Astral/H3X
Member
One is a macro, one is a 1.4MF, and one is a 1.8 AF.
For a hot second I had an almost identical set of three (though for my A7), but I returned the FE 50mm 1.8 because I don't need it right now.
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NeoGAF Camera Equipment Thread | MK II
- Thread starter MRORANGE
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One is a macro, one is a 1.4MF, and one is a 1.8 AF.
For a hot second I had an almost identical set of three (though for my A7), but I returned the FE 50mm 1.8 because I don't need it right now.
I don't think the 110mm is designed to focus that close. The 120mm is a macro lens, right? Macro + medium format must be a recipe for crazy thin focal planes.
While it is the widest aperture MF lens available (as far as I'm aware), the image circle is quite a bit smaller than on lens systems designed for 120 film, so they have quite a bit more leeway on the aperture before the lens becomes enormous. That said, it's really not as big as I would have expected. Looking at the dimensions, it's pretty much exactly the same size as the Sigma 85mm f/1.4, and even a little lighter than it.
It makes sense, as there are only so many FF users who will be willing to pay to move up to full frame, so they might as well try to convert some existing medium format owners with a unique lens lineup (particularly as they'll be able to use their existing lenses with adapters).
sechsterangriff
Member
I just don't think they can maintain the same readout, iso, fps and buffers at such high resolutions. That's why don't think they'll introduce an "R" just yet. And if they do I don't think it will focus on resolution.
Astral/H3X
Member
They'll just release an A9FW (for FUCK YO WALLET)
JadedWriter
Member
Yeah Sony really does not care about the bank accounts of their customer base. Every company is like this, but every time I look at their stuff I'm like:
"My bank account."
Yeah and phones (especially the iPhones) will take multiple shots in auto and blend them to improve dynamic range and noise. When you shoot RAW however you just get a single picture.
Astral/H3X
Member
Well that's fucking annoying.
JadedWriter
Member
Damn, and people wonder why I want nothing to do with phone cameras...It would probably look a bit crap with all the ghosting
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Oh neat the Sony camera has an ethernet port. That's useful!
By focus close, I mean in terms of portraiture. The Fuji 120mm f4 that they released with the GFX is a crazy good portrait lens. Sharp, good contrast, and hardly any CA. It also nails focus on eyes at a high keeper rate when paired with the GFX.
Astral/H3X
Member
Gimme an f1.4 80mm lens on Medium Format.
BOKEH
BOKEH
Lasthope106
Member
Astral/H3X answered for me.
The Sony 50mm f1.8 is great for portraits, but I like my Sony 35mm f1.8 more general photography. If I had know the limitations of it I wouldn't have picked it up. You can still use the 50mm for other things, but there have been quite a few occasions where I couldn't take the picture I wanted because I didn't have the room to back away enough from the subject.
Last year I watched a video about adapting vintage lenses to the a6000 and the guy on youtube had the Pentax 50mm f1.4, so I got the same. It's an interesting lens but I don't use it as much. It does look damn cool though.
Astral/H3X recommend me the Canon 50mm f3.5 macro and the pictures I've taken have been phenomenal for the price. You definitely need a light source if you are shooting indoors. It will probably not work with insects as the focus distance is really close.
The Samyang a.k.a. Rokinon has been interesting. Asking questions about it on this thread got me banned lol. The pictures that I've taken with it in low light settings, wide open, with a tripod and a 2 second shutter speed have been spectacular. Handholding has been a different story, but I'm learning the specifics of my copy. For the price, it's a great lens. Amazon had it on sale yesterday for about $220 I think. I might pick a second copy at some point.
itsbenoclock
Member
So the Sony a9 announcement; it's a fully electronic shutter that can shoot 20fps...designed for sports. So I only just realised that means it must be a 20fps global shutter in that thing outputting full resolution images, which is insane...but further to that could this lead to a potential announcement of an a7siii with global shutter video recording? Probably not since the FS7 even has pretty slow rolling shutter but perhaps we're closer than previously thought
Edit: Nope, still uses rolling shutter for the silent mode, my mistake
Edit: Nope, still uses rolling shutter for the silent mode, my mistake
Astral/H3X
Member
You can totally use the 50mm f3.5 to shoot bugs -- just need to have a bracket and a flash.
I kinda wanna make a comparison of current smartphones and older camera phones' camera quality. I looked at the files of my trusty old KC910 (2008) and for all of its flaws (chroma noise everywhere) there were some decent looking files. Not sure if it's just the scene, but I like the highlights and colors here. There is quite a lot of bloom which could be why.
the better twin
Member
A9 competes directly with the Nikon D5 ($6500) and the canon 1Dx II ($6000).Yeah Sony really does not care about the bank accounts of their customer base. Every company is like this, but every time I look at their stuff I'm like:
"My bank account."
JadedWriter
Member
I would honestly buy anything over a D5...
