Played them both for the 1st time this weekend, and finished them both these past 2 days.
All I have to say is, Holy shit.
Completely missed out on this series. Wow. Damn.
I'm sorry if this thread is useless- but having never touched either of these games, and playing them straight through one after the other, its quite something. I just had to comment.
I'd be most interested in your opinions on both games, from all aspects; gameplay, story, graphics, etc... It's very uncommon to find someone who experienced both games at the same time this late to the party, should be a great chance for relatively unbiased opinion on such controversial games (well at least MGS2).
You can't just make a thread like this and say "Wow, I missed out"... No shit, what a cocktease!
Played through Sons of Liberty like three times but I still don't own it. I'm going to have to buy it sometime or another just to make sure I have it in my collection.
Since you never experienced MGS before I wager the impact of playing Raiden over Solid was less of a jarring experience for you then previous fans. Playing MGS3 it hones in that expectations of MGS's main character are thrown for a loop of not being sure what to expect.
I mean did you choose the option in the begining of MGS3 that said, "I like MGS2"? That was quite screw job.
I'd be most interested in your opinions on both games, from all aspects; gameplay, story, graphics, etc... It's very uncommon to find someone who experienced both games at the same time this late to the party, should be a great chance for relatively unbiased opinion on such controversial games (well at least MGS2).
You can't just make a thread like this and say "Wow, I missed out"... No shit, what a cocktease!
Its nice to know you're interested, but the very reason I didn't include anything is that I doubted anyone would give a shit. I mean I know both games have been turned inside out already.
If I'm up to it a may write something up, but a paragraph or two wont do it justice. I will say that MGS3 could be the most 'complete' game I've ever played, in terms of being satisfied with the incredibly long 'climax' and and series of events that I assumed to be the ending but turned out to last a large percentage of the gametime. What they pulled off with narratives, set pieces, cinematics, production values and details in both games, I found utterly astonishing and brilliant as a whole. Not that I found everything flawless, but some aspects are so well done and over the top you tend to forgive everything else. Again, I doubt anyone would be interested in more in depth impressions as both these games are old news. But for someone experiencing both at the same time, it was one hell of an experience as far as gaming goes.
And yes, I feel I need to own these games, even though I don't own a ps2. You feel guilty otherwise.
MGS2 was also my first MGS, missed out on the first one during my few years' hiatus from gaming (completed MG and Snake's Revenge countless times as a kid though). MGS2 was just unbelievable to me. The whole thing was just jaw-dropping, and I honestly didn't mind playing as Raiden. Immediately afterwards I found a copy of MG Greatest Hits, and played through it multiple times, but I have never replayed MGS2.
When I saw the MGS3 trailer (E3 2003? I can't remember) I almost passed out. The wait from then until MGS3 was extremely painful, and MGS3 did not disappoint at all.
The series is my second favorite franchise in all of gaming. It is truly awesome.
Have you played Twin Snakes? Just wondering, not a huge deal if you haven't, but as a series fan now (I'm thinking) you'd probably want to check it out.
Luckily for me, between each series I always forget about the game. Then when i play them they hit me like a ton of bricks. Doesn't look like I'll be forgetting about 4 though unfortunately, just going to make the wait painful.
I didn't mind Raiden what I did mind was those stupid codec conv. between him and Rose it was like soup opera gone terribly wrong ugh. and the ending was fucked up beyond believe the only thing missing was a picture of Kojima laughing at all us :lol
on the other hand MGS3 is one of the best experience this gen along with RE4
yeah...that seems a bit too fast for even me, and i speed through all my games. MGS2 and 3 took less than 13-14 hours each for me, each beaten in roughly 2-3 days
if this was his first time entering the MGS series, that's pretty damn fast
Metal Gear Solid 2 is one of my favorite games of all time. I loved EVERYTHING (YES. E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G) about it, and I would play it again in a heartbeat. It was the only game in history to shock me into playing it again. After the final credits rolled I literally felt emotionally drained. Nothing can compare to that game, in my opinion.
