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[atyourservice]

I think a lot of this forum needs to consider that the number of protagonists with those features is only going to increase as time goes on.

If the sex or ethnicity of these characters doesn't matter, then at what point will it stop being an issue when they aren't the "default"

At what point will it just be normal to have these characters leading games, in your mind?

 

[Danjin44]

I have zero problem playing female character or black character, heck I dont even mind playing as a gay character.

All I want is to like the design and its well written....thats all.

 

[DeVeAn]

What's the default? Let me guess "straight white guy"

 

[LectureMaster]

People don't have problem with Franklin, Lee Everett, Marcus, CJ, Colt, Nadine, or Lara, Jill, Faith, and Jesse. The list goes on.

Genius, in the end of the day, what people want are well designed and written characters, regardless gender or race.

It is you guys always want to play the sex race card to defend those low effort DEI forced contents.

 

[Interfectum]

What's the default? Let me guess "straight white guy"

The default should be what the target audience is.

 

[RagnarokIV]

Use pattern recognition.

Female isn’t a problem, and neither is not being white.

 

[Bloody Crow of Cainhurst]

When the sun burns out

 

[Zacfoldor]

 

[GHG]

I think a lot of this forum needs to consider that the number of protagonists with those features is only going to increase as time goes on.

And if it's going to increase then you (and the creators) also need to consider the fact that people will discuss these things as they see fit.

 

[Gaiff]

Lara Croft. No complaint.

Joanna Dark. No complaint.

Jade from Beyond Good and Evil. No complaint.

2B. No complaint.

Alyx Vance. No complaint.

CJ. No complaint.

Emmet Graves from Starhawk. No complaint.

Colt from Deathloop. No complaint.

James Heller from Prototype 2. No complaint.

Bayek. No complaint.

Even Aloy was initially well-received.

Need me to go on, OP?

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

Blame all the activist devs and DEI consulting companies in their echo chambers for making Strong BIPOC Female the DEI poster child.

Don’t blame gamers for noticing patterns and getting tired of the same shit over and over.

 

[MetalFreak]

When they stop giving that snarky vibe and that kinda of “fuck all men” attitude.
And when they stop looking like a trans version of Vin Diesel.

 

[diffusionx]

game industry, especially western devs, burned through their goodwill and benefit of the doubt long ago

 

[RagnarokIV]

Lara Croft. No complaint.

Joanna Dark. No complaint.

Jade from Beyond Good and Evil. No complaint.

2B. No complaint.

Alyx Vance. No complaint.

CJ. No complaint.

Emmet Graves from Starhawk. No complaint.

Colt from Deathloop. No complaint.

James Heller from Prototype 2. No complaint.

Bayek. No complaint.

Even Aloy was initially well-received.

Need me to go on, OP?

The ginger from Star Wabs Jedi Fallen Order. No complaint.

 

[March Climber]

At what point will it just be normal to have these characters leading games, in your mind?

This question will never be answered earnestly so the thread is pointless.

Hell, some people in the other thread were trying to use the ‘they changed her face’ BS because they were too afraid to personally call her ugly or unattractive.

 

[Gamer_By_Proxy]

It's not the sex or skin color, it's the preaching, "trans", and other real world agenda getting inserted in games.
There's nuance that no one ever discusses in good faith.

 

[DragoonKain]

I never immediately write a game off. That's dumb. The content of what's in the game and how good it is, is what matters.

People can do what they want, but some people need to really go outside and find things more important to care about than culture wars.

 

[owandeseis]

Wasn't The Witcher 4 trailer the one with the most likes from TGA?

 

[Strider7]

We don’t care what race or gender the character is. Just make good characters.

 

[Cert.in.Death]

Is she hot?
Is he hot?
Is is he/she/they/xyrs hot?

 

[Gaiff]

Hell, I'll go a step further and remind everyone that GTA San Andreas was the best selling GTA until GTA V. It sold more than IV that followed it and the others that preceded, all starring white dudes. CJ is one of the most liked protagonists in the series and he's an African-American gangbanger. Clearly, being black might not be the problem, OP.

 

[Crayon]

This all comes down to weather jordan has character flaws and growth during the story. We don't know that yet but nd can clearly do it if they want.

