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[drawkcaB]

Well, if Nautilus jungle wasn't getting help from Riot before, they may have finally done him in for good. I think I'll do something I haven't done in a long time and post in the official boards asking Riot to give Nautilus something to help him out in the jungle...

Riot hates tank junglers /kanye.

 

[zkylon]

i think it's not necessarily that terrible since cassi will reset the passive with her q, right? same with teamfights, tanks gonna get blasted from all directions so passive probably not gonna have that much of an effect

the stats do sound kind of bonkers but there's time for balancing that

 

[Stone Ocean]

i think it's not necessarily that terrible since cassi will reset the passive with her q, right? same with teamfights, tanks gonna get blasted from all directions so passive probably not gonna have that much of an effect

the stats do sound kind of bonkers but there's time for balancing that

So for Cassio, if she Q+Es somebody and then within 5 seconds hits them with E+E+E+Q. The subsequent Es and Qs will deal reduced damage.

Sounds like it's per spell and that it refreshes?

 

[Envelope]

Well, if Nautilus jungle wasn't getting help from Riot before, they may have finally done him in for good. I think I'll do something I haven't done in a long time and post in the official boards asking Riot to give Nautilus something to help him out in the jungle...

Riot hates tank junglers /kanye.

tbh riot hates the jungle right now

shitty unbalanced camps encourages the most boring pathing possible, if you aren't picking graves you might as well ff, terrible camp spawn timers means snowballing champs snowball harder and if you get invaded even once you might as well ff, kindred is still dead, etc, etc

 

[BreezyLimbo]

If the block is dependent per spell, it'll wreck DPS casters

 

[Stone Ocean]

Kindred needs to stay dead until a rework. She's basically Devourer - The Champion, the only way she can have that passive is if she's vulnerable early but if she's vulnerable early she can't actually scale, so essentially she's impossible to be balanced, either she's shit or she's too good.

 

[zkylon]

Sounds like it's per spell and that it refreshes?

hmm yeah then i guess they'll nerf base stats or something

that sounds really strong against everyone, not just cassi

 

[Newt]

I want to complain about something, but all my hatred is gone because of how good the botlane meta is good right now.

 

[drawkcaB]

tbh riot hates the jungle right now

shitty unbalanced camps encourages the most boring pathing possible, if you aren't picking graves you might as well ff, terrible camp spawn timers means snowballing champs snowball harder and if you get invaded even once you might as well ff, kindred is still dead, etc, etc

I actually like it a helluva lot more right now than I did at the beginning of S7 and the end of S6. At least we have non-heavy farming junglers having a fighting chance with the catch-up XP mechanic and junglers aren't outscaling the solo laners. Outside of my grievances with tank junglers, my issues with the jungle are down to individual champions.

It's just really frustrating to me that tank junglers are in a bad spot. The fix is as easy as increasing Cinderhulk's bonus damage to monsters to 120~125%, but Riot won't do it because 2 years ago Cinderhulk was stupid.

Kindred needs to stay dead until a rework. She's basically Devourer - The Champion, the only way she can have that passive is if she's vulnerable early but if she's vulnerable early she can't actually scale, so essentially she's impossible to be balanced, either she's shit or she's too good.

Lots of Kindred mains say she's in a really good spot, but I still won't bother playing her because the camp stacking mini-game is god damn frustrating and random as shit.

 

[Envelope]

I want to complain about something, but all my hatred is gone because of how good the botlane meta is good right now.

whoever gets bork first wins lane doesn't seem that good to me tbh

 

[Stone Ocean]

Every jungler bar 3 or so is arguably in a bad spot.

whoever gets bork first wins lane doesn't seem that good to me tbh

Even if that were all there is to bot lane, I'd rather have a lane that actually rewards aggression than being too scared to do anything because I might get 5v2'd and doing anything isn't worth it.

 

[Newt]

whoever gets bork first wins lane doesn't seem that good to me tbh

Nah, Crit and Lethality builds are still very viable.

 

[Envelope]

also if kindred needs to be executed then i will settle for nothing less than the deletion of ivern from the game

also shaco needs his ankles broken for a very long time as punishment for the disgusting bruiser build

 

[Newt]

Yeah whoever designed Ivern needs to be fired.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Nah, Crit and Lethality builds are still very viable.

Yeah, every ADC but Corki is highly viable in the current patch. BoTRK fixed crit user issues, Lethality is still fine, some ADCs have more than one build path, you can actually kill tanks, bot hasn't been this healthy in years.

