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[jarrod]

Optical media has as much room for future growth potential as 3DM has.

UMD doesn't though, the spec is final at this stage. DS cards will be getting continually larger and cheaper, with Matrix actually accelerating Moore's law.

The point is rather moot though related to either PSP or DS if they don't have the capability to take advantage of that future growth. 1.8 Gig is obviously the max for PSP but what is it for NDS? I've only read "over 128 Meg".

I'm not 100% sure, but I imagine future cards could circumvent the DS' theoretical data limit by sectioning the ROM into pools in the cards. This was how Famicom, Super Famicom & NeoGeo all surpassed their theoretical limits.

Ah, the sky's the limit.

 

[Lyte Edge]

Fuck load times! That's why I'm getting an N64 instead of that retarded GayStation.

Look back to 1996, too. PSX load times improved to the point that they seemed almost non-existant in many games. The same thing will happen with the PSP.

 

[paul777]

But, but....the N64 had no loading times. Since apparently loading times are the ONLY factor in whether or not somebody is going to like a console/handheld, then obviously it should've been loads popular than the PS1! The same power that made the PS1 a more attractive option is going to make the PSP an attractive option, as well. Its got that some Sony sensibility behind it.

You haven't been paying attention. I did not say loading times are the only factor. I said convenience (which encompasses everything from portability to battery life, price, loading times, etc.) was a big factor, which DS has an obvious advantage in. The other big factor (games) also has DS at an advantage. Now let me ask you this: do you think the Game Boy audience is not only going to ignore the fact that all of the big games they've been buying on Game Boy are not on PSP, they're also going to get used to loading times all because of "some Sony sensibility?" I am sorry, but that is too farfetched for me. The PS1 was not succesful, because of "some Sony sensibility." It was successful, because it had a more appealing library of games than the N64. As it stands, the GBA has the most appealing library among portables, and the DS has the most appealing future release list.

I may be wrong, but history swings in my favor once again. You STILL only have an opinion to go on. Perhaps I have an opinion, too, but at least its informed and backed up with evidence from past trends.

No, it doesn't swing in your favor. Past trends dictate people buy portable systems primarily for the reasons I outlined above. Therefore, past trends dictate that the people who made Game Boy Advance a huge success are much more likely to stick with a Nintendo handheld.

 

[Belfast]

You haven't been paying attention. I did not say loading times are the only factor. I said convenience (which encompasses everything from portability to battery life, price, loading times, etc.) was a big factor, which DS has an obvious advantage in. The other big factor (games) also has DS at an advantage. Now let me ask you this: do you think the Game Boy audience is not only going to ignore the fact that all of the big games they've been buying on Game Boy are not on PSP, they're also going to get used to loading times all because of "some Sony sensibility?" I am sorry, but that is too farfetched for me. The PS1 was not succesful, because of "some Sony sensibility." It was successful, because it had a more appealing library of games than the N64. As it stands, the GBA has the most appealing library among portables, and the DS has the most appealing future release list.





No, it doesn't swing in your favor. Past trends dictate people buy portable systems primarily for the reasons I outlined above. Therefore, past trends dictate that the people who made Game Boy Advance a huge success are much more likely to stick with a Nintendo handheld.

Whether or not DS/PSP has the most appealing future lineup is TOTALLY up in the air, and the GBA *does* have the leg-up on BOTH of them at the moment. I'm willing to accept that it will remain the portable system with the largest installed base, but the PSP is bringing TONS of new consumers into the portable market. Many of them previously console-only gamers. And I would contend the PS1 WAS a success because of the Sony brand name, at least initially. After it had time to construct a stable of excellent games, then you could claim that, but in the beginning, it was their ability to market and pervade this sense of "cool" that got a lot of people on board even when they didn't know what to expect from the system in the future.

 

[kaching]

UMD doesn't though, the spec is final at this stage. DS cards will be getting contiually larger and cheaper, with Matrix actually accelerating Moore's law.

I'm aware of the UMD limit, I point it out later in the same post. I was speaking of future growth potential of Optical media tech in general at this point.

You're speculating about growth potential of DS cards, which is fine, but you haven't truly defined 3DM as the happy medium until that comes to pass, if it does. Until then, DS cards stand far closer to traditional solid state ROM than it does to optical ROM on the spectrum of capacityrice performance

 

[jarrod]

I'm aware of the UMD limit, I point it out later in the same post. I was speaking of future growth potential of Optical media tech in general at this point.

