WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Man...unless you're playing reanimator, I wouldn't count on Elesh. I mean, what's your ramp plan?
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Magic: The Gathering |OT|
- Thread starter The Technomancer
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Man...unless you're playing reanimator, I wouldn't count on Elesh. I mean, what's your ramp plan?
It's a Birthing Pod scheme, so a good curve would be:
Turn 1 - Mana creature
Turn 2 - 3 drop: Blade Splicer/Birthing Pod/Borderland Ranger
Turn 3 - Pod up for Resto Angel/Metamorph/Solemn
Moving onto Thragtusk, Sun Titan/Wurmcoil, then Norn as the top of the pyramid.
The deck has cast turn 3 Wurmcoils, if my mana creatures don't get destroyed (which they almost certainly will lol). It has potential, but I'm not sure if it can swing hard enough.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Ah, didn't catch the pod. Duh.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Goblins.
Keru_Shiri
Member
At the FNM level, Goblins, or RDW in general will be your best bet for cheapest, though its a bit of a stretch of how competitive you'll actually be.
narcosis219
Member
A budget Spirit Delver would be pretty decent as well.
It's composed of delver, common cantrips, lingering souls, drogskol captains, and 2-3 runechanter's pikes.
4 Lingering Souls will cost you 8 bucks
4 Drogskol Captains will cost you 3 bucks
2-3 Runechanter's Pike will cost you 2-3 bucks
4 each of Delver, Thought Scour, Ponder, Gitaxian Probe, Mana Leak, and Vapor Snag (or Unsummon). These are all common cards that will cost anywhere between free and 25 cents each depending on how you get them.
Add in islands, plains, a swamp and 2 evolving wilds, and you're good to go. The core cards cost $14 + the commons. Under $20 is doable.
Mind you, you will be strictly weaker than the other Delver decks you're playing against, but this is as good as budget gets. You just can't get consistent wins (comparable to the real Delver decks) without cards like Snapcaster Mage, Dual Lands, and the Swords. You'll still be able to hold your own against most of the meta most of the time, but don't expect to place =P
It's composed of delver, common cantrips, lingering souls, drogskol captains, and 2-3 runechanter's pikes.
4 Lingering Souls will cost you 8 bucks
4 Drogskol Captains will cost you 3 bucks
2-3 Runechanter's Pike will cost you 2-3 bucks
4 each of Delver, Thought Scour, Ponder, Gitaxian Probe, Mana Leak, and Vapor Snag (or Unsummon). These are all common cards that will cost anywhere between free and 25 cents each depending on how you get them.
Add in islands, plains, a swamp and 2 evolving wilds, and you're good to go. The core cards cost $14 + the commons. Under $20 is doable.
Mind you, you will be strictly weaker than the other Delver decks you're playing against, but this is as good as budget gets. You just can't get consistent wins (comparable to the real Delver decks) without cards like Snapcaster Mage, Dual Lands, and the Swords. You'll still be able to hold your own against most of the meta most of the time, but don't expect to place =P
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Thanks. I made a joke that a mod thought was "funny, but over the line." Then I come back and "bitch" is an autoban.
I don't think I'll be long for sticking around. Arbitrary and milquetoast rules annoy me too much. But, I'll stick around here as long as I can. You guys are awesome.
The mods have definitely got more sensitive recently, I'm not a fan either. Since they came into the Euro 2012 thread and banned people for the c word it seems.
riskVSreward
Member
Having some confusion on what to do with this demon deck.. although it is a lot faster than I anticipated it would be, but that prevents me from getting most of these big guys out
26 Creatures
3 Soulcage Fiend
4 Somberwald Vigilante
4 Reassembling Skeleton
2 Blind Zealot
1 Demonlord of Ashmouth
1 Grinning Demon
1 Reiver Demon
2 Demonic Taskmaster
2 Demon of Death's Gate
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Ravenous Demon
1 Renegade Demon
2 Onyx Mage
1 Hanweir Lancer
16 Spells
1 Gravepurge
3 Disentomb
4 Unhallowed Pact
2 Undying Evil
1 Shade's Form
1 Doom Blade
1 Demonic Rising
1 Yoke of the Damned
1 Vigor Mortis
1 Grave Peril
2 Artifacts - Executioner's Hood
24 Lands
3 Dragonskull Summit
2 Tainted Peak
8 Mountains
11 Swamps
So any thoughts?