 

[drawkcaB]

Yeah whoever designed Ivern needs to be fired.

also if kindred needs to be executed then i will settle for nothing less than the deletion of ivern from the game

also shaco needs his ankles broken for a very long time as punishment for the disgusting bruiser build

You guys need to have a nice long gingerly stroll through the woods with a nice bag of candy and wash that hate away.

Every jungler bar 3 or so is arguably in a bad spot.

Now this is just nonsense.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Ivern wouldn't be as annoying to play against if Redemption and Grail weren't a thing.

 

[Envelope]

You guys need to have a nice long gingerly stroll through the woods with a nice bag of candy and wash that hate away.

if only i could get through without the infinite slows and stuns and knockups and lack of visibility and inability to target anything due to daisy being in my face and bullshit damage from ivern's ranged autos zzzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[Newt]

I thought Nunu was an asshole champ and then Ivern came out.

 

[JulianImp]

Yeah whoever designed Ivern needs to be fired.

I'm happy he's a non-issue in my elo. In bronze, I'd say the worst jungler I've seen so far is Shaco, mostly because he makes himself visible only as he's already behind you and about to tunleash his whole kit at point-blank range. Zac can also do that kind of stuff, but he relies more on his teammates following up his cc chain rather than bursting you down himself like Shaco does.

 

[drawkcaB]

Ivern wouldn't be as annoying to play against if Redemption and Grail weren't a thing.

Nail. Head. Riot could use a brute force nerf and reduce Ivern's gold intake by X% when he clears camps to delay his item pickups. But I'm not a particularly big fan of that since it takes away the possibility of alternative item builds incorporating non-support items. Lowering Ivern's gold income in the end just further solidifies him into his Redemption-Athene's/Ardent Censor/Locket build.

I'd rather entirely do away with the damage on Trigger Seed and shift that power elsewhere in his kit so that Q max first skill order paths become dominant.

I mean...among other changes I'd make like increasing his grove time to 5s scaling down at levels 6/11/16, increasing the per champion CD timer on Daisy's knock-up, and removing his ability to share buffs with teammates. There's so much hidden power in buff sharing that it's got to go. I don't know why it's there at all.

if only i could get through without the infinite slows and stuns and knockups and lack of visibility and inability to target anything due to daisy being in my face and bullshit damage from ivern's ranged autos zzzzzzzzzzzzz

I thought Nunu was an asshole champ and then Ivern came out.

*Hugs* Come on now friends, let's share a cup of hot cocoa.

I'm happy he's a non-issue in my elo. In bronze, I'd say the worst jungler I've seen so far is Shaco, mostly because he makes himself visible only as he's already behind you and about to tunleash his whole kit at point-blank range. Zac can also do that kind of stuff, but he relies more on his teammates following up his cc chain rather than bursting you down himself like Shaco does.

That's because people in bronze don't know any better than to copy high elo builds for Ivern. Runic Echoes->Redemption->Rylais/Liandry's and carry your own ass.

 

[Ever]

ADC metas are never fun tbh

 

[Newt]

ADC metas are never fun tbh

Not really an ADC meta though.

 

[FoxSpirit]

That's because people in bronze don't know any better than to copy high elo builds for Ivern. Runic Echoes->Redemption->Rylais/Liandry's and carry your own ass.

Why Runic and Redemption?

 

[Ever]

Not really an ADC meta though.

That's what the ADC mains want you to think.

 

[drawkcaB]

Why Runic and Redemption?

Makes you less dependent on teammates in lower elo. I used to do Grail/Redemption but when you can't depend on your teammates to properly use the Q-dash mechanic to get in range ASAP because they're boosted macaques you kinda take matters into your own hands.

In all honesty, the funnest games I've had with Ivern were going runic->Liandry's or runic->Iceborn->Abyssal. Grail centric builds are very boring to me.

 

[zkylon]

all items on pbe now, interesting changes

abyssal is now a tank item, banshee's is a mage item and ga is an adc item

i think this is a good change overall, abyssal passive always felt like it served a weird purpose because of the short range (the mystery cdr is kind of weird tho), and now mages have a really good defensive item to buy specially for the lategame. it's not gonna be a great second item but i think people weren't buying abyssal that often these days anyway

not sure about ga, seems pretty bad stats wise but i like it not being a tank item anymore. i think someone like olaf will buy this more than like lucian tho?

the helmet does sound pretty dumb

Just played the match up again. Even after getting first blood I found it really hard to do anything to him. I feel like he just pushes me in constantly and I end up having to use my Q to farm under turret. Also Leblanc is really E reliant now more than ever and Yasuo has too many ways to outplay it.

