feynoob
Banned
CMA is a different body organization.
The government has no involvement with them.
Microsoft / Activision Deal Approval Watch |OT| (MS/ABK close)
- Status
The government has no involvement with them.
foamdino
Member
In the vote I voted for:
"Yes, will be approved but only with behavioral concessions."
Not because I want this consolidation to happen, just because I thought that the regulatory bodies wouldn't do enough due diligence. Thankfully the CMA seems to actually give a crap about doing it's job (being an independent regulator, and being on the side of not allowing mergers by default). What I don't understand is how anyone can look at a $2 trillion company buying another company for ~$69 billion and think "well that's fine"
At what point do these absurd mergers become "whoa hold-up maybe the regulators should take a serious look at that?" - the Zenimax deal was ridiculous, prior to that Minecraft for $2 billion was obscene - neither should have been approved (in my opinion).
Allowing this kind of massive deal is not in anyone's interest (apart from the very few people who will make a $ profit from it).
If you like gaming as a hobby, or if you work in game dev, or an adjacent field (server hw, middleware etc), then this deal is toxic - same as Nvidia trying to get Arm - these deals should be killed and the regulators should be firm and make it clear that "no you don't go around buying companies to squash competition"
The cheerleaders thinking only about "free games on gamepass" ffs you've been brainwashed by Microsoft
"Yes, will be approved but only with behavioral concessions."
Not because I want this consolidation to happen, just because I thought that the regulatory bodies wouldn't do enough due diligence. Thankfully the CMA seems to actually give a crap about doing it's job (being an independent regulator, and being on the side of not allowing mergers by default). What I don't understand is how anyone can look at a $2 trillion company buying another company for ~$69 billion and think "well that's fine"
At what point do these absurd mergers become "whoa hold-up maybe the regulators should take a serious look at that?" - the Zenimax deal was ridiculous, prior to that Minecraft for $2 billion was obscene - neither should have been approved (in my opinion).
Allowing this kind of massive deal is not in anyone's interest (apart from the very few people who will make a $ profit from it).
If you like gaming as a hobby, or if you work in game dev, or an adjacent field (server hw, middleware etc), then this deal is toxic - same as Nvidia trying to get Arm - these deals should be killed and the regulators should be firm and make it clear that "no you don't go around buying companies to squash competition"
The cheerleaders thinking only about "free games on gamepass" ffs you've been brainwashed by Microsoft
MasterCornholio
Member
Yeah it's why that date was very important during the trial. They even said so themselves that any later and the deal would be in jeopardy. The CAT just gave ABK an easy way out if they want it.
jm89
Member
Banjo64
cumsessed
Sad attempt by Smith that’ll go nowhere.
The Chancellor has nothing to do with M&As, fostering competitive markets or preventing consumer harm. If he even tried to lean on the CMA, the stench of corruption would end his career.
Sums up their Microsoft’s entire approach to this acquisition, and their obvious distain for the UK (and US) regulator.
All of that aside, I have no idea why Microsoft are chasing this like their literal lives depend on it. Desperation. They must really want to be the only living room box/data collector. Buy Sony/Nintendo folks.
The Chancellor has nothing to do with M&As, fostering competitive markets or preventing consumer harm. If he even tried to lean on the CMA, the stench of corruption would end his career.
Sums up their Microsoft’s entire approach to this acquisition, and their obvious distain for the UK (and US) regulator.
All of that aside, I have no idea why Microsoft are chasing this like their literal lives depend on it. Desperation. They must really want to be the only living room box/data collector. Buy Sony/Nintendo folks.
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Riky
$MSFT
It's a non ministerial government department that has independence for decision making. It's remit and funding come from the government.
MasterCornholio
Member
Maybe they see it as Xboxs last chance?
But I have no idea why they would think that. Xbox will continue even without ABK.
Bernoulli
M2 slut
It's too late now
If they wanted to influence the CMA with gov pressure it should have been before the decision
Now it's too late they've already blocked
MasterCornholio
Member
Convincing the CAT is their best option at the moment. They should focus on that if they want to succeed.
Astray
Member
At this point, I am almost convinced that internally, this gen is Xbox's last chance. That's the only reason this entire deal is probably happening to begin with. A last gasp for relevance in a marketplace that seems to have just.. moved on from their offerings.
feynoob
Banned
Meaning the government cannot get involved with their decisions.
