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[DJ_Tet]

How do you feel about this outcome? I am against the Federal Govt going over the state's heads in this ruling. Please don't turn this into a conservative/christian bash, a Bush bash is fine as apparently he was behind the case going to the Supreme Court in the first place. The ruling was 6-3, with 3 out of the 4 conservative judges dissenting. Justice O'Conner wrote the dissenting views with state rights being the main reason.

This ruling essentially goes over your local state laws concerning medical marijuana. I'm disappointed that this issue is so untouchable for politicians. I really think they are out of touch on this one.

ps-The ruling came down yesterday, but I did a search and couldn't find anything, sorry if old

 

[Hitokage]

Having not read the opinion, I'm betting it has something to do with the FDA's authority over drugs bought and sold.

 

[Ponn]

Feds arresting dying cancer patients, old people and various other people in unbearable pain? Sounds about right for America. I don't see this being enforced and/or getting changed later.

 

[Willco]

Can't say I disagree, simply because this issue is usually hijacked by potheads to tell everyone how not bad marijuana is, despite the fact they're not the ones that should benefit from it being legal for medicinal purposes.

 

[DJ_Tet]

Wow, a pre-hijack against potheads. Please, do go on about how bad marijuana is for someone with an inoperable brain tumor

 

[Zaptruder]

Those that would truly benefit from medical marijuana often have other alternatives to pain relief anyway... for the small minority that would have no other alternative... their suffering will be required to keep the overall health of the country better off... they're already so many poisons in the country, no need to legalise another.


...

Is probably something along the lines of what they thought.

 

[Willco]

Wow, a pre-hijack against potheads.

It's only a matter of time before it comes up.

Please, do go on about how bad marijuana is for someone with an inoperable brain tumor

If you read my statement and those I've made in the past, I think it's pretty clear where I stand on the issue of marijuana being used for medicinal purposes.

 

[Leatherface]

Not that I'm a big pot head or anything, but I'm pretty bothered by it. Especially for medical reasons. Pot is no worse then alcohol. It really bothers me that some "moral" overly conservative douches have the right to say what is good and what is bad for us.

It shouldn't be illegal in the first place IMO, but when it comes to someone medically NEEDING it, there should be no debate.

 

[DJ_Tet]

The conservative judges were the only ones who dissented, well everyone except for Scalia.

 

[heavy liquid]

I think it's wrong. I don't smoke pot, but could care less if other people do, especially if it's for medicinal purposes. In fact, I'd rather it be legalized, and the DEA go after harder and more destructive drugs. I find it totally hypocrytical that pot is illegal when I can buy alcohol and tobacco at the grocery store. But it's all about the money, right?

 

[Phoenix]

Its a jurisdiction issue. Federal statutes always trump state legislation/statutes. I'm sure they didn't even take long to write this opinion.

 

[ManaByte]

Can't say I disagree, simply because this issue is usually hijacked by potheads to tell everyone how not bad marijuana is, despite the fact they're not the ones that should benefit from it being legal for medicinal purposes.

Exactly. And while this is obviously partly to do with the FDA, another part of the problem was that the way medical marijuana was being handled was a joke. Anyone could easily get their hands on it "legally" and while the people who did need it for medical reasons were getting it, potheads were using the current system as well.

I think it's wrong. I don't smoke pot, but could care less if other people do, especially if it's for medicinal purposes. In fact, I'd rather it be legalized, and the DEA go after harder and more destructive drugs. I find it totally hypocrytical that pot is illegal when I can buy alcohol and tobacco at the grocery store. But it's all about the money, right?

Well if the medical marijuana was being controlled better, this probably wouldn't happen.

 

[impirius]

Thought Scalia would go the other way... geez.

 

[Drensch]

If you have cancer and smoke pot, the terrorists win.

 

[Sapiens]

I heard on the radio today how some americans will "escape" to Canada in order to enjoy their pot.

