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Let's discuss- which ip has explored the most videogame genres (mario or star wars or something else?)
Draxon Gamer
Banned
I guess that gameplay video recording I saw must have been from whatever was leaked then.
kicker
Banned
Yeah, I can't find this \/
You'll have to use whichever portal to another dimension you pull these games out of to find it for us, you absolute legend
Draxon Gamer
Banned
I'm not sure where you would put Wario Ware style games, but I guess that is technically under party?
Megaman has a Wario Ware kind of game called Rockman Intuition.
Megaman has a Wario Ware kind of game called Rockman Intuition.
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Draxon Gamer
Banned
Not really, late 90s Star Wars was putting out X-wing, adventure games, action adventure games, rpgs, and innovative FPS games in 3D covering all the major genres that were also the fasted evolving at the time. 3D Platform games only peaked for a few years and then became more niche thereafter dying in the middle 2000s.
They could come back and do a platform game, but I'm not sure what the point of that would be 20 years later. Not exactly a genre that sells outside a few old franchises or nostalgia.
kicker
Banned
It's still weird that we never got a star wars game even during that short peak of 3d platformers. Ratchet and Clank, Jak and Daxter, Banjo, Crash?, Mario, so on. As far as I can tell, there was no stretch of time where Lucasarts suddenly got precious with the star wars ip so they could definitely have made one.
I guess it just never worked out.
Yeah, agree on there being no point in a modern 3d platformer outside of established brands still holding on like R&C and Mario.
Astral Dog
Member
Mario i guess
Turn based RPG,Platformer,Racing game,puzzle game,fighting game(in Smash Bros.)sports games including football,baseball,Golf,Olympics, and Tennis, party board game,action adventure,Movie,toys,theme park,spin offs like Luigi's Mansion and WarionLand,etc
Turn based RPG,Platformer,Racing game,puzzle game,fighting game(in Smash Bros.)sports games including football,baseball,Golf,Olympics, and Tennis, party board game,action adventure,Movie,toys,theme park,spin offs like Luigi's Mansion and WarionLand,etc
kicker
Banned
This one is genuinely hard to place. There's no official listing or genre category since it's rare.
Well, since everywhere it exists, it's compared to warioware, and warioware is considered a party game, then I guess it's a party game.
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Ratchet and Jak weren't really during a peak. People look highly too those games but those were among the only ones that were relevant outside a couple third parties. Most other platformers no one was buying anymore and I think that's to blame on the adventure and collection aspect.
With Dreamcast and N64 with single sticks those kind of platform games were necessary, but when the 2nd stick started to be used correctly by Xbox and PS2 which finally grew third-person Action Adventure games on consoles like PC, then there wasn't much reason to buy them. The open-ended nature of your Banjos was to give you a platform game that could also take the place of an Adventure game as consoles started moving to 3D. Once that necessity was gone it was over.
Jak itself pivoted to being a GTA clone, Naughty Dog saw they couldn't get away with the same formula of the first game twice and knew they had to change.
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Usually people put Wario Ware under party and I guess from the mini-game progression aspect that's reasonable.
kicker
Banned
Since genres are kinda arbitrary in different people's opinions (making this whole comparison kinda arbitrary like we've already mentioned), I tried to use listings by wiki or game awards categories so it's not just us deciding what counts.
I was going to say that the Megaman game wasn't a party game since it could only be played singleplayer, but a little research revealed that my understanding of the genre was not complete.
kicker
Banned
Yeah, It almost seems like some older genres were just stepping stones for other genres that were limited by design and tech of the past. Same way modern tomb raider games cannot be called platformer games in any way
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Many people will say the first entries in Tomb Raider were platforms but the objective of the developers using the tech they had available fogs the definitions. Consoles took a long time to get to 3D and they did it the same time when PC was accelerating tech-wise, reducing prices on chips so instead of having a few years of StarFox level 3D on consoles, consoles skipped two generations and leap right to texture mapped polygons with high counts and rendering effects.
When you consider this, it makes sense why there was so much hardship and compromise at the time. Consoles didn't have time to build up to something because they all rushed into it. We went from Starfox and Virtua racing to Need for Speed, Star Fighter, Ridge Racer, Tekken, and Cyberia in one year.