I still need to play MGS3, but I don't have an American Ps2.
Good Q. It was actually 3 days. And I'm not the type to game long sessions. Thig is, I got a hold of the ps2 for a few days and promised myself I would get through those 2 games, as when the week starts, forget it. I will not have time and won't bother playing in 10 minute sessions. This is the 1st weekend in a long time that I have some free time and actually rescheduled other stuff to get through these games. And again, this is something I would NEVER think of doingusually, but it was a special case.
I started with 3, then 2 as I wanted to go chronologically. I was so close to quitting so many times at the beginning, as the controls aren't exactly second nature to me. But once they were down, I got settled and the brilliance emerged. I got through MGS2 so much quicker as the controls had become so natural.
So, as for your comments- yes, I shocked even myself. Some may accuse me of rushing through the games- but from my perspective, this may have been the only chance to experience them for a loong time. And it was damned worth it.
Again, my jaw is still someone slack from the experience.
I doubt anyone would consider this a spoiler, but just in case...
No, you play as Snake the whole time in MGS1. But after playing an entire game with such a great character, it's a lot more jarring to have Raiden thrown at you in MGS2.
Raiden controls the same as Snake for the most part and his storyline was interesting too...I don't see why he gets all the hate. Hating Raiden is like hating yourself. You and Raiden share one thing, you are pawns. Someone tells you what to do and you are doing it without questioning it.
I didn't see this thread and started a similar one. ;
I'll just cut/paste what I posted about MGS. Still have to go through MGS2/3.
me said:
- MGS. Every time I play one of the games I quit early because of the cameras. Well I started the PSX one and it was easier to get into. Then it started to really annoy me (switch controller to fight mantis... yeah I know it's unique but it irked me). At that time I'd give the game a C. Then it just got better and better. The more I played the less the controls bothered me and man the boss fights using a stinger were AWESOME. Also, the codecs/movies never bothered me. Maybe it's with MGS2 that they're really long? I actually wanted more cut scenes. I just finished it 5 minutes ago. Final score: A-. The minus for control.
BTW -
The president of the united states is the 3rd successful clone of Big Boss? :lol and the undercover guy can't be otacon right? From the trailer for 4 he seems like one of the good guys.
I'm really glad you've played and enjoyed both games. Have you played MGS or MGS: TTS?
Heh, I remember being surprised when I saw you getting hyped over the MGS4 trailer, as I didn't remember you ever being in any previous MGS thread.
Again, MGS is my favorite videogame series, so I'm always glad when the series gets a new fan.
As for me, MGS was incredible, but MGS2 was better in every way, except maybe some of the character designs. Since Raiden plays the same as Snake, and since Snake is always nearby, I never had a problem with that. MGS3 is better in every way, except that stealth is somewhat diminished since the soldiers' bullets don't do as much damage as the did in the previous games, and there are a number of situations where nothing is happening (which was never in the previous games),
I never really hated the Raiden part, but I did play 2 before the original, so that might explain quite a bit. Even still, it never really bothered me. I kind of accepted the cheesy melodrama as part of the game experience.
But by the time you're in RAY, trying to run naked through the hallway as Campbell is sitting there screaming shit at you like "I saw Rose with... another man. They looked, how should I say? Intimate. I'm sorry to tell you, Raiden." and "I hear it's amazing when the famous purple stuffed worm in flapjaw space does a raw blink on harakiri rock. I need scissors! 61!" It's jsut awesome. Then it all culminates in that last charge with Snake, with him saying "If you need extra ammo, just let me know." to Raiden's "What if you run out?" followed by snake pointing at his headband going "infinite ammo." Awesome shit.
what sucked for me is that after all the shit I was trying to wrap my head around, and finally did, with the second one, playing the first ones story was soo simple. Not really enough to detract it, but definitely a bit of a shock. It was like going from watching i <3 huckabees to watching independence day.
