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First major contractor pulls out of Iraq

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http://www.latimes.com/news/nationw...2dec22,0,5578961.story?coll=la-home-headlines

"It would have been a crime to spend that kind of money to do that type of work," Camel-Toueg said.

THE CONFLICT IN IRAQ
U.S. Contractor Pulls Out of Reconstruction Effort in Iraq

By T. Christian Miller, Times Staff Writer

WASHINGTON — For the first time, a major U.S. contractor has dropped out of the multibillion-dollar effort to rebuild Iraq, raising new worries about the country's growing violence and its effect on reconstruction.

Contrack International Inc., the leader of a partnership that won one of 12 major reconstruction contracts awarded this year, cited skyrocketing security costs in reaching a decision with the U.S. government last month to terminate work in Iraq.



"We reached a point where our costs were getting to be prohibitive," said Karim Camel-Toueg, president of Arlington, Va.-based Contrack, which had won a $325-million award to rebuild Iraq's shattered transportation system. "We felt we were not serving the government, and that the dollars were not being spent smartly."

Although a few companies and nonprofit groups have pulled out of contracts in Iraq because of security concerns, Contrack's is the largest to be canceled to date, U.S. officials said. The move has led to fears that Iraq's mounting violence could prompt other firms to consider pulling out, or discourage them from seeking work in Iraq, further crippling reconstruction.

U.S. reconstruction officials said the termination of Contrack's contract, which was not previously disclosed, would not hamper rebuilding. They said they were planning to put the contract up for rebidding, a process that could take months, and were hopeful that Iraqi firms would participate. So far, most major contracts have been won by U.S.-based multinational firms.

Contrack's partnership was supposed to construct new roads, bridges and transportation terminals in Iraq. It wound up only refurbishing a handful of train depots, company officials said.

Nonetheless, the firm was paid about $30 million during the eight months it was under contract, mostly for site assessments and design work, company and U.S. officials said.

"It's not a terrible loss," said Amy Burns, spokeswoman for the Pentagon's Iraq Project and Contracting Office, which oversees the bulk of the reconstruction work in the country. "It actually may be good that we're both moving on."

But reconstruction experts say Contrack's withdrawal might foretell trouble with other contractors.

""It's a very bad sign," said Michael O'Hanlon, a scholar at the Brookings Institution think tank in Washington who has closely followed the reconstruction process. "If this is how other private companies are thinking, it's a very bad potential warning."

Coming as U.S. reconstruction officials have been touting signs of progress, Contrack's withdrawal underscores the challenges in the $18.4-billion effort to rebuild Iraq.

The effort to revamp the country is considered vital to providing Iraqis with jobs and services and to weakening the insurgency. So far, however, it has been beset with delays, violence, allegations of graft and waste, and frustration among ordinary Iraqis and top U.S. military commanders at the lack of progress.

Contrack's joint venture also included Egyptian and Swiss firms.

At one point, Contrack and its joint venture had hired nearly 2,000 people in Iraq and had offices in an upper-income neighborhood in Baghdad, said Wahid Hakki, Contrack's vice president for U.S. operations.

But as the insurgency intensified, company workers found themselves increasingly under assault. Small-arms and mortar fire became common at construction sites. Gunmen attacked the joint venture's headquarters about 2 1/2 months ago.

Earlier this year, an Egyptian driver working for the firm was kidnapped. His body was found 12 days later, dumped outside one of the company's construction sites with five bullet holes in the head. A note found on his body said "collaborator."

Unlike such projects as power plants, which can be secured, Contrack's work sites were roads and bridges out in the open. In some cases, Camel-Toueg said, the security expenses for simple tasks such as fixing potholes soared to 60% of the cost of the project. U.S. contracting regulations that required compliance with complex accounting rules further increased overhead.

"It would have been a crime to spend that kind of money to do that type of work," Camel-Toueg said.

The company also found that it was having difficulty with such basic matters as buying construction material. At one site, for instance, the sole supplier of gravel shut his quarry after receiving threats from insurgents about cooperating with Americans, Hakki said. The company's work ground to a halt.