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Mega Man powered up would go under Mega Man level maker, the whole point of that game is that it's a remake of the first game with new assets that will allow you too make your own levels with various modern or classic rules, and share them on the servers so other people can try out your levels and whatever rules you have or what character you make people use.
Pacman All-stars was an MMO for windows.
Rockman Poker can go under Casino/gambling for Mega Man
If we are including things like Sewing than it would be fair to split Shmups from the FMV or rail shooters, as Mega Man has a gradius style game called Megaman Rush marine.
Pacman VR came out in the late 1990s VR arcades
Rockman Sprite Logic is an art game. It's basically somewhat like a Mega Man themed Picross game.
I think that about does it for both Pacman and Mega Man.
Pacman All-stars was an MMO for windows.
Rockman Poker can go under Casino/gambling for Mega Man
If we are including things like Sewing than it would be fair to split Shmups from the FMV or rail shooters, as Mega Man has a gradius style game called Megaman Rush marine.
Pacman VR came out in the late 1990s VR arcades
Rockman Sprite Logic is an art game. It's basically somewhat like a Mega Man themed Picross game.
I think that about does it for both Pacman and Mega Man.
kicker
Banned
This is heavily debatable. In the same way Star Wars Galactic Battlegrounds (or a few other star wars games) having a level editor mode doesn't make it a 'level maker' game, I'm not sure Mega man powered up counts as a level editor game. There's also the fact that everywhere it is officially recorded, the level editor is not referenced as a core part of the game and the game is classified solely as a platformer.
Not *really* an mmo though, right? From what I can see, it's similar to a standard multiplayer mode in any other game. 4 players, one type of activity, so on. I really doubt anyone on the internet has referred to this as a massively multiplayer online game in isolation.
Will addRockman Poker can go under Casino/gambling for Mega Man
Well, if we're going that route then yeah, we should just split FMV, Lightgun/Rail shooter, and Shmups into their own genres categories. They aren't really similar if you think about it so it's weird that I ever grouped them together.
Amazing there was a VR pacman game in 1996. Will add.Pacman VR came out in the late 1990s VR arcades
Rockman Sprite Logic is an art game. It's basically somewhat like a Mega Man themed Picross game.
I think that about does it for both Pacman and Mega Man.
I'm curious about where you find information on some of these games though
I saw some of them on the official wikis, but they weren't listed under any genre categories and usually didn't have their own wiki pages.
Guilty_AI
Gold Member
Touhou is a strong candidate, if you include fan games
>Shmups
>Fighting games
>Arkanoid
>Rhythm games
>Metroidvanias/2D platformings
>3D platformings
>Action RPGs
>JRPGs
>Dungeon Crawlers
>Roguelikes
>Visual Novels
>FPSs
>3D shmups
>Puzzles
>Farming
>Management Sim
>RTS
>Soccer
>Monopoly, Mahjong, and other board games
>Racing
>Survival
>Pong-style
>Match-3
>Tower Defense
>Horror
>Shmups
>Fighting games
>Arkanoid
>Rhythm games
>Metroidvanias/2D platformings
>3D platformings
>Action RPGs
>JRPGs
>Dungeon Crawlers
>Roguelikes
>Visual Novels
>FPSs
>3D shmups
>Puzzles
>Farming
>Management Sim
>RTS
>Soccer
>Monopoly, Mahjong, and other board games
>Racing
>Survival
>Pong-style
>Match-3
>Tower Defense
>Horror
kicker
Banned
Damn, that is an impressive collection. I'll check the official games out later and add a column for it if they match up.
I think we've passed the point of legitimacy with this table, but nah, we aren't including fan games. Though I'm now pretty sure Sonic would win this if we were.
This pointless comparison has given me a new level of respect, confusion and wariness when it comes to the sonic fandom. The blue hedgehog inspires something powerful in them
Guilty_AI
Gold Member
Yeah, if you include only official games, it wouldn't be that many.
However, i think the clear winner, regardless of being only official or including fangames, is Star Wars. The amount of stuff on it out there is insane, and has been going since the dawn of gaming.
kicker
Banned
True to this. A 46-year-old franchise that's stuck close to gaming from the very beginning.
