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[krameriffic]

If you use the same weapon type, itll be the same 5 skills. Some people have complained that combat while leveling gets pretty samey.

I liked the system from GW1 where you acquired certain skills for certain weapons from enemies that used them. It gave extra variety to the skills you chose and also a nice sense of player-driven progression. I find it perplexing that each weapon type has only as many skills associated with it as you can slot. It gives you a choice of skills through which weapon, but eliminates any choice within a certain class of weapon.

 

[Varna]

You choose the last five skills of the game based primarily off your class.

I think I understand. But two of these slots of locked for certain types of skills.. healing and elite. I'm sure you are more limited on those options.

 

[Orayn]

Do the 5 weapon skills ever change? Maybe get different Sword abilities as you level up?

So you basically only choose 3 skills?

The first five are based on your weapon and profession. Each profession has five skills for each two-handed weapon it can use, three for each main hand weapon, and two for each off-hand weapon.

The next five are chosen by you, and constrained by certain categories. Each procession has half a dozen choices of self-heal and elite skills, and many more choices of utility skill. Racial skills are also utilities.

 

[Escape Goat]

Let me explain what an overflow server is and what it does. It is a technology we also use as our version of a queuing system. When a map or a world you want to log into is at capacity limit, the game will ask you if you want to play on an overflow server - so you can actually play while you are in a queue. Once space opens on your world, the game will ask you if you want to join your friends on your world. And you keep all the progress you made while you were playing on the overflow server.

This is pretty awesome. I'm really shocked that nobody has ever done this before. Part of the reason I stopped playing WoW was because I could never log in to my stupid server without waiting in a queue.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

So many videos and new information. March can't come quick enough.

 

[Helmholtz]

I have to say, while I'm extremely excited for GW2, I share some of the above concerns about the skill system. Having 5 predetermined skills just seems like such a step back from GW1. It seems like something that will reduce creativity and increase repetitiveness. GW1's system of choosing whichever 8 skills you wanted was pretty good, imo. I really hope my concerns are unfounded though.

 

[Aeris130]

I have to say, while I'm extremely excited for GW2, I share some of the above concerns about the skill system. Having 5 predetermined skills just seems like such a step back from GW1. It seems like something that will reduce creativity and increase repetitiveness. GW1's system of choosing whichever 8 skills you wanted was pretty good, imo. I really hope my concerns are unfounded though.

You don't choose any 8 skills in GW1 however, you go to pvx wiki and search for a build that the top 1% have math'd out for you (check the GW wiki for comments on individual encounters and bring whatever skill is needed outside the build). Anything else and you're gimping yourself. The same will probably happen in GW2, but at least this guarantees that casual players will always have a bare minimum of useful skills available no matter how they spec.

 

[Helmholtz]

You don't choose any 8 skills in GW1 however, you go to pvx wiki and search for a build that the top 1% have math'd out for you (check the GW wiki for comments on individual encounters and bring whatever skill is needed outside the build). Anything else and you're gimping yourself. The same will probably happen in GW2, but at least it'll be impossible for casual players to fill their entire bar in a "bad" way.

A lot of PVX builds are overrated, imo. I created most of mine. The same PVX build stuff will likely exist in GW2 as well, but instead of showing 8 skills it will show which weapons to use and the best utility/elite skills that go along with them. I always thought part of the fun in GW1 was setting up different builds and experimenting. It just seems like in GW2 the experimentation with skills will be significantly reduced.
Edit: I do agree about the whole casual player thing though. Whenever I introduced a friend to GW1 and we started playing, their skill bar was almost always atrocious. So this new system will certainly help fix that. But I'm more concerned about late game variety.

 

[RepairmanJack]

A lot of PVX builds are overrated, imo. I created most of mine. The same PVX build stuff will likely exist in GW2 as well, but instead of showing 8 skills it will show which weapons to use and the best utility/elite skills that go along with them. I always thought part of the fun in GW1 was setting up different builds and experimenting. It just seems like in GW2 the experimentation with skills will be significantly reduced.

