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[White Man]

From the 1950s to the 1970s, this MKULTRA/MKSEARCH was the CIA's attempt to master the fine art of mind control. This equated to 20 years of wacky government-sanctioned debauch involving numerour toxic and psychoactive chemicals.

The big incident that everyone knows from MKULTRA would be the death of Frank Olson, an Army biochemist and biological weapons researcher, whom appeared to commit suicide a week after being secretly dosed with LSD so researchers could gauge his reaction. My favorite MKULTRA story is Operation Midnight Climax, where the CIA set up brothels, illicitly filled the patrons with psychoactive drugs, and observed what would happen via two-way mirrors.

Some experiments even took place in Canada, though it's not really known to what extent. At least one American doctor was recruited to move across the border and carry out experiments on his patients. The information on the nature of this experiments is foggy, but there was apparently some Eternal Sunshine type of stuff being attempted, using, well, lots of drugs and super-strong electroshock.

Most of the MKULTRA documents were destroyed just as the project was finally being put under gov't scrutiny. Because of the lack of information, it's impossible to know everything that was done under the banner of this project. As a side-effect of the lack of information, a lot of tin-foiliness is centered on MKULTRA, linking it to everything from Jonestown to military recruiting. Frankly, if the gov't wanted mind control so badly, they should've just hired good ol' L. Ron Hubbard, who spent the same 20 years crafting one of the most interesting mind control protocols that's ever existed.

 

[Minotauro]

I thought this thread was going to be about a new Mortal Kombat game.

Regardless, this is pretty interesting...I had no idea such things went on.

 

[Dilbert]

Ah, good -- someone else discovered what my old tag meant.

The big scandal wasn't even that the CIA was conducting mind-control experiments with drugs -- it was that it was violating its charter and conducting operations against United States citizens. The recent intelligence "reforms" in which information will be shared between intelligence agencies probably means that everything is fair game now.

"MK ULTRA" is also the title of the best poem in Matthew Rohrer's new book, A Green Light. If you like poetry at all, you should check it out. (It's not on the web anywhere -- you'll have to see it in your local bookstore.)

 

[border]

Sounds interesting. I would like to know more.

And what is the meaning of tin-foiliness?

 

[KiNeSiS]

From the 1950s to the 1970s, this MKULTRA/MKSEARCH was the CIA's attempt to master the fine art of mind control. This equated to 20 years of wacky government-sanctioned debauch involving numerour toxic and psychoactive chemicals.

The big incident that everyone knows from MKULTRA would be the death of Frank Olson, an Army biochemist and biological weapons researcher, whom appeared to commit suicide a week after being secretly dosed with LSD so researchers could gauge his reaction. My favorite MKULTRA story is Operation Midnight Climax, where the CIA set up brothels, illicitly filled the patrons with psychoactive drugs, and observed what would happen via two-way mirrors.

Some experiments even took place in Canada, though it's not really known to what extent. At least one American doctor was recruited to move across the border and carry out experiments on his patients. The information on the nature of this experiments is foggy, but there was apparently some Eternal Sunshine type of stuff being attempted, using, well, lots of drugs and super-strong electroshock.

Most of the MKULTRA documents were destroyed just as the project was finally being put under gov't scrutiny. Because of the lack of information, it's impossible to know everything that was done under the banner of this project. As a side-effect of the lack of information, a lot of tin-foiliness is centered on MKULTRA, linking it to everything from Jonestown to military recruiting. Frankly, if the gov't wanted mind control so badly, they should've just hired good ol' L. Ron Hubbard, who spent the same 20 years crafting one of the most interesting mind control protocols that's ever existed.

Very good research, This stuff still goes on today however in the form of media brainwash.

I recomend a good song mentioning MKULTRA,
It's by Immortal Technique- 4th Branch
Give it a listen, enjoy

 

[White Man]

Ah, good -- someone else discovered what my old tag meant.

The big scandal wasn't even that the CIA was conducting mind-control experiments with drugs -- it was that it was violating its charter and conducting operations against United States citizens. The recent intelligence "reforms" in which information will be shared between intelligence agencies probably means that everything is fair game now.

"MK ULTRA" is also the title of the best poem in Matthew Rohrer's new book, A Green Light. If you like poetry at all, you should check it out. (It's not on the web anywhere -- you'll have to see it in your local bookstore.)

I've known about this for a long time. I wrote a short story about people tied up in a cult in the 60s that was inspired by certain MKULTRA anecdotes.

Another verified story is of several black federal prison inmates that were dosed on LSD for 77 days straight, and in payment, they'd get their drug of choice.