Shame that there isn't a consistent level of quality across the games though
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Powered Up is literally 90% level editor. The remake of Mega Man 1 is only there to demonstrate the use of assets you can use in the level editors, as well as playing at the bosses. Modern and Classic mode use the same grid the whole game is designed for you to edit in Square blocks, it's not similar to Galactic Battlegrounds in anyway. One you're done with the 2 hour MM1 remake there's almost nothing else to do outside what were two DLC skins and one DLC character, two if you include Protoman but you could unlock him through the game itself. The rest of the game was about making levels with rules or taking advantage of the new special abilities boss characters have (like making Ice Man the character for your stage and requiring him to cross gaps by freezing rows of bullets to reach a ledge) and then uploading them online.
With the servers down MMPU is a dead game unless you want to play modern mode and see what the deal is with Timeman and Oilman. It's not like Maverick Hunter X on the same system which was an extensive full-single player remake with no gimmicks outside being able to play as Vile in a different mode.
Games like Rebel Assault are FMV rail shooters, and there are Lightgun FMV games as well and even FMV TPS games, Creature Shock, Cyberia etc, so there's definitely some overlap with some of those so I get why you probably initially put those together.
Because I don't use Wiki. Also some of them I played myself like Pacman VR.
kicker
Banned
Well, I guess I'll add it with an asterisk. Solely because everywhere official, the level maker mode is still referred to as side content whereas for the others it's the main game.
And with that Megaman and Star wars are tied for 1st place.
I'll ask for a title change
Anyone have any ideas of other genres or suggestioms for opening up some of the ones we lumped together?
LRKD
Member
Digimon has a quite diverse genre of games, maybe not the most, and a lot of them are variations of rpgs, but it's still pretty wild. The first game is a Tamagotchi turned rpg. the second is a dungeon crawler rpg, third is a more tradition rpg. '4th' is a multiplayer action rpg like Crystal Chronicles. Then there's also a kart game, 2d party fighter like smash bros, a 3d party fighter, digimon world championship idk what to even call that game I guess wikipedia calls it 'life simulation' though. there have been several mmos, card battle games, the latest was a vn/trpg. There was an edutainment game, a variety of gatcha mobile games.
I imagine digimon might not be on the top of the list, but it definitely deserves a mention.
I imagine digimon might not be on the top of the list, but it definitely deserves a mention.
kicker
Banned
It's like the japanese are the only ones that know how to create a range of experiences for their ips.
Will look into digimon
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Most of the ranges you are referring to that some "know how" to do are nches or underperformers. Not all of course, but generally pushing the IP that hard was a sign of a studio desperately trying to diversify using what would during much of that ips run, the companies most profitable or most farthest reaching IP. Often used until something sticks or they can get another project off the ground to remove relying too much on one series.
When a game company can have several internal IP competing in reach and sales, there isn't much reason to take one of them and put them in several genres, some that honestly, don't make much sense for some of the characters. Because you already have other new ip that do well.
I don't think to be honest, half of Mario's catalog, as well as Mega Mans make much sense imo. Star Wars has a few head scratchers as well but instead of only focusing on select characters, Star Wars enters genres as a brand with a theme instead, which allows you to not be as restricted, which is why it is not as strange as seeing Pacman in a FF style rpg, or a TPS.
I don't recall a major western studio, now or back in the day that had to over-rely on one IP. Maybe smaller ones but that's a given.
Draxon Gamer
Banned
I found this dancing Rockman Eccentric game, this is some sort of DDR game probably using the controller given the they use the NES sprites, but this fits under dancing I believe:
I also wonder if edutainment should be a category under Miscellaneous, since iirc all the series on your list have one.
Also, are you using all video games including electronics handhelds (official) or are you only counting games released on interchangeable handhelds and consoles, or PC and mac? The electronic handhelds would add for all the games you have listed, probably Star Wars too.
I also wonder if edutainment should be a category under Miscellaneous, since iirc all the series on your list have one.
Also, are you using all video games including electronics handhelds (official) or are you only counting games released on interchangeable handhelds and consoles, or PC and mac? The electronic handhelds would add for all the games you have listed, probably Star Wars too.
kicker
Banned
Yeah, they were kind of forced to diversify even if it didn't make sense, but they seem to attempt it even when they're already succesful, Mario being a prime example. The games might not all have sold amazingly, but that brand has the highest average quality in this comparison, hands down.
Another thing, I'm not sure, but it seems the japanese also have a wide variety of hardware platforms and experiences integrated into their gaming industry. Arcade cabinets, pachinko, handhelds, custom peripherals, etc.
Also, It's still odd to me that PC never rrally took off there like it did in neighbouring korea/china/most of asia.