Lasthope106
Member
Oh I'm definitely going to try taking pictures but if it doesn't work well I have my Tokina
If I get enough into Macro I'll get the Sony 90mm at some point.
jongkookie
Member
Yup. I discovered this a few months ago when I took a shot of a sunset in dng, pulled it up to Lightroom and you can see noise on the darker spots even at 100 ISO... almost made throw it out the window until I remembered I'm under Apple's upgrade plan.
Same here. I'm only using the NEX-5 coz I had to use it for a previous gig that I left a few weeks ago. I was gonna sell it but who's gonna buy a camera from 2012 for $200? I ended up just buying another F to E mount just so I can use my unused lenses with it.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Damn, the A9 can still record just 30 fps when doing 4K. Full-frame sensor recording, sure, but that seems like a big oversight for a $4,500 camera.
Astral/H3X
Member
Dude got a 40 minute long review done in just a few hours?
Ah, got to shoot it beforehand.
JadedWriter
Member
I think one of my biggest hang ups with getting something smaller is that I really like full frame image quality and depth of field. My D810 supposedly doesn't have all the modern bells and whistles but I still think image wise it's still pretty effing top tier. Even my D600 is no slouch so it's pretty hard for me to dumb it down not to mention find new lenses to buy, I really like 2.8 zooms so I'm fucked.
Yeah, I was hoping the fast sensor readout meant 60fps 4k. No Log either, I wonder if they have a video focused camera on the horizon.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Damn, that's a total game changer when it comes to shooting moving objects... Can't wait to see how this technology evolves.
Price aside, why would anyone honestly consider a DSLR over this?
Seems pretty good but I despise the ergonomics of Sony's DSLR's. Just way too tiny and dinky and feels like it'll break into pieces on a rough outdoor shoot.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
The A7r ii feel sturdy and durable to me...
Plus mirrorless cameras inherently have fewer moving parts making them less likely to have something break when dropped.
JadedWriter
Member
The build isn't bad at all, my problem would be balancing with long glass. I would not want to put the Tamron 70-200 G2, plus an adapter onto a Sony body because that shit would be top heavy and put a lot of strain on the wrists. Yeah you can use a monopod, but you can only pack so much and move around with so much stuff. The Tamron I think is heavier than my Sigma.
This is also part of it, when I was using an a7rii with metabones + canon lens it was a nightmare even with a battery grip.
But I just generally don't like the buttons or the way it holds, Canon and Panasonic are way better in that department imo.
JadedWriter
Member
At least it's not just me that doesn't like Sony ergonomics. I prefer Nikon's layout, but it's what I learned on so it just works for me. If I can just change stuff with my face pressed into the viewfinder then that's a win in my book, though I can't do that with white balance. I technically can, but I just don't know what the damn symbols mean. I always see these youtubers praising Sony for everything, but it just seems like a product I wouldn't enjoy shooting with, at least straight out of the box that is.
Yeah it's not for me, maybe a camera cage would mitigate some of my problems with it but that just adds one more thing I have to fiddle with and I just want a simple and easy to use DSLR that I can pop out of my backpack and pop back in. Canon has always been that way for me and Panasonic is pretty much just as good with ergonomics if not better.
JadedWriter
Member
It's just extra camera bag weight and at that point it just turns into another dslr. People complain about the form factor, but unless you're carrying around a bag full of primes once you put on a 2.8 zoom the size difference really doesn't save that much weight. M43rd's fine it's smaller, but full frame? No, shit's big regardless depending on the lens you have. G Master lenses are huge, at least with a dslr the lens weight is balanced better.
TerryLee81
Member
At least they made the grip a bit deeper compared to the a7. Sports shooters are going to use big ass lenses on this camera, there is no need for the body to be small.
It's as if some manufacturers think size is the only advantage of mirrorless cameras, so they make them as small as possible. But that's not the case anymore,there's many more advantages now.
But luckily cameras get bigger, look at the GH5 and E-M1 II for example. It's a shame samsung left the camera business, because the NX-1 was one of the best APS-C cameras and it was huge.
It's as if some manufacturers think size is the only advantage of mirrorless cameras, so they make them as small as possible. But that's not the case anymore,there's many more advantages now.
But luckily cameras get bigger, look at the GH5 and E-M1 II for example. It's a shame samsung left the camera business, because the NX-1 was one of the best APS-C cameras and it was huge.
Sony camera's workflow is poor. Overall ergonomics is still better on DSLR. Quality of weather resistance is still to be seen. Plenty of time when OVF is still better than EVF. All imo of course.
But at least now they have an increasing set of quality, native FF lenses if $ isn't a problem.
Also since I'm not a sports shooter and don't really have problem shooting BIF on my "inferior" Pentax AF, if I had the money I'd rather just spend a couple more k for a Fuji MF.
Heat could be an issue with 60fps 4k read out + processing. I'm guessing the Log will probably be a paid DLC.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
What does workflow in relation to a camera mean? Too many button presses to accomplish certain things? I don't find that to be the case personally, but as you said, it's all opinion based.
Also, in which scenarios is an OVF better than an EVF? I can't think of a single advantage other than being able to look through it even when the camera is off, but that's completely unimportant to me.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
lag. It's getting more responsive as tech improves, but it'll never be faster than the speed of light. Unless of course, the sensor does a kind of "always taking pictures" functionality so that it can record images even before your finger presses the shutter button.
