the house. If he has to go somewhere and I'm not around or I have to go with my dad, the dog comes with him/us. The only time she was never with either him or me was when we had to leave her overnight at the vets for IV treatment for the HGE. She will be 5 years old on April 6th.

Why are they recommending Bordetella then?

Since her HGE, my dad took the doctor's recommendation and gave her Pro Plan weight management food.

I know you don't want to spend more money but you might want to check out some higher end products. On the plus side, you can feed your pet smaller portions and they'll get same nutritional benefits as larger portions of the stuff you are currently feeding. Don't let your vet recommend food. They are generally given a one hour course from the manufacturer of the products they recommend. Stuff from Purina or Hills just aren't good foods. She's young so getting her weight under control shouldn't be that difficult and will give her a much better life as a senior.

 

[DonMigs85]

you should probably tell your dad to stop giving her human food. She might also need a special prescription diet.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Why are they recommending Bordetella then?

That's normal. She gets that either once every 6 months or once every year. In fact, never had a problem about the temperature until today.

I know you don't want to spend more money but you might want to check out some higher end products. On the plus side, you can feed your pet smaller portions and they'll get same nutritional benefits as larger portions of the stuff you are currently feeding. Don't let your vet recommend food. They are generally given a one hour course from the manufacturer of the products they recommend.

My dad can barely afford the food she has now, though. That's why he's very hesitant to even do the blood work. Anything you can recommend that would be as cheap or even cheaper than Pro Plan?

you should probably tell your dad to stop giving her human food. She might also need a special prescription diet.

I have. He doesn't listen and like I mentioned in my post earlier, he snapped at me.

 

[bender]

That's normal. She gets that either once every 6 months or once every year. In fact, never had a problem about the temperature until today.

If you aren't boarding or doing doggie day care, I'd break the habit of giving her that vaccination. Does your groomer require it? It used to prevent kennel cough.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

If you aren't boarding or doing doggie day care, I'd break the habit of giving her that vaccination. Does your groomer require it? It used to prevent kennel cough.

I don't even know what it's for but no, it's not any groomer. The Spay and Neuter Clinic sends us a postcard when she needs it.

Edit: Thanks for the heads up on the Bordetella. I'm doing some Googefu and from what I can find, it seems like the dog really doesn't need this. I should bring it up to the vet next time but I'm sure they'll make some kind of excuse just so they can make their $12 for the day. BTW, the Bordetella is given intranasal. It's not a shot that's actually injected in her.

 

[DonMigs85]

If the dog dies an early death due to diabetes, your dad will learn the hard way.
Do you have other family members or friends who can talk sense into him?

 

[lm04]

even though diabetes is more common in fat dogs, they're supposed to lose weight with this condition, not getting fatter.
also the high temperature is very uncommon in early stage diabetes

edit: do you know someone with diabetes? you could borrow a glucometer and measure it yourself

 

[Darkmakaimura]

even though diabetes is more common in fat dogs, they're supposed to lose weight with this condition, not getting fatter.
also the high temperature is very uncommon in early stage diabetes

Oh this is awesome if true.

But why would her temperature be so high and then raise like that? The vet said normal temperature is around 99 or 100 for a dog.

edit: do you know someone with diabetes? you could borrow a glucometer and measure it yourself

Yes, but they don't live in town.

 

[bender]

Injecting into the nose is normal, I've don't think I've seen it administered a different way. I'm not a vet but I do firmly believe we over vaccinate our pets. Yearly and semi annual vaccinations are a really easy revenue stream for your clinic as they can send can auto-send you those mailers saying xyz is due. Before your next vaccination regiment, ask for them to perform a titer test.

If the dog dies an early death due to diabetes, your dad will learn the hard way.
Do you have other family members or friends who can talk sense into him?

Harsh but good advice. What happens when the dog has an emergency? Anything that happens after hours that requires immediate attention can eclipse a thousand dollars easily.

 

[DVMGamer]

I don't even know what it's for but no, it's not any groomer. The Spay and Neuter Clinic sends us a postcard when she needs it.

Edit: Thanks for the heads up on the Bordetella. I'm doing some Googefu and from what I can find, it seems like the dog really doesn't need this. I should bring it up to the vet next time but I'm sure they'll make some kind of excuse just so they can make their $12 for the day. BTW, the Bordetella is given intranasal. It's not a shot that's actually injected in her.

There is also a Bordetella injectable vaccine (and even an oral vaccine now). I only recommend it to clients that take their dogs to kennels/groomers/day care.

Diabetes is quite a stretch from just the signs listed; other things could be going on as well. If money is an issue, maybe talk with your vet about prioritizing tests. Starting with a urinalysis can rule out an infection, see if there is glucose in the urine, and see how well the kidneys are concentrating urine.

 

[lm04]

But why would her temperature be so high and then raise like that? The vet said normal temperature is around 99 or 100 for a dog.

yeah, 104 is really high. i've seen dogs with high temp just because they're stressed, but never that high
but that is another thing that you can easily check at home

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Harsh but good advice. What happens when the dog has an emergency? Anything that happens after hours that requires immediate attention can eclipse a thousand dollars easily.

That kind of happened already when she had the HGE. She was almost brought to a 24 hour vet but when I spoke to a vet, they said we could wait until morning and when 6am hit, the dog was being taken to the vet. Right now, she's very healthy and is actually barking at something (a neighbor, probably) as I type this. When she had the HGE, she was very, depressingly sick.

 

[Imbarkus]

How did things turn out for the pup and your dad?

 

[Darkmakaimura]

How did things turn out for the pup and your dad?

Can't afford the checkup but so far, she seems pretty healthy.

 

[Imbarkus]

Can't afford the checkup but so far, she seems pretty healthy.

Good to hear.

 

[marrec]

Can't afford the checkup but so far, she seems pretty healthy.

Has she lost any weight at all? 31lbs is enormous for a standard Doxie as I'm sure you know.

 

[Farslain]

Sounds like it could be canine diabetes.

Drinking too much, urinating too much, being lethargic are all earlier symptoms. Eating too much despite weight loss and bad breath are more advanced symptoms.

Canine diabetes is so treatable if the owner wants to treat it, in your fathers case unfortunately it sounds like the dog is doomed. Arguing with a vet, someone who deals with this stuff day in day out doesn't leave much hope that anyone can intelligently get through.

Like most serious diseases the faster you start treatment the better the chances of recovery.

My 15 year old Corgi died of it last year after having been diagnosed with it at 13. Over those 2 years we went from vet treatment to self treatment and became literal experts on diets and insulin treatments.

The whole process has to start with a good vet and it can be expensive.

You can buy a blood glucose meter for peanuts, you can buy insulin for peanuts, you can exercise a diabetic dog gently to remove excess weight and you can adjust and control it's diet to make the animal have a healthy few more years.

Sadly without immediate care it seems most un diagnosed dogs are lucky to make it a month or two, especially if they are overweight, not being exercised and still being fed like they are someone's baby being given shit from dinner plates every time the owner sees them.

I wish the dog the very best of luck.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

If I had the money, I wouldn't hesitate.