True, we allow it for the terminally ill, but the idea that people would come to Canada to enjoy their weed is insane...Oh, sorry, for medical reasons.

I do not beleive in medical MJ. Not at all.

And people who lump it in with alcohol are suspect. I can enjoy a glass of red wine, not feel any effects (mind altering, or whatever), but a single hit of marijuana can seriously impair the mind.

Having a glass of wine with your meal is respectable. Smoking a J and going to the movies stinking like shit is not for me.

 

[akascream]

Fucking scientologists are everywhere.

 

[DJ_Tet]

By that same token, I feel people who think that medical marijuana being legal is going to make it any easier for their kids to get pot are suspect.

It's easier for kids to get weed in junior high and high school than it is to get alcohol, at least it was for me and my friends. I've heard similar sentiment as well. I don't get the connection. It's already pretty damn easy to get marijuana.

 

[akascream]

And people who lump it in with alcohol are suspect. I can enjoy a glass of red wine, not feel any effects (mind altering, or whatever)

While that is probably true of moderation (I was never capable of that), I consider alcohol to be far worse than marijuanna as a drug. I'd consider it worse than most illegal substances to be honest. Not that I condone the use of drugs, or marijuana, quite the opposite.

I do tend to err on the side of freedom though. If they want to fuck up thier lives, or manage thier pain with whatever, I think it ought to be thier choice. As long as they keep it to themselves anyway, once there is a victim involved, there ought to be high penalties, as there are for alcohol related incidents like drunk driving.

 

[darscot]

My opinion on this is very simple and I've lived it . If you haven't you really have no clue. My Mother died of cancer when I was a kid. Near the end she got basically strung out on morphine. At the time I didn't understand how much the drugs changed her. It was something her and my Dad tried to hide from us kids. It was her dirty secret and I now realize she felt a lot of shame about being on the drugs. The fact that she felt embarasment for it angers me to this day. She had no reason to feel that way.

Jump ahead to my teenage years and one of my best friends Mom's gets breast cancer. Her Docter prescribes marrijuna for pain and appetite. I go over for a Thanksgiving dinner and everyone there goes out side and smokes with her. Just to show they supported her decision. These people are not pot heads there just ordinary people that had a loved one that was very sick. For most of them it was the only time they had ever smoked it in their lives. I have to say it was probable the best dinner I have ever been to in my life. She was aware and happy and people laughed and had a good time.

When I was kid my Mom was sick and most of the time she was so out of it she wouldn't let me or my brother around her. My friend sits out on the porch with his Mom they smoke a joint they laugh and enjoy the time she has left.

No one will ever convince me medical marujuna is bad yet morphine which is basically heroin is good.

 

[Leatherface]

My opinion on this is very simple and I've lived it . If you haven't you really have no clue. My Mother died of cancer when I was a kid. Near the end she got basically strung out on morphine. At the time I didn't understand how much the drugs changed her. It was something her and my Dad tried to hide from us kids. It was her dirty secret and I now realize she felt a lot of shame about being on the drugs. The fact that she felt embarasment for it angers me to this day. She had no reason to feel that way.

Jump ahead to my teenage years and one of my best friends Mom's gets breast cancer. Her Docter prescribes marrijuna for pain and appetite. I go over for a Thanksgiving dinner and everyone there goes out side and smokes with her. Just to show they supported her decision. These people are not pot heads there just ordinary people that had a loved one that was very sick. For most of them it was the only time they had ever smoked it in their lives. I have to say it was probable the best dinner I have ever been to in my life. She was aware and happy and people laughed and had a good time.

When I was kid my Mom was sick and most of the time she was so out of it she wouldn't let me or my brother around her. My friend sits out on the porch with his Mom they smoke a joint they laugh and enjoy the time she has left.

No one will ever convince me medical marujuna is bad yet morphine which is basically heroin is good.

I agree 100%. Now doesn't it piss you off that some overly conservative dipshit politicians are imposing their brand of morals on your buddy's mom? It sure pisses me off.

