I'm going to take $1,405.35 and turn it into $100,000 using stock options.

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Ash_69 said:
I was just going to make this point. The only way you will cash in is if the release far exceeds market expectations. The release of the game and its potential revenue would have been factored into the share price long ago.

Also great thread! Studied accounting and finance 5 years ago but realised how much I had forgotten!
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It's like how apple stock went up when they announced the iPhone 5 because it pleased investors and potential sales targets were through the roof. After release weekend the sales were "only" 5M, missing the 6-8M analyst target.
Massive freak out end of the world is upon us apple is doomed happened that week.
It's a love-hate game... Options are stressful as hell
 
Intresting experiment, wish I had some money to invest that I didn't mind losing.
 
CyclopsRock said:
They also said "This to me means that if I have diversified portfolio, I will make money in the long run no matter what." You can't really have a 'diversified portfolio' of two indices. Whatever man, who cares - either of us could be right, and at any rate, it doesn't matter a jot does it?
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Of course buying into a hedge fund doesn't make you diversified either.

Hedge funds are high risk leveraged funds originally designed to offset some other cost or risk, hence 'hedge' fund.

Index funds are what he was referring to, they are themost intrintrinsically diverse securities you can buy. Hedge funds on the other hand can be focused on a segment or even an individual stock.
 
iamblades said:
Of course buying into a hedge fund doesn't make you diversified either.

Hedge funds are high risk leveraged funds originally designed to offset some other cost or risk, hence 'hedge' fund.

Index funds are what he was referring to, they are themost intrintrinsically diverse securities you can buy. Hedge funds on the other hand can be focused on a segment or even an individual stock.
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i would probably argue that hedge funds are the most misunderstood investment vehicle in the industry. at this point "hedge fund" basically refers to a fee scheme rather than an investment strategy. the range of trades hedge funds can engage in is enormous, almost unconstrained.
 
Rubenov said:
Barely possible? More like impossible except for a one-in-a-million strike of luck.
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Not true. If you're willing to go slow and steady and play index options its a lot more realistic. Indexes tend to move more smoothly and not spike in one direction or the other. If they do they tend to return to the normal mean. You're not gonna see huge gains like you could if you're trading stock options but it is easier to make adjustments.
 
jboldiga said:
Not true. If you're willing to go slow and steady and play index options its a lot more realistic. Indexes tend to move more smoothly and not spike in one direction or the other. If they do they tend to return to the normal mean. You're not gonna see huge gains like you could if you're trading stock options but it is easier to make adjustments.
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Can you do it? Earn a 5,000% return in X amount of time? Here's a fact: the large majority of traders can't beat the market. That includes professionals that do this for a living. Market average annual returns are 6 - 10% (this year has been good as we are ~15% ytd). So, nearly impossible would be correct.
 
I'm doing a 1k investopedia simulation inspired by this thread... and funny you bought HP calls. I am down $600 on my HP investment. Really have to watch the news and know when to cut losses!!

My trades since I started:
GBSx.png
<- Some of those are stocks. I think I will continue the simulation with options only, as they are more fun.

Outstanding Portfolio

10/1/2012
Bought 30 HPQ calls, Nov 17th expiration, $19 strike...bought @ .25 ; now worth 0.04.

10/3/2012
Bought 85 WFQ puts, Oct 5th expiration, $34.50 strike...bought @ .04 (active trade) = ???


I got interested in playing with some real money, so I opened a ShareBuilder account since it has connections to my existing bank, ING. It really sucks compared to my friend's TD Ameritrade account. It's really optimized for long-term investments, not high risk quick deals. Oh well. Free opening bonus of $50 is a free $50 and I will certainly not complain when there are 0 fees, minimums, etc.
 
Fury Sense said:
I'm doing a 1k investopedia simulation inspired by this thread... and funny you bought HP calls. I am down $600 on my HP investment. Really have to watch the news and know when to cut losses!!

My trades since I started:


Outstanding Portfolio

10/1/2012
Bought 30 HPQ calls, Nov 17th expiration, $19 strike...bought @ .25 ; now worth 0.04.

10/3/2012
Bought 85 WFQ puts, Oct 5th expiration, $34.50 strike...bought @ .04 (active trade) = ???


I got interested in playing with some real money, so I opened a ShareBuilder account since it has connections to my existing bank, ING. It really sucks compared to my friend's TD Ameritrade account. It's really optimized for long-term investments, not high risk quick deals. Oh well. Free opening bonus of $50 is a free $50 and I will certainly not complain when there are 0 fees, minimums, etc.
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Man HP was rough today! Glad I havent touched that stock with a 10-foot pole.
Apple at 650$ the other day is a ridiculously good buy. It's trading at such low P/E ratio when taking into account its cash on hand and will inevitably go significantly higher once people start understanding that the approximately 670$/share price tag shouldn't turn off potential investors. ITS A PERCENTAGE GAME!
Who cares if you have 1000 shares of a 7$ stock or 10 shares of a 700$ stock. If it goes up 10% its the same damn thing. Its about investing in a stock that has good earnings, outlook and a strong product pipeline.
 
