New Geist Interview

i know they did it to expand the give variety to the gameplay, and since they are dealing with something supernatural and science fictional i guess they have some room to get creative, but how exactly to objects like a keypad or a dog food bowl get "possessed"?
 
- Metroid Prime and Geist look alike to me. MP has more organic environments, but overall the graphics are in the same "league"
- Halo and Geist look alike aesthetically in that they are both present on the same generation of hardware and use the same broad amount of polygons. OK, so Halo has (overused) specular surfaces. That doesn't feel relevant to me when comparing games.

I'm not getting into a hissy fight over which games look better than others. I'm sure everyone will shoot me down and call me insane for even thinking of putting Halo in this thread, but that's probably because I've always agreed with the visual plateau way of thinking within generations.

I don't think Metroid Prime succeeded because it tried to be a so-called "FPA", but rather because it translated Metroid's 2D gameplay into a 3D environment, and did so very successfully. That is the reason why Metroid Prime scored quite a bit of accolades.
MP succeeded in a variety of areas, one of which was its ability to translate Metroid into 3d. The other was how well it offered an alternative in the FP(S/A) arena. Its ability to succeed in more than one area is what made it so critically acclaimed, and it's probably one of the design goals the game was subject to while under development.

I'd like to think Geist underwent the same kind of reasoning. Maybe n-Space isn't Retro Studios and doens't have the money and situation to hire the absolute AAA+ staff the industry has, nor does it have the historically AAA+ license to back up its requirements. But I principally disagree with denouncing a game's potential just because its graphics are arguably "mediocre" or its developers have a bad track record.

Graphics affect people too much these days. It's very sad. :(

Anyway, out before I lose the thread and get decapitated.
 
Rahul said:
- Metroid Prime and Geist look alike to me. MP has more organic environments, but overall the graphics are in the same "league"
- Halo and Geist look alike aesthetically in that they are both present on the same generation of hardware and use the same broad amount of polygons. OK, so Halo has (overused) specular surfaces. That doesn't feel relevant to me when comparing games.

Dude, it is OFFICIAL. You need to go to the optometrist and seriously get a check up. I'm genuinely concerned... it seems that in my opinion you're in the first stages of glaucoma.

Rahul said:
I'd like to think Geist underwent the same kind of reasoning. Maybe n-Space isn't Retro Studios and doens't have the money and situation to hire the absolute AAA+ staff the industry has, nor does it have the historically AAA+ license to back up its requirements. But I principally disagree with denouncing a game's potential just because its graphics are arguably "mediocre" or its developers have a bad track record.

Check the last post of page 1 of this thread. Visuals are HARDLY the only thing people are complaining about.
 
Geist isn't the worst looking game in the world. It is however technically lacking. What seals the deal however is the fact that its art direction sucks. Excuse me, it has no art direction. Top that with the fact that it appears to control and animate horribly, and you have a bad game. Period.

Halo 2 and Metroid Prime are among the best games of this generation. And when all is said and done, Geist won't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence as those games. It will be on SonicMegaDrives "avoid" list for this forum. I can't believe Nintendo is publishing this crap based on a concept. I would prefer another Kirby Air Ride to this.
 
Amir0x said:
E3 2004



GDC Hands-On

I just want to know where the optimism comes from, really. It looks awful. By all accounts it IS awful so far. And the only thing anyone has to be nice about it is that it has an "intruiging concept", which has NEVER EVER saved a game from being shitty before.


I'm not too worried about controls and AI, that stuff is always WIP. I doubt the graphics will see any huge changes, but that's not a big deal. If we all wrote off games on visuals, certain series would not have gone on to makes millions (lets's be frank, stuff like Pokemon and GTA are underwhelming when compared to other games on their respective platforms).

The optisim is really based on the concept, but I don't see how that's bad thing considering that there is no finished product to evaluate. People are ripping the game on stuff that can and will likely be changed before it goes gold.
 
duckroll said:
. Until then, I will step on the game every chance I get until it is released and well, we'll see! :lol

Dont you have better things to do? If you dont like the concept of the game, then ignore it.