 

[xsarien]

I think it's ridiculous that the notion can even be entertained that there are perfectly legal drugs out there with more serious side effects than marijuana, yet most of them are not illegal.

That's not to say that the ol' reefer isn't completely harmless, smoking anything isn't terribly good for your lungs. But on the flipside of that equation, at least marijuana does have legitimate medical purposes. You can't say that about tobacco-related products, which are sold just about anywhere to just about anyone.

 

[Sapiens]

I do tend to err on the side of freedom though. If they want to fuck up thier lives...

I think it is the responsibility of a nation's leaders to ensure that we don't have people "fucking up" their lives. Not only do they put others at risk by doing so, but they set a bad example for children.

In moderation, alcohol doesn't have the same effect on one's mind that drugs like marijuana has.

There are flaws with my beleifs here, but this is just the sort of life I lead, with which I am happy. I don't get drunk, not anymore, and I stay away from drugs. They cannot aide me in the success I hope to one day enjoy in my future.

 

[xsarien]

I think it is the responsibility of a nation's leaders to ensure that we don't have people "fucking up" their lives. Not only do they put others at risk by doing so, but they set a bad example for children.

Please, think of the CHILDREN! Don't you care ABOUT THE CHILDREN?

It's an argument with so many holes that it wouldn't work as a spaghetti strainer. Those children eventually grow up, and it should be their individual parents who decide what they should and should not be exposed to, not the government's. Even so, at least put some consistency into your argument. If you want a nanny-state, then there should be as tight a restriction on alcohol, tobacco, junk food, fast cars, loose women, and pornography. All restricted, in fear of people becoming so addicted and/or dependent on them that they fuck up their lives.

In moderation, alcohol doesn't have the same effect on one's mind that drugs like marijuana has.

"In moderation," marijuana isn't any more harmful than a good beer buzz.

There are flaws with my beleifs here

You don't say...

 

[DJ_Tet]

If they legalized weed then everyone would ask for heroin and crack to be legal.

I wouldn't. WTF is that?

 

[xsarien]

...

Druggies would clamor for other illegal drugs to be legalized if one illegal drug suddenly became legal. Get it?

And funny enough, the burden of proof is on you! It's an empty argument, and you know it.

 

[DJ_Tet]

No I get what you're saying, I just think that's bullshit.

Alcohol is a drug, do drunks clamor for crack to be legal?

It's the grouping of marijuana with heroin and crack and cocaine that I find problematic with your statement.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

Having been both critically drunk, and overly baked Id say the drinking was far more mind altering.

 

[DJ_Tet]

So potheads want crack. That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. I don't know any potheads clamoring for legal crack. Pot is basically decriminalized in my state, so there most certainly is a distinction between "illegal drugs." There is a distinction between both laws and users, making blanket statements doesn't help anyone.

 

[darscot]

It's such a strange thing the whole pot vs booze debate. I don't know how anyone could possible experience both and believe pot could be worse for you. It's blatantly obvious once you have done both.

Smoke too much weed you normally eat far too much and sleep like log. You wake up and think man I ate too much I need to go to the gym or go get some fresh air. You usually feel a little stupid or fuzzy for a day or two.

When you drink too much you end up with your head in the toilet puke your frickin lungs. Or better yet puke untill you have nothing left to puke but your body is so messed up it just keeps on puking. You literaly lying there saying I'm sorry I'll never do it again just stop frickin puking already. You get the worst sleep of your life, wake up and wonder where the fuck am I and what in the hell did I do. All you want to do is crawl into a hole and die. You can't even think your head is pounding so hard. Your first though is I need some drugs to make this stop. Then I need to sleep for a week. Then all you pot head buddies show up and try and convince you that you need to get up.

 

[Incognito]

Drinking is far worse than toking a few bowls.

 

[themadcowtipper]

simply because this issue is usually hijacked by potheads to tell everyone how not bad marijuana is, despite the fact they're not the ones that should benefit from it being legal for medicinal purposes.

