DopeyFish said:haha the 2nd set of pictures looks weird. the forza pic almost looks more real than the real pic
ArcadeStickMonk said:I played PGR2 in a kiosk once and when I went through a turn, the whole screen "skipped" because it didn't update fast enough. That looked pathetic.
In a racer, where sense of speed is everything, it makes no sense to work such meticulous recreation if you cannot get the hardware to push it at a proper framerate.
Most of the very best console racers come out of Japan, who have taken full advantage of the current hardware. The next time they ship a 30fps racer you let me know.
.ArcadeStickMonk said:This means nothing without 60 frames
30fps in racers should be outlawed.
Ronin said:This only enforces it.
GT4 > Forza
maximum360 said:I disagree. This looks darn good. GT tends to have great looking cars but the backgrounds are never up to par.
ArcadeStickMonk said:In a racer, where sense of speed is everything, it makes no sense to work such meticulous recreation if you cannot get the hardware to push it at a proper framerate.
Shompola said:And how is the sense of speed in GT4? because it was pathetic in 60fps GT3. Midtown Madness 3, a 30fps game has a great sense of speed to the degree that I personally didn't even know it was running at 30 fps until someone told me so.
Shompola said:And how is the sense of speed in GT4?
Forsete said:Someone post that McLaren video.
Lazy8s said:A racer at 30 fps is left wanting, but pushing 60 fps to accentuate fast speeds without accompanying it with progressive scan is unsatisfactory. A high-res game at 60 fps has a full image to update every 1/60th of a second, but an interlaced TV can only display half of that. So, the interlacing of the game becomes an extra annoying high speed flicker for games that push 60 fps but can't support proscan.
The point is that, for those advocating the ideal of capturing high speed racing and saying 30 fps doesn't cut it, a game like GT4 is not a good example either because it introduces the extra problem of a strong flicker. To capture fast motion, the display has to be both smooth as well as solid.<head spinning> Didn't you guys get in to this argument over PGR2?
DopeyFish said:haha the 2nd set of pictures looks weird. the forza pic almost looks more real than the real pic
Lazy8s said:DarienA:
The point is that, for those advocating the ideal of capturing high speed racing and saying 30 fps doesn't cut it, a game like GT4 is not a good example either because it introduces the extra problem of a strong flicker. To capture fast motion, the display has to be both smooth as well as solid.
No, you just didn't read it correctly.You're full of it.
Lazy8s said:dark10x:
No, you just didn't read it correctly.
It didn't say that high-res was needed for a good display of speed; it said that proscan was needed to prevent high-res games (GT4, Forza, and every game this gen, basically) that run 60 fps from having an unusually strong flicker and worsening the solidity of their display.
You provided no counter-argument at all (just a separate argument covering trade-offs), and this last issue here was completely beside the point regarding the technical issues. However, for this, it should be noted that the people playing their games in proscan could very well be doing it on a monitor instead of a TV and not have line-doubling capabilities to compensate for interlaced games, especially at this point in time with this generation of machines.So, if both Forza and GT4 were 60 fps...they would both flicker on an analog TV while neither would suffer from that problem on a progressive scan TV (though Forza's 480p output would certainly look cleaner).
XboxGamers said:Forza got graphics features that the PS2 hardware can't comprehend.
Lazy8s said:dark10x:
You provided no counter-argument at all (just a separate argument covering trade-offs), and this last issue here was completely beside the point regarding the technical issues. However, for this, it should be noted that the people playing their games in proscan could very well be doing it on a monitor instead of a TV and not have line-doubling capabilities to compensate for interlaced games, especially at this point in time with this generation of machines.
but pushing 60 fps to accentuate fast speeds without accompanying it with progressive scan is unsatisfactory. A high-res game at 60 fps has a full image to update every 1/60th of a second, but an interlaced TV can only display half of that. So, the interlacing of the game becomes an extra annoying high speed flicker for games that push 60 fps but can't support proscan.
ArcadeStickMonk said:I believe this game needs 60 frames
Lazy8s said:I can tell you about 60 frames
dark10x said:Oh snap!
Gek54 said:PS2 does AA, but what do you mean 'full details'?
Vitten said:Reality wins.
Society said:wow, that pit picture in gt4 is pretty....empty,
dark10x said:If you are using an HDTV, you will experience flicker-free gameplay. If you are using a monitor, you're shit out of luck (like all those poor GC users who wanted to play Tales of Symphonia but only had access to a monitor...).
people like me will notice the really basic lighting in GT4, the low res baked lightmaps for the cars
Both 30fps, as well as picture flicker, hurt the overall look of the game.
Yeah for the most part, but the colors and resolution is going to look muddy. Not having progressive scan is a no no in my book, no 2 ways about it. And what's with those GT4 pics with AA turned on when it's not turned on in the game? I'd rather see pics of what the game really looks like (that goes for Tecmo's fake ass pics also).