Support NeoGAF

[Hitler Stole My Potato]

He talks about the split from Nintendo which basically boiled down to the two companies having different philosophies. SK wants to make "bigger, deeper, more meaningful games" while Nintendo is intent on focusing on "smaller and simpler" titles. Also it looks like their next game will be called Engagement Theory.

LINK

 

[FeedMeAStrayCat]

Engagement Theory? That's a terrible name, really.

 

[Krowley]

and if you read between the lines, i think he's basicly saying they wanted more cash to expand their team (to make bigger games, or to be able to release their games faster) and nintendo wouldn't go for it.. he talks about how they have doubled their team size now that they are with sega, and still sounds really positive about nintendo... he says that what systems they put their next gen game on is up to sega and that it's basicly wide open at the moment.

 

[duckroll]

He talks about the split from Nintendo which basically boiled down to the two companies having different philosophies. SK wants to make "bigger, deeper, more meaningful games" while Nintendo is intent on focusing on "smaller and simpler" titles. Also it looks like their next game will be called Engagement Theory.

LINK

Oh man what a lameass backpeddling loser dumbass he is. Didn't he keep gushing over and over when they joined Nintendo how they have the "same philosophies" when it comes to games and how Miyamoto and him understand each other "perfectly" and so on and so forth? Bleh, SK = history.

 

[Kobun Heat]

Denis has often talked about engagement theory as something they keep in mind when they create games (see Power-Up, page something or another in the back). So that was probably what he was saying. I'm in no mood to download a video right now though, so I couldn't tell you.

 

[Hitler Stole My Potato]

Engagement Theory? That's a terrible name, really.

I honestly don't know how that is any worse than any other game title.

 

[Hitler Stole My Potato]

Denis has often talked about engagement theory as something they keep in mind when they create games (see Power-Up, page something or another in the back). So that was probably what he was saying. I'm in no mood to download a video right now though, so I couldn't tell you.

Well maybe, but in the context of the interview it sounded like he was talking about it as their next game.

 

[krypt0nian]

Fat Denis was way better.

Bring back Fat Denis, SEGA you fucks!!!

 

[Firest0rm]

The reason SK broke off is likely like Krowley said, they wouldn't get more funding and thats because their games didnt sell so Nintendo didn't see a great investment.

 

[Porridge]

The reason SK broke off is likely like Krowley said, they wouldn't get more funding and thats because their games didnt sell so Nintendo didn't see a great investment.

fire's got it right, although i'm curious about how many copies of Twin Snakes they sold

 

[Dan]

SK wants to make "bigger, deeper, more meaningful games"

For their sake I sure hope this means something beyond the superficial, pointless and irrelevant insanity effects from Eternal Darkness. My god, for such a touted feature it could not have affected gameplay less.

 

[FeedMeAStrayCat]

I honestly don't know how that is any worse than any other game title.

You're right, most game titles aren't really that great. But this "Engagement Theory" makes it sound like it's some sort of game where the player tries to figure out why and how couples get engaged or something retarded like that.

Examples of good names that I like:
Eternal Darkness
Perfect Dark

Ok, those are the only two I can think of at this very moment, and they both have "dark.." in it. Strange. :lol

 

[FeedMeAStrayCat]

For their sake I sure hope this means something beyond the superficial, pointless and irrelevant insanity effects from Eternal Darkness. My god, for such a touted feature it could not have affected gameplay less.

They may not have affected gameplay a whole lot, but I thought they rocked. Erasing the memory card was classic.. :lol

 

[Rocket Punch]

Come one people grow brain.. engagement theory... He's obviously talking about conceptualizing games. It's a methodology for making games, not an ACTUAL GAME.

 

[tetsuoxb]

My opinion of Denis Dyack is that he should teach a college course on game theory and leave the actual production to those who have more than just a theoretical understanding.