I could be wrong, but my understanding was that it would almost be required to swap weapons mid combat to really be efficient. With long CD's and different sets being good for different situations and what not. I took it as it would be pretty hard to stick with just one weapon in a fight and come out on top. To me this adds a lot more depth to the combat and a lot more of a skill gap in the game. At least that is what I am hoping for, if anything I would think it would bring more depth than the previous system. Though I didn't play GW1 much at all.

 

[Dinosaur Tamer]

You can also switch between two different weapon sets on the fly, right? That would be pretty much like having a cooldown that lets you cycle between two sets for your first 5 skills on the bar.

Edit:

I could be wrong, but my understanding was that it would almost be required to swap weapons mid combat to really be efficient. With long CD's and different sets being good for different situations and what not. I took it as it would be pretty hard to stick with just one weapon in a fight and come out on top. To me this adds a lot more depth to the combat and a lot more of a skill gap in the game. At least that is what I am hoping for, if anything I would think it would bring more depth than the previous system. Though I didn't play GW1 much at all.

Yeah, right. I got the same impression from some of the beta videos.

 

[Proven]

I have to say, while I'm extremely excited for GW2, I share some of the above concerns about the skill system. Having 5 predetermined skills just seems like such a step back from GW1. It seems like something that will reduce creativity and increase repetitiveness. GW1's system of choosing whichever 8 skills you wanted was pretty good, imo. I really hope my concerns are unfounded though.

Let's take the Warrior for example. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/List_of_warrior_skills

From his weapon skills, the last two (Harpoon Gun and Spear) are both aquatic weapons. So counting only everything about that, and ignoring the burst skills as they're a profession mechanic, you have 40 skills to choose from. They come in sets of 2s, 3s, and 5s, sure. But now you have to also weigh the use of each of those skills with whatever else you're carrying. There are a lot of possible combinations, and they're all designed to fit together and accomplish different things; there's no need to always combine that with this for an optimal build. You're then allowed to bring two weapon sets into battle, allowing you to round out your options more.

Now let's look at the skills placed in the second half of his bar. The Warrior has 4 skills to choose for his Heal, 16 to choose for his Utilities, and 3 to choose for his Elite. From those combinations, you have to weigh each of those with each other, and your weapon skills. You don't get to swap in a second set of this in the middle of battle, so their choices are very important. But that doesn't stop you from bring a skill that works better with one weapon set or another, a skill that works for both equally, or a skill that powers your other utilities.

Put that all together, and you're choosing a full bar of 15 skills that work together for you and can answer a number of situations.

Looking back on Guild Wars 1, as a warrior you'd have to bring, let's say, 3 different skills that were specific for your weapon set? And if you swapped weapons in battle, then it had to be for a specific purpose since you'd lose those 3 skills. Then you could fill the rest of your bar with utilities or spells or what-have-you, but at least one slot was going to go for Elites, and in a lot of cases you'd bring a Resurrection Signet as well, right? So that's 5 skill slots used off the bat with 3 slots left, and on top of that you were picking them primarily for one weapon so you if an enemy brought something into battle that countered you, you were pretty boned.

That's the changed philosophy of Guild Wars 2.

 

[AppleSmack]

One thing I don't understand in this game is the level "side kicking". Doesn't this mean that you can easily skip literally all the content of the game and just go to the end game? Like what is the benefit of actually doing the dynamic events and quests? Why bother getting XP when you can just jump levels at will anyway? I'm not sure about this sort of feature because it'll kind of kill the rewarding and accomplished feeling you get after working up to a certain level.

 

[Hawkian]

It just seems like in GW2 the experimentation with skills will be significantly reduced.

I actually doubt this. Remember that you can switch weapon sets in the middle of combat, which means you actually have a considerably higher number of skills at your disposal at any given time than you did in GW1, even if you don't get to pick every single one regardless of what weapon you're using. There will be a lot of different combinations to try and I bet a lot will be viable.

It very much has the appearance to me of a system that's very simple at first but has a lot of depth behind it.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

One thing I don't understand in this game is the level "side kicking". Doesn't this mean that you can easily skip literally all the content of the game and just go to the end game? Like what is the benefit of actually doing the dynamic events and quests? Why bother getting XP when you can just jump levels at will anyway? I'm not sure about this sort of feature because it'll kind of kill the rewarding and accomplished feeling you get after working up to a certain level.