Hakki contrasted the security situation in Iraq with that in Afghanistan, where the company has faced difficulties in its reconstruction work but has made progress.

"In Iraq, the general environment was very, very tough," Hakki said. "We were just not able to do what we were hoping to do. It's definitely a disappointment."

Reconstruction officials declared at a news conference last week that they had reached a milestone: more than 1,000 construction starts out of an estimated 2,500 to 3,000 planned projects.

"Even though the situation is difficult, even though the security environment is not what we'd like it to be, progress is being made," Charles Hess, director of the reconstruction office, said at the conference. He made no mention of Contrack's withdrawal.
 

mrmyth

Member
24805BP.jpg
 

Phoenix

Member
Very unfortunate. Hopefully this will mean that the US Army Corps of Engineers will be able to handle the load or otherwise things will head south. Gotta get the country up and running again if there is going to be any hope of stabilizing it.
 
mrmyth said:

No matter what your views on this war are (and I think it was a foolish, imperialistic move), it isn't excellent that this has happened. It will only make things that much more difficult if other companies start pulling out. Both for the Iraqi, and U.S. casualties.
 

mrmyth

Member
Not exactly gloating, but the less civilians over there the better. I feel Iraq is a lost cause, and I think its a waste of resources to continue trying to rebiuld it. And quite frankly, in a choice between us and them, I'd rather see their country tank than ours. Especially if ours is tanking trying to prop up theirs. Maybe if the contractors give up the current administration will actually consider pulling out in the next four years.
 

Stele

Holds a little red book
Their country tanked because they were bombed and starved by sanctions for 12 years.
 

mrmyth

Member
And I'm not arguing what got the country to its present point. I'd just rather not see Americans dying over there trying to fix what can't be fixed.
 

ShadowRed

Banned
mrmyth said:
And I'm not arguing what got the country to its present point. I'd just rather not see Americans dying over there trying to fix what can't be fixed.




Oh wait so you should be able to bomb, kill and mame at will then when it gets too expesive run home and let the people you screwed over suffer, BS.
 

Dujour

Banned
Solid Snake once said that the only winners in war are the people. I don't think it applies to this case. :/
 
mrmyth said:
Not exactly gloating, but the less civilians over there the better. I feel Iraq is a lost cause, and I think its a waste of resources to continue trying to rebiuld it. And quite frankly, in a choice between us and them, I'd rather see their country tank than ours. Especially if ours is tanking trying to prop up theirs. Maybe if the contractors give up the current administration will actually consider pulling out in the next four years.


It's a lost cause if the US is the only game in town.
 

Saturnman

Banned
ManDudeChild said:
No matter what your views on this war are (and I think it was a foolish, imperialistic move), it isn't excellent that this has happened. It will only make things that much more difficult if other companies start pulling out. Both for the Iraqi, and U.S. casualties.

In the long-term, it will make the superpower think twice before invading a perceived weak country. It also sends a message to any potential victim that they can resist quite effectively. I consider this a good thing for the future.
 

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
1980's Saturnman said:
In the long-term, it will make the superpower think twice before invading a perceived weak country. It also sends a message to any potential victim that they can resist quite effectively. I consider this a good thing for the future.
I agree with your thoughts on Vietnam.
 

Saturnman

Banned
Vietnam did teach a lesson to America and made it wary to invade other countries as eagerly... for a while. It also changed their policies in war, the importance of an exit strategy in particular, which was somehow forgotten in Iraq, even with Powell on board. :)
 
mrmyth said:
Not exactly gloating, but the less civilians over there the better. I feel Iraq is a lost cause, and I think its a waste of resources to continue trying to rebiuld it. And quite frankly, in a choice between us and them, I'd rather see their country tank than ours. Especially if ours is tanking trying to prop up theirs. Maybe if the contractors give up the current administration will actually consider pulling out in the next four years.

If their country tanks, rest assured that you will create even more people who are angry at the United States for mucking their lives. Remember 9/11? There, you just created more political ammo, and more volunteers to make its sequel.