The first is definitely straight forward. It's not exactly bad though, and not weak in character development. They all succeed in that. It's simple though, and although Snake is a veteran he's also very naive. In the dark. In a sense, it makes MGS1's plot a little less impactful, realizing a lot of it is in vain. But the important thing to pull from it was Snake's wisening up to the truth, his relationship with Liquid, and maybe most importantly confrontations with other warriors. Probably the most truthful stuff Snake took from the experience. Vulcan Raven, Grey Fox, Sniper Wolf, Otacon..
As a game, especially one made on psx in '98, I think it holds up incredibly well. Voice acting, cinematics, and characters all hold up real well. It was seriously a game ahead of it's time, entirely ambitious. MGS2 excels even more so in ambition. It tries incredible stuff, makes the gamer question motive, makes you feel hopeless or upset. Not to mention it delivers on really layering some of the themes and tones set up in the world Snake will fight against in 4, and what Big Boss fought against post 3. It was cold, calculating, but especially thought out. In the series as a whole, it serves it's own purpose. They all have their seperate feel and add to the series as a whole, as maybe the most innovative series of the 3D era. As far as experience anyway.
MGS3 I consider the series' masterpiece. Perfection. It just gives you everything a gamer could hope for. It's just an insane ride through the bizzare, exciting, and amazing. It's just simply incredible. No other way to describe it. I think it definitely elevated the series to a greater height, though I've admired and expected a lot from the series since 1. I can't even imagine what Kojima plans for 4.
As far as anyone who isn't able to get into a certain game in the series, definitely give it another try. There's elements which they all hit at some point in the game, and some heights unique to each game. The series needs to be experienced as a whole. Even if you didn't like being manipulated in 2. Letting go a bit and letting the game take you a bit could do you some wonders. There's no reason for reserve, it's one of the most highly respected series for a reason. The idea of simply playing as Raiden shouldn't be enough to turn people off. Especially considering the game allows Snake to play a unique role in that game, that we don't see him in anywhere else in the series. In 3rd person, in action. He's so entirely noble by the end of 2, brilliant even. You believe him to be a hero, and maybe truly the only opposition to the Patriots. Not to mention Ocelot sheds his skin even more so in that one. Rarely do you see a series with multiple villains so important and developed. Big Boss, Liquid, Ocelot, The Boss. The way they co-exist in this universe is really interesting itself.
Besides, what other series provides a chapter to it's legacy by killing the main character? It was a really memorable and unsettling situation right as the Tanker chapter ended. A complete "what the fuck?!". He did it again in MGS3, post nuclear strike. What a jolt. I wanted to hug the man so bad when the real opening began.
I don't know, I still remember being quite miffed at the change of characters after the 1st mission in MGS2. I never sold the game, but I also haven't played it since. Hearing lots of talk about the end boss being a tremendous pain in the ass doesn't help.
But I'm sure one day I'll finally pick 'er back up and give it the old college try. Once I finish that, it'll be time to tackle Snake Eater. I figure by the time I finish those two games, MGS4 will be out, so it should work out nicely.
I don't know, I still remember being quite miffed at the change of characters after the 1st mission in MGS2. I never sold the game, but I also haven't played it since. Hearing lots of talk about the end boss being a tremendous pain in the ass doesn't help.
Eh? If anyone told you the last boss in MGS2 is hard you should stop listening to them.
I wasn't really bothered by Raiden. He wasn't as good a character as Snake but he's not as terrible as some make him out to be. I thought he was an interesting little experiment by Kojima. Take a character and make him more human than Snake and have him do basically the samethings Snake did (and in some cases more) and see how fans react to him. I think Raiden probably gets more hatred due to Rose more than how he actually acts.
I played 2 right after 3. Both have a ridiculous set of assets, and aspects where they slightly exceed each other. However, in terms of my enjoyment, I'm going to have the give the edge to 2. There was something-more real-, more massive, more all-encompassing about the story and the characters. I never really felt any real emotion with 3, as incredible as it was. With 2- I did. So many scenes were hit in such a brilliant fashion. It could also be a preference in style, which is subjective.