Because it's not your real level and you won't have access to the same things that a level 80 has(equipment/skill wise). Sidekicking up only works if you're with a higher level person I believe.

I also cannot think of a reason why someone would want to skip to the end. Kind of defeats the purpose of buying the game if you ask me.

 

[Jiraiza]

Count me in on being impressed by the overflow server thing. Now there won't be people complaining about getting reimbursed for their lost game time! (Not that it matters here anyway.)

 

[Sophia]

It very much has the appearance to me of a system that's very simple at first but has a lot of depth behind it.

It actually reminds me of how League of Legends handles it's skill summoner spell system, in a way. Except with five skills rather than two.

 

[AppleSmack]

Because it's not your real level and you won't have access to the same things that a level 80 has(equipment/skill wise). Sidekicking up only works if you're with a higher level person I believe.

I also cannot think of a reason why someone would want to skip to the end. Kind of defeats the purpose of buying the game if you ask me.

So working up gear and stuff at the higher level makes a difference right? Like completing dungeons and getting the loot from that will give you gear that is better than other level 80s have right? So there is a still a stat system? I can still imagine people just going up to level 80 for the hell of it so they could get the best gear and play the "real game" early on.

 

[Proven]

One thing I don't understand in this game is the level "side kicking". Doesn't this mean that you can easily skip literally all the content of the game and just go to the end game? Like what is the benefit of actually doing the dynamic events and quests? Why bother getting XP when you can just jump levels at will anyway? I'm not sure about this sort of feature because it'll kind of kill the rewarding and accomplished feeling you get after working up to a certain level.

Yeah, you could go to the end game if you had a level 80 friend that pulled you there through party mechanics. Yeah, you'd have your stats boosted too. But the experience you gain is scaled, you don't get any access to any new skills, it doesn't count for your actual story completion rate, and the weaponry you gain is either scaled or will be useless to you once you leave as the level requirement would be too high.

It'd be just like jumping into WvWvW at level 2. Yes, you're allowed to do this, but your contribution will be minimal and you're not actually getting boosted.

The primary point of allowing this is so you can always play with your friends. No matter what, always. The higher level guy will still do much of the carrying, as just having your stats increase or decrease doesn't change the difficulty of the dungeon or area. You'll play together for a couple hours, have a blast, and then when you go solo again you're plopped back right where you left in terms of your story/progress, and you'll only actually have gained about 5 levels.

So working up gear and stuff at the higher level makes a difference right? Like completing dungeons and getting the loot from that will give you gear that is better than other level 80s have right? So there is a still a stat system? I can still imagine people just going up to level 80 for the hell of it so they could get the best gear and play the "real game" early on.

Gear is gated by level. I don't know how the system works for finding rarer (greens, blues, etc.) weapons works. And bonus stats for equipment have to be essentially "crafted" in, but I'm not sure if that scales with your level.

 

[AppleSmack]

Yeah, you could go to the end game if you had a level 80 friend that pulled you there through party mechanics. Yeah, you'd have your stats boosted to. But the experience you gain is scaled, you don't get any access to any new skills, it doesn't count for your actual story completion rate, and the weaponry you gain is either scaled or will be useless to you once you leave as the level requirement would be too high.

It'd be just like jumping into WvWvW at level 2. Yes, you're allowed to do this, but your contribution will be minimal and you're not actually getting boosted.

The primary point of allowing this is so you can always play with your friends. No matter what, always. The higher level guy will still do much of the carrying, as just having your stats increase or decrease doesn't change the difficulty of the dungeon or area. You'll play together for a couple hours, have a blast, and then when you go solo again you're plopped back right where you left in terms of your story/progress, and you'll only actually have gained about 5 levels.

Ah I see, so you can only do it temporarily to play with someone. You can't do it at will and make it permanent? Makes more sense, thanks.

 

[Helmholtz]

skill stuff

Yeah, I suppose this makes sense. I think the problem is I'm thinking more in terms of the way GW1's combat worked, which was a lot less dependent on dodging and way less dependent on weapon swapping.
Thanks for alleviating my fears a bit

 

[Escape Goat]

One thing I don't understand in this game is the level "side kicking". Doesn't this mean that you can easily skip literally all the content of the game and just go to the end game? Like what is the benefit of actually doing the dynamic events and quests? Why bother getting XP when you can just jump levels at will anyway? I'm not sure about this sort of feature because it'll kind of kill the rewarding and accomplished feeling you get after working up to a certain level.

