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[crimsonspider89]

Learning links involves learning which normals to use where and mix ups. I mean I don't even bother with the links when I play and just play a VERY basic footsie and poke game.

And I beat people doing that. Maybe I should say learn the properties of certain moves and learn what to do spacing wise which is what I try to learn before combos.

EDIT: I mean you spend a large amount of beginning hours learning the game. After that, you don't spend much time playing it where Marvel is the direct opposite. You learn it quick but have to spend more time in the lab learning it.

 

[KidA Seven]

SFIV you have to spend about 6 hours learning the links but after learning the links, you are already extremely close to mastering the game.

What?


Desk must be the best player in the world then.

This is the first time (the thread) I've heard people say "Marvel is the harder game to master." I thought it was accepted that Marvel was the easiest, but was more hype (according to marvel heads).

 

[Karsticles]

I'm just gonna assume you don't know what Romancancel is.

Please, enough with the arrogance. It's pathetic.

What?
Desk must be the best player in the world then.

IIRC, Desk did well in tournaments when he did enter, but he doesn't play competitively for some reason. CvS2 tournaments, at least.

 

[Conceited]

SFIV you have to spend about 6 hours learning the links but after learning the links, you are already extremely close to mastering the game.

Hahahahahaahhhahhaahahaha.

Post of the year.

 

[rCIZZLE]

No SF is easier to master than Marvel but Marvel is easier to get into.

Marvel has more things to consider and fills the screen with so much crap that it becomes hard to figure out where to block and that is where the harder to master falls into the area.

Marvel, sure you can learn how to play in 30 minutes. But mastering, well, none of the pros playing it have mastered it TBH yet. Still do drops and make mistakes.

SFIV you have to spend about 6 hours learning the links but after learning the links, you are already extremely close to mastering the game.

EDIT: No not because quality. A cultural difference. They have trouble accepting flashy type games as serious games and even more so for games that are team based. Go look up what they call Kusoru games. They fall into high damage, high flash, and a lot of times team based as well.

I always thought it was the opposite. The fact that SF4 has less going on means you really need to know the game throughout and how to condition your opponent to play your game. Marvel has too many characters that can ToD. If a happy birthday happens you can win with a hit and a mixup. Getting to that point is a long process though.

 

[Conceited]

I have this name for a reason, you know.

 

[sleepykyo]

No SF is easier to master than Marvel but Marvel is easier to get into.

Marvel has more things to consider and fills the screen with so much crap that it becomes hard to figure out where to block and that is where the harder to master falls into the area.

Marvel, sure you can learn how to play in 30 minutes. But mastering, well, none of the pros playing it have mastered it TBH yet. Still do drops and make mistakes.

SFIV you have to spend about 6 hours learning the links but after learning the links, you are already extremely close to mastering the game.

Man, you place a lot of emphasis on combos, to exclusion of spacing, footsies, patience and psychology.

 

[Karsticles]

I always thought it was the opposite. The fact that SF4 has less going on means you really need to know the game throughout and how to condition your opponent to play your game. Marvel has too many characters that can ToD. If a happy birthday happens you can win with a hit and a mixup. Getting to that point is a long process though.

I don't think it's productive to talk about SF and MvC in terms of whether one is easier to get into over the other, or whether one is easier to master. The kinds of things you need to learn in each are pretty different. MvC is undeniably the faster of the two games, and the game that requires the most matchup knowledge (teams instead of individual characters), and the more punishing of the two, though. SF is more about patience, MvC is more about overwhelming your opponent's senses.

I have this name for a reason, you know.

You earn it sir.

 

[Rice-Eater]

Oh boy, are we really having a SF4 vs Marvel 3 debate? I'm sorry to say I also involved myself in this. Lets just bury this and do what we do best, ignore each other and bag on the rest of the games that never reaches 100+ players at a tournament unless a free shirt is thrown in.

Spoiler

Yeah yeah, Final Round, I know. I'm just kidding guys

 

[crimsonspider89]

Yes, which was my fault. I forgot everyone else does combos then spacing where I try to learn spacing, usage and frame data first. Sorry that I try to learn fundamentals first. Figured that is what most people do first.

And Marvel is hard to master due to the 50 character's hitboxes, mix ups, spacing, weak points, and such. Not to mention assists that can change the outcome of one match.