That being said, I found both to be absolute masterpieces in their own right. You just don't get production values higher than that.
negitoro7 - i had the same problem as you, i LOVED MGS on the playstation, played it multiple times and is still one of my fondest gaming memories...
MGS2 i just didnt get - i hated the controls, the overly long cutscenes and the codec conversations that just seemed to go on and on forever... I didnt mind playing as raiden tho!
I did finish the game but i actually got up and made a cup of tea during the ending i was so bored It's the only time i've ever felt like i wanted to finish a game but at the same time wanted to shout "for fucks sake just get on with it" at the TV during the ending.. to this day I don't know what compelled me to finish it..
I havn't played MGS3.. and i'm not sure if i want to. I love how it looks and the temptation is there to play it because i really want it to be like the experience i had playing MGS but i just dont want to face the possibility that i will hate it as much as the second one... i might get around to it at some point, but someone needs to convince me im gonna like it more than MGS2
oh and for what it's worth i bought twin snakes on day of release but it's still languishing in my pile of shame.. will it ruin my last good memory of playing MGS? i dunno, perhaps i should give it a shot and see how i feel about trying 3 afterwards... I'm not entirely convinced that it isnt just my taste in games that has changed in the years since i played MGS
I havn't played MGS3.. and i'm not sure if i want to. I love how it looks and the temptation is there to play it because i really want it to be like the experience i had playing MGS but i just dont want to face the possibility that i will hate it as much as the second one... i might get around to it at some point, but someone needs to convince me im gonna like it more than MGS2
oh and for what it's worth i bought twin snakes on day of release but it's still languishing in my pile of shame.. will it ruin my last good memory of playing MGS? i dunno, perhaps i should give it a shot and see how i feel about trying 3 afterwards... I'm not entirely convinced that it isnt just my taste in games that has changed in the years since i played MGS
Anyone who's actually played MGS3 can tell you that the codec plays a MUCH smaller role in the game. And the cutscenes are, for the most part, more entertaining than the ones in MGS2. The story is also a LOT more straightforward, but that doesn't mean it's dumbed down.
MGS3 is not better in every way, but overall, I'd say it's more accessible than MGS2 was.
I'm pretty much Kojima's bitch (aren't we all :lol) so I liked all MGS games. Before I started playing MGS2 i knew that Snake wouldn't be the only character, so i kinda prepared myself for it. But i couldn't believe what i was playing/seeing. I had never seen a story this 'smart' (the whole digital age and patriots thing) in a video game and therefore alone you should respect Kojima.
Second of all, the fact that he wanted the players to learn more about snake in the third person was also a pretty daring move. It was a good decision because we could learn more about Snake in a different way. Yes it sparked alot of controversy, but playing as Raiden was alot of fun. I really cared for Raiden, he was a bit whiny at times but still, I loved the character.
I didn't really have any big complaints about MGS2, but I can understand why people don't like it because of the amount of cutscenes. The story was told in big chunks and you didn't even know what the whole game was about 'till the end part. If it was more balanced (gameplay/cutscene) then it would be even better, but again, I didn't mind.
Don't get me started on MGS1 though, it was perfect in every way...
MGS3 rapes MGS2, there's no doubt. The other day I replayed MGS2 from start to finish in a day(took me about 5 hours). Most cut-scenes are shitty and boring(and very skip-worthy). The ones that are actually entertaining can be hand-picked. Nevermind the codec sequences, which BESIDES being insanely obtrusive, are also shitty and boring.
MGS3 is an AMAZING improvement over its prequel in those two aspects. The cut-scenes are all pretty much freaking awesome, and after the first couple of hours the codec becomes pretty much optional...you'll get called at the most 2 times during the entire game. BUT, unlike MGS2, you'll want to call the people on your radio, because most convos are hilarious. That's not to say that it hasn't improved gameplay wise, because holy hell it did.
Raiden controls the same as Snake for the most part and his storyline was interesting too...I don't see why he gets all the hate. Hating Raiden is like hating yourself. You and Raiden share one thing, you are pawns. Someone tells you what to do and you are doing it without questioning it.
; 