 

[Ellery]

Most people are intelligent enough to tell when it is forced and when it isn't. They just feel it and usually those games that heavily force it fail miserably.

On top of that you have a small but very loud group that has interests beyond being genuine and would rather watch some turmoil. Some people concern trolling. Happens everywhere.

Like we all can tell AC Shadows is super forced and other studios like Naughty Dog create original characters in fictional universes with their own identity and not just a token to signal boost.

And also there are just always haters. Believe it or not I do know a guy who hates strawberries. Can you imagine that

 

[TGO]

I think a lot of this forum needs to consider that the number of protagonists with those features is only going to increase as time goes on.

Why

 

[Firestartah]

I think a lot of this forum needs to consider that the number of protagonists with those features is only going to increase as time goes on.

Eh, not really. You can only fool capitalism so much, until your studio gets closed (Volition with Saints Row reboot, Concord studio).

What you say would make sense if these initiatives would lead to more gamer women or people of color joining gaming. But as it has been said multiple times, the current core games industry is still living on the back of white (and asian) males. Everything else is a super minority, especially if you dont count shit like sports games where diversity doesnt even matter since they recreate the real players. (i mean ppl who buy just fifa or madden yearly)

The AAA core games market is still carried on the backs of hetero white (and asian) males and it will remain like this since gen Z and even worse, gen alpha are not into these types of games and are happy to either play fortnite/roblox or emulate retro games, they just dont buy 70$ games.

 

[llien]

The default should be what the target audience is.

Or rather, what the target audience wants.

 

[Guilty_AI]

Once DEI is gone and there isn't a corporate culture of virtual signaling anymore

 

[Interfectum]

Even big series like Star Wars and other franchises have fallen into the trap of leaning too heavily into West Coast liberal ideals. In their effort to avoid casting lead roles that reflect their core audience, they’ve instead pushed minorities to the forefront. While having a diverse cast and trying to appeal to broader demographics isn’t inherently a bad thing, it’s clear that many studios have overcorrected and are now facing backlash. When you neglect or alienate your core audience, these are the consequences you face.

 

[MarV0]

Maybe after 10 years of zero Wokeness.

 

[Aces High]

Zoe Saldana's career is the perfect example how to do it the right way.

Her movies are super succesful.

 

[Omnipunctual Godot]

That's really the problem with the industry making racial and sexual identities "trendy," isn't it? When people get tired of the trend, what happens to the people?

 

[rodrigolfp]

The default should be what the target audience is.

Is not the target audience everyone in the planet (maybe outside the planet too, who knows) that wants to play the game?? Or there are people forbidden to play the game??

 

[analog_future]

I don't do that now

 

[bender]

There was a lot of backlash about CJ when he was revealed.

 

[bundylove]

Buddy this trend is already going away world wide unless you live in a liberal stronghold .

 

[MagiusNecros]

Maybe make well written characters that don't have a physiological trait or sexual orientation as their entire personality?

 

[Dacvak]

I miss the days where everyone just talked about the intricacies of gaming on this forum.

NeoGAF used to be filled with industry veterans, insider discussion, and quality comprehensive debate. And it was all centered around the fundamentals of gaming, like mechanics/design/innovation/etc.

While I believe you can still find quality discussions like that (which is why I’m still here), it’s quite obvious that the overall tone of the forum has shifted towards one of thinly-veiled political views. (And hey, that’s also just kind of the internet at large, so I don’t blame GAF for that.)

But it’s a shame, because so many gaming vets, journos, and icons have jumped ship. Even folks like Wario64 have gone. And it’s understandable as to why, there’s just so much political pollution that it’s tough to extract the same level of quality discussions used to have here.

I feel like the old man yelling at the clouds, but this forum has drastically changed. And despite the best efforts of EviLore (banning outright political discussion was a great move), things still seem to always circle back to thinly-veiled political discussion.

I still love this place, and I hold onto hope that it can return to a board of pure gaming discussion someday. But posts like this show how the focus has truly shifted. It’s a shame, in my opinion.

 

[Banjo64]

There will always be new start ups who are hungry and want to make exceptional games. Some of them will be bought out by the corporations that push this piss. But new ones will always take their place.

 

[ssringo]

The "well" has been poisoned and it'll probably be a while before the thought doesn't at least spring to mind.

