iPhone - Official Thread

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Souldriver said:
Well, if there never will be non-simlocked version of the iPhone, there will be quite a few markets Apple won't ever be able/allowed to release their phone. Tying is within the grey zone of European legislation as it is.
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You can already get official Apple unlocked iPhones in France and Germany, just at a premium price. It's unlocked through iTunes, so the phone's IMEI is put on Apple's whitelist which bypasses the usual activation stage of registering the iPhone through iTunes.

It will probably be the same arrangement in Belgium.
 
John Carmack weighs in with his thoughts on the SDK as well:

John Carmack said:
“Just based on the blurbs, it looks very good—a simulator plus debugging on the native device is the best of both worlds, and a 70% royalty deal for apps over iTunes is quite good,” Carmack wrote. “The iTunes distribution channel is really a more important aspect than a lot of people understand. The ability to distribute larger applications than the over-the-air limits and effectively market your title with more than a dozen character deck name, combined with the reasonable income split make this look like a very interesting market.”
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He doesn't seem to have a problem with Apple taking 30%
 
border said:
Their goal was 10 million phones in the product's first year. The iPhone's anniversary is in June. Last I heard, they were not going to make that. I assume that's still the case since they seem to have now moved the goalposts and the goal has become "10 million sold in 2008".



So the people in this thread just made it all up? That's funny, seeing as how a Google search for "3G iphone" yields a ton of relevant results beyond NeoGAF.
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I get to reply to BOTH of your comments.

Apple always said 10 million by the end of 2008, never in the first year.

I'm not saying anyone "made anything up." It's a fact that a 3G iPhone is coming, but no one knows when. People have been talking about it since the day the iPhone was announced. However, in this thread people started conjecturing that there would be a 3G phone announced to coincide with the 2.0 update and you were talking about it like it was a fact. It could certainly happen, but it's nothing more than hoping at this point.
 
I think the only thing I'm not sure about with the 70/30 revenue split is whether that's going to seem unfair to devs because it doesn't scale based on software pricing. Jobs is pitching it as the cut they take to cover costs, but if two pieces of software get the same number of downloads and let's say take up the same amount of storage space on Apple's servers, but one piece of software costs more than the other, why should Apple get a greater cut of the revenue in that case?
 
Right. And free software could easily consume more bandwidth then the stuff that costs money, depending on the app. It's a strange agreement to be sure, but not unlike something on XBLA where the devs set the price as well.
 
I'm tempted to program something now and throw it on the store for $5. That's not too much and it's still within the realms of impulse buying as long as it's a good app.

Time to brainstorm...
 
Phoenix said:
30% rev share is low.... VERY low.
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Yeah, seems to be the consensus from the devs that I've been seeing today in the wake of the announcements yesterday.

Maybe Carmack will bring Doom RPG to the iPhone in a souped up version! :) He's already familiar with the OS X dev tools and has spoken highly of them in the past.
 
Having played around with this for a while, this is a death blow for Palm - they can wrap that shit up. Once the iPhone goes 3G, it will be the ultimate device. Balmer AM cry.
 
border said:
Will the new iPhone support EDGE and 3G, or will you have to choose between the two?
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Anything that supports 3G generally has the caps to fallback to EDGE in areas where 3G is not available.
 
eXxy said:
iPhone applications can't run in the background. So much for a decent IM app. :\

http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/03/07/iphone-sdk-some-of-the-details-arent-great/
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Whoa...that's actually kind of blow for gaming in particular, isn't it? It explicitly refers to answering the phone as one of the things that will force a 3rd party app to quit. Do you really want to be forced to choose between quitting the game or ignoring the call? Well, actually, I know what I'd do, 9 times out of 10. ;)
 
eXxy said:
iPhone applications can't run in the background. So much for a decent IM app. :\
http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/03/07/iphone-sdk-some-of-the-details-arent-great/
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That really sucks but I have to say I'm not the least bit surprised considering Apple's stability and security concerns.

There is an alternative solution for persistant IM. A company called PDA Apps made an IM program called "Verichat" (they may still) that solved the problem by running a backend server. When you logged into the IM client but closed the program, the server kept you logged in remotely. If you get an IM, it was forwarded to you via SMS to alert you.
 
I suppose that also means that you can't have apps with icons that can be updated like SMS, Email, voice messages and such.
 
kaching said:
Whoa...that's actually kind of blow for gaming in particular, isn't it? It explicitly refers to answering the phone as one of the things that will force a 3rd party app to quit. Do you really want to be forced to choose between quitting the game or ignoring the call? Well, actually, I know what I'd do, 9 times out of 10. ;)
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I think there are API calls that detect when you are closing the app by opening something else or hitting the Home button. That way you can save the state before you close, then next time it's opened up just restore the state.