I still ended up getting really fed and doing things. Here's a funny highlight I thought you would enjoy <3

https://youtu.be/D6-66vRYEi0

i would like to say i enjoy good leblanc play but that lux tilted me the face off the earth lol

 

[Stone Ocean]

Randuin's Omen
Crit Damage reduction removed

It's about fucking time. It makes no sense how Randuins could just fuck over auto attacks in 4 different ways.

I expected changes to AD items though? At least that's what Meddler said when he confirmed the crit changes were shelved. Maybe they're only coming with the 7.9 PBE cycle?

 

[drawkcaB]

That Cinderhulk change has a chance of backfiring, but then again it'll let tank junglers actually farm minions when the opportunity comes up...

Ok wait, hold up. Why wouldn't I, as a tank jungler, build Sunfire and just ignore Cinderhulk now?

I don't think you buffed cinderhulk enough. Needs something else.

Very possible. Will definitely be wanting to see how Cinderhulk users are performing upon release (especially relative to their pre-patch performance and their lane tank counterparts), if nothing else.

Light at the end of the tunnel? Maybe?

Several changes here that I really like on true jungle tanks though, particularly..mmmm...Taaahmmmm.

 

[zkylon]

not enough xayah art yet but things look promising

 

[Talents]

Not enough Xayah hentai &#128555;&#128555;&#128555;&#128555;

 

[23qwerty]

&#129300;

 

[JulianImp]

Makes you less dependent on teammates in lower elo. I used to do Grail/Redemption but when you can't depend on your teammates to properly use the Q-dash mechanic to get in range ASAP because they're boosted macaques you kinda take matters into your own hands.

In all honesty, the funnest games I've had with Ivern were going runic->Liandry's or runic->Iceborn->Abyssal. Grail centric builds are very boring to me.

But how can they even be boosted if they're in bronze? Bronze is crap because even if they pick meta op champs and copy pro builds, the're often doomed by the fact that they don't really know their champions enough to know when to commit to an all-in, when to poke, when to chase and when to gtfo to avoid feeding kills, for example. Then again there's the dumb thought process that you can make anything work in bronze because you're playing against apes, but that only really applies if you aren't still a bronze ape yourself, IMO.

Also, if I had to go jungle I think I'd rather play an obvious "follow up once I initiate for free kill" champ such as Zac or maybe Naut rather than Ivern.

 

[Ever]

How is Karma allowed to be this busted, lol.

Just throw out shields and poke in lane. Then throw out 2 second CD shields once you have Redemption and Locket

So gross lmao

But how can they even be boosted if they're in bronze? Bronze is crap because even if they pick meta op champs and copy pro builds, the're often doomed by the fact that they don't really know their champions enough to know when to commit to an all-in, when to poke, when to chase and when to gtfo to avoid feeding kills, for example. Then again there's the dumb thought process that you can make anything work in bronze because you're playing against apes, but that only really applies if you aren't still a bronze ape yourself, IMO.

Also, if I had to go jungle I think I'd rather play an obvious "follow up once I initiate for free kill" champ such as Zac or maybe Naut rather than Ivern.

Picking meta OP champs and copying OP builds should be enough to get you out of Bronze, or at least into high Bronze. Many of the most common problems I see among Bronze players is improper Runes/Masteries, or poor/static itemization (and farming, but that's another topic).

As far as damage items on Zac goes, I'd really only go for one at most. Either Rod of Ages or Liandry's Torment, take your pick.

 

[JulianImp]

Picking meta OP champs and copying OP builds should be enough to get you out of Bronze, or at least into high Bronze. Many of the most common problems I see among Bronze players is improper Runes/Masteries, or poor/static itemization (and farming, but that's another topic).

As far as damage items on Zac goes, I'd really only go for one at most. Either Rod of Ages or Liandry's Torment, take your pick.

I'd say that having a better understanding of decent kiting, your role in fights, csing/wave management and all that is worth a lot more than picking stuff that's op in lcs. Like, I'm not really doing amazingly good, but having picked up some good habits and going otp on each of my roles as Teemo and Nami have been giving me some nice results so I can slowly climb while getting a better grip on game basics (tend to win more games than I lose, at least). One of the reasons I think I do okay is that I know my champs well enough to not do monkey-tier stuff all the time, and I'd probably lose that if I were to hop aboard the OP champion of the week bandwagon.

 

[phinious]

It's kind of funny how pav always hosts other Teemo players and most of them feed like there's no tomorrow while building full ap and getting deleted. Pav's build using mallet and visage is a lot better for a champion that is required to go into his 500 aa range and stay there for a while to do anything relevant, while on the other hand rushing linadries, void staff, mpen boots and nashors really isnt worth it if the lack of defensive items means you're getting deleted in half a second every single fight.