"But oh my god, some other gamers are liking the concept of the game and i dont, wtf?!!!11oneone I must absolutely come in every geist threads and preach my opinion of it as if it was fact for everyone else, because being more annoying than a jehovah witness is my ultimate goal in life"
 
Amir0x said:
Dude, it is OFFICIAL. You need to go to the optometrist and seriously get a check up. I'm genuinely concerned... it seems that in my opinion you're in the first stages of glaucoma.
I'm proud you're taking time out of your day to bash me, Amir0x. I'd never have thought I'd get controversial enough to have you notice.

Amir0x said:
Check the last post of page 1 of this thread. Visuals are HARDLY the only thing people are complaining about.
Absolutely, but it happened to be a primary angle within my discussion with duckroll, which is the only reason I came into the thread in the first place. I can't argue gameplay though -- I haven't played it, so there's not much I can say. I don't intend to align myself with peoples' impressions. All I can comment on is the potential I see when hearing the game described, and the visuals as shown in screenshots.
 
ge-man said:
I'm not too worried about controls and AI, that stuff is always WIP. I doubt the graphics will see and huge changes, but that's not a big deal. If we all wrote off games on visuals, cetain series would not have gone on to makes millions (lets's be frank, stuff like Pokemon and GTA are underwhelming when compared to other games on their platforms).

The optisim is really based on the concept, but I don't see how that's bad thing considering that there is no finished product to evaluate. People are ripping the game on stuff that can and will likely be changed before it goes gold.

You know, when you have had more than one chance to show off your game... and BOTH times it sucks dramatically, yeah... people are going to scratch their heads. Usually in the time frame between one entire year you can generally put out a demo that has decent controls. Not so with them.

Listen, what it comes down to is what you said in the final paragraph. You're optimistic because of the concept. But, then, you should be optimistic about a million games, because a lot of them have interesting and "unique" concepts.

Too bad the majority of them suck, this not being least of them.

Rahul said:
I'm proud you're taking time out of your day to bash me, Amir0x. I'd never have thought I'd get controversial enough to have you notice.

All in good fun.

Rahul said:
Absolutely, but it happened to be a primary angle within my discussion with duckroll, which is the only reason I came into the thread in the first place. I can't argue gameplay though -- I haven't played it, so there's not much I can say. I don't intend to align myself with peoples' impressions. All I can comment on is the potential I see when hearing the game described, and the visuals as shown in screenshots.

Heh, but you can comment on more because there have been many more impressions to go off of (from people who actually played it) and it's ALL negative. It's not exactly a conspiracy :P

But anyway, you're just going to continue to defend yourself from in the hole but I think you're setting yourself up here.
 
ge-man said:
I'm not too worried about controls and AI, that stuff is always WIP. I doubt the graphics will see and huge changes, but that's not a big deal. If we all wrote off games on visuals, cetain series would not have gone on to makes millions (lets's be frank, stuff like Pokemon and GTA are underwhelming when compared to other games on their platforms).
The optisim is really based on the concept, but I don't see how that's bad thing considering that there is no finished product to evaluate. People are ripping the game on stuff that can and will likely be changed before it goes gold.


Pokemon and GTA have mediocre graphics. But Pokemon is fun for fans. And GTA is ambitious. This game is neither. It's just a one trick pony that would be in the bargain bin in about 5 seconds if it were released on the Xbox or PS2.
 
Buggy Loop said:
Dont you have better things to do? If you dont like the concept of the game, then ignore it.

"But oh my god, some other gamers are liking the concept of the game and i dont, wtf?!!!11oneone I must absolutely come in every geist threads and preach my opinion of it as if it was fact for everyone else, because being more annoying than a jehovah witness is my ultimate goal in life"
Buggy Loop, duckroll. duckroll, Buggy Loop!