 

[Gahiggidy]

Now it makes since. Why I had to kill the same three demons in Eternal Darkness over, and over, and over again. Not enough artists!

 

[Mr Gump]

Oh man what a lameass backpeddling loser dumbass he is. Didn't he keep gushing over and over when they joined Nintendo how they have the "same philosophies" when it comes to games and how Miyamoto and him understand each other "perfectly" and so on and so forth? Bleh, SK = history.

haha werd.

ED was booooooooooooooooooooring.

 

[krypt0nian]

Come one people grow brain.. engagement theory... He's obviously talking about conceptualizing games. It's a methodology for making games, not an ACTUAL GAME.

Did you watch the video?

 

[Hitler Stole My Potato]

Come one people grow brain.. engagement theory... He's obviously talking about conceptualizing games. It's a methodology for making games, not an ACTUAL GAME.

Yes. People grow brain. Brain good.

Seriously though, it isn't that obvious when watching the video.


"...in just talking to us over the last day and a half you'll see that we have this sort of grand approach to making large games, very heavily content driven games. Where when you look at Engagement Theory right away we're combining five elements of this gaming enviornment that's trying to create something that's not a smaller and simpler approach."


I mean I suppose if you're intimately familiar with Dyack speak it may be apparent that Engagement Theory isn't a game, but to an outside observer like myself it sure as hell sounded like a title slip when I heard it.

 

[Myoclonic Jerk]

 

[midnightguy]

DD: for next generation with Sega, Sega is looking at all of next-generation. whatever makes sense, we're gonna do.



SEGA !!!!!!

 

[Myoclonic Jerk]

I like Dennis' ideas, and now I only like AV in SEGA

so they can combine and give us one hell of a racing game with "bigger, deeper" story

 

[Kicko]

and if you read between the lines, i think he's basicly saying they wanted more cash to expand their team (to make bigger games, or to be able to release their games faster) and nintendo wouldn't go for it...

Ding Ding Ding! We have a winner!

 

[fse]

SK just wants $$$.

 

[Particle Physicist]

he says that what systems they put their next gen game on is up to sega and that it's basicly wide open at the moment.

i guess that means they definitely wont be on nintendos console. sega only put sonic games and some other random junk on the gc.. im sure the trend will continue with the revolution.

 

[mj1108]

he says that what systems they put their next gen game on is up to sega and that it's basicly wide open at the moment.

That settles it then: XBox 360 exclusive bomba.

 

[Gaia Theory]

i guess that means they definitely wont be on nintendos console. sega only put sonic games and some other random junk on the gc.. im sure the trend will continue with the revolution.

Yes - random like that million selling Monkey Ball franchise.

Random like the fan favorite RPG Skies of Arcadia.

Random like F-Zero.

Don't be so quick to dismiss Sonic. Everyone seemed to want Sonic Mega Collection.

 

[Scrow]

this interview was a waste of time and just covered shit we've already heard a thousand times.

 

[metsallica]

Yup. I'm real glad Matt flew to Canada to bring us back such a hard-hitting journalistic expose! Five whole minutes of horribly edited amateurish video, complete with random inopportune zooms! FANTASTIC! But hey, at least there were BUBBLES! That's money well spent, SK.

For those who can't get the video, Denis says this:

Though no official reason was given for the decision, IGNcube speculates that the philosophies of the two companies did not mesh. Silicon Knights has always been a very content-driven studio with strong beliefs in the elements of game creation including story, artistry, sound, and technology. Nintendo has recently downplayed the role of technology in game creation and has been known to de-emphasize story, graphics and sound in favor of classic play mechanics.

in front of a green, Silicon Knights emblem floating in a "fish tank."

For Matt's sake I hope rest of the stuff from the visit is a bit meatier... but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Rocket Punch]

Hmm... did you ever, by any chance, write an angry email to GA about their C- Ninja Gaiden review? Just a thought.

Idot.