You might say that I'm using a bogeyman here that is unlikely to occur. But, remember, half-ass meddling is what got us into this "War on Terrorism" in the first place.


Of course, I'm not even getting into the effects that a destabilized Iraq could have on its neighbors. That would spell more bad news for us too y'know.
 

Crow357

Member
Hmm, a story from the LA Times. Everytime I read one of those I have to ask myself, "Wow, what if that was true!?"
 
Crow357 said:
Hmm, a story from the LA Times. Everytime I read one of those I have to ask myself, "Wow, what if that was true!?"


:lol :lol

your favorite news channel, fox news, is even reporting this.
 
It's pretty good. Of course, the alternative where I live really sucks. I have to get my food/restaurant sections from somewhere local.
 

Phoenix

Member
Saturnman said:
Vietnam did teach a lesson to America and made it wary to invade other countries as eagerly... for a while. It also changed their policies in war, the importance of an exit strategy in particular, which was somehow forgotten in Iraq, even with Powell on board. :)

Nah. The people who forgot about exit strategies are the citizens who didn't study history. Every successful occupation that has 'ended well' took over a decade and required a manned presence during that time.
 

Crow357

Member
Incognito said:
:lol :lol

your favorite news channel, fox news, is even reporting this.

LOL... ok, well, if 2 news agencies are reporting something then I'll believe it... :)

I don't know who ripclaw is though... I'm just a red-necked red-stater that "don't know nuthin"... :D
 

Phoenix

Member
mrmyth said:
Not exactly gloating, but the less civilians over there the better. I feel Iraq is a lost cause, and I think its a waste of resources to continue trying to rebiuld it. And quite frankly, in a choice between us and them, I'd rather see their country tank than ours. Especially if ours is tanking trying to prop up theirs. Maybe if the contractors give up the current administration will actually consider pulling out in the next four years.


Foolishness. The largest attack on our country was launched from a relatively backwards destabilized country. Having a relatively advanced industrial nation destabilized has led to far far worse (i.e. Germany coming out of WWI).
 

Crow357

Member
Saturnman said:
Vietnam did teach a lesson to America and made it wary to invade other countries as eagerly... for a while. It also changed their policies in war, the importance of an exit strategy in particular, which was somehow forgotten in Iraq, even with Powell on board. :)

What I want to know is where was our exit strategy in Bosnia? We're still there btw.
 
mrmyth said:
Not exactly gloating, but the less civilians over there the better. I feel Iraq is a lost cause, and I think its a waste of resources to continue trying to rebiuld it. And quite frankly, in a choice between us and them, I'd rather see their country tank than ours. Especially if ours is tanking trying to prop up theirs. Maybe if the contractors give up the current administration will actually consider pulling out in the next four years.
:lol Don't want to repeat what others have said but simply
Two Words:
BLOW BACK
 
Saturnman said:
In the long-term, it will make the superpower think twice before invading a perceived weak country. It also sends a message to any potential victim that they can resist quite effectively.

We should go isolationalist? The UN, (the organization that should be doing this), was too busy enjoying "side benefits" from Saddam's dictatorship to give an effort in the name of people's rights. And for crying out in the beer the victims are Iraqi civilians, not the monsters causing this shit and chaos.

I consider this a good thing for the future.


And I'm glad death and loss makes you feels all betters, I really do.
 
Crow357 said:
What I want to know is where was our exit strategy in Bosnia? We're still there btw.

Well, iirc, NATO runs the peacekeeping force over in Bosnia. The EU peacekeeping force is taking over the peacekeeping duties in Bosnia. America intends on keeping about 150 troops there.

Also, remember that Bosnia under NATO has been considerably less dangerous to the foreign forces compared to Iraq under "coalition" forces.

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=3832652
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:...bosnia+casualties+nato&hl=en&client=firefox-a

edit: and er beaten by saturnman . Well, consider yourself educated.
 

Phoenix

Member
Saturnman said:
There's no real exit strategy for Bosnia, it's peace-keepng, not war or guerilla warfare. No body bags or explosion reminding the public of troops being stationned there.