For the most parts yea it's number of buttons, menus you have to go through to switch functions. Ways to do certain things. I have to use multiple brands of camera and Sony is almost always the most awkward one to use. Also do they write custom EXIF for manual lens info yet? I search my library based on GPS and lens info a lot of time, it becomes difficult if I can't have the camera write focal length and fstop in EXIF.
EVF lags despite all the improvements and it's a bit worse in darker scene. Screen door effect. The combination of the two make it feels like viewing in VR. So if I am looking through the EVF for prolong period of time, I get eye strain. And if I'm shooting in situation where there's a lot of panning, motion sickness becomes an issue.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Really? Lag? We're talking milliseconds here and isn't shutter lag a far more important factor?
An OVF offers more or less the same image that your eyes are seeing, but I don't see how that helps you take a picture more quickly when there is an inherent lag between when you push the button and when the picture is recorded.
OK. I guess I can understand this even if I don't agree. The refresh rates are very high on most EVFs, but there are obviously some individual thresholds here. Personally, I value the ability to be able to see how the picture will look (including exactly what is in focus, the depth of field, etc.) before I take the photo. Being able to see in the dark doesn't hurt, either.
I can customize every button on my A7RII and haven't personally had any issues. I understand a different system being awkward at first. It was a bit odd coming from Canon, but I quickly got used to it. The A9 has another whole dial system for even more quick access options.
No idea about the custom EXIF for manual lens thing. I have never encountered a scenario where I would want to search using the parameters you outlined. I'm also not a professional photographer, but that seems like a very specific requirement you have, so I understand that using equipment that suits those requirements would be the way to go.
I think this is overstated a bit. It's inaccurate so you still need to check the image afterwards if it's critical. It is definitely nice to be able to get to the ballpark more quickly when using a manual lens.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Yeah really. They're both important.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
How is it inaccurate? Especially when manual focusing, the focus of the image is always exactly where it was displayed in the EVF before hitting the shutter. Seriously. I've been doing some macro photography recently and I've never got an unexpected result.
I can't imagine a situation where a modern EVF would introduce enough lag to actually change the result you might get. On the other hand, you don't have a mirror, so there is far less delay in getting back to seeing your image in the viewfinder after hitting the shutter button. I mean, the A9 that was just announced has zero blackout. That's insane.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Maybe you can't imagine it, but if you do hardcore sports photography, it matters. Auto focus also matters, battery life also matters, and lens ecosystem also matters.
JadedWriter
Member
This is why I don't think anybody heavily invested in Nikon or Canon gear is going to drop Nikon. I mean sure some do it, but I don't think a lot of sports pros would.
reggieandTFE
Member
The Olympus E-m1 Mark II using its electric shutter shoots shoots 60 fps RAW with AF locked and 18 fps RAW with C-AF. It also It also has the lowest rolling shutter of any camera tested (probably until the A9 is released, at least.) Of course, it's easier to do for Olympus because they're only using a 4/3 sized sensor outputting 20 megapixel 12-bit RAWs compared to the A9.
Here's some sensor readout times measured for various cameras.
The E-M1 mark II scored ----------------10ms.
Blackmagic Ursa Mini, and Sony FS7 ---14ms.
a7s II FF 4K ------------------30.4 ms (30.2-30.6)
XT2 4k ------------------------ 30.7 ms
a7R II--------------------------- 33.3 ms (35.6-32.2-32.8-35.3-32.6-31.1)
RX100 IV 4K ----------------- 36.6 ms (36.4-36.7)
a6300/a6500 4K 24fps --- 39.0 ms (39.2-38.9)
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Since I'm genuinely curious. What situation would call for 60 fps without any continuous auto-focus? Rapid movement on a 2D plane?
I believe we were talking about OVF vs EVF, but yes of course those things matter.
Since the discussion stemmed from my original point about the A9, it certainly seems like the auto focus is going to be pretty much best in clase. Battery life will be good, but not DSLR level. The lens ecosystem is getting pretty damn good in Sony's camp, but of course if you're already invested in one it's hard to switch.
I certainly don't do "hardcore" sports photography, but I believe this guy does:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJQqOp18k0A&t=122s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQnj4Pt8F6k
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
We are, which is what my first sentence addresses.
My second sentence uses the word "also", and it references your previous statement about how anyone would honestly consider a DSLR over this new camera. Of course, maybe this camera fixes a lot of the old cons and makes so much improvements in other areas that it sets a new standard. If so, that's great for the evolution of tech.
sorry I meant focus peaking
reggieandTFE
Member
Mostly bursts for action that will be occurring in one place. Stuff like this. I think it opens up some creative opportunities. https://youtu.be/t4Rl8yc_zrc?t=326
And Olympus added a "pro-capture" mode that allows you to half-press the shutter prior and it will start buffering photos. Once you fully click the shutter, it will give save the previous 20 photos prior to shutter press and the 14 photos afterward as well. All full sized RAW.
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