26 Creatures
3 Soulcage Fiend
4 Somberwald Vigilante
4 Reassembling Skeleton
2 Blind Zealot
1 Demonlord of Ashmouth
1 Grinning Demon
1 Reiver Demon
2 Demonic Taskmaster
2 Demon of Death's Gate
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Ravenous Demon
1 Renegade Demon
2 Onyx Mage
1 Hanweir Lancer
16 Spells
1 Gravepurge
3 Disentomb
4 Unhallowed Pact
2 Undying Evil
1 Shade's Form
1 Doom Blade
1 Demonic Rising
1 Yoke of the Damned
1 Vigor Mortis
1 Grave Peril
2 Artifacts - Executioner's Hood
24 Lands
3 Dragonskull Summit
2 Tainted Peak
8 Mountains
11 Swamps
So any thoughts?
narcosis219
Member
His ETB is fine as long as your other creatures have undying/when a creature dies effects.
He runs pretty well in a Blood Artist/Zombies deck where you will have blood artists on board. Ashmouth comes in, you sacrifice a Geralf's Messenger and get his undying and ETB do 2 damage trigger, or sacrifice a Gravecrawler and summon him back later. In both cases, you get X number of blood artists triggers giving you a 2*X lifepoint swing.
Still, he's not very playable in standard, but he can serve a purpose as a sac-outlet.
As for the rest of that deck, I'm kind of wondering what those random humans are doing in there? Somberwald Vigilante is a pretty subpar creature given how many good 1 drops black and red have. He doesn't seem to do anything besides chump and become fodder for Ashmouth. Hanweir Lancer is nice for the first strike, but your demons already have evasion anyway.
Soulcage Fiend makes no sense in your deck because you have no source of lifegain. He is borderline good if you have a way to gain life because he is essentially creating a 0 point life differential. You turn this into an advantage for you by having sources of life gain to make up for losing 3. Other than that, he can be useful in burn decks where you just need him for the absolute 3 damage for the kill or something.
Blind Zealot is kind of hard to get use of because he has no evasion. He is better replaced by a straight up removal card like geth's verdict. Same effect except it happens instantly and you don't have to hope you manage to hit your opponent to trigger it.
All the other demons are... okay I'll just stop... Demons aren't really a playable trible to be honest. One or 2 demons in a ramp or control type deck would work, but not if your whole deck revovles around demons.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Do what I do and stick to fringe community threads. 95% of my NeoGaf posts are in Call of Duty threads, Team Fortress 2 threads (although I haven't been active there in months), and this thread. You're safe here.
Ignore any advice you get on cheaping out on the lands. Do not cheap out on lands if you want to be competitive. Spend the money and buy the duals you need for your deck. A playset of Evolving Wilds does not substitute for duals. If you don't want to buy duals, then build RDW or mono-green Dungrove. No sense spending money on cards for a sweet UW deck if your mana base is going to screw you 20% of the time.
After that; well, I have no concept for how much the paper game costs anymore since I only play MTGO, so I'll leave deck suggestions to the rest of the thread.
Well I'd like to have more than one ravenous demon in it eventually, so thats where the humans come in
VindictiveGnome
Member
Are we allowed to post trades in here? I have a few M13 rares and mythics I want to get rid of.
narcosis219
Member
Im sure you can post your list, but the rest of it should be done via pm
VindictiveGnome
Member
Yeah, completely agree to keep the thread from being cluttered. Pretty much all I want is a Thragtusk. Multiple Thragtusks would be nice. PM me! If this isn't allowed, let me know.