Considering the game doesn't have a subscription each month, people are going to play as long as they are having fun. So there isn't a need to develop time sinks to draw out subscriptions. So why not let people play with their friends whenever they want? The people who want to conquer every mission and get every prize will still level up normally. And the people who would normally drop the game play awhile longer. And both groups are more likely to pay Arena money in the form of macrotransactions which add up faster and net more profit per transaction than a monthly sub.

 

[AppleSmack]

Considering the game doesn't have a subscription each month, people are going to play as long as they are having fun. So there isn't a need to develop time sinks to draw out subscriptions. So why not let people play with their friends whenever they want? The people who want to conquer every mission and get every prize will still level up normally. And the people who would normally drop the game play awhile longer. And both groups are more likely to pay Arena money in the form of macrotransactions which add up faster and net more profit per transaction than a monthly sub.

Because it kills the sense of reward and accomplishment you get from legitly going from 1-80. its not just about milking subscriptions. There will never be any sense of accomplishment if people can just hop levels at will and make them permanent. I agree with letting people temporarily go to their friends level or their friend being able to go down to theirs to play with one another, but it definitely should not be something permanent. As soon as your friend decides he doesn't want to play with you anymore you should go back to where you are really supposed to be in the game. You definitely should have to work for things such as better gear and being a true level 80.

 

[Escape Goat]

Because it kills the sense of reward and accomplishment you get from legitly going from 1-80. its not just about milking subscriptions. I agree with letting people temporarily go to their friends level or their friend being able to go down to theirs to play with one another, but it definitely should not be something permanent. As soon as your friend decides he doesn't want to play with you anymore you should go back to where you are really supposed to be in the game.

I thought you did go back to you original level once you left your friend's group?

 

[mysteriousmage09]

A lot of PVX builds are overrated, imo. I created most of mine. The same PVX build stuff will likely exist in GW2 as well, but instead of showing 8 skills it will show which weapons to use and the best utility/elite skills that go along with them. I always thought part of the fun in GW1 was setting up different builds and experimenting. It just seems like in GW2 the experimentation with skills will be significantly reduced.
Edit: I do agree about the whole casual player thing though. Whenever I introduced a friend to GW1 and we started playing, their skill bar was almost always atrocious. So this new system will certainly help fix that. But I'm more concerned about late game variety.

If anything the variety is much higher. Look at the Elementalist for example. You can start with fire attunement abilities doing aoe or whatever in which you have 15 skills with the weapon combos you can use (not counting the exclusive underwater abilities), and then you can instantly swap attunement to say air magic and then you have another 15 skills with the weapon combos to use and start lashing lightning abilities around and on to earth attunement for another 15 abilities after that if you wish and then there's water attunement for even more abilities.

You are now given a much larger arsenal abilities that you can combo together anyway you see fit. So I don't see where you see skill experimentation has been significantly reduced.

 

[etiolate]

I have to say, while I'm extremely excited for GW2, I share some of the above concerns about the skill system. Having 5 predetermined skills just seems like such a step back from GW1. It seems like something that will reduce creativity and increase repetitiveness. GW1's system of choosing whichever 8 skills you wanted was pretty good, imo. I really hope my concerns are unfounded though.

Yeah it's a real concern. An additional concern is that the weapon bars are setup to have one spammable skill and the rest on cooldowns. This makes it very obvious how to play, but very limiting. You aren't going to see two greatsword Mesmers play differently. They have one spammable skill and the rest will be hit on cooldown. There's isn't options for other ways to play that weapon set. The game really needs more than one constantly available skill per weapon.

 

[AppleSmack]

I thought you did go back to you original level once you left your friend's group?

Yeah, that is why I'm fine with it. I thought it was something that you can do at will and make permanent .

 

[Nymerio]

About sidekicking: Can you sidekick yourself down to a friends level or does it only work one way?