Why should I? I don't own an xbox... It was just so obvious, I'm mean, come on. You only need some basic listening skills to understand what he's trying to say. Not to say he (Denis) is in any way fluent in public speaking. I don't really care either way.

 

[Solid]

OMGWTF!!!

Downloading now

 

[Solid]

Pretty good intertview, I still like to hear what their next project is though. Guess I'll have to wait till Monday or whatever

Pretty cool stuff behind Denis in the video. And good choice to have ED music in the background.

 

[Hero]

Why the hell should Nintendo have footed the bill for a very technological (i.e. expensive) game when between two different releases couldn't even hit a million? Especially when one of the games is using the Metal Gear Solid name. If they couldn't sell that, what makes anyone believe they can make a new, original game and have it sell well?

 

[Solid]

? Kobun spill the beans!

 

[DDayton]

Well, with Sega footing the bill, we can look forward to a game being announced, hidden in development for four years, then being released as a multiplatform title... and failing miserably, of course.

Keep in mind, I liked Eternal Darkness.

 

[geogaddi]

Nintendo is more Nietzsche/continental philosophy where as Silicon Knights is more into Moore/Wittgenstein/Anglo-Saxon Analytic Philosophy.

I can see why they'd break up.

 

[capslock]

Though no official reason was given for the decision, IGNcube speculates that the philosophies of the two companies did not mesh. Silicon Knights has always been a very content-driven studio with strong beliefs in the elements of game creation including story, artistry, sound, and technology. Nintendo has recently downplayed the role of technology in game creation and has been known to de-emphasize story, graphics and sound in favor of classic play mechanics.

Well, that explains the twin graphical powerhouses of Eternal Darkness and MGS: TS.

 

[Shaheed79]

I still think Nintendo is stupid for letting them go. SK is the type of company that will eventually come out with a game that will pay off big time because of their broad vision to fuse gameplay and deep storytelling. Nintendo will be kicking themselves in the ass when SK gets a critically acclaimed hot seller on the 360 that could of been theirs. DMA Designs anyone? Nintendo had them in their pocket with the N64 and stupidly let them slip away. Rare is another one. Sometimes I really think Nintendo lacks any real meaningful vision and their recent lack of support for talented western developers is disgusting. Stuff like this makes me want to see Nintendo get their ass handed to em again in the west. WTF are they doing at NOA? They were getting all the great western devs on-board the N64 but now its like they don't give a damn anymore.

 

[Vark]

I still think Nintendo is stupid for letting them go. SK is the type of company that will eventually come out with a game that will pay off big time because of their broad vision to fuse gameplay and deep storytelling. Nintendo will be kicking themselves in the ass when SK gets a critically acclaimed hot seller on the 360 that could of been theirs. DMA Designs anyone? Nintendo had them in their pocket with the N64 and stupidly let them slip away. Rare is another one. Sometimes I really think Nintendo lacks any real meaningful vision and their recent lack of support for talented western developers is disgusting. Stuff like this makes me want to see Nintendo get their ass handed to em again in the west. WTF are they doing at NOA? They were getting all the great western devs on-board the N64 but now its like they don't give a damn anymore.

You do realize Nintendo is in this to make money right? Does it make sense to fund a company for 6 years, dump in ten's of millions of dollars on the *chance* they they may, one day, make a game that makes them back their investment?

 

[Striek]

talented western developers

This term has no place in a thread about SK.

 

[Shiggy]

Denis: Without getting specific, we plan to create interesting features in every game we create. Story is only one of five other critical areas that we believe are needed to create a great game. The others are audio, art, technology and gameplay. Having a game strong in all five of these areas is what we believe the key to creating a successful game. I believe I first spoke of this concept which we coined ?Engagement Theory? in 1995 at the Game Developers Conference.

 

[Redbeard]

As we grow and go in directions that are gonna take us next generation, the games that we create, partnered with our other partners, are gonna be unique to that relationship. We're going in a direction that we think is going be successful, and that's why we're going in it, we believe in it strongly.

