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Domestic Spying Bill passes Panel

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ronito

Member
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060913/pl_nm/security_surveillance_dc

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A bill backed by President George W. Bush to enable a court review of his domestic spying program won the approval on Wednesday of a U.S. Senate panel under election-year pressure to safeguard civil liberties.


Bush's Republicans hailed the measure and brushed off Democratic complaints that it could actually further undermine the rights of law-abiding Americans because of what they called loopholes that would expand presidential powers.

The bill would clear the way for a secret court created by the 1978 Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act to examine the legality of the warrantless surveillance program the White House launched after the September 11 attacks.

On a party-line vote of 10-8, the Republican-led panel sent the bill to the full Senate for an uncertain fate ahead of November 7 congressional elections.

Republicans hold 55 of 100 Senate seats. But they would need 60 votes if Democrats try to raise a procedural hurdle.

After the September 11 attacks, Bush directed the National Security Agency to eavesdrop on international phone calls and e-mails of U.S. citizens without obtaining a warrant when in pursuit of suspected terrorists.

A federal judge in Detroit ruled the program illegal. Bush has appealed. The case is expected to end up in the Supreme Court.

Democrats and some Republicans said the program overstepped presidential authority and may even violate the 1978 act which requires warrants for individual eavesdropping suspects inside the United States.

Bush countered his powers were inherent in time of war.

The House of Representatives has been struggling to craft and win passage of a measure of its own. Republicans control both houses of Congress.

JUDICIAL REVIEW

"My search has been to find a way to have a judicial review," said Chairman Arlen Specter, a Pennsylvania Republican senator who drafted the bill with the White House. "If someone has a better idea, I'm open to it."

Specter's bill would permit but not mandate a FISA court review. Critics charge it would also expand Bush's powers to eavesdrop. They said the FISA court would review the entire program at once rather than individual wiretaps, which could continue without warrants.

"This bill is all about authorizing the president to invade homes, e-mails and telephone conversations of American citizens in ways that are expressly forbidden by law," said Sen. Patrick Leahy (news, bio, voting record) of Vermont, top Democrat on the Judiciary Committee.

The committee also approved two other NSA bills, also on 10-8 votes. But neither have White House support and, a senior aide said, may not even be brought up for a Senate vote.

Specter and Sen. Lindsey Graham (news, bio, voting record), a South Carolina Republican, joined the eight committee Democrats to pass a measure that would reaffirm that FISA is the exclusive means by which the government can conduct electronic surveillance of Americans on U.S. soil for foreign intelligence.

With the support of only the panel's 10 Republicans, the committee approved a bill that would require a warrant on wiretaps beyond 45 days unless the administration certifies
one could not be obtained and that surveillance must continue.

Right to protection from unreasonable search and seizure permitted but not mandated.

Also warrants on 45 days+? Unless they can't? WTF?
 

bob_arctor

Tough_Smooth
Filibuster this shit.

Edit:
The committee also approved two other NSA bills, also on 10-8 votes. But neither have White House support and, a senior aide said, may not even be brought up for a Senate vote.

I. Republican-sponsored bills

A. The current Specter bill in the Senate, S 2453, as amended in committee:

1) Repeal the core requirement of FISA that its procedures and the criminal Wiretap Act (Title III) "shall be the exlusive means" for conducting electronic surveillance. The bill essentially makes FISA optional overall, by explicitly deferring to the President's "inherent" constitutional authority instead.

2) Authorize (but not require) the President to submit the current NSA surveillance program to review and blessing by the FISA courts. This review effectively would be limited to Fourth Amendment issues. The separation-of-powers issues deriving from FISA itself would not be reviewed, because Congress already would have capitulated in Step 1) above.

3) Refer all third-party court challenges to intelligence-surveillance programs to the FISA courts, instead of the ordinary District Courts such as those of Judge Taylor in Detroit, Judge Lynch in New York or Judge Walker in San Francisco, which now have several cases before them. I am uncertain of what effect this would have on Judge Taylor's case, since she already has ruled against the program and issued an injunction.

4) Make some fundamental changes to the definitions within FISA, most importantly removing the current provision that makes FISA apply to any intelligence surveillance acquired within the United States, regardless of who the target is. This apparently would have the effect of authorizing warrantless surveillance beyond that now reported to take place under the NSA program.

B. The DeWine bill in the Senate, S 2455:

1) Essentially ratify the current general NSA program by authorizing such warrantless surveillance within FISA.

2) For the absence of judicial review by the FISA courts of warrant applications, substitute general oversight by the congressional Intelligence committees.

C. The Wilson bill in the House, HR 5825, cosponsored by GOP committee chairmen there.

1) Make changes to FISA's definitions, including key changes identical to those in Specter's bill (see above).

2) Authorize within FISA a program of warrantless surveillance similar to that reported to occur in the NSA program today. This provision is similar but not identical to the "ratification" proposed in the DeWine bill. The Wilson bill also calls for general congressional oversight in lieu of individual warrants.

II. Democratic bills

A. The Feinstein bill in the Senate, S 3001, also sponsored by Specter but only nominally.

1) Reaffirm that FISA and Title III procedures "shall be the exclusive means" for conducting surveillance, eliminating the chance that the AUMF might be construed to authorize warrantless surveillance that FISA prohibits.

2) Provide increased flexibility in FISA's current "emergency" provisions for beginning surveillance before warrants are issued, and increasing the emergency period from the current one-stage provision of three days to a two-phase provision of three days at first, with the final warrant application not due for seven days. The greater flexibility within the three days is offset by detailed oversight reports to Congress and the FISA courts.

3) Increase the resources for processing these individual FISA warrants.