Project Midway said:
Nintendo could put shit into a dvd case and some of you would still be telling us how innovative that shit is.
If this were an Xbox game developed by MGS I'd be just as interested. This has nothing to do with "gamer politics" -- at least not for me.
 
Rahul said:
If this were an Xbox game developed by MGS I'd be just as interested. This has nothing to do with "gamer politics" -- at least not for me.
ok, thats fine. I just cant imagine this game getting any attention on any other console than GCN. (but to be honest I dont know that much about Geist so I could be wrong...:P)
 
Project Midway said:
Nintendo could put shit into a dvd case and some of you would still be telling us how innovative that shit is.

speaking of innovation, how about you get some new lines already. "NINTENDO COULD SHIT AND YOU FANBOYS WOULD LIKE IT HAHA!!"
 
I'm actually the biggest Nintendo fan here (I've never touched a console other than a Nintendo one), and I can honestly tell you that Geist looks terrible. If it were being published by someone like Midway on Xbox, no one would be talking about it.
 
God's Hand said:
I'm actually the biggest Nintendo fan here (I've never touched a console other than a Nintendo one), and I can honestly tell you that Geist looks terrible. If it were being published by someone like Midway on Xbox, no one would be talking about it.
Sure it would, except I'd like, make a thread on here and get ignored like I usually do when I bring up an obscure topic. And then I'd just talk about it with insertcredit or some other more niche community. The fact that Nintendo is involved gives games huge press -- that's just a fact. It's not a negative attribute for the game, but a positive one, right? At least this way they get much more feedback and are much more motivated to make a difference.
 
God's Hand said:
(I've never touched a console other than a Nintendo one)

Wow, dude. Seriously - get out of the house and join the 128/32bit bit generation, because you have missed out on a colossal amount of classic games.
 
Speevy said:
Pokemon and GTA have mediocre graphics. But Pokemon is fun for fans. And GTA is ambitious. This game is neither. It's just a one trick pony that would be in the bargain bin in about 5 seconds if it were released on the Xbox or PS2.

I understand that. That was my point--they transcend their poor presentation. Again, we haven't seen the complete product. How do you know that the AI and controls are going to suck for the final game, or that the game design will be lacking? You can glean that from demos that have been limited to one area?

I won't bother anymore, though. I can understand people being uninterested, but I don't understand how some can be down right hostile to the game. I don't see anything that warrants the venom. It's not like N-Space is raping a well loved franchise or something.
 
This game is a blatant example of Nintendo branding at work. Like someone else said, if the game came out by another lower grade dev, it would be laughed out of the forum. This is no different than obviously crap EA titles getting higher than deserved attention
 
Geist looks like shit. I can't comment on how it plays, but there is no denying that it is graphically a steaming pile of ass. How anyone can even begin to compare it to Metroid Prime is beyond me.
 
Buggy Loop said:
Dont you have better things to do? If you dont like the concept of the game, then ignore it.

"But oh my god, some other gamers are liking the concept of the game and i dont, wtf?!!!11oneone I must absolutely come in every geist threads and preach my opinion of it as if it was fact for everyone else, because being more annoying than a jehovah witness is my ultimate goal in life"

witness.gif
 
Mooreberg said:
hello america! I am STAR.

You guys are freaking me out, by the way. You're setting the game up against these impossibly high bars -- it has to look as good as Halo with the gameplay of Prime -- and if it doesn't reach them it's crap.

Well, if Jade Empire doesn't look as good as Final Fantasy X then it's crap. And if Forza isn't as full-featured as GT4 then it's crap. And if Rise of the Kasai doesn't have the gameplay of Prince of Persia then it's crap. I can do this all day.
 
I think you have to consider the fact these guys haven't had the oppurtunity to develop with the budget they have now. And many their previous titles didn't require much tasking of hardware. I would assume they are fairly new to GC development.

With two months of polish time, they should be able to sharpen up the textures a little, remember Metroid Prime 2 didn't look all that great until they start putting time in on polishing up the title.
 