I think the groups that we're with don't have a smaller, simpler approach to things.

I wonder who their "other partners" are, beyond Sega?

Someone must know...

 

[MomoPufflet]

My opinion of Denis Dyack is that he should teach a college course on game theory and leave the actual production to those who have more than just a theoretical understanding.

Perfectly stated.

 

[Doogdogg]

You do realize Nintendo is in this to make money right? Does it make sense to fund a company for 6 years, dump in ten's of millions of dollars on the *chance* they they may, one day, make a game that makes them back their investment?

yeah rare got teh boot since they no longer rake in teh dough for nintendo. though rare itself was responsible for about 1 billion in revenue for nintendo during the n64 days. at the end of the day nintendo laugh all the way to the bank with almost $200 million from Microsoft. :lol

 

[Jonnyboy117]

Maybe a difference of philosophy really is why they split up, but it sure goes against many things Denis said while they were together. He loved to talk about how SK and Nintendo were a perfect match because they both felt the same way about making games, and how Nintendo really seemed to understand what SK wanted to push with their games, and how it would be better to think of SK as a "first-party" developer, not "second-party", because they were so deeply integrated and compatible with Nintendo.

I haven't watched the video yet, but I know Denis well enough to have a pretty good idea of what he's going to say. The man stays on message, but as I explained above, I'm not sure how much of that message actually goes into the execution of their games and business decisions.

 

[Pellham]

He talks about the split from Nintendo which basically boiled down to the two companies having different philosophies. SK wants to make "bigger, deeper, more meaningful games" while Nintendo is intent on focusing on "smaller and simpler" titles. Also it looks like their next game will be called Engagement Theory.

Hahaha, I think everyone knows the real reason. SK's games were selling like shit, and they were turning into Rare #2, so Nintendo dumped them before they lost any more money.

 

[Gio_CoD]

I give up. After watching this interview, I completely don't give a shit about Silicon Knights or anything they're involved with anymore.

I was one of the fans of Eternal Darkness. I still think it's a fantastic game, but it wasn't so insanely awesome that they need to be as secretive as they are. Tell us what you're fucking making, Denis. Release a screenshot or two.

It's funny that they talk up all about how they're a "technology" driven dev-house, and the only two games they released this generation were hardly technological marvels. The character models in ED looked like a high-res N64 model (though to be fair, that's pretty much what they were), and Twin Snakes somehow magically looked worse than fucking MGS2 did on the Playstation 2. That game was released what... 3 years before Twin Snakes? And on less powerful hardware? Then MGS3 came and just completely blew Twin Snakes way the fuck out of the water.

And I don't want to hear people blaming the Gamecube or the small disc size of the GOD. Resident Evil 4 came out and pretty much shut everyone the fuck up about the Cube's graphical abilities. Silicon Knights SUCKS at technology. The only reason I was interested in them is because I liked their stories and their original ideas. Now I just don't give two shits about them.

Anyway... good luck with Sega, Denis. I hope they let you remake Streets of Rage or some other stupid shit with all of your "talent".

 

[Solid]

Haleon don't give up! Only 5 more days and you'll get blown away!

 

[Duckhuntdog]

Aren't Retro and SK about the same size team-wise? What does that say? Not much probably, but...

 

[Jonnyboy117]

Just finally watched the video. What I said before still goes. All I really got out of the video was a chuckle at Denis talking about how SK and Nintendo were so compatible because they shared the same ideas about quality and game design. Now he works with SEGA.

I still don't buy any of this explanation. SK was always a very different company from Nintendo, that's why Nintendo bought its share of the company in the first place. Portfolio diversity. So giving that as a reason for the break up just doesn't sit well with me.

All this SK talk does have me jonesing for another play through Eternal Darkness. I never did bother with Twin Snakes, since I hate MGS.