Sure, I agree there.

You're speculating about growth potential of DS cards, which is fine, but you haven't truly defined 3DM as the happy medium until that comes to pass, if it does.

I'm not speculating on potential really, I'm simply pointing out it exists. 3DM's strength definitely lies in it's potential, but the current tecnhology is already producing attractive yields at low costs.

Until then, DS cards stand far closer to traditional solid state ROM than it does to optical ROM on the spectrum of capacityrice performance

That's still deceptive though, when a 64MB card likely costs in the range of $2-6 to produce right now. It's a moot point really when it'll likely cost a publisher the same to have a DS game versus a PSP game manufactered by SCEI and NCL.

The original statement by Arcticfox was essentially "expensive carts vs cheap optical media"... which really isn't the case with 3DM. Regardless of where DS cards stand at this moment using a specific comparative ratio, they themselves can hardly be viewed as expensive in real world terms.

 

[Deg]

Well if its anything like home consoles. No one cares about loading really.

GC owners are just spoilt on this. Much like wireless controller.

 

[All Hail C-Webb]

Well if its anything like home consoles. No one cares about loading really.

GC owners are just spoilt on this. Much like wireless controller.

The thing is, it's nothing like home consoles.
If I want to take a dump, I'm not going to bring a PSP with me if I know I have to wait forever before I actually get to play. Handehelds are made to be played in short bursts, or pick up and play. Having to wait a minute before you can actually start playing is going ot turn a few people away (not necesarilly from buying a PSP, but maybe from buying as many games, or even playing them as much).

 

[dark10x]

Good lord, I can't believe how many people actually play games on the shitter. :lol

 

[jarrod]

Toilet gaming is simply the best gaming. Similar to toilet reading.

 

[6.8]

I can't think of how many hours I've played on the shitter. Tetris made bathroom sessions much longer than they needed to.

 

[Belfast]

The thing is, it's nothing like home consoles.
If I want to take a dump, I'm not going to bring a PSP with me if I know I have to wait forever before I actually get to play. Handehelds are made to be played in short bursts, or pick up and play. Having to wait a minute before you can actually start playing is going ot turn a few people away (not necesarilly from buying a PSP, but maybe from buying as many games, or even playing them as much).

LESS THAN THIRTY SECONDS DOES NOT EQUAL A MINUTE LET ALONE THIS PURELY HYPOTHETICAL "FOREVER."

I've played games on the toilet on occassion, but only because I was bored and lazy and had nothing else pressing to do. I've also done similar things with reading. But at the same time, I don't think it should be used as a benchmark for assessing the qualities of a portable gaming console. Shit, its still pick up and play. You can go one round of RR I'd assume in about 4-5 minutes (at least 80% of that time spent ACTUALLY PLAYING). As I said before, anyway, if you're going to stay on the toilet that long playing a game (fiften minutes, half an hour, an hour, longer?) then the loading time should make about as much difference to you as it would were you sitting in front of your TV playing on a console.

 

[Amir0x]

This thread is still alive...

...listen, loading is definitely something most of us would rather not have. This is an advantage the DS has, no doubt. However, the fact that the PSP has load times will not detract from the amount of people interested in it, and I think that's the point that will become extremely clear after the US/Europe launch.

 

[Tim]

Look back to 1996, too. PSX load times improved to the point that they seemed almost non-existant in many games. The same thing will happen with the PSP.

How do you explain the retardedly long loading times PS2 games still have then? I think it's more logical to compare the psp to PS2 in that regard.

 

[Defensor]

I hope you toilet gamers disinfect your portables

 

[6.8]

I hope you toilet gamers disinfect your portables

 

[dark10x]

How do you explain the retardedly long loading times PS2 games still have then? I think it's more logical to compare the psp to PS2 in that regard.

Err, which games are you referring to? Most of the PS2 games I've been playing load VERY quickly. I have well over 100 PS2 titles, and only a handful suffer from somewhat lengthy loadtimes (which still really aren't all that bad). What the heck are you playing that makes you say that?

 

[Belfast]

This thread is still alive...

...listen, loading is definitely something most of us would rather not have. This is an advantage the DS has, no doubt. However, the fact that the PSP has load times will not detract from the amount of people interested in it, and I think that's the point that will become extremely clear after the US/Europe launch.

You're right. This thread should be no more. And the next person who creates a PSP loading times *complaint* thread gets banned for a week.