Wow your a Clairvoyant, it happened just like you said it would...

 

[akascream]

Just to show they supported her decision

I don't mean any offense here, because your post seems pretty genuine, but I believe you are being a bit nieve. There are many ways to show support, the least of which involves getting high.

Drinking is far worse than toking a few bowls.

Or a few lines for that matter. Anyone ever known or talked to a wino? Those fuckers are more fucked up than any crackhead I've ever seen. Alcohol in excess is a fucking awful substance.

I think it is the responsibility of a nation's leaders to ensure that we don't have people "fucking up" their lives.

As long as no 3rd parties are effected, who the fuck are our "nation's leaders" to butt in where they have no business doing so. Fuck off I say.

 

[Zaptruder]

They're all unecessary poisons to human kind... but alcohol is too easy to make and has too much legacy.

 

[bob_arctor]

...

Druggies would clamor for other illegal drugs to be legalized if one illegal drug suddenly became legal. Get it?

So, how 'bout we tell 'em a big FUCK NO? The all-mighty greenery should be spared the foregone conclusions hardcore drugs make of themselves. This has nothing to do with weed being "good" the way a crackhead thinks sucking dick for a vial is good. Eventually. Public clamoring from binged-out addicts? Fuck 'em. Or Methadone that shit. Somethin'.

 

[Nerevar]

In moderation, alcohol doesn't have the same effect on one's mind that drugs like marijuana has.

I'm glad your extensive investigation into the issues has revealed such a compelling and well-grounded argument for you to ply on internet messageboards where people might mistake you for knowing what the hell you're talking about!



And for the record, I agree with the conservatives on this one. State's rights should not be overriden by federal regulations unless a constitutional issue is involved.

 

[Incognito]

WHAT THE FUCK? CAN YOU READ? CRACK HEADS WOULD WANT CRACK TO BE LEGAL AND HEROIN USERS WOULD WANT HEROIN. I LUMPED THEM ALL TOGETHER BECAUSE THEY'RE ALL ILLEGAL DRUGS

situation example:

Pothead: Oh man! I want weed to be legal!
Feds: Ok, marijuana is now legal!
Other people who do different illegal drugs: HEY WHAT ABOUT US?! OUR DRUGS ARE GOOD TOO! WE WANT IT LEGAL!

Understand?

I'm not going to try to explain it to you if you haven't even gotten it yet.

LEGALIZING GAY MARRIAGE WOULD LEAD TO LEGAL, BACKYARD ANIMAL FUCKING AND INCEST RELATIONSHIPS!!!!!!!

SLIUPPPPPPERRRY SLOOPE WHAT????

 

[Willco]

The alcohol versus marijuana debate is tiresome and generally leads to nowhere. The problem is that the medicinal marijuana programs that were in place were a joke and taken advantage of by people who use it for recreational purposes.

I'm not advocating anything and I'm not saying marijuana is worse than so-and-so, but this topic is a great example of how a bunch of people and/or potheads just use the argument because they want to smoke marijuana. The only person with a legitimate complaint has been darscot. The rest of you are like, "But alcohol is worse and why is that legal!"

 

[akascream]

but this topic is a great example of how a bunch of people and/or potheads just use the argument because they want to smoke marijuana

I'll make the comparison and I'm not a pothead nor do I advocate it's use. There goes your little theory.

There's something to be said for the hypocrisy of our system, and for what...backwards compatibility? You can walk into a pharmacy in Mexico and buy antibiotics, or pain killers. Not in the good-ol USA. Land of the free my ass. You need a license to be a god damn beautician here. W. T F. (heh) Oh, but you can buy one of the most dangerous drugs known to man so long as you are 21 years old.

It's fucking bullshit IMO.

 

[Incognito]

There are people with my disease who, sometimes, are in great pain, and medicinal marijuana would greatly alleviate that pain.