A better idea is to probably just design with it saving the state constantly if the user makes some kind of change. Otherwise if they get a phone call it will kill your app.
 
yayaba said:
I think there are API calls that detect when you are closing the app by opening something else or hitting the Home button. That way you can save the state before you close, then next time it's opened up just restore the state.
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Yep. Consider switching apps on the iPhone equivalent to closing the DS clamshell. The app should go into standby mode if state is important, which it normally is.
 
eXxy said:
T-minus 10, 9, 8, 7 before Kung Fu Jedi comes in to tell us how this isn't a big deal. ;)
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:lol

Ok! I probably deserve that! :D

That it is a bit of a let down, but one that I hope the creative devs can overcome. Hopefully things like the music player, which can obviously be used while you're surfing, doing e-mail, etc. can still easily be used while playing games and using third party apps.
 
yayaba said:
I think there are API calls that detect when you are closing the app by opening something else or hitting the Home button. That way you can save the state before you close, then next time it's opened up just restore the state.

A better idea is to probably just design with it saving the state constantly if the user makes some kind of change. Otherwise if they get a phone call it will kill your app.
Click to expand...
Yeah, as long as there's an OS event to pick up on and cue a quick save state when an app switch/close is about to occur, it wouldn't be that bad.
 
Phoenix said:
Having played around with this for a while, this is a death blow for Palm - they can wrap that shit up. Once the iPhone goes 3G, it will be the ultimate device. Balmer AM cry.
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"Balmer am cry" because the Iphone takes out one of their competitors? :)
 
The no-daemon process rule does have me a little annoyed, as all three utilities I've thought of making wouldn't work under that rule.

Anyone thinking that a 30% cut of revenue (and NO cost or risk) for 100% of your marketing, distribution, basic Q&A, etc. is anything other than a complete STEAL is out of their fucking mind. Ballmer is trying to spin this because Windows Mobile is an open development platform (sort of), but no one can deny that a 30% revenue hit for that amount of risk mitigation and free services is unbelievably awesome for devs of all sizes.

Most games now spend as much on marketing as development.

Software developers can produce software in this sort of environment without relying on publishers for funding, so this is a GREAT way to cut out the middle man, just like how iTunes killed the record companies. Only difference is that most development houses are wholly owned, while musicians aren't quite owned property.
 
I figure Apple will either let AOL run in the background or they'll make their own iChat that will. No biggie. The rest of the apps don't need to run in the background.
 
Is there a way to delete multiple emails at once? I'm getting annoyed with not being able to highlight and mass edit items. And no copy and paste? Wow. This thing is far from polished. I'm still deciding whether to keep this iPhone or go back to my Windows Mobile PPC.
 
Bboy AJ said:
Is there a way to delete multiple emails at once? I'm getting annoyed with not being able to highlight and mass edit items. And no copy and paste? Wow. This thing is far from polished. I'm still deciding whether to keep this iPhone or go back to my Windows Mobile PPC.
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That feature is coming in the 2.0 update in late June.
 
ckohler said:
That feature is coming in the 2.0 update in late June.
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I see. Thanks for the information. Lots of unrealized potential and lots of simple stuff that should not have been overlooked.
 
I wish Apple's approach to applications running in the background simply had the iPhone manage memory and disable the ability to run something in the background if the phone was reaching memory limits. I'm not a programmer, so I don't know how difficult that would be to implement, but it seems simple enough.
 
eXxy said:
I wish Apple's approach to applications running in the background simply had the iPhone manage memory and disable the ability to run something in the background if the phone was reaching memory limits. I'm not a programmer, so I don't know how difficult that would be to implement, but it seems simple enough.
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Memory has NOTHING to do with the rule. The iPhone is built on OS X with as much memory as many machines that were built for OS X around its debut. iPhone can multitask just fine.

All it has to do with is bandwidth. Bandwidth in that, background applications that require network access will stack up, and having 30 applications in the background using EDGE consistently would cripple AT&T's margins.
 
I'm headed back to the U.S. tomorrow for two weeks, which means I get my iPhone back for that time period! :D

I've had an iPod touch to try to make up for the lack of iPhone, but Japan's WiFi scene isn't as good as it should be.

Does Safari still crash?
 
Juice said:
Memory has NOTHING to do with the rule. The iPhone is built on OS X with as much memory as many machines that were built for OS X around its debut. iPhone can multitask just fine.

