Queso de Grande
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Air hockey is about to get sick!
Insane scientific breakthrough on room temperature Superconductivity [nope]
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Air hockey is about to get sick!
Insane Metal
Member
Expected, but still, a bummer.
Claimed superconductor LK-99 is an online sensation — but replication efforts fall short
Social media is abuzz with chatter about the material, but some scientists are pushing back on the hype.www.nature.com
Claimed superconductor LK-99 is an online sensation — but replication efforts fall short
A Korean team's claim to have discovered a superconductor that works at room temperature and ambient pressure has become a viral sensation — and prompted a slew of replication efforts by scientists and amateurs alike. But initial efforts to experimentally and theoretically reproduce the buzzworthy result have come up short, and researchers remain deeply sceptical.
The research team, led by Sukbae Lee and Ji-Hoon Kim at the start-up firm Quantum Energy Research Centre in Seoul said in preprints published on 25 July1,2 that a compound of copper, lead, phosphorus and oxygen, dubbed LK-99, is a superconductor at ambient pressure and temperatures above 127 °C (400 Kelvin). The team claims that samples show two key signs of superconductivity: zero electrical resistance and the Meissner effect, in which the material expels magnetic fields, leading samples to levitate above a magnet. Previous efforts have achieved superconductivity only in certain materials under incredibly low temperatures or extremely high pressures. No material has ever been confirmed to be a superconductor under ambient conditions.
LK-99's purported superconductivity drew immediate scrutiny from scientists. "My first impression was 'no.'" says Inna Vishik, a condensed matter experimentalist at the University of California, Davis. "These 'Unidentified Superconducting Objects', as they're sometimes called, reliably show up on the arXiv. There's a new one every year or so." Advances in superconductivity are often touted for their potential practical impact on technologies such as computer chips and maglev trains, but Vishik points out that such excitement might be misplaced. Historically, progress in superconductivity has had tremendous benefits for basic science, but little in the way of everyday applications. There's no guarantee a material that is a room-temperature superconductor would be of practical use, Vishik says.
The first attempts to replicate LK-99, reported in the past days, have not improved the material's prospects. None of the studies provide direct evidence for any superconductivity in the material. (The Korean team did not respond to Nature's request for comment.)
Two separate experimental efforts by teams at the National Physical Laboratory of India in New Delhi3 and Beihang University in Beijing4, reported synthesizing LK-99, but did not observe signs of superconductivity. A third experiment by researchers at Southeast University in Nanjing5 found no Meissner effect, but measured near zero resistance in LK-99 at -163 °C (110 K) — which is far below room temperature, but high for superconductors.
Theorists have also entered the fray. Several theoretical studies6,7,8,9 used a computational technique called density functional theory (DFT) to calculate LK-99's electronic structure. The DFT calculations suggest LK-99 might have interesting electronic features that, in other materials, have been associated with behavior such as ferromagnetism and superconductivity. But none of the studies found evidence that LK-99 is a superconductor at ambient conditions.
Early efforts
Replicators first attempted to synthesize LK-99, following the process described by the Korean team, which involved mixing powdered components and two stages of heating up to 925 °C. (The high temperatures and use of lead have prompted concerns about amateur replication attempts, which researchers say are dangerous.)
To confirm that material's structure and identity, replicators used X-ray diffraction, an atomic imaging technique. The Beihang team concluded that their sample's structure was "highly consistent" with that of LK-99.
A co-author on the National Physical Laboratory team, physicist Veerpal Singh Awana, acknowledged small differences between their sample and that of the Korean team. "Our LK-99 is very similar to that as the reported superconducting LK-99," he says.
But Robert Palgrave, a chemist at University College London, says that both teams' materials differ from the original. Both X-ray diffraction patterns are significantly different from the Korean team's patterns and from each other, says Palgrave. (Members of the Beihang team did not respond to Nature's request for comment.)
The Southeastern University team's experiment produced X-ray diffraction data that is more consistent with the Korean team's sample, according to Palgrave. But several researchers have questioned their claim of achieving zero resistance at -163 °C. Evan Zalys-Geller, a condensed matter physicist at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge, says that the resistance measurement wasn't sensitive enough to distinguish between a zero resistance superconductor or a low-resistance metal like copper. (Members of the Southeastern University team did not respond to a request for comment.)
Theory troubles
Uncertainty about the structure of LK-99 limits the conclusions that researchers can draw from theoretical studies, which assume a given structure for the material to make calculations.