 

[scytheavatar]

My claim wasn't that it mattered, he claimed Japan didn't play Marvel due to taste, I provided evidence it was because of quality.

And Japan didn't consider Marvel to be quality due to their taste. Quality is a hard thing to define.

 

[Karsticles]

Oh boy, are we really having a SF4 vs Marvel 3 debate? I'm sorry to say I also involved myself in this. Lets just bury this and do what we do best, ignore each other and bag on the rest of the games that never reaches 100+ players at a tournament unless a free shirt is thrown in.

Spoiler

Yeah yeah, Final Round, I know. I'm just kidding guys

Do you want to blame MrWizard, or this guy?
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=37731524&postcount=784

 

[Conceited]

And Japan didn't consider Marvel to be quality due to their taste.

Again, believing a fighting game is shitty is completely quantifiable. It's not necessarily a matter of taste.

Do you think people believe Rise of the Robots is a shitty game because of taste?

 

[KidA Seven]

Do you want to blame MrWizard, or this guy?
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=37731524&postcount=784

Me? Marvel heads started the "marvel > every other capcom game." :lol Don't be upset when other people respond.

 

[Karsticles]

Me? Marvel heads started the "marvel > every other capcom game." :lol

But you said "let's get this shit started"! "Marvel heads" were just re-posting MrWizard's stuff.

 

[Rice-Eater]

Do you want to blame MrWizard, or this guy?
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=37731524&postcount=784

Solarpowered? Take it easy on him, he's just stating his opinion man

 

[crimsonspider89]

Also, go look up what the kusoge crowd plays. They play games they ENJOY. Not to be the best. Marvel fell into this category for lack of arcade release and for the low execution. So the way it was released is one of the main reasons.

So Japan does enjoy playing Marvel but they don't take it seriously as we do or maybe just no arcades limits the way the Japanese play them.

 

[KidA Seven]

But you said "let's get this shit started"! "Marvel heads" were just re-posting MrWizard's stuff.

That was a joke.

Regardless of what I said, marvel fans put the topic out there first.

 

[Karsticles]

Solarpowered? Take it easy on him, he's just stating his opinion man

No no, KidA! Solarpowered only gets upset about Hsien-ko being terrible. Or at least he once did. His morbidity over her complete lack of fighting power made him lose the capacity for being upset about anything in life. In a sense, he came to say to himself: "What fate could be worse than wanting to main Hsien-ko in UMvC3?"

That was a joke.

Regardless of what I said, marvel fans put the topic out there first.

Marvel fans were just discussing stream chat sir! Or do you want to blame MrWizard?!

 

[KingofSarus]

Marvel 3 fanboys wouldn't know a good game even if it slapped them in the face.

At least Japan have fun with it while knowing it's a "shit game."

 

[KidA Seven]

No no, KidA! Solarpowered only gets upset about Hsien-ko being terrible. Or at least he once did. His morbidity over her complete lack of fighting power made him lose the capacity for being upset about anything in life. In a sense, he came to say to himself: "What fate could be worse than wanting to main Hsien-ko in UMvC3?"


Marvel fans were just discussing stream chat sir! Or do you want to blame MrWizard?!

I'm putting the blame on sixfortyfive's "hold dat shit." :lol


Reignited dat SF Marvel rivalry.


Edit: Sorry Rice-eater. I can't hate on KOF man.

 

[Karsticles]

Marvel 3 fanboys wouldn't know a good game even if it slapped them in the face.

At least Japan have fun with it while knowing it's a "shit game."

I have fun while knowing it's the best game Capcom has made in the last 10 years. ;-)

I'm putting the blame on sixfortyfive's "hold dat shit." :lol
Reignited dat SF Marvel rivalry.

I like both games, but SF just doesn't light the fire in my belly. I like games that challenge me to think of how to break them.

 

[crimsonspider89]

Huh?

IF I had more funds I would buy: KOF, SG, already have BB(would get all the characters though).

I own SFIV already. Not getting SFxT. Want to get P4A as well. So yeah, money is limiting me right now.

 

[smurfx]

hey japan isn't into fps games, western rpg's and american sports games as well so they gotta be shit too right? well if japan says so then its gotta be true!

