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Fatal Frame series Vs Silent Hill Series

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Kabuki Waq

Member
Personally I enjoy the combat and scares of fatal frame series much more than the silent hill series. Sure Silent Hill 1 had awesome atmosphere(best first 10 min of survival horror game ever) and enemie designs but the rest of the series sort of let me down in the actual combat and scares department.

Fatal frame i love the fps like combat and the creepy atmosphere.


+1 Fatal frame.
 
As i've always said, FF is a great series and is quite scary. But the stories for the most part are dull and the characters are forgettable. SH is the better series overall as its much more well rounded.
 
i would say the stories are equal with silent hill being more cryptic but interms of combat FF owns silent hill. Silent hill is just clumky and has to rely on atmosphere while FF does combat and atmosphere really well.
 
It's hard to say. I really, really enjoyed Fatal Frame/Project Zero. It's a horror game with gameplay that's actually fun and original. And it has great atmosphere as well...But there are a few things I would like to see being done in a better, or at least different way. Keep in mind I haven't played the sequel, so I don't know how much different it is from the first game.

Based on the first game though, the story needs to be presented in a better way. I'm not a fan of finding scraps of paper, diaries etc and reading 5 pages of plot everytime. They don't have to remove them completely, but the story parts should be integrated better with the game, through cutscenes preferrably. I liked the tapes though.

Also, I would like to see more variation in environments. The traditional asian backdrops are nice and all, but I think it would be cooler with more variation and more modern locations, like factories, towns, jails, and similar. If that's too extreme for the series, they could just make a spinoff or something.
 
I'm not touching any survival horror game for its combat other than RE4. Overall the genre is a giant mess when it comes to that area.

I think SH just gives you more. Great music, graphics, characters, stories, atmosphere and scares. FF is for the most part is just atmosphere and scares for me. It does that really well but its not as well put together as the SH series.
 
SolidSnakex said:
I'm not touching any survival horror game for its combat other than RE4. Overall the genre is a giant mess when it comes to that area.

I think SH just gives you more. Great music, graphics, characters, stories, atmosphere and scares. FF is for the most part is just atmosphere and scares for me. It does that really well but its not as well put together as the SH series.
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Thats just hte thing the Cobat in FF is actually GOOD! and the atmosphere and scares are at the least on par with silent hill series. You cant tell me you dont notice horrible controls when playing survival horror games?
 
Very tough call. Both are favorite series, and actually have very different feels in gameplay. The issue of setting and character is also especially important to these games.

I give the nod to Silent Hill for the primarily gritty and mature American characters, storyline, and personal relationships. In SH1/SH2/SH4 it is for me like navigating a like avatar through nightmare worlds, primarily looking to discover something or someone rather than outright fear for oneself.

The Fatal Frames are very different with the young, fragile girls placed in jeopardy in dark Japanese villages with only a mystical camera for protection, as though I'm guiding them to safety rather than being them. Which actually leads to a scarier setting IMO...if I screw up and Mio gets hit and screams I'm not happy about it. If James or Henry gets hit I just hit the button, essentially tell him to suck it up, and take another swing...

Which gets to gameplay. Gameplay is more secondary to this style of game than some others, but I'd generally give the nod to Fatal Frame in this case. It is a well-done fusion of 3rd-person exploration and 1st-person "shooting", with actual reflex/skill needed to be more effective in getting higher-scoring/more damaging shots on higher difficulties. The extra missions and survival modes (FF2 Xbox) speak to this. And additionally, fighting in 1st-person against phasing ghosts by its very nature lends to a frightful atmosphere. I'm actually looking forward next to a good sit-down with FF2 Xbox to play the whole game in 1st-person.

OTOH, the Silent Hills have the 10-star ranking system which is a more-or-less successful ranking/rewards system for the end-game. And despite the active gameplay never being as refined as that in the Fatal Frames, the SHs have the benefit of interesting weapon selection and various ways to bloodily combat enemies.
 