They are independent for a reason.
Me trying to explain him the processTrying to reason with riky?
Good luck champ.
azertydu91
Hard to Kill
You means like spending tens of millions to get Ninja and other streamers to mixer something like a month before closing it ?
Riky
$MSFT
Meaning the government cannot get involved with their decisions.
They are independent for a reason.
Me trying to explain him the process
I just said that the decision making is independent, but claiming that the government has "no involvement" in a government department that they fund and set for the remit for is laughable.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
They conditioned their users to no longer buy games, and their sub count is hitting a plateau (Phil's words). Hell, nobody is buying their boxes anymore going by their own admission with sales being down big time YoY.
Something has to make up for when the promised AAA games hit the sub.
Desperation and pride. Also, monetary compensation on pre-sale shares for exec's.
feynoob
Banned
Aside of funding, they can't get involved with CMA.
So MS move here isn't worth anything.
feynoob
Banned
Ok, let's not go full sky here.
Astray
Member
There's a similar feel here tbh.
It's just super weird to me how they had so much time to actually prepare for this gen, and yet they largely came up with nothing. Even the controller is basically the same with an added share button. It almost feels like an effort to save on R&D while they feel out how this gen goes.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I'm only repeating what they've admitted to the CMA. Phil's words on subs plateauing, and their earnings reports on abysmal console sales.
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Riky
$MSFT
Not only funding, they set the remit for the CMA. If they are unhappy with decisions that the CMA take they can change that remit in the future.
You think that ministers and civil servants can't talk to the CMA? They like any government department can be held to account in front of a parliamentary select committee and asked questions.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
They have tons of studios and they could be outputting generation defining games because they're backed by a platform holder. Instead we have this circus.
God, what xbox could do in capable hands.... sigh.
feynoob
Banned
Putting their games on gamepass day1 was going to have effect on their sales anyway.
And for sales, they are unreliable as you can change the trajectory by having games and hype on your system.
Xbox one who has bad sold around 50m-55m+.
This showcase and their upcoming future games will change that trajectory.
3-5 years is the time we can see the result of these actions.
One more thing, PS+ premium is becoming gamepass slowly, aside of the day1.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
So you're suggesting coercion?
jm89
Member
They already are.
New UK Law Will Give CMA Broad Powers To Boost Competition in Digital Markets | Insights | Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom LLP
The UK’s new regulatory regime for digital markets will give the CMA expansive powers to control the conduct of the largest tech companies, including authority to address the “root causes” of their market power.
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feynoob
Banned
Why do you think they made them independent in the first place?
To make sure stuff like this doesn't happen.
IllegalLemon
Member
I don't think Karen Smith would understand that. You see he's pretty insistent on pestering high ranking officials, to have his way. They're not really that used to being told "NO".
feynoob
Banned
If they bend for him, Amazon and other big boys will do the same thing as smith.
It's a dangerous territory to play around.
Riky
$MSFT
I'm not sure you understand what I'm saying. They come to an independent decision that the government can't challenge or dismiss, nobody disputes that.
However they ARE a government department and they are funded and their overall remit is set by the government. They can be held to account by parliament at a select committee. The Bank Of England is also independent, do you think the chancellor doesn't talk to the Bank of England and give his views because of that? Same with the CMA.
LoveCake
Member
I am not sure why Phil isn't addressing this first, the reason for the subs plateauing and console sales going down is because the studios Xbox own haven't been making any games.
This is from today's Times newspaper.
I don't see how this merger has any benefits for gamer's other than gamepass gamer's.
This deal is bad for the gaming industry and bad for gamer's.
*I am a gamepass user on Xbox Series X, PS5 (disc) & Switch.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
It's bad for the majority of gaming consumers.I am not sure why Phil isn't addressing this first, the reason for the subs plateauing and console sales going down is because the studios Xbox own haven't been making any games.
This is from today's Times newspaper.
I don't see how this merger has any benefits for gamer's other than gamepass gamer's.
This deal is bad for the gaming industry and bad for gamer's.
*I am a gamepass user on Xbox Series X, PS5 (disc) & Switch.
Riky
$MSFT
They are laying the groundwork for a situation where the CAT appeal is successful.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Only for the CMA to say "no" twice?
feynoob
Banned
Government involvement on their decisions means that they arent acting as independent.