I've seen enough sources on the amphetamine/barbituate story as well. The patient would have an IV in each arm, one piping amphetamines, and the other piping barbituates into him. This would apparently cause the subject to start babbling without even knowing what he was saying or talking about. Knowing the nature of the chemicals involved, I'd be shocked if there wasn't at least one death involving this particular experiment.

And what is the meaning of tin-foiliness?

There are a lot of questionable MKULTRA stories out there. And of course the conspiracy set tries to tie it to things like the Kennedy assassinations and such.

One 'tin foil' story I've heard a few times about MKULTRA concerns the CIA trying to buy doses of LSD in the 50s, when it only existed in the vaults of the pharmaceutical company Sandoz. When Sandoz refused to sell such a questionable compound, the CIA just got the molecule diagrams and figured out how to synthesize the chemical itself.

This bit of potential and probably fiction goes on to imply that the CIA produced LSD was the same LSD taht would later become popular in the 60s. It's just a fable that blames the CIA for drug issues that would later effect the country. The story seems a bit too nice to be true.

 

[Flynn]

Watch The Ipcress File.

 

[Property of Jumpship]

Didnt Jacob's Ladder touch on this a bit? I seem to remember that after he got back from Nam (really still in Nam, right?) he meet that scientist who explained that it was a drug they took to increase their aggressivness. I could be mistaken, been a long time since I have seen that movie.

 

[White Man]

Didnt Jacob's Ladder touch on this a bit? I seem to remember that after he got back from Nam (really still in Nam, right?) he meet that scientist who explained that it was a drug they took to increase their aggressivness. I could be mistaken, been a long time since I have seen that movie.

BZ aka 'Agent Buzz'. It's a real drug with shadowy origins. The CIA's played with it, but as a chemical warfare agent, not as a mind control mechanism. It''s even more unpredictable than LSD.

The Army started playing with it shortly after it was synthesized, in the late 50s, I believe. What they eventually used it for goes into tin-foil territory, but by looking at official sources and inventories, it's pretty well known that the Army had somewhere around 100k pounds of the stuff, which would be enough to dose an entire small country. BZ gas was used in Vietnam, but as a weapon. It's difficult to get concrete answers on this stuff. The documentation on its full usage has never been declassified.

The US had bombs containing BZ up until the mid-80s.

The chemical made a brief appearance on the streets in the 60s. It's like the nightmare marriage of LSD and PCP. Entropic psychosis coupled (allegedly) with hallucinations from hell. It's relatively easy to synthesize compared to other synthetics, but to the best of my knowledge, it's not on the streets.

EDIT: While doing some more MKULTRA research, I stumbled on a master's thesis from 2002. The title:

The Effects of Nicotine on MK-801-induced Attentional Deficits: An Animal Model of Schizophrenia

Naturally, MK-801 was one of the MKULTRA developed chemicals. The thesis was written by someone in Bethesda, MD. <puts on tinfoil hat>

 

[Gorey]

Damn, I never knew exactly what MKULTRA referred to. Thanks White Man, that's interesting stuff.

Any good books/references offhand?

 

[White Man]

You could find this in most bookstores. It's pretty decent, and it does a good job of making the distinction between what is documented and true and what is anecdotal and unverifiable.

Much like Jonestown, the definitive MKULTRA book has yet to be written, because what has not been destroyed has not been declassified.

 

[Son of Godzilla]

I thought this was going to be about the band.

 

[border]

Shouldn't Freedom of Information Act allow access to the documention?

Just out of curiousity, what was it that made them think LSD would be at all useful for mind control? My experiences with the drug haven't really made me highly susceptible to suggestion or anything like that. I wouldn't think that anyone in a chemically-induced psychotic state would be a particularly useful sleeper agent or mole.

EDIT: Though come to think of it, wasn't LSD something totally different back then? Not chemically, but in terms of strength and effects. Not sure if my past usage would really reflect the drug's capabilities.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

Just out of curiousity, what was it that made them think LSD would be at all useful for mind control?

I'm not sure what differences there are in the chemical/strength/etc. from then to now, but the early hullabaloo was all about personality and behavioral changes happening rapidly with few controlled LSD sessions. If I were an organization with the goals and resources of the CIA, seeing how far that could be taken wouldn't seem a big jump.

 

[fart]

I thought this was going to be about the band.

me too

 

[cubicle47b]

I thought this was going to be about the band.

Yeah... Someone should start one about the band. The Dream Is Over rocks and everyone can participate since you can download all three albums from John Vanderslice's website.