Kabuki Waq said:
i dunno i just feel gameplay should not be a secondary aspect in any gaming genre.
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It is when you're dealing with survival horror games in general. THeir gameplay just isn't enough to carry that game. If you stripped away the quality of the story and scares in the games they wouldn't get reviews nearly as high or the fan following that they do have.
 
jarrod said:
Survival horror blows regardless. Thank god Capcom woke up and started making action games.
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Yeah, but I don't see how that's really related to the topic since the Resident Evil games never really were about horror IMO, more like action games with clunky controls featuring zombified enemies and, at best, a cheesy b-movie plot. ;)
 
Kiriku said:
Yeah, but I don't see how that's really related to the topic since the Resident Evil games never really were about horror IMO, more like action games with clunky controls featuring zombified enemies and, at best, a cheesy b-movie plot. ;)
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RE2 was really the first shift for the series on the road to action game, but the games still retained fundamental elements of survival horror (limited item management, inane puzzle solving, classic horror setting, spooks, etc). Derivatives like Dino Crisis, Onimusha and Devil May Cry allowed Capcom to explore in different directions though and RE4 has sealed the deal, moving Resident Evil out of survival horror territory I think. Definitely a move for the better.

Also, SSX first brought up Resident Evil. :)
 
For a horror game, Fatal Frame. SH has not even come close to frighten me. Maybe living in a snow storm prone country has maybe me immune to low visibility 'scares'.
 
RE2 was really the first shift for the series on the road to action game, but the games still retained fundamental elements of survival horror (limited item management, inane puzzle solving, classic horror setting, spooks, etc). Derivatives like Dino Crisis, Onimusha and Devil May Cry allowed Capcom to explore in different directions though and RE4 has sealed the deal, moving Resident Evil out of survival horror territory I think. Definitely a move for the better.

Also, SSX first brought up Resident Evil.
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I guess this is an odd statement considering the amount of work that went into RE4, but I think it was a lazy move to make it into the product we have now. It's like they gave up on trying to perfect the horror formula; like they weren't able to balance the horror and the action, so they just cranked up the game in the aspect that was most familiar to them.

I would much rather have seen Capcom really try to perfect the horror genre... instead, they just gave us a highly polished action title with great production values, but without any real innovation.
 
Ceb said:
I guess this is an odd statement considering the amount of work that went into RE4, but I think it was a lazy move to make it into the product we have now. It's like they gave up on trying to perfect the horror formula; like they weren't able to balance the horror and the action, so they just cranked up the game in the aspect that was most familiar to them.

I would much rather have seen Capcom really try to perfect the horror genre... instead, they just gave us a highly polished action title with great production values, but without any real innovation.
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the frustrating thing is there are little bits of brilliant horror atmosphere in RE4 (the village for one, but also in the military building, although ripping SH, was still very effective). Not to mention the additions to the original in REmake. A shame Mikami just said "fuck it... lets turn this into RESolid". Great game, no doubt... but it's a shame the 'horror' foundation took a backseat.
 
The military building? Are you thinking about the "meat bags" near the end?

Anyway, I agree... it has touches of horror brilliance throughout (first couple of Regenerator encounters!). The one BIG atmosphere killer for me was the godawful writing. You can come up with all kinds of excuses about how it's "intentional", but in my eyes, there's just no excuse for it.
 
jarrod said:
RE2 was really the first shift for the series on the road to action game, but the games still retained fundamental elements of survival horror (limited item management, inane puzzle solving, classic horror setting, spooks, etc). Derivatives like Dino Crisis, Onimusha and Devil May Cry allowed Capcom to explore in different directions though and RE4 has sealed the deal, moving Resident Evil out of survival horror territory I think. Definitely a move for the better.
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I agree that RE2 was a shift towards action, but I still think RE1 was an action game at heart as well. The only 'spooks' were cheap in the "dogs jump through windows!!"-way rather than a creepy atmosphere with situations that freak you out. I mean, it's more surprise than horror. And when did limited item management become a fundamental element of horror games?
But wait, you just said 'survival horror' rather than 'horror'...I'll just choose to largely group the Res Evil games in 'survival horror', equal them to action games with little if any horror and be done with that. :P

jarrod said:
Also, SSX first brought up Resident Evil.
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Fair enough. :)


Ceb said:
I guess this is an odd statement considering the amount of work that went into RE4, but I think it was a lazy move to make it into the product we have now. It's like they gave up on trying to perfect the horror formula; like they weren't able to balance the horror and the action, so they just cranked up the game in the aspect that was most familiar to them.

I would much rather have seen Capcom really try to perfect the horror genre... instead, they just gave us a highly polished action title with great production values, but without any real innovation.
Click to expand...