4) Make the current provision allowing 15 days of warrantless surveillance immediately following a declaration of war also apply to 15 days following a national emergency or passage of an AUMF, as defined by the War Powers Act.

B. The Harman bill in the House, HR 5371, cosponsored by many fellow Democrats.

1) Reaffirm that FISA and Title III provisions are the "exclusive means" for conducting surveillance. This language is similar not identical to that in the Feinstein bill.

2) Require the President to report to the Intelligence committees specific recommendations to ensure that such individual warrants can be processed efficiently, including emergency warrant applications.

3) Authorize "such sums as may be necessary" for efficient processing of FISA warrants.
 

The Stealth Fox

Junior Member
They are trying to protect us from terrorists. You just hate Bush because you're a freedom-hating, terrorist loving-liberoislamofascist.
 

bob_arctor

Tough_Smooth
WASHINGTON -
President Bush visited Capitol Hill Thursday where he conferred behind closed doors with House Republicans on legislation to give the government more power to spy on, imprison and interrogate terrorism suspects.

Bush's proposals would narrow the U.S. legal interpretation of the Geneva Conventions in a bid to allow tougher interrogations and shield U.S. personnel from being prosecuted for war crimes.

But a former member of his administration endorsed efforts by three Republican senators to block President Bush's plan to authorize harsh interrogations of terror suspects.

Former Secretary of State Colin Powell on Thursday said that Congress must not pass Bush's proposal to redefine U.S. compliance with the Geneva Conventions, a treaty that sets international standards for the treatment of prisoners of war.

Powell sent a letter to Sen. John McCain (news, bio, voting record), R-Ariz., one of the rebellious lawmakers <<:lol seeking limits to legislation on interrogations, in the latest sign of GOP division over White House security.

"The world is beginning to doubt the moral basis of our fight against terrorism," said Powell, who served under Bush and is a former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. "To redefine Common Article 3 would add to those doubts. Furthermore, it would put our own troops at risk."

Republican dissatisfaction with the administration's security proposals is becoming more prominent as the midterm election season has arrived. The Bush White House wants Congress to approve greater executive power to spy on, imprison and interrogate terrorism suspects.

Walking through the Capitol to a basement conference room, Bush was flanked by Vice President Dick Cheney, House Speaker Dennis Hastert and White House adviser Karl Rove.

For Bush, the election season visit capped a week of high-profile administration pressure to rescue bills mired in turf battles and privacy concerns. It also gave GOP leaders a chance to press for loyalty among Republicans confronted on the campaign trail by war-weary voters.

"I have not really seen anybody running away from the president," House Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, told reporters this week when asked about the caucus' split. "Frankly, I think that would be a bad idea."

Bush was expected to ask for support for two key pieces of legislation he says are crucial to preventing terrorist attacks. One would meet CIA demands that Congress reinterpret the nation's treaty obligations to allow tougher interrogations of detainees, but it's snagged in the Senate between the leadership and a trio of powerful Republicans.

At nearly the same time Bush met with House Republicans, Sen. John Warner , R-Va., chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, on Thursday was asking his panel to finish an alternative to the White House plan to prosecute terror suspects and redefine acts that constitute war crimes.

The White House on Thursday said the alternate approach was unacceptable because it would force the CIA to end a program of using forceful interrogation methods with suspected terrorists.

"The president will not accept something that shuts the program down," presidential spokesman Tony Snow said.

Quick, someone list countries that allow "coerced"/hearsay evidence and don't allow the accused to see the evidence against him!
 

ronito

Member
"The president will not accept something that shuts the program down," presidential spokesman Tony Snow said.

Last time I checked the American people were supposed to be "The Decider" Tony. I swear pretty soon we're going to go back to divine right because so many people are huddled in their corners afraid of terrrists to do anything.
 

bob_arctor

Tough_Smooth
ronito said:
Last time I checked the American people were supposed to be "The Decider" Tony. I swear pretty soon we're going to go back to divine right because so many people are huddled in their corners afraid of terrrists to do anything.

Are you suggesting an uprising perhaps? Better yet, let's put it this way: would Thomas Paine think any of this Common Sense?
 

Tauntaun

Banned
"The president will not accept something that shuts the program down," presidential spokesman Tony Snow said.

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.
- The Declaration of Independence :)
 

bob_arctor

Tough_Smooth
ronito said:
Sorry Nintendo's pricing announcement is enough to make me protest.

:lol I *just* left from reading that thread! So $50 more is a deal breaker huh? I figure I would--oh. Um. What about that torture-endorsing prick of a President? I wish Wii the people would hold him accountable!
 

maynerd

Banned
Good news

http://glenngreenwald.blogspot.com/2006/09/sen-reid-specter-bill-will-not-be.html

Sen. Reid stated flatly and unequivocally -- and I'm paraphrasing -- that the Specter bill was not going anywhere, that it would not be enacted. I then asked him how he could be so certain about that -- specifically, I asked where the 51 votes against the Specter bill would come from in light of the support it enjoys from both the White House and at least some of the ostensibly "independent" Republicans, exacerbated by the fact that all 10 Republicans on the Judiciary Committee voted in favor of it yesterday (at least they voted in favor of sending it to the Senate floor).

In response, Sen. Reid explained that our system does not allow every bill to be enacted simply because a majority supports it, that Senate rules allow minority rights to be protected, clearly alluding to a filibuster. Indeed, as part of that vow, Sen. Reid specifically referenced the fact that in the Senate, one does not need 50%, but only 40%, to block the enactment of a bill. He explained that rule existed to protect minority rights. When I asked him expressly whether the Democrats are committed to filibustering the Specter bill if doing so is necessary to defeat it, he said he thought that would not be necessary, but repeated that they would make sure the Specter bill did not become law. He was unequivocal about that a second time.
 
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