On 31 July, a theoretical analysis posted on Twitter prompted excitement among online enthusiasts. Sinéad Griffin, who studies quantum materials at Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, shared her theory paper, accompanied by a gif of former US president Barack Obama performing a 'mic drop'. The optimism was prompted by Griffin's use of DFT to find that LK-99 has 'flat bands', a feature that indicates electrons in the material are strongly correlated with each other. "Flat band systems tend to show interesting physics," Vishik says. "So when a material is predicted to have a flat band, people get kind of excited."
Griffin later rebuffed the optimism, tweeting: "My paper did *not* prove nor give evidence of superconductivity."
Other theory papers also suggested the presence of flat bands, but all of them suffer from the same assumption about the structure, says Leslie Schoop, a solid state chemist at Princeton University in New Jersey. "In a nutshell, I don't believe any of the DFT before I know the correct crystal structure," she says.
Griffin agrees that knowing the structure is essential. But she says that the structure found by the Korean team is similar to that of other lead phosphate minerals. "So it's not too bizarre to think it possible."
Even if future experiments confirm flat bands, the feature does not mean the material would display room-temperature superconductivity, Schoop says. The association between flat bands and superconductivity comes from other materials, such as 'twisted' layers of graphene — slightly offset sheets of atomically thin carbon — which displayed superconductivity at -271 °C (1.7 K) and featured flat bands. But this does not provide evidence for superconductivity above 127 °C (400 K) in the lead-based LK-99, Schoop says.
Viral videos
The limited success of the replication attempts has not quelled speculation online. Unverified videos of samples, supposedly levitating because of superconductivity, have circulated as viral evidence, despite the fact that many materials — including graphene, frogs and pliers — can exhibit similar magnetic behaviour.
Previous room-temperature superconductivity claims, including one made in March by the controversial physicist Ranga Dias, have made headlines. But the viral attention associated with LK-99 has surpassed many of its predecessors.
Frustrated by the atmosphere of hype, some scientists have taken to mimicking the levitation videos with everyday materials suspended by string and other props. "I opened Twitter up one day and noticed a bunch of sketchy videos with little floating pebbles," says Eric Aspling, a physicist at Binghamton University in New York. In response, he uploaded a video featuring a "sample of LK-99 shaped as a fork" suspended by tape. "I thought, 'How can anybody be convinced by this?'," he says.
I'm sure AI will help us develop better tech in no time though.
Raonak
Banned
It doesn't really make any sense to me, scientific and technological breakthroughs have been happening all throughout the history and from all over the world. Like this being a Korean discovery.
The march of technology just looks orchestrated, because it's the natural evolution of human understanding. We stand on the shoulders of the combined knowledge of humanity. One small discovery opens up a whole avenue of research. It's just accelerating a bit more because of the internets ability to share information.
Buggy Loop
Member
These two events were 66 years apart.
66 years.
A journalist, 9 weeks before the first flight, predicted that humans would never fly, it would take 10 million years to develop
In 1903, New York Times predicted that airplanes would take 10 million years to develop
Only nine weeks later, the Wright Brothers achieved manned flight. The pathologically cynical always will find a reason to complain.
bigthink.com
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
I was thinking about this the other day - what's a recent discovery or invention that's changed our lives recently?
Unknown Soldier
Member
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
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TaylorSwiftFan
Member
Yeah but I've been using the internet for 25 years now. iPhone came out in 2007.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
All good stuff but I mean in the last 5-10 years. I feel like since the iPhone, I haven't had anything life changing since the iPhone.
mitch1971
Member
With predictions like that he must of been a GAF'erA journalist, 9 weeks before the first flight, predicted that humans would never fly, it would take 10 million years to develop
In 1903, New York Times predicted that airplanes would take 10 million years to develop
Only nine weeks later, the Wright Brothers achieved manned flight. The pathologically cynical always will find a reason to complain.
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Kenpachii
Member
Patcher uncle
FunkMiller
Banned
Threads like this would do really well to issue a ban on posts from social media. If people have to actually go looking for updates from reputable scientific sites, they'd get more accurate information.
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Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
That the idea that human progress requires alien tech is nonsense, given that we went from the first powered flight to landing on the moon in little over a century.
It's the same argument that insists our ancients were mental retards who couldn't pile rocks on top of another without alien tech.