ugh well HPQ turned out to be a piece of shit, can't even get rid of all the calls I had, 38 of them will probably end up worthless...that trade will probably end up being the death of this experiment, should've just stuck to my tip and kept the PCS puts, it's still getting clobbered

bought 9 $147 SPY calls expiring tomorrow @ .11, total balance like $285 or something
 
arglebargle said:
i would probably argue that hedge funds are the most misunderstood investment vehicle in the industry. at this point "hedge fund" basically refers to a fee scheme rather than an investment strategy. the range of trades hedge funds can engage in is enormous, almost unconstrained.
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Oh, I agree with that. I was just talking about the original idea of the hedge fund. Hedge funds today typically remain more highly leveraged and more risky than other types of funds though, just because of the history behind the original purpose of them.
 
MVP said:
ugh well HPQ turned out to be a piece of shit, can't even get rid of all the calls I had, 38 of them will probably end up worthless...that trade will probably end up being the death of this experiment, should've just stuck to my tip and kept the PCS puts, it's still getting clobbered
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That's how it is, don't let the losses demoralize you, it happens.
 
so on the day of expiration do you have to make the decision to purchase the option or let it expire at the begining of the day or at end of the day?
 
Just discovered this thread.

OP, I have $2-3k im willling to invest into the stock market if I just understood any of that shit. I will be reading this thread and following it, hoping to gain knowledge and maybe be able to play the game like you. I'd love to turn that shit into 100k

<edit>EH...Nvm....after posting, Im reading the last posts and he lost it all?

FUCK
 
Fixed2BeBroken said:
Just discovered this thread.

OP, I have $2-3k im willling to invest into the stock market if I just understood any of that shit. I will be reading this thread and following it, hoping to gain knowledge and maybe be able to play the game like you. I'd love to turn that shit into 100k

<edit>EH...Nvm....after posting, Im reading the last posts and he lost it all?

FUCK
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This was doomed from the beggining, if people could consistently (i.e. more than a lucky play) earn a 5,000% return in a relatively short time, then this world would be full of millionaires.

Let this thread serve as a lesson to many, don't fuck with the stock market, especially if you can't afford to lose the money.

Live below your means, pay down debt, invest (conservatively, not gambling with options). These, IMO, are the most important steps towards increasing your capital.
 
ggnoobIGN said:
Decent jobs report and he'll be in the money.
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That's part of my point. Any investing scenario where you depend on a good report or news to make money is doomed to fail. You will win some, no doubt, but you will also lose many times.

I've won big, really big in the stock market, only to lose all my profits and then some more. Like me, there are tons of people out there. I devour anything stock/option related as it is my passion, so I was glad to see what people had to say.

The stock market can break you, and has to be treated with respect. The key is to find your investing style, set some rules and stick to them. MVP's method of buying OOM options with short expiries is not a good strategy to use and highly likely to make you lose money most of the time. There's no free lunch out there. More than anything, it requires time. If you don't have the time to learn and research, then just allocate a portion of your money to buying the QQQ and SPY ETFs and add during significant (5% or more) dips.
 
Rubenov said:
That's part of my point. Any investing scenario where you depend on a good report or news to make money is doomed to fail. You will win some, no doubt, but you will also lose many times.

I've won big, really big in the stock market, only to lose all my profits and then some more. Like me, there are tons of people out there. I devour anything stock/option related as it is my passion, so I was glad to see what people had to say.

The stock market can break you, and has to be treated with respect. The key is to find your investing style, set some rules and stick to them. MVP's method of buying OOM options with short expiries is not a good strategy to use and highly likely to make you lose money most of the time. There's no free lunch out there. More than anything, it requires time. If you don't have the time to learn and research, then just allocate a portion of your money to buying the QQQ and SPY ETFs and add during significant (5% or more) dips.
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I do it for a living so I know what you mean. OP seemed to have the money to blow. Honestly the best way to learn is to try, even if it means losing a lot at first.
 
Rubenov said:
Live below your means, pay down debt, invest (conservatively, not gambling with options). These, IMO, are the most important steps towards increasing your capital.
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Thanks man, good advice, but I have no debt, already fully fund two retirement accounts, have savings and two other trading accounts I manage, not counting the Roth I trade. I own my car, live in a nice high-rise with a girlfriend I'm happy with, and have a steady 9-to-5 with one of the big credit card companies. Just don't want people to get the idea I'm some degenerate gambler trying to strike it rich overnight with options like you make it sound. Maybe like 5 years ago when I first learned what options were lol

I said from the beginning that what I'm doing in this thread is for entertainment purposes, just to get the occasional adrenaline rush I need and not do it in another account, plus also run an experiment that people can learn from, and to get a conversation started about investing besides the usual boring crap. Not everyone wants to buy and hold hoping for 3% returns. I'm young so I can take chances.