Kobun Heat said:
You guys are freaking me out, by the way. You're setting the game up against these impossibly high bars -- it has to look as good as Halo with the gameplay of Prime -- and if it doesn't reach them it's crap.

Well, if Jade Empire doesn't look as good as Final Fantasy X then it's crap. And if Forza isn't as full-featured as GT4 then it's crap. And if Rise of the Kasai doesn't have the gameplay of Prince of Persia then it's crap. I can do this all day.

mrdid.jpg
 
Kobun Heat said:
hello america! I am STAR.

You guys are freaking me out, by the way. You're setting the game up against these impossibly high bars -- it has to look as good as Halo with the gameplay of Prime -- and if it doesn't reach them it's crap.

Well, if Jade Empire doesn't look as good as Final Fantasy X then it's crap. And if Forza isn't as full-featured as GT4 then it's crap. And if Rise of the Kasai doesn't have the gameplay of Prince of Persia then it's crap. I can do this all day.

Like duck said, strawman.

And, uh, also... according to impressions... it's pretty much that the gameplay sucks thus far.
 
The vitriol and rampant generalisations in this thread have me scratching my head, frankly.

Shit, I've as much admitted that the execution will probably be flawed, and yet people are STILL debating with me about whether or not I'm "allowed" to be intrigued by the concept.

No perceived franchise/company/console bias is going to sway me in this. Hell, I couldn't WAIT for Custom Robo, particularly since the N64 games were supposed to be quite fantastic. I loved the concept, and there were 2 games backing it up that were generally considered well executed and fun. Saw I bought Custom Robo for the Cube, and the game universally SUCKED. No spin. No bias. No "Nintendo" goggles coloring my vision. Same way I played Psi-Ops due to its intriguing concepts. That game was pure ass too. Thankfully, I didn't buy it.

Same here. I'm more cautious now, PARTICULARLY given the developer, but I'll be fucked if I'm going to be dictated what I'm allowed to openly anticipate. Heh.

And Amir0x, there are PLENTY of impressions out there from 2003 and 2004 that NOTE the problems with the game, yet still express an overall positive impression. Frankly, I don't have the time or energy to point them out to you, but I could just as easily spend the next 10 minutes finding them and quoting select phrases "proving" my point. I think I'll take a nap instead. :)
 
Mejilan said:
The vitriol and rampant generalisations in this thread have me scratching my head, frankly.

Shit, I've as much admitted that the execution will probably be flawed, and yet people are STILL debating with me about whether or not I'm "allowed" to be intrigued by the concept.

No perceived franchise/company/console bias is going to sway me in this. Hell, I couldn't WAIT for Custom Robo, particularly since the N64 games were supposed to be quite fantastic. I loved the concept, and there were 2 games backing it up that were generally considered well executed and fun. Saw I bought Custom Robo for the Cube, and the game universally SUCKED. No spin. No bias. No "Nintendo" goggles coloring my vision. Same way I played Psi-Ops due to its intriguing concepts. That game was pure ass too. Thankfully, I didn't buy it.

Seems like someone is feeling guilty, because I wasn't accusing you of Nintend-shaded goggles. Unless you were addressing someone else.

Mejilan said:
Same here. I'm more cautious now, PARTICULARLY given the developer, but I'll be fucked if I'm going to be dictated what I'm allowed to openly anticipate. Heh.

Fight the power!

Mejilan said:
And Amir0x, there are PLENTY of impressions out there from 2003 and 2004 that NOTE the problems with the game, yet still express an overall positive impression. Frankly, I don't have the time or energy to point them out to you, but I could just as easily spend the next 10 minutes finding them and quoting select phrases "proving" my point. I think I'll take a nap instead. :)

- Poor Controls
- Poor AI
- Poor Art Direction
- Mediocre Visuals
- "INTRUIGING CONCEPT, POSESS A DOG"

That's what the previews/impressions come down to. At the end of the day, ALL previews/impressions aren't going to outright slander a game until the day it releases. They will always try to find positive aspects. Point is, it's painfully obvious just how positive it all is.
 