Most of us hate, HATE having to inject morphine or any other pain-killer into our bodies because it turns us into walking zombies for three minutes until we pass the fuck out only to awake 8 hours later to the pain -- again. Hell, I've turned down painkillers of that power because of their side effects, instead wanting to just deal with the pain.

 

[Nerevar]

The alcohol versus marijuana debate is tiresome and generally leads to nowhere. The problem is that the medicinal marijuana programs that were in place were a joke and taken advantage of by people who use it for recreational purposes.

I'm not advocating anything and I'm not saying marijuana is worse than so-and-so, but this topic is a great example of how a bunch of people and/or potheads just use the argument because they want to smoke marijuana. The only person with a legitimate complaint has been darscot. The rest of you are like, "But alcohol is worse and why is that legal!"

Wilco, I'd like to point out the first post in this thread that lead us on this tangent was actually by an anti-pot individual

And people who lump it in with alcohol are suspect. I can enjoy a glass of red wine, not feel any effects (mind altering, or whatever), but a single hit of marijuana can seriously impair the mind.

95% of the posts after this point have been debating this fact. The only people that "hijacked" this thread are you and Sapienshomo.

 

[OpinionatedCyborg]

They're all unecessary poisons to human kind... but alcohol is too easy to make and has too much legacy.

Nah, they all have a purpose in the grand scheme of things. Alcohol, in extreme moderation, has been shown to promote good health. Marijuana, as darscot clearly told us, is useful in treating patients currently in extreme pain without drugging them up to the point where they aren't themselves anymore. To certain extent, nearly everything we eat coudl be loosely defined as poisonous; the free radicals we get and trans fats we digest do a lot of harm to our bodies too.

My 2 cents on the alcohol versus marijuana debate: studies have been performed showing those high on weed committ no more dangerous driving acts than those sober. The same cannot be said for drunk drivers who are responsible for thousands upon thousands of deaths per year. Neither vice should be banned, but if we're gonna argue pointlessly about which is more dangerous, I'm gonna side with marijuana as the safer choice.

EDIT: "Drunken driving killed an estimated 16,654 people last year, nearly 40 percent of the nation's total traffic deaths, according to agency projections released in April."
-http://www.wired.com/news/autotech/0,2554,67686,00.html?tw=wn_5techhead

Wow. 40 percent of America's traffic deaths can be attributed to drunk drivers. THAT is a problem that needs to be solved.

 

[Willco]

Wilco, I'd like to point out the first post in this thread that lead us on this tangent was actually by an anti-pot individual

This argument was going to come up regardless of his comments, and I lump him with the whole debate. I never said one side was right or wrong, I said the whole debate is tiresome and leads to three pages of nothing.

95% of the posts after this point have been debating this fact. The only people that "hijacked" this thread are you and Sapienshomo.

How did I hijack anything when I posted a legitimate complaint instead of rehashing an old, tiresome debate?

Answer: Not at all.

The only people who have had anything of value to add have been Incognito and darscot.

I'll make the comparison and I'm not a pothead nor do I advocate it's use. There goes your little theory.

There's something to be said for the hypocrisy of our system, and for what...backwards compatibility? You can walk into a pharmacy in Mexico and buy antibiotics, or pain killers. Not in the good-ol USA. Land of the free my ass. You need a license to be a god damn beautician here. W. T F. (heh) Oh, but you can buy one of the most dangerous drugs known to man so long as you are 21 years old.

It's fucking bullshit IMO.

The ability to purchase narcotics in a pharmacy in Mexico doesn't make that country better. They're heavily regulated for a reason. If the same kind of regulations were in place for marijuana as well, we'd probably all be better off.

Alcohol used to be illegal, but it caused more problems during prohibition than when it was legal. Plus, it's a culture thing. For years, billions of people have been drinking alcohol. If anything, the way Americans market and keep alcohol away from those under 21-years-old causes more problems. Alcohol is not meant to be drank in mass quantities so people can crash cars into other people. If you don't know your tolerance, don't overdo it.