 

[Professor Beef]

hey japan isn't into fps games, western rpg's and american sports games as well so they gotta be shit too right? well if japan says so then its gotta be true!

FPS's are out, dating sims are in!

 

[Karsticles]

hey japan isn't into fps games, western rpg's and american sports games as well so they gotta be shit too right? well if japan says so then its gotta be true!

Not to mention the entire Xbox 360 system. And did you hear that Call of Duty: Black Ops 2, is probably going to be the best game ever made?

 

[KingofSarus]

hey japan isn't into fps games, western rpg's and american sports games as well so they gotta be shit too right? well if japan says so then its gotta be true!

Nope.
Because even top-players in our good ol' country say the same shit.

Hell, even Noel Brown shat on the game on a Big Two stream and I'm sure you follow Justin Wong on Twitter.

Haha! There's a reason why I didn't add the follow up in my previous post. Good shit.

 

[Conceited]

hey japan isn't into fps games, western rpg's and american sports games as well so they gotta be shit too right? well if japan says so then its gotta be true!

That is quite the logic leap.

Japan loves fighting games, that's why they are so good at recognizing the bad ones.

 

[DD-11]

I'm just gonna assume you don't know what Romancancel is.



This is completely ridiculous, you can judge whether a game is good or not based on quantifiable factors, nothing to do with taste.

You can't be serious.

 

[Rice-Eater]

Whatever happens, we gotta bury this tonight before Dahbomb wakes up. Then no matter what happens, we all lose.

 

[crimsonspider89]

Huh? Noel Brown hasn't shat on Mahvel to my knowledge and Jwong is just salty that he is losing now. The players who are taking the game SERIOUSLY unlike Jwong understand the reason behind everything and don't shat on the game.

Well, at least I know one thing: I was right about SFxT going to be ass.

 

[Karsticles]

That is quite the logic leap.

Japan loves fighting games, that's why they are so good at recognizing the bad ones.

I love videogames, that's why I'm so good at recognizing the good ones.

Are you anywhere near recognizing how moronic your argument was?

Whatever happens, we gotta bury this tonight before Dahbomb wakes up. Then no matter what happens, we all lose.

Are you kidding? Someone has to take over for me when I go to bed in a minute.

 

[Vice]

Nope.
Because even top-players in our good ol' country say the same shit.

Hell, even Noel Brown shat on the game on a Big Two stream and I'm sure you follow Justin Wong on Twitter.

Haha! There's a reason why I didn't add the follow up in my previous post. Good shit.

Top players, from all countries, shitted on SFIV, SFIII, Super Turbo, the Alpha series and so on. That doesn't make them bad games, it just means that certain players don't like them.

 

[Conceited]

You can't be serious.

About? Are you going to try to tell me that every shitty fighting game ever made has been deemed so because of peoples taste? Some games are just broken and shitty on a mechanical level.

I love videogames, that's why I'm so good at recognizing the good ones.

Are you anywhere near recognizing how moronic your argument was?

I appreciate the insult, but I'm still waiting for you to explain how a game can't be justified as shit based on mechanics and balance, instead of "taste".

 

[smurfx]

Nope.
Because even top-players in our good ol' country say the same shit.

Hell, even Noel Brown shat on the game on a Big Two stream and I'm sure you follow Justin Wong on Twitter.

Haha! There's a reason why I didn't add the follow up in my previous post. Good shit.

i'm not sitting here and saying marvel is a perfect game because it sure as hell is not but i can't stand when people's whole argument about why the game sucks is japan hates it.

 

[KidA Seven]

Whatever happens, we gotta bury this tonight before Dahbomb wakes up. Then no matter what happens, we all lose.

Dahbomb is lucky Saty isn't here.

 

[crimsonspider89]

Yeah, some games are shitty and broken. Marvel is broken on purpose. One of the main reasons for it being labeled Kusoge is due to its console only release.

Other is easy execution.

I take it somebody didn't watch KVO. The players were hype and the ones at the top showed dedication to the game.

SO point: No arcade, not received well in Japan.

 

[KingofSarus]

Huh? Noel Brown hasn't shat on Mahvel to my knowledge.

He did on that day when he went on about how he liked using "beautiful characters" in fighting games like Sheik. (lol Wolverine and Mel Gibson)

Jwong is just salty that he is losing now.