 

[AppleSmack]

About sidekicking: Can you sidekick yourself down to a friends level or does it only work one way?

Yep, works both ways.

 

[Principate]

About sidekicking: Can you sidekick yourself down to a friends level or does it only work one way?

Your automatically sidekicked down to the level of the event (actually one or two higher). Means you pretty much can't ruin an event by one shotting stuff and also every event is viable.

 

[flyinpiranha]

Considering the game doesn't have a subscription each month, people are going to play as long as they are having fun. So there isn't a need to develop time sinks to draw out subscriptions. So why not let people play with their friends whenever they want? The people who want to conquer every mission and get every prize will still level up normally. And the people who would normally drop the game play awhile longer. And both groups are more likely to pay Arena money in the form of macrotransactions which add up faster and net more profit per transaction than a monthly sub.

What kind of transactions were in GW1? I didn't play it so not sure how they make money on this besides expansions. Or are the expansions where the cash cow is?

Has there been any word on what kind of things are "for sale" in game?

 

[AppleSmack]

What kind of transactions were in GW1? I didn't play it so not sure how they make money on this besides expansions. Or are the expansions where the cash cow is?

Has there been any word on what kind of things are "for sale" in game?

I've heard rumors about shit like faster leveling potions. They said it'll be nothing that will hurt gameplay for others.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sidekick

Explained here. You have to be with someone for it to work and you won't be getting level 80 rewards for example.

You will get xp and equipment somewhat proportional to your real level but will be lower than if you're playing in level appropriate zones.

So there's no issue of people getting powerful equipment a head of time.

 

[Levyne]

What kind of transactions were in GW1? I didn't play it so not sure how they make money on this besides expansions. Or are the expansions where the cash cow is?

Has there been any word on what kind of things are "for sale" in game?

Costumes, extra storage or character space, ability to have other character's on the account as heroes of each other, some other stuff

^ That is what you can buy for guild wars 1, other than the expansions

 

[Nymerio]

Awesome. That's something that always bothered me with other mmos, that I couldn't really use my main to play with a friend who just started the game.

 

[schwupp]

just to clear it up:
weapons and armor are still just skins like in gw1?

 

[Principate]

just to clear it up:
weapons and armor are still just skins like in gw1?

At max level yeah, though there's a large variety.

 

[Helmholtz]

Costumes, extra storage or character space, ability to have other character's on the account as heroes of each other, some other stuff

^ That is what you can buy for guild wars 1, other than the expansions

Also Skill Unlock packs, which unlock every skill in the game for PVP characters to use, and PVE characters to unlock via tomes. Character item unlock packs that let you unlock PVP weapons/items. Makeover packs that let you change the way a character looks. Character name change.
The unlock packs likely won't be valid in GW2 though, seeing as how there are no strict pvp characters.

 

[flyinpiranha]

I've heard rumors about shit like faster leveling potions. They said it'll be nothing that will hurt gameplay for others.

Costumes, extra storage or character space, ability to have other character's on the account as heroes of each other, some other stuff

^ That is what you can buy for guild wars 1, other than the expansions

Cool, sounds awesome.

I like the idea of being able to throw a couple bucks at the game to make me look like I want to instead of farming for months.

 

[Orayn]

just to clear it up:
weapons and armor are still just skins like in gw1?

Kind of. The itemization is a little more varied when you're leveling up, but it's similar to the original once you hit the "plateau" at level 30. It's also gone from being primarily crafted to being looted or bought with karma from completing world events.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Awesome post about weapon skills

Thanks for all the info, it actually all makes a ton of sense.
Can't wait to experiment with all the available weapon types.

 

[Dinosaur Tamer]

After seeing how much the game borrows from DAoC I wonder if there will be some kind of rank or title system for PvP. I am not sure how I would feel about PvP rewards being limited to cosmetic armor upgrades.

Edit: Just to clarify: the game shows enemy players in WvWvW as "Blue/Red/Green Intruder", which is very similar to how DAoC handled this in RvR. Now, in DAoC you could gain PvP ranks that would replace the Intruder "title" that enemies see. Considering how similar the whole WvWvW system seems to be to DAoC already, I would love if they "borrowed" this as well.