Personally it comes down to overall appeal which isn't any one thing but instead is a combination of many things and can be difficult to put into words beyond "I just know". Something like Dustborn was immediately incredibly unappealing in nearly every way but Timespinners was quite the opposite despite starring a female and the supporting cast being a hamfisted checklist of the alphabet (and yes, I'm looking forward to the sequel).

/shrug

 

[SF Kosmo]

Less than 10% of games have a discrete female protagonist. While it's more than in the past, it's telling that people react so strongly to any representation that they see as heterodox.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Once we get the bald, straight male over-correction I guess. I bet Gears Day One brings in a whole slew of this stuff.

Less than 10% of games have a discrete female protagonist. While it's more than in the past, it's telling that people react so strongly to any representation that they see as heterodox.

Feels like every AAA game is a girl boss game now, especially in Sony's first party. Returnal, Horizon, The Last of Us Part 2, R&C Rift Apart, Ghost of Yotei and now Intergalactic. It's a bit extreme now.

 

[TexMex]

It is extremely easy for any rational adult to parse out what is a disingenuous reaction to the world we live in and what is organic story telling. As pointed out in this thread, there are countless examples of female/minority led games that are beloved. Pandering is obnoxious and gross and should be called out.

 

[Interfectum]

Is not the target audience everyone in the planet (maybe outside the planet too, who knows) that wants to play the game?? Or there are people forbidden to play the game??

If your primary audience consists mostly of straight white males, making lesbian female leads the focus of your $200 million game might not be the smartest move.

 

[Bernoulli]

The default should be what the target audience is.

How is the target audience going to play this now?

 

[cormack12]

It is normal and plenty of games have diverse leads that people like. You need to ask first why these aren't considered good enough to fulfil the criteria.

Gaiff has listed a few and there are so many more edge characters too that people like - for instance Merrin. Faith from Mirrors Edge, Julianna from Death Loop, Aveline from AC. Amicia from Plague Tale. Senua from Hellblade. There is a lot of diversity just in that list.

The real reason they don't count? Because they are in good shape, wear nice fitting clothes that clearly show they are women and they are overall not ugly.

The second point is that if a studio starts droning on about diversity, nine times out of ten it will be surface level appalling. Look we made a fat chick AND she is black!!! We did Diversity.

One of the most hotly anticipated games has you playing as a black lead in Blade, and I am going to be Wesley fucking Snipes when I play it. Sifu was widely acclaimed playing as a Japanese man or woman. Franklin is largely regarded as the best character in GTA V. Lincoln in Mafia III and who can forget the Cole Train or Barrett?

 

[rodrigolfp]

If your primary audience consists mostly of straight white males, making lesbian female leads the focus of your $200 million game might not be the smartest move.

And how I define what is the taste in gaming of straight white males??

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Lara Croft. No complaint.

Joanna Dark. No complaint.

Jade from Beyond Good and Evil. No complaint.

2B. No complaint.

Alyx Vance. No complaint.

CJ. No complaint.

Emmet Graves from Starhawk. No complaint.

Colt from Deathloop. No complaint.

James Heller from Prototype 2. No complaint.

Bayek. No complaint.

Even Aloy was initially well-received.

Need me to go on, OP?

My favorite part about these examples is that the pro DEI gamers will read it...have a blank lifeless expression on their face...and then two minute later repeat the same "You just don't like any women in games" comment. They are never able to return this volley.

 

[vpance]

It won't become normalized, because the market will eventually grow enough balls to vote with their wallets like they're beginning to. The death of Ubisoft and failures of recent woke games are representative of the first canaries in the coal mine to die.

I believe the pendulum has swung far enough left now that we're seeing the faint beginnings of the swing back. Remember this crazy train actually began in 2012.

 

[RoboFu]

When they do not look like the poster child for lunacy?

right now its a case of " get bit by dog enough and you start fearing every dog "

 

[Dacvak]

Never in my whole life have I prejudged an entire game based off of what a character looks like. And that has certainly never affected my overall enjoyment of a game.

It’s pathetic to me how many people here will see a screenshot of one character and immediately make a judgment on an entire game. Unless I’m playing DOA Beach Volleyball, it has literally never mattered to me even once.