Yeah, because the game is bullshit.
That's the reason why I (and tons of others) even watch the tournaments, because of the salt. lol

The players who are taking the game SERIOUSLY unlike Jwong understand the reason behind everything and don't shat on the game.

Nope.

Well, at least I know one thing: I was right about SFxT going to be ass.

It's a shame, but it's only Capcom's fault.

 

[Rice-Eater]

Dahbomb is lucky Saty isn't here.

Saty is a double edged sword. He could be our greatest ally, but also our greatest enemy at the same time. Tis best that he lurks in the shadows right now.

 

[Parallax Scroll]

in my opinion, marvel

 

[Professor Beef]

Dahbomb is lucky Saty isn't here.

Saty doesn't give a shit about Marvel, and I'm pretty sure he wouldn't waste his breath in this discussion because it's completely stupid on every side.

 

[KingofSarus]

Top players, from all countries, shitted on SFIV, SFIII, Super Turbo, the Alpha series and so on. That doesn't make them bad games, it just means that certain players don't like them.

Did those Street Fighter(s) have such bullshit like X-Factor, Dark Phoenix, or Wesker's glasses? lol

i'm not sitting here and saying marvel is a perfect game because it sure as hell is not but i can't stand when people's whole argument about why the game sucks is japan hates it.

That's not my whole argument, bro.

That's just the cherry on top. Haha

 

[DD-11]

About? Are you going to try to tell me that every shitty fighting game ever made has been deemed so because of peoples taste? Some games are just broken and shitty on a mechanical level.

That this is your argument. Japan hates it and so it's a shitty game. Or it doesn't have links so it's a shitty game. This is like arguing with a 6 year old.

Japan likes some fucked up things, their preference for things shouldn't be a measure of anything.

Marvel is different. It has different challenges and different systems. Different != shitty.

I love SFIV. I also love Marvel. I hate arguing with idiots, so I'm going to stop.

 

[Conceited]

That this is your argument. Japan hates it and so it's a shitty game. Or it doesn't have links so it's a shitty game. This is like arguing with a 6 year old.

What? I posted that article because of what Karsticles posted, not as a reflection or enforcement of my own opinion.

Also, I have never mentioned links once.

 

[crimsonspider89]

Alright then, find posts where Fchamp/ChrisG/Marlinpie/Noel(he didn't shat on it, just saying didn't have many gorgeous characters)/Rog/Viscant(trying to get better) constantly shat on it. Hell, Yipes now that he has started to take it seriously has quit giving it issues.

A lot of the young and upcoming players love this game.

But it does have issues: TAC's a big one, tags being overheads, some of the character balance choices

And XF isn't an issue with how much of the game is going to become incoming mix up city.

 

[Vice]

Did those Street Fighter(s) have such bullshit like X-Factor, Dark Phoenix, or Wesker's glasses? lol

At the time stuff like super meter, parrying, alpha counters and custom combos were considered pieces of shit by large, or vocal, chunks of the community because they destroyed the risk-reward gameplay that made Sf2 good to them. So yes, they did have bullshit.
For example, currently a lot of people think SFIV isn't as good as older games because of ultras and how the game heavily favors vortex characters.

 

[Professor Beef]

Ah, so we're at the "show me where X said Y" stage, are we?

Jesus fuck, some people will argue over anything.

 

[Karsticles]

At the time stuff like super meter, parrying, alpha counters and custom combos were considered pieces of shit by large, or vocal, chunks of the community because they destroyed the risk-reward gameplay that made Sf2 good to them. So yes, they did have bullshit.
For example, currently a lot of people think SFIV isn't as good as older games because of ultras and how the game heavily favors vortex characters.

Last I checked, Sirlin still thinks that 3S is bad.

 

[Conceited]

Ah, so we're at the "show me where X said Y" stage, are we?

Jesus fuck, some people will argue over anything.

Whoa Beef, I have seen you argue over much less.

And with my insomnia and nothing to do but watch WNF and post here, I see no reason not to have a pointless argument.

 

[smurfx]

Ah, so we're at the "show me where X said Y" stage, are we?

Jesus fuck, some people will argue over anything.

lol welcome to neogaf.