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[gofreak]

Seems almost obligatory to consult GAF on planned PC component purchases, so here I am

I've had my current PC about 18 months now, I think, and I'm itching to give it an upgrade, and also get Vista. My current spec is a AMD X2 3800+, 512MB of really crappy RAM that I intended to upgrade but never did, a DFI Lanparty nf4 motherboard, a overclocked XFX 7900 GT, and a 600W Seasonic PSU.

So I'm looking to replace a few core components, as per this list. GPU will be upgraded later in the year.

Gigabyte GA_P35C_DS3R (Socket 775)
- A new P35 board. Support for 45nm Penryns, and DDR3 (and DDR2). It's only downside I can tell is just the one PCI-Express x16 slot, but it's not a big deal as I doubt I'll ever use SLi.

4GB GeIL (4x1GB) PC6400C4 800MHz Ultra Low Latency DDR2 (CAS 4-4-4-12)
- Yes, I plan to get Vista 64-bit..

Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 "LGA775 Conroe" 2.40GHz (1066FSB)

All this, plus vista OEM, comes in under €700 inc delivery.

So I guess asides from any glaring no-nos that might be there, I've a couple of specific questions. I'm interested in overclocking the conroe, it seems they're great overclockers, but I've heard a couple of people say that it might be more difficult to overclock using 4 sticks of RAM than 2. I would like the 4GB, and the only 2GB sticks that I can find (for 2x2GB) seem to be CL5 or higher. These Geil sticks seem to be really good for overclocking, apparently, with very flexible voltage accomodation etc. but I hope I'm not screwing myself by getting 4 of them. I'm not looking for a MAJOR overclock, but 3-3.2Ghz would be nice..

Second, on the CPU, if I don't want to aggressively overclock, would I be as well off getting a E6420 now? It'd save me 40 euro, but I'm not sure if it would clock as easily to the range I'm thinking of, as above.

Finally, my current system seems quite noisy even though I tried to select components that would be quiet :lol Can anyone recommend a good CPU cooler that's OK for overclocking and also very quiet (fanless perhaps?), or would I be OK with the stock cooler? And more generally, might it make sense to replace my case fans perhaps with something quieter? The ones I have now were supposed to be quiet, but there are 2 or 3 of them in there..

Thanks for any tips..

 

[Bauer Action Hour]

As far as overclocking is concerned, I've got an E4300 @ 3Ghz w/ air cooling (Scythe Ninja fan/HS on an MSI P6N Platinum board). You should have no problem hitting 3Ghz w/ the E6420 and especially w/ the E6600.

In your place, I'd grab the E6420 and save the 40 Euros (maybe for a new vga card).

 

[gofreak]

As far as overclocking is concerned, I've got an E4300 @ 3Ghz w/ air cooling (Scythe Ninja fan/HS on an MSI P6N Platinum board). You should have no problem hitting 3Ghz w/ the E6420 and especially w/ the E6600.

In your place, I'd grab the E6420 and save the 40 Euros (maybe for a new vga card).

I've read the 4300s are champion overclockers, but I'm sort of hesitant on the smaller cache, and curious if I could overclock a E6600 or E6420 even further then..

Do you use a fan with the Scythe Ninja, and if so, which one? Fanless appeals to me, but they say not to use it without one if you're on a high frequency CPU with heavy loads.

 

[Thyrus]

The stock cooler on the E6600 is fine really, it's the same one that intel used on those crazy P4 chips which ran hot as hell so it's overkill for the cool running E6600. It's fairly quiet and decent for some mild overclocking (3.0 shouldn't be a problem). You'll want an aftermarket cooler if you're aiming for records tho.

Clocking an e6420 to e6600 speeds or beyond shouldn't be a problem on a good mobo and ram, heck you might not even have to change the core voltage.

Btw, i wouldn't get an OEM edition. At the moment 64bit vista has a few more quirks than 32 bit. Sure alot of things will work just fine but some won't and well a retail vista comes as both 32 and 64 bit so you won't be screwd over if 64bit gives you too many headaches. There's also poorer backwards compatibility in 64bit vista due to no automatic file and registery redirection.

Another point againt OEM is the fact that your license will be tied to that single motherboard, and with microsofts new initiative of enforcing activation you're probably screwd if you want to change mobo or get another one. If you get a retail one you'll have 32 bit and 64 bit vista for any PC you have for the rest of your life (or more likely the 7-9 years vista will last).