I don't agree at all. I feel like teemos that stand there and aa are worthless. Shrooms and Q are where his dmg is. Hit and run! Max cdr and just shroom everything. If you die in 1 second you will still do way more dmg than if you don't die all game with a tank build.

 

[Newt]

Who is Pav lol.

 

[23qwerty]

just some teemo 1trick streamer

 

[Orochinagis]

Our support asked, tresh or mundo? the unranked guy told him Mundo. We lost

 

[Newt]

Our support asked, tresh or mundo? the unranked guy told him Mundo. We lost

lmao

 

[JulianImp]

Ivan Pavlov's a challenger Teemp otp and supposedly #2 main worldwide. Basically got a lot better at playing Teemo after watching the stream and watching his gameplan against different champions, as well as learning how to do a more flexible build order that caters to the enemy team more than just buying items in a set path every single game.

I don't agree at all. I feel like teemos that stand there and aa are worthless. Shrooms and Q are where his dmg is. Hit and run! Max cdr and just shroom everything. If you die in 1 second you will still do way more dmg than if you don't die all game with a tank build.

Except I consistently do most damage or 2nd most damage in my team despite going Mallet + BorK + Visage + Runaans/Nashors, while also not dying in two hits (which throws many people off since they expect the glass cannon ap build) and being decent frontline material. Seriously, on-hit Teemo's giving me really good results while not disrupting team comps by giving us another glass cannon. Like, at least Malz or Zyra can unload their whole kits for massive damage, while Teemo's shrooms are absolutely unusable in teamfights and your paper-thin defenses mean you won't be abusing your E either, so that leaves what, Q damage?

 

[MrCookiepants]

i would like to say i enjoy good leblanc play but that lux tilted me the face off the earth lol

She was definitely tilted. Not sure why she flashed when she was in Q range already. Mundo also Q'd a minion. Still pretty funny.

As far as damage items on Zac goes, I'd really only go for one at most. Either Rod of Ages or Liandry's Torment, take your pick.

Why would you buy RoA on Zac, he doesn't use mana.

 

[JulianImp]

Had a crappy game where we started with like a 12/2 lead, but then adc and jg began arguing, we got infernal dragon stolen twice by Yi (who even was forced to farm sidelanes to get back into the game), and everybody decided it'd be a good idea to burn their abilities on the Renekton that was awfully behind and then they'd lose over and over to Yi.

I wasn't really missing playing with potato people, but I guess I am in bronze, after all.

 

[Orochinagis]

One more chance, lets see what happen

 

[drawkcaB]

Another Tahm Jungle game, another win, although in this case I didn't really carry like the last game. Just johnny-on-spot with good saves and ultimates. More of a support sort of performance today. I built a Frozen Mallet even though it was really a bad enemy team composition for it. I definitely should have gone IBG for the CDR and clear speed.

Good Lord ulting into the enemy team with that new tank item is going to be hilarious.

 

[zkylon]

ok early birthday wishers, now it's actually my birthday so i'm ready for some lovin'

much love for my lolgaf friends, you guys rock

Not enough Xayah hentai &#65533;&#65533;&#65533;&#65533;&#65533;&#65533;&#65533;&#65533;

artists generally don't follow announcements that closely and only start doing pictures when champions are released

give it time

Our support asked, tresh or mundo? the unranked guy told him Mundo. We lost

a tragedy in two acts

She was definitely tilted. Not sure why she flashed when she was in Q range already. Mundo also Q'd a minion. Still pretty funny.

i mostly kept getting frustrated at her short e's

like she kept throwing them at her own feet

One more chance, lets see what happen

you can do eet

 

[Orochinagis]

And I lost, demoted to Silver V,

What a ride but I am not gonna spend more time on this game. Have fun guys

 

[Newt]

And I lost, demoted to Silver V,

What a ride but I am not gonna spend more time on this game. Have fun guys

lol pls

You don't get to advance without improving.

 

[Calvero]

Man we've been losing players this week

 

[drawkcaB]

I know this is going to sound insane, but every single time the opposing team has a support Lux, they win. Every damn time, without fail. Add a bronze Kalista, a Sion support who had absolutely zero clue how to play him in that role (or at all really going by his awful decisions). Game was done before I hit level six.

Any rate, just I was trying out jungle Renekton in that match and there's definitely something there worth exploring some more. His initial clear is slow and on the unsafe side of things, but once he gets a second rank in Q it's easy breezy. His fury stacks stay long enough that they're always around to help out his clear speed.

His ganks are quite strong even at level 3. The double dash on his E is absolutely money. Get in close, position correctly and dash through. They panic flash, then dash again, W stun, and voila, successful gank after that.

It's unfortunate that the whole first time experience was mared by a truly awful team.