How many decisions do you think the government will disagree? You know that this won't stop with MS.
Banjo64
cumsessed
MasterCornholio
Member
Well it depends if they are making the right choices here. Seems like they should be talking more with the CAT and CMA then politicians in my opinion.
But the first thing they should do is renegotiate the delay. ABK is their first obstacle in the process.
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Riky
$MSFT
The Times article says they are talking to the CMA and the Chancellor.
MasterCornholio
Member
Well they should focus more on the CMA than the chancellor. After all the CMA are the ones blocking the deal.
Riky
$MSFT
Getting your point of view over to the second most powerful person in government isn't going to do them any harm, getting the Chancellor of The Exchequer into a meeting in this time frame shows you have clout.
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Banjo64
cumsessed
I feel sorry for Sheev in that case.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
You are suggesting coercion. That's corruption.
MasterCornholio
Member
What clout? They can't even convince the CMA to let the deal through.
Yeah I'm definitely not expecting that to happen.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
If it does, that opens the floodgates for all the big corpos. RIP competition and consumer choice.
KungFucius
King Snowflake
The FTC does not care about the UK, it is outside of their jurisdiction. The whole idea of pulling out of the UK is nonsense, but if it did happen how exactly would that influence competition in US markets?
Yup it's kinda embarrassing like some people in their fanaticism are pretty much openly supporting corruption scenarios
it says a lot about both them and the company they support.Anyway I'm really looking forward to see in July that contract extension where Activision shareholders are asked to approve waiting for 2024 for a new CMA decision and in case that decision is still the same to agree with leaving the UK market
let's also see the price they'll ask for that just in case.There is a reason why Microsoft is basically desperate to have this closed before the end of July. Too bad there is no legal way to do it.
MasterCornholio
Member
Yup it's kinda embarrassing like some people in their fanaticism are pretty much openly supporting corruption scenarios
Anyway I'm really looking forward to see in July that contract extension where Activision shareholders are asked to approve waiting for 2024 for a new CMA decision and in case that decision is still the same to agree with leaving the UK market
There is a reason why Microsoft is basically desperate to have this closed before the end of July. Too bad there is no legal way to do it.
I think Microsofts best option is to end this cleanly. Whether it's by dropping the deal or successfully going through the appeal process. If they do anything illegal its going to look extremely bad for them. And potentially endanger any future acquisitions they want to make. Worst case scenario is that they kill off Xbox due to this. Nobody wants to see them eliminated from the market due to their desperation.
foamdino
Member
One thing that I hope is clear to everyone, regardless of in the past you liked Xbox or not.
It is now clear that Microsoft have not changed since the 90s when they tried (and succeeded) in burying Netscape in the browser wars. The behaviour being shown in this past 12 months should appal everyone.
It is now clear that Microsoft have not changed since the 90s when they tried (and succeeded) in burying Netscape in the browser wars. The behaviour being shown in this past 12 months should appal everyone.
- Paying shills to astroturf and spread FUD (the least if the infractions)
- Being economical with the truth about keeping Bethesda games multi-plat ("we pinky-swear, oh but now the deal is passed nope they're all exclusive from here out")
- Claiming that Amazon, Apple, Google are their competition, not Sony and Nintendo "as they're out of position with respect to cloud"... but the cloud isn't a big deal "honest guv"
- "We're really concerned about stories from ABK"... "We're buying our best friends ABK, they're great"
- And finally... threatening the cybersecurity of a nation state <- at the point where a company believes it can do this with no consequences, that company should be broken up
feynoob
Banned
All this would have been nice and dandy, except gamers and people have gold fish memories.
We will forget about this in 1-2 years from now on.
foamdino
Member
I lived and worked through the browser wars - never forgive and never forget just how awful they were. Over the years they've been on a redemption arc with open source dev (which features heavily in my work) - to the point where younger people think Microsoft is cool/friendly (unlike Oracle for example). Us older engineers remember though.
The desperation Microsoft is showing right now for this deal is something I have never seen before from a huge corporation. Did Nvidia go crazy like this and threatened the FTC and send execs to talk to Biden? It's actually embarrassing at this point for such a successful company to do all this.
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SSfox
Member
Companies like this Monopoly is their only purpose.
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