All it has to do with is bandwidth. Bandwidth in that, background applications that require network access will stack up, and having 30 applications in the background using EDGE consistently would cripple AT&T's margins.
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Not to mention that if apps were allowed to run in the background, malicious software could be running continuously without the user's knowledge.
 
SteveMeister said:
Not to mention that if apps were allowed to run in the background, malicious software could be running continuously without the user's knowledge.
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I think they're more concerned about a mobile Transmission port than genuinely malicious software people install intentionally.
 
No voice dialing? No voice command? The speaker is weak. Phone call volume is low. Lots of little problems that should have been ironed out to begin with. Supposedly I have to wait until June for them to fix it. Hmm.

I like the iPhone but it isn't as professional as my Windows Mobile 6 PPC. It just doesn't do as much, despite what others want to say. It's a brilliant media phone but as a pocket PC, it fails. I really hope the June firmware fixes all these things. And that the hackers out there get it going so that I don't have to wait too long until I can get around the firmware as I'm using an unlocked/jailbroken iPhone.

Can the weather icon on the home screen be dynamic in that it displays the current weather without me having to click on it for information?

Is there a way to get it to display my schedule for the day on the home screen? All it does is pop up little alerts as I've got the alerts set up but no full on schedule? Weak! I have to access the calendar itself to get to my list. You can tell this phone is designed for the kiddies.

I think I'll keep it as an addition to my PPC but no way does this thing work for professionals. I love it for what it is but I realize that it's really not for those of us who need to get things done. I think that's the best way for me to be happy with it. I just need to recognize it is what it is. Won't be replacing my PPC.
 
I wonder how many updates we will see until 2.0. Considering we are only at 1.1.4 currently.

In any case, the features added by 2.0 really will make this a pretty complete phone. The move toward focusing on enterprise is huge, IMO. Already I use the phone quite a bit for work, but to have those extra capabilities puts it over the top.

A good thing (about the only good thing) in having to wait for June should be the large number of apps available right out of the gate.
 
Bboy AJ said:
You can tell this phone is designed for the kiddies.

I think I'll keep it as an addition to my PPC but no way does this thing work for professionals. I love it for what it is but I realize that it's really not for those of us who need to get things done.
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Jesus Christ.
 
Bboy AJ said:
Is there a way to get it to display my schedule for the day on the home screen? All it does is pop up little alerts as I've got the alerts set up but no full on schedule? Weak!
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OMG you mean that to see my calendar I actually have to select it? What kind of counter-intuitive design is that?

Anyway it's not a problem, here I'll provide you with your schedule for today and every other day until June:

9am: browse GAF
10am: post on GAF
11am: post on GAF
12am: piss and moan about iPhone
1pm: miss point
2pm: fail to realize that all things I just complained about not being iPhone features become iPhone features in June.
3pm: post on GAF anyway
4pm: cry bitter tears over imminent and inevitable death of Pocket PC and Windows Mobile
5pm: ??????
6pm: PROFIT!!!!
 
Yes, I have to select calendar instead of having my schedule immediately in front of me on the home screen. I'd rather not have to.

I have .66 posts on GAF per day while you have 3. I'm not sure why people are projecting their own inadequacies on me. If you can't help me with my concerns, then don't bother posting.

I'm not speaking ill of your precious iPhone (no wonder the gaming forum is always up in arms about fanboys). Wow, get a fucking life. I'm not insulting your mother, I am looking to address my problems with the phone. There are just some issues I have with it and I'm looking for a solution. If your only reason for responding to my post is to defend your iPhone (from what, I have no idea) then please refrain.

That said, anything? I'm guessing not about the calendar but how about the weather icon? I hope the update lets me see the battery life as a percentage rather than a bar.
 
Hey, the weather icon is a good idea. I used to say the same thing about the calendar icon on the iPhone and in the Apple doc. It used to show a generic date, now it updates with the correct one every day so you can see it at a glance.

I see no reason why they couldn't do it with the weather too; you'd just have to define how often you want it to check for an update and which city you want on the home screen if you have multiple cities set up.

Or you could just look out the fucking window.
 
Vyer said:
God dammit, you guys gave him exactly what he wanted. Way to fucking go.
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No they didn't. I still don't have a solution :lol

I bought the phone. Are you fanboys happy? Can I talk about it without getting people jumping down my throat about my concerns? I didn't come in here to bash it; I'm quite pleased with what it is.
Gary Whitta said:
Hey, the weather icon is a good idea. I used to say the same thing about the calendar icon on the iPhone and in the Apple doc. It used to show a generic date, now it updates with the correct one every day so you can see it at a glance.
Click to expand...
That sets a good precedent for change then. Here's hoping.
 
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