Also, it's a good thing for most people here that it DIDN'T go so well, judging from the "Oh wow I want to invest money, oh nevermind you lost, so now I don't want to invest money anymore" posts. Had I nailed every trade I'm sure we'd have a lot of new option traders in this thread buying up all the .05 calls in pharmaceuticals expiring next month.
 
im going to miss this thread. i always enjoy finance discussion, and there were several knowledgeable posters in here. ah well, see you guys next time i guess.
 
MVP said:
Thanks man, good advice, but I have no debt, already fully fund two retirement accounts, have savings and two other trading accounts I manage, not counting the Roth I trade. I own my car, live in a nice high-rise with a girlfriend I'm happy with, and have a steady 9-to-5 with one of the big credit card companies. Just don't want people to get the idea I'm some degenerate gambler trying to strike it rich overnight with options like you make it sound. Maybe like 5 years ago when I first learned what options were lol

I said from the beginning that what I'm doing in this thread is for entertainment purposes, just to get the occasional adrenaline rush I need and not do it in another account, plus also run an experiment that people can learn from, and to get a conversation started about investing besides the usual boring crap. Not everyone wants to buy and hold hoping for 3% returns. I'm young so I can take chances.

Also, it's a good thing for most people here that it DIDN'T go so well, judging from the "Oh wow I want to invest money, oh nevermind you lost, so now I don't want to invest money anymore" posts. Had I nailed every trade I'm sure we'd have a lot of new option traders in this thread buying up all the .05 calls in pharmaceuticals expiring next month.
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you sound like the exact person that should be doing it. Kind of bummed you didn't hit it big, would have been cool to witness.

Unfortunately I'm exactly the person that does the 3% thing :) too cautious with money. I'll never be stinky rich due to that. however, I should avoid poor quite nicely as well I reckon.
 
MVP said:
Thanks man, good advice, but I have no debt, already fully fund two retirement accounts, have savings and two other trading accounts I manage, not counting the Roth I trade. I own my car, live in a nice high-rise with a girlfriend I'm happy with, and have a steady 9-to-5 with one of the big credit card companies. Just don't want people to get the idea I'm some degenerate gambler trying to strike it rich overnight with options like you make it sound. Maybe like 5 years ago when I first learned what options were lol

I said from the beginning that what I'm doing in this thread is for entertainment purposes, just to get the occasional adrenaline rush I need and not do it in another account, plus also run an experiment that people can learn from, and to get a conversation started about investing besides the usual boring crap. Not everyone wants to buy and hold hoping for 3% returns. I'm young so I can take chances.

Also, it's a good thing for most people here that it DIDN'T go so well, judging from the "Oh wow I want to invest money, oh nevermind you lost, so now I don't want to invest money anymore" posts. Had I nailed every trade I'm sure we'd have a lot of new option traders in this thread buying up all the .05 calls in pharmaceuticals expiring next month.
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Good, sounds like you are doing well for yourself. My comment was more aimed towards some posters here that may not be doing as well and were 'inspired' by this thread. You Can put all the disclaimers you want and still get people making an attempt at it that shouldn't be. But, this was fun, thanks.
 
catfish said:
you sound like the exact person that should be doing it. Kind of bummed you didn't hit it big, would have been cool to witness.

Unfortunately I'm exactly the person that does the 3% thing :) too cautious with money. I'll never be stinky rich due to that. however, I should avoid poor quite nicely as well I reckon.
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Yeah I'm like that too mostly with the other accounts, but I can't help but speculate once in a while, I need the rush. I need to always either be working on starting a side business, or taking shots at something bigger. There's definitely a gambler in me.

Rubenov said:
Good, sounds like you are doing well for yourself. My comment was more aimed towards some posters here that may not be doing as well and were 'inspired' by this thread. You Can put all the disclaimers you want and still get people making an attempt at it that shouldn't be. But, this was fun, thanks.
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Thanks, I know you were trying to warn people from the beginning I noticed, in my head I figured it was a given you can't be drowning in debt or try to trade options to pay the bills, but then from some of the posts I guess I didn't realize the impression I was giving off with the thread title and whatnot. I just thought it would grab eyeballs, and then people could come in and read about some new shit.

Assuming this SPY trade goes busto, I may end up just doing it again from this thread with a different strategy, and a different starting amount. Also if you have any idea which way I should do it that people can learn from, I don't think people learned anything from my random gambles lol
 
MVP said:
Yeah I'm like that too mostly with the other accounts, but I can't help but speculate once in a while, I need the rush. I need to always either be working on starting a side business, or taking shots at something bigger. There's definitely a gambler in me.



Thanks, I know you were trying to warn people from the beginning I noticed, in my head I figured it was a given you can't be drowning in debt or try to trade options to pay the bills, but then from some of the posts I guess I didn't realize the impression I was giving off with the thread title and whatnot. I just thought it would grab eyeballs, and then people could come in and read about some new shit.

Assuming this SPY trade goes busto, I may end up just doing it again from this thread with a different strategy, and a different starting amount. Also if you have any idea which way I should do it that people can learn from, I don't think people learned anything from my random gambles lol
Click to expand...

It worked. Now I'm in here learning about options, clicking links and expanding my context. For that I thank you OP. Curiously continuing to follow this thread.
 
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