 

[darscot]

I don't mean any offense here, because your post seems pretty genuine, but I believe you are being a bit nieve here. There are many ways to show support, the least of which involves getting high.

None taken, It always amuses me that I am the nieve one. If you ever had to sit though a dinner where someone at the table is dying there not pleasant. There down right horrible. We could have all sat in silence and felt akward and sad. Yes many people will say what we did was wrong and we abused the medical marijuna policy. After all we all took part without prescription. The women was dieing and didnt want to be alienated. You can show support your way but dont tell me how to show mine.

 

[akascream]

None taken, It always amuses me that I am the nieve one. If you ever had to sit though a dinner where someone at the table is dying there not pleasant. There down right horrible. We could have all sat in silence and felt akward and sad. Yes many people will say what we did was wrong and we abused the medical marijuna policy. After all we all took part without prescription. The women was dieing and didnt want to be alienated. You can show support your way but dont tell me how to show mine.

Fair enough, but lets not pretend that getting high isn't enjoyable. That's all I'm saying.

 

[Nerevar]

This argument was going to come up regardless of his comments, and I lump him with the whole debate. I never said one side was right or wrong, I said the whole debate is tiresome and leads to three pages of nothing.

Actually, you said:

Can't say I disagree, simply because this issue is usually hijacked by potheads to tell everyone how not bad marijuana is, despite the fact they're not the ones that should benefit from it being legal for medicinal purposes.

Sounds to me like someone's backpedalling.

How did I hijack anything when I posted a legitimate complaint instead of rehashing an old, tiresome debate?

Answer: Not at all.

Please, you said that you agreed with the ruling simply because it gets hijacked by potheads with other agendas. How is that different from someone saying that they disagree because the issue is hijacked by moralists with an outside agenda (i.e. keeping pot illegal)?

Answer: It isn't


And you left both Phoenix and my comments off the list of "people who have said anything of value" despite both of us commenting on the ruling, not the comparative value of legalizing pot in our society.

 

[akascream]

Careful Willco, nverever will call for your banning if you disagree with him.

 

[Nerevar]

Careful Willco, nverever will call for your banning if you disagree with him.

Still bitter aka? Maybe in that timeframe you learned the meaning of the word "fetish", so next time you won't come across as ignorant and insulting to the population of gayming-age.

I'd also like to add that it was -jinx- who did ban you, and it wasn't for disagreeing with him.

/hijack.

 

[Willco]

Sounds to me like someone's backpedalling.

No, I'm not talking about disagreeing or agreeing with the ruling, I'm talking about the pot versus alcohol debate.

I agree with the ruling, because if you read what I have said, it's simply because there hasn't been a solution or program in place that is competent enough to help those who need it and is not abused by people who want to use marijuana for recreational purposes. Perhaps if I saw more proof of properly regulated medicinal marijuana or some kind of solution to put an appropiate program in place, I'd change my mind.

This is an addition to the state and federal issues at hand, which is as you said, the first thing that needs to be settled.

And you left both Phoenix and my comments off the list of "people who have said anything of value" despite both of us commenting on the ruling, not the comparative value of legalizing pot in our society.

Mainly because you were being a dick, and I have Phoenix on ignore.

 

[videogamer]

The ruling was 6-3, with 3 out of the 4 conservative judges dissenting. Justice O'Conner wrote the dissenting views with state rights being the main reason.

1. Uhhh Kennedy is usually listed under as a conservative...
2. It's generally agreed that the court has 5, not 4, conservative justices.

 

[akascream]

Still bitter aka? Maybe in that timeframe you learned the meaning of the word "fetish", so next time you won't come across as ignorant and insulting to the population of gayming-age.

I'd also like to add that it was -jinx- who did ban you, and it wasn't for disagreeing with him.

/hijack.

I just thought you ought to be called out on your petty holier than thou bullshit.