-Door to Nothingness
-Akroma's Memorial
-2x Master of the Pearl Trident
-Vampire Nocturnus
-Firewing Phoenix
-2x Boundless Realms
-Trading Post
-Nefarox, Overlord of Grixis
-Drowned Catacomb
-Sands of Delirium
-Ground Seal
-3x Moldgraf Monstrosity
Haven't been in here in awhile, anyone play MTGO V4 Beta? Loaded it up and shut it off. Pretty horrible. Everything just seems to cluttered, couldn't figure out how to sort by set formy collection, trading seemed like more of a hassle, and couldn't find payouts on the tournaments (doesn't seem to link to the website). If they switch, looks like I'll be done on there for awhile.
For FNM last week threw together a fun little Zombie Pod deck and went 2-1, should have played some more to get used to mulligans, kept some pretty bad hands (no red source and a 1 of Zealous, kept it for the open and that cost me.). Probably play it a couple more times before rotation then finish up with my Frites deck.
For FNM last week threw together a fun little Zombie Pod deck and went 2-1, should have played some more to get used to mulligans, kept some pretty bad hands (no red source and a 1 of Zealous, kept it for the open and that cost me.). Probably play it a couple more times before rotation then finish up with my Frites deck.
Been testing out G/W aggro and so far I actually prefer Wolfir Silverheart over Thragtusk. Him and his soulbond partner hits for so hard and add trample with Rancor, it's a force. Thragtusk was a little trickier to play with because I didn't want to trade with their less valued power 3 creature.
Wolfir is just amazing in any deck you slap him in. Thragtusk is more of a build around card.
No, but they are.
Not confirmed. But there are a bunch of cards in M13 that work super well with the Shocklands and they've hinted pretty strongly about it in a bunch of articles. So it is extremely likely at this point.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I'm currently proxying the shocklands to see what the big deal is...I got to say, I still don't "get" them. I would much, much rather have the SoM lands than the shocklands.
Having classic dual lands and all their advantages (fetchable and able to come in untapped) for only 2 life which you don't always need to pay is pretty awesome for formats where duals are not legal.
In Modern you can fetch them, and the choice of how they come into play is always down to you unless you are nearly dead.
I can't tell you how many times I draw a SoM land when I need an important drop, four lands in. Giving the player the option will almost always be a popular option vs an effect they can't control. Not to mention they're searchable with fetch lands and other search engines.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Yeah, that's more indicative of how awesome the dual lands are. So the shocklands are fetchable. I guess some decks rely on that a lot, but I've never really played with any deck that needed to fetch anything that wasn't a basic land for a one of.
Well, that would be same if you drew any land on T4 when you really needed X.
Say you're holding a 5 drop though that can end the game. You have 4 lands and you draw a SoM land you have to wait a turn which means a lot in constructed. If it was a shock you win the game. It's really just how much each drawback for the lands hurt you and paying 2 life is easier to deal with than being a turn behind.
narcosis219
Member
They work best with fetchlands and im not talking about evolving wilds. Fetchlands make your shock lands come into the battlefield untapped. It makes your mana base way more consistent and reliable than it is now in standard, hence why these things cost like 20 when they came out
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Right, but that draw could apply to a lot of cards that you wouldn't want then. On the other hand SoM lands can can on untapped with no downside. Pretty big deal for quick aggro decks (my favorite)
Exactly. It can be the difference between winning and losing, depending on the deck.
Well yeah, in a quick aggro deck I'd prefer something that works stronger out of the gate. But I tend to play more mid-range.
narcosis219
Member
2 life sounds like it costs a lot more than it actually is.
I'd say paying 2 life to put it into the battlefield is worth the ability to fetch them and being able to play them after turn 3. Having consistency is huge in Magic. Again, life isn't as important as you'd think!
Even in a quick aggro deck I'd still prefer shocklands. Unless it's some affinity type deck, you may need a 3 or 4 drop to help close it out and you may need to draw into that land. Even if this is an unlikely situation, deck building is still about maximizing your chance to win. Assuming winning is your ultimate goal, of course.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Well, between the choice of NOT losing life and losing it for the same effect, I'll take the latter. It's not a big deal, until it is.
...well, yeah. I don't see too many people playing to not win...lol.
I'll play with them a bit more, but as of right now, everytime I've drawn them I've just wished for Seachrome instead.
In Standard I don't think Shocklands are going to have a super massive impact. I mean people will definitely play them but without fetch lands they lose a bit of their lustre.