Yeah, that would be classified under rhythm even if not dancing. Looks like you were right about megaman being up there in genres.I found this dancing Rockman Eccentric game, this is some sort of DDR game probably using the controller given the they use the NES sprites, but this fits under dancing I believe:
Yeah, all videogames, no platform restrictions. A lot of games from mobile and limited edition handelds are already included, If I recall correctly.
You can share anything you find
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Not really, there are a few Mario genres that did well initially that they milk because they do well and not much variation in those genres outside those popular spin-offs. That's why they still even when not needed continue to sell Mario Spin-offs like Mario Kart. Where as Sonic doesn't have a racing game as successful but has various styles of racing games, more than Mario.
Then there's guys like Pacman, where a racing game doesn't make much sense outside a cash grab. We likely won't see a Street Fighter, Halo, Hitman, or Resident Evil branded racing game for example. The next closest mascot racing game to Mario Kart from a different franchise regarding sales is probably Crash, excluding f2p mobile games of course.
PC did take off in Japan in the 80s when NEC controlled the computer industry and Fujitsu and Sanyo were competing. But then died for 20 years ironically because of NEC itself, it's main marketing push was for hardware that wasn't exactly game friendly and while their PCs had a ton of games they never took advantage of it. Instead, they competed with themselves on that front by releasing their own console which not only hurt their PC gaming prospects, but their competitors. Several of the companies involved in the Japanese PC industry were also working with software companies and arcade studios so once windows took over the PC industry was mostly dead until it started rebuilding in the 2000s.
I believe if that never happened, many of the Japanese PC developers would have stayed on the platform, and console studio woulds have released more games on both PC and console. But the damage was great enough that the libraries later devolved into visual novels and porn games.
Fujitsu tried to release a console in 1993 based on their PC's showcasing how defeated the local PC industry gaming industry was. NEC released a successor to theirs in 1994 and failed just the same, focusing on what genres were still left standing in the Japanese PC industry and the use of CD-ROM instead of making a proper console successor to the PC Engine. Both consoles burned and had poor outdated libraries at the time.
Korea in comparison had a thriving PC industry that was small in comparison but growing quickly. With a lot of ports of Western PC games and several of their own. Consoles never really hit too well there, the Goldstar 3DO model was the only one that had impact on whether Korean gamers chose consoles over PC or not, but then that never happened again until the PS2, and then never since. PC just exploded in South Korea.
kicker
Banned
This is interesting stuff. I had only heard the broad strokes like that fact that post-WW2 the japanese supposedly had economic reform that forced a lot of industries to shift models and rethink strategies. I had seen somewhere else that they switched to consoles and more dedicated gaming machines early compared to the rest of the industry, I just didn't know they abandoned a PC gaming industry to do it.
So I did some more searching and it seems this is a part of that Rockman Intuition! warioware-style game.I found this dancing Rockman Eccentric game, this is some sort of DDR game probably using the controller given the they use the NES sprites, but this fits under dancing I believe:
It's a rhythm minigame section of a party game, essentially. Like yakuza karaoke or other small sections of larger games. I don't think that counts.
kicker
Banned
So while checking up on the game you mentioned, I found this article
Mega Man feels the beat in Sound Rangers: Rhythm & Battle
www.destructoid.com
You seem to have a way to pull these games out of the internet, any chance you saw another reference (image, video, link, review, anything) to this somewhere?
Draxon Gamer
Banned
This is interesting stuff. I had only heard the broad strokes like that fact that post-WW2 the japanese supposedly had economic reform that forced a lot of industries to shift models and rethink strategies. I had seen somewhere else that they switched to consoles and more dedicated gaming machines early compared to the rest of the industry, I just didn't know they abandoned a PC gaming industry to do it.
So I did some more searching and it seems this is a part of that Rockman Intuition! warioware-style game.
It's a rhythm minigame section of a party game, essentially. Like yakuza karaoke or other small sections of larger games. I don't think that counts.
Intuition was a complication of separate mobile games though, so separately you could argue they all count.
Like I said before it's a tough cookie to nail down.
There's even a mobile game where you're just Mega Man falling down a pit dodging spikes.