I think it was a wise decision, seeing as they weren't really trying much to make a real horror game in the previous games. The only big shift towards horror would be that first version of Resident Evil 4, with the ghosts/hallucinations. But in the end, they chose more action which I think was the right choice even though I'm still curious about how the more spooky Resident Evil would've turned out. :)
 
The way I see it, there's plenty of great action games, but not as many great horror games. It would just have been interesting to see what Production Studio 4 could've done with the genre if they had put their hearts into it...

I sort of agree with you that the previous RE titles weren't pure horror. I think calling them "action games" is stretching it a bit though. For me, RE1 is definitely more about suspense/eeriness than it is about action. A wise man once likened the game to the film Predator though, and how do you classify that movie? Sci-fi? Horror? Action? It's a mixture of different genres, but I wouldn't say that its roots lie in the "action" genre. Same thing with RE.

Wow, I don't know where I'm going with this. There's bound to be some contradictions in this post... if so, just ignore them. :lol
 
Kiriku said:
I agree that RE2 was a shift towards action, but I still think RE1 was an action game at heart as well.
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Naw, RE1 directly followed in the footsteps of AITD. It was much too slow, quiet and atmospheric (for the time) to really be considered an action game. RE2 on I can see being called action games, but not RE1.


Kiriku said:
The only 'spooks' were cheap in the "dogs jump through windows!!"-way rather than a creepy atmosphere with situations that freak you out. I mean, it's more surprise than horror.
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It's a different genre of horror, that's pretty well represented in film too. Less psychological and more "surprise" as you say or cheap thrills, but it's still a well established style in the horror genre. After all, Resident Evil's B-move roots started somewhere... just because you might prefer one style over another, or one has more effect in scaring you, that doesn't discredit the validity of other styles. If "it doesn't scare me" is the litmus test for qualifying horror games, then I'd have to say there are no horror games at all really.


Kiriku said:
And when did limited item management become a fundamental element of horror games?
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This was something else RE took from AITD iirc, though I admit I tend to stay away from the genre. The only survival horror games I've played (most very briefly) being AITD2, RE1-2, SH1-2, Code Veronica, D2, Eternal Darkness & RE4. And Luigi's Mansion if you want to count it. :)
 
jarrod said:
Naw, RE1 directly followed in the footsteps of AITD. It was much too slow, quiet and atmospheric (for the time) to really be considered an action game. RE2 on I can see being called action games, but not RE1.
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Well, I see your point...but it didn't feel to me like the game went out of its way to scare people, but rather offer an action-adventure with some cheesy scares. You still had to kill enemies with weapons, action-style, to move on, although I'll admit that ammo was so limited it forced you to run past enemies at times.

jarrod said:
It's a different genre of horror, that's pretty well represented in film too. Less psychological and more "surprise" as you say or cheap thrills, but it's still a well established style in the horror genre. After all, Resident Evil's B-move roots started somewhere... just because you might prefer one style over another, or one has more effect in scaring you, that doesn't discredit the validity of other styles. If "it doesn't scare me" is the litmus test for qualifying horror games, then I'd have to say there are no horror games at all really.
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OK, I'll agree there's good horror and bad horror. ;)
But seriously, as I mentioned before it seems to me that the RE devs never really went out of their way to scare people nearly as much as in the Silent Hill games, for example. It's not their main goal in the Res Evil games to scare people, thus it doesn't make them as much horror games as the Silent Hill games. But yeah, I guess one could pull the 'it's all subjective!' card here as well. :P

jarrod said:
This was something else RE took from AITD iirc, though I admit I tend to stay away from the genre. The only survival horror games I've played (most very briefly) being AITD2, RE1-2, SH1-2, Code Veronica, D2, Eternal Darkness & RE4. And Luigi's Mansion if you want to count it. :)
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Since you entered a thread titled "Fatal Frame series Vs Silent Hill Series" and mentioned how much the survival horror genre blows, how about giving Fatal Frame a whirl since you clearly haven't played it? It's actually a very different and refreshing experience compared to the other game series in the genre. But then, you did say the genre blows...so maybe it's hopeless...:P
 
Kiriku said:
Well, I see your point...but it didn't feel to me like the game went out of its way to scare people, but rather offer an action-adventure with some cheesy scares. You still had to kill enemies with weapons, action-style, to move on, although I'll admit that ammo was so limited it forced you to run past enemies at times.
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I dunno, I still feel there was a marked shift in tone between RE1 and RE2. Again, if you call RE1 an action game, I think that'd have to extend to over to the AITD games, Deep Fear, Carrier and tons more similar games.