Yes, sharing videos on twitter is not science. Most of this new era of paid blue checks are just trying to get attention and followers by any means necessary and have no credibility. Wannabe influencers and grifters, not notable individuals and public figures with reputations. It's different from how it was until recently.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
Yeah, blue checks are no longer creidibility it's important to remember that
CrankyJay™
Member
I didn't say all human progress. Beside, it was just a quirky tongue in cheek thought, not meant to be taken seriously at all.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
Ah, apologies then. I've known enough people who genuinely believe these things that I took your post at face value.
bender
What time is it?
Omega Supreme Holopsicon
Banned
I hope its eventually proven real, and all those confident guys saying theyve disproved it get proven wrong.
Wildebeest
Member
I still believe in the spirit of the thing. This is going to usher in a new age of cutting edge scientific research streamed live on twitch by grumpy Russian catgirls.
sankt-Antonio
Banned
Melon Husk
Member
Yup, there's been enough time now to replicate. Until the next wild discovery.
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Trogdor1123
Gold Member
Well, that sucks…
funkygunther
Banned
Just more evidence that the only thing that can debunk science is better science.
In conclusion:
In conclusion:
Robot Carnival
Member
shame this didn't turn out to be what we all hoped, but while the world goes back into the search for an actual room temperature and pressure superconductor, in the mean time, is LK-99 useful as something else? or is it's property already exists in other materials?
It's useful as a rock to throw at grad students
Instead of letting this fade away to be replaced by the next viral BS on social media, stop to take a look at everything that was posted earlier. Paid blue check hype men. Levitating rock videos. Swarms of nonsense building upon itself, keeping LK-99 trending 24/7 for weeks.
This is not how science works, at all. We're firmly in the post-truth era where it's easier to disseminate bad information, since it's more exciting. You get more engagement. The algorithm isn't interested in truth.
This is not how science works, at all. We're firmly in the post-truth era where it's easier to disseminate bad information, since it's more exciting. You get more engagement. The algorithm isn't interested in truth.
Kilau
Gold Member
Insane Metal
Member
Isn't science amazing? It's idiot-proof. Test it, if it fails, it fails and there's no turn around.
ScHlAuChi
Member
bender
What time is it?
Just look at some of the responses in this thread or the one on the gaming side.
This is such a weird take as the VAST majority of coverage was some variation of world changing or automatic noble prize from pundits more concerned about presentation and production values instead of understanding basic fundamentals of the topic they are covering. But I guess it makes sense, and view/click counts will bear this out, as opinions from actual scientists get fractions of the views and are dismissed by people who really want this to be true. This predictable outcome will not change anything and will be memory holed just in time for the next magic bean to be announced. All this information at our fingertips and we are dumber than ever.
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Plies
GAF's Nicest Lunch Thief and Nosiest Dildo Archeologist
Omega Supreme Holopsicon
Banned
the universities have been creating the wrong material. Some people are seemingly creating something different.
Pictures of Iris Alexander LK99 Samples | NextBigFuture.com
Iris Alexander had the first publicly claimed LK99 levitation and now has claimed to have low resistance at about 7 degrees celsius.
www.nextbigfuture.com
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Melon Husk
Member
the universities have been creating the wrong material. Some people are seemingly creating something different.
Pictures of Iris Alexander LK99 Samples | NextBigFuture.com
Iris Alexander had the first publicly claimed LK99 levitation and now has claimed to have low resistance at about 7 degrees celsius.
We're so back
Omega Supreme Holopsicon
Banned
Original Team Says LK99 Superconductivity Is Real and Next Published Paper Will Provide Answers and Evidence | NextBigFuture.com
The original LK99 team reassures the world that LK99 superconductivity is real and was demonstrated. They will provide evidence and answers in the next
www.nextbigfuture.com
Original team says their next paper will prove superconductivity does occur in lk99.
Plies
GAF's Nicest Lunch Thief and Nosiest Dildo Archeologist
Original Team Says LK99 Superconductivity Is Real and Next Published Paper Will Provide Answers and Evidence | NextBigFuture.com
The original LK99 team reassures the world that LK99 superconductivity is real and was demonstrated. They will provide evidence and answers in the next
Original team says their next paper will prove superconductivity does occur in lk99.
justonething
Jada's BFF
Original Team Says LK99 Superconductivity Is Real and Next Published Paper Will Provide Answers and Evidence | NextBigFuture.com
The original LK99 team reassures the world that LK99 superconductivity is real and was demonstrated. They will provide evidence and answers in the next
Original team says their next paper will prove superconductivity does occur in lk99.
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