Yeah, it's a rhythm shooter, they even have the new character from the cancelled Legends 3 as playable in it since the game was announced close to the cancellation.So while checking up on the game you mentioned, I found this article
supposedly referring to an iphone exclusive japan-only mega man game. The genre is not clear but the name seems to suggest it was a rhythm game; I can't seem to find any other mention of it or proof of its existence or release. Not even on the wayback machineMega Man feels the beat in Sound Rangers: Rhythm & Battle
You seem to have a way to pull these games out of the internet, any chance you saw another reference (image, video, link, review, anything) to this somewhere?
You have to match and attack to the music to destroy enemies. Very hard to find info on, it flew under the radar. Probably didn't last too long based on where Capcom was as a company at the time.
kicker
Banned
I'm not sure this is accurate. In the video I saw of gameplay it seemed like they just made different minigames for areas of Intuition's gameplay. If those games are standalone, then yeah they would count, I think. I haven't found any reference to Intuition though.
And yeah, it is tough. This is all based on dubious, indefinite genre definitions anyway.
Nice. Will update the table. Looks like you were right about Mega man taking the crown.
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Mega Man has the most times of desperation where Capcom tried to use the franchise to keep themselves up or to save the franchise, which is also why there are 7 spin-offs and a crazy amount of games tackling different things.
The fact that they never could even after all of that effort for decades get the series into the mainstream is really something. Sure, some of that was the fault of Capcom itself or a couple of rouges like Inafune but it's crazy how you can have so many games across so many genres and spin offs and they couldn't even outsell SF during the period where it was in the grave.
I do suppose there is a extreme shortage of 3D games in the series though. X command Mission, X7, Canon Spike cameo, the racing game, and the three Legends Entries are pretty much all their is for 3D games unless I'm forgetting something. Maybe that's part of a problem, lack of a TPS entry.
BTW, Pokemon is another series to consider, it has a bunch of genres covered.
kicker
Banned
Yeah, just skimming through I'm already seeing Trading card, AR, digital board game, racing games. Might be something there.
Yeah, it still amazes me that they're still releasing new mega man games to this day. I wouldn't have guessed the franchise was so important to them for all this effort. I think we've seen that having quality output when you spread your ip that wide is the exception.
I can't blame capcom for trying when they were in serious uncertainty, but it appears they've been pushing mega man throughout its entire existence. Nowadays they seem to have figured out the 'give people what they want' idea for their other games, and it seems to be working for them.
Draxon Gamer
Banned
Maybe. But they need to put more focus in Mega Man games with better productions and let them breath and come u with a plan of action that doesn't involve cannibalization. Even Mega Man after 9 and 10 which were done in NES style was not enough for their multiple games most years strategy to hold up. It dropped to one game a year before then, then they put the series on hold.
Mega Man 11 did eventually with sales pass MM2 but we are still talking about a series that has failed to expand its audience for 40 years among its best selling games. Two of it's best selling games are one volume of one collection and two volumes combined of another collection of old games. Where are the new games? Where are the remakes to bring back those failed or under-performing higher production entries so they can have a second chance?
I feel Capcom has been spraying the franchise up until the hiatus after 2010 from 1989, and figured that strategy would keep working. They are more focused now but they are taking a lot less risks now which I find strange because Capcom has refocused on their other IP that were down in the dumps. Devil May Cry, Street Fighter where they managed to salvage V, and Resident Evil between 6 and 7. Maybe they don't have anyone internally that wants to take on such a role knowing that if they mess up that's going to be a black mark on them.
kicker
Banned
I don't know, capcom has seemed rather daring recently. Evidently, not with megaman but overall, I like the direction they're going in. Bringing back Dragons Dogma, opening up to the pc platform, investing in VR modes for their games.
Although yeah, I'll concede that it's mostly with the popular franchises. Maybe they're just fed up with trying that scattershot strategy and they associate megaman solely with what has worked in the past. I mean, these are the expectations their president has for their franchises now https://www.videogameschronicle.com...s-target-is-10-million-capcom-president-says/ and their marketing for the game has been relentless to prove it.
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Darkmakaimura
Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
Warhammer 40,000 has had a very diverse genre even if it is based off a tabletop game.
You have first person shooters, third person shooters, flight sims, car combat, role-playing games, real-time strategy, turn based strategy, platformers and probably a few others I can't think of right now.
You have first person shooters, third person shooters, flight sims, car combat, role-playing games, real-time strategy, turn based strategy, platformers and probably a few others I can't think of right now.
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