 

[gofreak]

tw, i wouldn't get an OEM edition. At the moment 64bit vista has a few more quirks than 32 bit. Sure alot of things will work just fine but some won't and well a retail vista comes as both 32 and 64 bit so you won't be screwd over if 64bit gives you too many headaches. There's also poorer backwards compatibility in 64bit vista due to no automatic file and registery redirection.

Another point againt OEM is the fact that your license will be tied to that single motherboard, and with microsofts new initiative of enforcing activation you're probably screwd if you want to change mobo or get another one. If you get a retail one you'll have 32 bit and 64 bit vista for any PC you have for the rest of your life (or more likely the 7-9 years vista will last).

Hmm, retail is so expensive though. And I'm not sure, but according to amazon, only the 32-bit DVD comes with the retail version, and you have to order the 64-bit separately, which seems like a PITA. (At least that's according to amazon.com ... amazon.co.uk doesn't say that).

The upgrade option is cheaper, but I'd be worried about having a bunch of legacy XP stuff still on my system (is that something to worry about?). I'd also still need to wait for MS to ship me a 64-bit version if I went that route..and what happens when I need to reinstall? Install XP first, and then Vista?

 

[Thyrus]

If you go the upgrade route you'll have to have XP installed yeah. This article explains it.

While retail costs more and you'll have to order the 64 bit disc from microsoft you do get both version to own for life and to install on how many different machines you want (only 1 at a time ofcourse). It only costs about twice as much as an OEM for a full or 50% for an upgrade, so that cost is recovered as soon as you get another motherboard (the OEM license is for one system and one system is defined as the motherboard). So if say your mobo goes down then odds are you're buying a new vista license again.

I'd just get the full one, saves you from having to have XP installed, saves you from buying a new vista with each different motherboard and you'll have a 32 bit to fall back on if the 64 bit dosn't work properly (odds are it isn't mature enough yet driver or software wise). Course if you're willing to install XP every time you want to install vista then just get an upgrade package, i just can't be bothered to hehe.

 

[gofreak]

I can see the longer term argument, for sure. Although it's more like 3x the price where I am, for the full retail version (well, ~€270 vs ~€100)

I don't understand why they don't put both discs in the box. You're paying enough for it!

I am leaning toward full retail, though..things just might work out more expensive than i'd hoped :/

 

[ORANGUTAN]

Quad Core Q660 price drop on July 22nd ($266). Definitely get that instead.. a no-brainer

 

[gofreak]

Yeah, I had considered that. But I kind of want to pull the trigger on this imminently. I've looked at the Q6600 prices here, and even if they're cut in half with this price drop, where I am they'll still be a fair bit more expensive than a E6600 or E6420 will be for me now. I also reckon by the time I want a quad core, it'll be a more mature penryn that I'm after, or perhaps I'll skip straight to an octocore with their series after that (and with a new mobo of course).

edit - to update, I'm going to get a Thermalright Ultra-120 Extreme with a Scythe fan..as per Anandtech, that offers the best air cooling performance and amongst the quietest cooling they've seen. But I'm kind of thinking of going with the E6420 now since costs are mounting..I figure I should be able to overclock it to 3-3.2Ghz, and maybe a little more. The E6600 would probably go a little further, but..

 

[gofreak]

A small update and a couple of new 'post-build'/overclocking questions.

So I've got everything set up, Vista 64-bit installed, first impressions are very good. To clarify, I went with the E6420, Thermalright Ultra-120 Extreme cooler with Sythe fan, 4GB of Geil PC6400 4-4-4-12 RAM. I've now taken to overclocking it. Incrementally worked my way up to 3.2Ghz (stock is 2.13Ghz). This is far as I can go with a 1:1 FSB:RAM ratio without overclocking my memory.

Now my question. First, on temperatures, the idle temp at 3.2Ghz is 30C, and under load (orthos), they seem to max out at 53C. I've been trying to find out what's reasonable for load temperatures, but most temperature guides I can find are quite complicated..I really just need to know what's safe, and moreover, feasible for regular use. Thusfar it seems OK, no crashing, but I'm slightly put off by SpeedFan's placement of little 'flame' icons beside my 50C+ temperatures..

Second, with those kinds of temps, would it be reasonable to look into further overclocking?

(I know if I spent enough time I could get all these answers on a dedicated OC board, but sometimes GAF is just easier And I know I've seen some people discussing conroes and overclocking before, so I figure someone might have an idea..thanks!)

 

[Tyrannical]

You only have half a gig of crappy RAM.

Buy 2 gig of ram that would work both in your current mobo and the one you are thinking of getting. Maybe decent RAM would remove your itch to upgrade.