 

[Sent]

After seeing how much the game borrows from DAoC I wonder if there will be some kind of rank or title system for PvP. I am not sure how I would feel about PvP rewards being limited to cosmetic armor upgrades.

I saw titles for Achievements so I'm sure there are ones for PVP (there were emotes for pvp in GW1 etc)

 

[etiolate]

From the ANet blog update posted in here earlier ( I think?)

The first three skills that a player gets while downed are determined by their profession while the fourth skill is shared by all professions. This fourth skill is used to call for help and make you invulnerable for a short period of time. While playing, we found that it was possible to get into a situation where you were down, but there were no enemies around to either finish you or that you could use to rally. This left you watching yourself slowly slip into unconsciousness while there was nothing you could do to stop it. Needless to say, this was not a particularly fun experience. To fix this problem, we turned this fourth skill into a channeled heal that is interrupted by damage. This means that as long as there are no enemies around to damage you, you’ll be able to revive yourself.

Also, some changes to boons and conditions. Poison now reduces outgoing healing, and weakness and vigor adjust endurance regeneration.

 

[schwupp]

At max level yeah, though there's a large variety.

good

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

I just remembered that they are adding a custom soundtrack feature in to the game. Going to put that Xenoblade OST to work(after listening to the original game tracks first).

 

[Helmholtz]

From the ANet blog update posted in here earlier ( I think?)



Also, some changes to boons and conditions. Poison now reduces outgoing healing, and weakness and vigor adjust endurance regeneration.

The new downed/defeated system sounds great, and very sensible.

 

[Jira]

TB: Finished editing up the cinematics video, I will upload that from here, the rest of what I work on today is for upload tomorrow.

- Fact is I've got very little time before I go to Finland for Assembly and I can't really pump out videos until after that

~ 5 hours of WvW footage.

Sooo footage from TB will be slow...by that time some of us might be in beta.

Speaking of which:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Vf25p1F0PPM

 

[Vigilant Walrus]

About lack of skill variety:

This is iconic, because people are still in the old themepark model of thinking. I am not sure there is something like a "Greatsword Mesmer". That is now how it's supposed to work. I am not sure that challenging content is designed to have a user only use one skill set exclusively. I don't think so.
Please also remember that having 1-5 being direct combat skills TO ONLY ONE weapon type, you still have 5-10 as defensive, supportive, healing, elite, and other useful spells. I absolutely think that GW2 will have much more practical variety than GW1.

What I mean by that, is that GW1 had an amazing amount of skills. But many skills were rarely used and many of them felt, played, seemed, looked and sounded identical outside of a 0.5 change difference in energy cost, or cooldown or something else. This means that GW1 had theoretically a larger amount of skills, but in practice and while gaming, many were just fluff.

It's really not different than what Blizzard is doing with WoWs talent tree. They are trying to remove the bullshit from their talent trees. And people cry foul because their illusions of choice is ruined. But fact of the matter is that a lot of those illusionary ways of playing woulfd be hindering for your characters. That's not true all the time. Particularly for GW1. It always seemed like that people had decided that some crazy build was overpowered, but then suddenly out of nowhere appeared a counter. GW1 really was the ultimate FOTM(Flavor of the month) type build game. But that's not always fun.
I'm looking forward to much more unity.

It's also shocking, but also great to hear stories of people being challenged about the game. Because suddenly it's not just looking at the HUD. No - it's dodging in all directions. Some of the players in WvW with short and long bows seemed really annoying, when just shooting melee guys down from their mighty towers.

 

[Hawkian]

can you use a gamepad with the game?? seems perfect for it

Yes you can, even if you can't. I played GW with a gamepad a ton and this seems way more suited for it.

 

[etiolate]

Walrus there was tons of choice and tons of builds in GW1. This is like you talking nonsense about GvG. There was no illusion of choice. There were new builds being made years after the game's release because of skill variety.

Also, when you design your skills purely around cooldowns, and you're locking half of the skillbars, then you are locking people into a playstyle. Utility skills are never meant to be main skills. You can tell that by their cooldown and functions. The weapon skills are meant to be primary skills. If you only have one skill up to use and the game demands you be constantly doing something, then the game is designed for you to spam that skill.