Historical lessons lost I guess. For a while after the operation ended there were actions on the ground that resulted in casualties. During the monitoring operations there were still engagements. Heck during the monitoring operations over Iraq after the Gulf War US aircraft were shot at every single day. The thing is getting Iraq to that point is going to take a considerable amount of time and the longer it takes to rebuild, the longer it will take to get to that point which is why one of the primary targets for insurgents/resistance fighters has been to strike at those things that would bring stability.... like the nearly weekly attacks on police stations, recruitment stations, and training facilities.

The one error that all presidents make who go to war isn't dealing with the war, it isn't dealing with the exit strategy, it isn't with dealing with the rebuilding - its the impatience of the TV diner instant lotto US public who expects things to wrap up nicely in a short amount of time and that is never ever ever going to happen.
 

Mandark

Small balls, big fun!
Crow357: Freeper-level trolling one-liners aren't encouraged around here. Cut it out or go away.
 

Hollywood

Banned
How much worse is it there now than it was before? The thing about going into a country, your not only responsible for what you do, but the stuff that was fucked up before you even got there.
 

Crow357

Member
Mandark said:
Crow357: Freeper-level trolling one-liners aren't encouraged around here. Cut it out or go away.

I'm not sure what this means. Are a free exchange of ideas not permitted?

Well, my point wasn't about whose controlling the troops. My point was that they're still there, put there by a Democrat president who said they'd be out of there.

In Iraq, we have an exit strategy. It's about getting that country on it's feet, getting elections started so that the Iraqi's can govern themselves. When that happens, we'll leave. It may take quite a few years for that to occur. It took quite a few years for Germany after WWII. In fact, the anti US newspaper stories printed at the time are very similar to the anti US stories being printed now. History repeats itself.
 

Saturnman

Banned
Crow357 said:
In Iraq, we have an exit strategy. It's about getting that country on it's feet, getting elections started so that the Iraqi's can govern themselves. When that happens, we'll leave. It may take quite a few years for that to occur. It took quite a few years for Germany after WWII. In fact, the anti US newspaper stories printed at the time are very similar to the anti US stories being printed now. History repeats itself.

Voluntarily putting yourself in a situation where success is the only way out is not an exit strategy.
 
SatelliteOfLove said:
We should go isolationalist? The UN, (the organization that should be doing this), was too busy enjoying "side benefits" from Saddam's dictatorship to give an effort in the name of people's rights. And for crying out in the beer the victims are Iraqi civilians, not the monsters causing this shit and chaos.




And I'm glad death and loss makes you feels all betters, I really do.


You have no clue do you. Don't fool yourself for a second. There are and were American companies that were reaping the "side beinifits" as well they have just been protected. Don't be so stupid to think that this UN bashing doesn't have an angle. It does you sit back and say they do nothing but, they can only do what the US allows them to do. It isn't an independent orgnization it is ruled and led by it's biggest backers. All of which see more benifit in the status quo.


Crow said:
In Iraq, we have an exit strategy. It's about getting that country on it's feet, getting elections started so that the Iraqi's can govern themselves. When that happens, we'll leave. It may take quite a few years for that to occur. It took quite a few years for Germany after WWII. In fact, the anti US newspaper stories printed at the time are very similar to the anti US stories being printed now. History repeats itself.


Crow you are correct in saying that we have an exit strategy but you are a fucking idiot if you believe for a second that we have a successful exit strategy. There is no way in hell this place is going to be ready for democratic elections, have a stable government, or be able to secure itself. Where I am it is relatively peaceful that that means that we only hear shelling in the early morning. A buddy of mine at another base took 10 missiles a few days back. In Najaf they are strapping claymore mines to themselves and blowing up dining halls. We had an Iraqi here that was a tailor and did name tags for the soldiers and contractors they threaten to kill him and his family if he continued to make nametags. Fucking nametags can you believe that shit?