Kiriku said:
OK, I'll agree there's good horror and bad horror. ;)
But seriously, as I mentioned before it seems to me that the RE devs never really went out of their way to scare people nearly as much as in the Silent Hill games, for example. It's not their main goal in the Res Evil games to scare people, thus it doesn't make them as much horror games as the Silent Hill games.
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I'd agree somewhat, but I'd also say it's rare for horror games to go out with the intention of scaring it's audience first and foremost... all these games really seem to just follow film genre standards for horror. From B-movie zombie fests (Resident Evil, Carrier) to Japanese ghost stories (Siren, Fatal Frame) to supernatural/psychological thrillers (Silent Hill, Eternal Darkness) to slasher flicks (Clocktower, Haunting Ground) all with varying degrees of success. It's less about scaring people and more about replicating cinematic experience with that added layer of control... even Luigi's Mansion is basically a retelling of Disney's Lonesome Ghosts.


Kiriku said:
But yeah, I guess one could pull the 'it's all subjective!' card here as well. :P
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It's not though, I'm saying subjective qualification in the horror genre is worthless. Better simply to just accept estabished genre standards rather than go by what freaks you out.


Kiriku said:
Since you entered a thread titled "Fatal Frame series Vs Silent Hill Series" and mentioned how much the survival horror genre blows, how about giving Fatal Frame a whirl since you clearly haven't played it? It's actually a very different and refreshing experience compared to the other game series in the genre. But then, you did say the genre blows...so maybe it's hopeless...:P
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Actually, this thread is making me consider giving Fatal Frame a whirl. So long as it doesn't have shit mechanics like SH/RE, I'll probably like it... it always reminded me of those Mansion of Hidden Souls games on Sega CD and Saturn, with a similar theme and perspective. :)
 
I've always thought Fatal Frame to be the best playing series in the whole Horror Action/Adventure sub-genre. (RE4 excluded, obviously.) SH series is still nothing to sneeze at, though.
 
I do enjoy both series, but Silent Hill wins out due to superior direction and story telling. Silent Hill offers some of the finest art and sound direction I've ever seen in a game. Fatal Frame does the exact opposite and uses a very "Dead or Alive"-ish look for its characters. It just feels cheap in comparison. The gameplay in Fatal Frame is certainly better, though. Possibly the greatest mechanics ever to grace the genre (RE4 not included, as that's more of an action game).

I also enjoyed Siren, but found myself disappointed by the incredible difficulty. The trial and error nature combined with the sheer toughness of its unkillable enemies actually managed to dampen the atmosphere quite a bit. Still, it was a neat experiment of a game and I'd love to see a sequel.
 
I can't believe I've gone this long without ever playing either FF. I love the Silent Hill and RE series, so trying FF seems like a no brainer, but the first one has been on "when I have time" status for so long that its sequel is already old news.
 
Ceb said:
Speaking of which: exactly when does Siren 2 come out in Japan?
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I don't think it has a solid date yet (Anoop recently did an update for IGN and didn't mention a release date). Here's the original trailer

http://www.playstation.jp/ch/pv/asx/pv_siren2_0122.asx

Really creepy and just messed up trailer. Sirens one of the most underrated survival horror games ever so hopefuly S2 will get alot more attention. Toyama said that the original was just an experiment and this one will have alot more to it. If there's one series that can beat SH, this is it imo.
 
FF was too slow for my tastes...it seemed like the running speed was about the same as SH's walking speed.

The camera aspect was pretty neat in FF...though the stories were standard eastern horror fare (read: about as good as the narrative in SH2's intro). I would have to put the SH series on top...simply because the SH games with the exception of 4 interested me enough to finish them

regarding gameplay: RE4 owns them all
regarding story: SH2 owns them all
 
Fatal Frame/Project Zero series is awesome.

It actually bugs me a lot that in gaming, both the mainstream and enthusiast only seems to care about Resident Evil and to a lesser extent Silent Hill.

As many have mentioned, FF actually has awesome gameplay to back up its video game format. But the fact that FF is fun to play, has a creepy atmosphere and is able to deliver the scares totally rocks the house. And not only that, the gameplay mechanic of the camera actually ADDS to the scary environment so that it's all integrated very well.

FF is my favorite game this gen. I only played a few hours of Akai Chou/Crimson Butterfly, so I can't comment too much on that.
 
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