When you have the ability to fetch with things like this:
It gives you crazy versatility to pull whatever mana you need when you need it. That fetch card there can theoretically give you access to any of the 5 colours.
narcosis219
Member
Well, think of how many games you lost because you got your life taken down to exactly 0, and compare that to the number of times you lost because you got hit with 12 damage and you were at 5 life. That extra 2 damage from the shock made no difference.
Of course there will be little specific situations where 2 life does matter, but it is very unlikely that you'll run into that situation very often. Magic is a game with a large randomness component in it. You could argue the same about a card like Emrakul. When you play him, you pretty much win, therefore you should maindeck him. Turns out you lose 90% of your games because you never really run into a situation where you are able to cast him. Same with shocklands doing enough damage to put you behind.
It's always better to bet on consistency rather than get caught up in little situations where you could win/lose due to some stringent circumstances. Otherwise, you can think up an endless amount of situations where every card is bad and you end up playing nothing.
After your third land drop you aren't getting the same effect.
Keru_Shiri
Member
I love shocklands. Makes my job as a burn player a lot easier, especially when combined with fetchlands. >
Joking aside, the power of shocklands comes from having any one of your fetchlands being capable of serving up a dual land, which is massively important for decks looking for a quick splash. Standard right now doesn't need crazy mana bases as much since the current crop of dual lands does a fine job already (anybody remember Painlands?), but that may change with a multicolored block coming.
Joking aside, the power of shocklands comes from having any one of your fetchlands being capable of serving up a dual land, which is massively important for decks looking for a quick splash. Standard right now doesn't need crazy mana bases as much since the current crop of dual lands does a fine job already (anybody remember Painlands?), but that may change with a multicolored block coming.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Shit. I said Seachrome. I made the connect to f'in SoM. I was actually talking about Glacial Fortress....the M10-13 lands.
Work and MTG talk makes for stupid mistakes. PUNTED!
Owlowiscious
Member
Got into an argument with my friend.
AP: "I end my turn"
NAP: "I cast Snapcaster at eot"
AP: "I vapor snag Snapcaster"
NAP: "You can't do that it's end of turn and you passed priority"
AP: "Both players receive priority after a spell resolves. "
NAP: "No, you only have priority when adding to the stack. You ended your turn, you can't play anymore cards."
AP: "Both players need to pass priority in a row before moving on. I passed, but then you cast something, so I will still have priority before the phase ends."
NAP: "No you ended your turn, you can only add to the stack, but you let snapcaster resolve."
[20 minutes of the most frustrating argument begins]
AP: "I end my turn"
NAP: "I cast Snapcaster at eot"
AP: "I vapor snag Snapcaster"
NAP: "You can't do that it's end of turn and you passed priority"
AP: "Both players receive priority after a spell resolves. "
NAP: "No, you only have priority when adding to the stack. You ended your turn, you can't play anymore cards."
AP: "Both players need to pass priority in a row before moving on. I passed, but then you cast something, so I will still have priority before the phase ends."
NAP: "No you ended your turn, you can only add to the stack, but you let snapcaster resolve."
[20 minutes of the most frustrating argument begins]
Yea, MTGO is really awesome for learning the nitty gritty of the rules.
narcosis219
Member
This is why I have the comp rules saved on my phone.
Keru_Shiri
Member
He wouldn't be able to play his Snapcaster if you actually ended your turn. Did you ever get the argument resolved?
As I understand it:
P1's End of Turn phase begins.
P1 passes priority.
P2 gains priority.
P2 puts Snapcaster Mage on the stack.
P1 gains priority.
P1 passes priority.
P2 gains prority.
P2 passes priority.
P2's Snapcaster Mage Resolves
End of Turn phase ends because both P1 and P2 have passed priority in a row.
P1's End of Turn phase begins.
P1 passes priority.
P2 gains priority.
P2 puts Snapcaster Mage on the stack.
P1 gains priority.
P1 passes priority.
P2 gains prority.
P2 passes priority.
P2's Snapcaster Mage Resolves
End of Turn phase ends because both P1 and P2 have passed priority in a row.
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