My office is near the MPs that are in charge of handling captured insurgents and the guys that are here to recruit and train the security forces. The MPs complain about having to let people go who they know are going to turn back around as try to kill us. Iraqi security forces? Ha! Those fuckers act like keystone fucking cops. On top of that the people most likely to show up to be in the security forces are the most corrupt of the bunch they are the ones most likely to shoot us in the back of the head. They join here because they have run out of options at home they are dead either way. Think of it like this if someone put up a sign saying in America saying free guns, ammo, and body armor no background check. Who would be the first to pick the stuff up? The ones most likely to use it in some crime, that’s who. Same thing here don’t let your President fool you. It’s not good here and he knows it, he also know he can lie to people like you so for him it’s a win/win. For the families that get auto signed letters from Rumsfield and the Iraqi people it’s a lose/lose.[/rant]
 

Mandark

Small balls, big fun!
Crow357 said:
Hmm, a story from the LA Times. Everytime I read one of those I have to ask myself, "Wow, what if that was true!?"
This is what I'm talking about. I don't think you need it explained, but if you do, go ahead and ask.

Do you really think the occupation of Germany is an accurate comparison? The US military didn't suffer a single combat casualty there after the war. There are a ton of other differences, but that right there should scuttle the idea.

SatelliteOfLove: If you really think there are only two policies available, I'd suggest you re-evaluate the situation. Dichotomies are so last month.

The oil-for-food reasoning on display should be avoided for two reasons. Firstly, American companies were included in Charles Duelfer's report, but were kept anonymous. Secondly, if one accepts the premise that countries support or oppose wars based on the financial interest of some corporations based on their soil, one must conclude that the US waged war on behalf of Halliburton et al.

Phoenix: Sounds to me like the problem is with the politicians who wage wars of choice and undersell the hardship involved. Also, patience in these cases is only a virtue when the situation is improving and will improve due to further occupation, something that really shouldn't be assumed.
 
Mandark said:
The oil-for-food reasoning on display should be avoided for two reasons. Firstly, American companies were included in Charles Duelfer's report, but were kept anonymous. Secondly, if one accepts the premise that countries support or oppose wars based on the financial interest of some corporations based on their soil, one must conclude that the US waged war on behalf of Halliburton et al.

A) Game, set, match
B) checkmate
C) l33t pnwage
D) all of the above
 
Tommie Hu$tle said:
You have no clue do you. Don't fool yourself for a second. There are and were American companies that were reaping the "side beinifits" as well they have just been protected. Don't be so stupid to think that this UN bashing doesn't have an angle. It does you sit back and say they do nothing but, they can only do what the US allows them to do. It isn't an independent orgnization it is ruled and led by it's biggest backers. All of which see more benifit in the status quo.

Yes. Thanks for going ahead and posting like I know nothing about Haliburton's "sailboat fuel", or the fact that some of that oil from that got here to these shores, or that American intelligence knew of the scam, but didn't act, despite no evidence. That report is new to me, though, as I haven't seen anything about American companies in it, (hardly surprising if it was true). That's the ONE angle you have here, so don't get so glib with it.

"Why the UN?" American companies or not, it's the UN's job to exert pressure on rogue nations or ones where the government rules thru tyrrany. The US shouldn't have spearheaded this, but if the US didn't, the UN don't either, then what? Stand by idly till Saddam died and have the chaos erupt later, (that's where the decent exit strategy arguement makes it's entrance)? It's a rhetorical question, but that's what fuels my internal moral debate about this situation.

And I have heard nothing about the UN being forced to take a marginalized role in Iraq; from what I've heard, the UN sent only that much when the US asked for support when Spain left. Where is this happening, and how?

Mandark: No. No I don't. Read my post in response to this post by Saturnman:

In the long-term, it will make the superpower think twice before invading a perceived weak country. It also sends a message to any potential victim that they can resist quite effectively. I consider this a good thing for the future.

It's semantics, granted, (why am I targeted for that? rofl, it's practically half the arguing at GAF), but the rest of my arguement there still stands. And to think, I agree with everything else in your post. See just how black and white I am? :)
 
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