Amir0x said:
Seems like someone is feeling guilty, because I wasn't accusing you of Nintend-shaded goggles. Unless you were addressing someone else.

I was not addressing anyone specifically in that part of the post. Just a general response to the hostility in this thread, both to the game itself, but particularly to those actually looking forward to it (unless/until it really does wind up shit.)
 
The Premise of this game reminds me of Omikron: The Nomad Soul. I loved what it was about, but the execution failed at times. I want this to be good
 
I don't see a big deal with some people anticipating the game, but I'm going to keep bashing it because it just seems like a really bad idea. This is going to be up there alongside Eternal Darkness and I wouldn't be surprised if n-space finds itself without a partnership a few months after Geist's release.

NOA is doing a really bad job of picking up outside developers for projects.
 
If it were being published by someone like Midway on Xbox, no one would be talking about it.

Well duh. How often do you see this statement being used. Need I remind you the other side of the coin. The obvious question.

Why would Nintendo pick this game up in the first place?
First party publisher budget >>>> Midway/Kemco budget?
Nintendo producers working on the game??

So yes the game might ultimately suck balls. But hell even Nintendo's own Kyoto developed games sometimes fail to deliver. But there is obviously potential in this game because Nintendo is involved. Period.
 
Amir0x said:
Like duck said, strawman.
"Geist is garbage because CHECK IT OUT HALO" is the logical fallacy here. I'm illustrating what happens when you take that way of thinking to its only possible conclusion.
 
Kobun Heat said:
"Geist is garbage because CHECK IT OUT HALO" is the logical fallacy here. I'm illustrating what happens when you take that way of thinking to its only possible conclusion.

I don't think anyone is making this conclusion, at least I'm not. However...

a.) You ALWAYS compare games to the pinaccle of any given genre, not the worst.
b.) The reason we're hating on Geist hardly has anything to do with Halo, Metroid Prime or solely its visuals.
c.) Everyone who has played the game has had some severe things to say about it.

I mean, that's what it comes down to. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck... then, you know the rest.

That's all I'm saying. This thread is an example of polar opposites. I can't understand how anyone can be enthusiastic about this game knowing just how bad impressions have been and lookin' at it with our own eyes. And they can't understand how anyone can hate on it so badly, knowing that the concept sounds neat and that it isn't a final product yet.
 
See? Instead of taking a much need nap and then moving onto my homework, I'm fricken reasearching Geist impressions, of all things. :lol

If you honestly think that these impressions resound with negativity or even imply that EVERYTHING about the game sucks, or that it even FUNDAMENTALLY sucks... well, then I don't know how to communicate with you guys. Amir0x, you couldn't be more wrong with your blanket generalisations claiming that everyone who's played this game hates it.

Below are a handful of dated impressions from "solid" and "reputable" websites (as far as they all go, collectively.) I'm avoiding more fan-orientated sites such as PlanetGameCube (though I'd argue they've pretty much earned a measure of credibility, regardless), in an attempt to keep this as untainted as possible.

IGN's 12/03 impressions:
http://cube.ign.com/articles/445/445862p1.html

IGN's 05/04 E3 impressions:
http://cube.ign.com/articles/513/513973p1.html

Gamespot's updated-for-GDC 05/05 impressions:
http://www.gamespot.com/gamecube/action/geist/preview_6120080.html

Gamespot's 05/04 E3 impressions:
http://www.gamespot.com/gamecube/action/geist/preview_6095910.html

I won't quote, because they can easily be taken out of context. IGN's 04 impressions (couldn't find any updated-for-GDC impressions at IGN, only vids and movies) reinforces the generally positive outlook the game earned in their eyes. They mention, in particular, generall sharp graphics, though rather generic artsyle, good mood, and unstable framerates. They obviously like the implementation so far, in particular how there seem to be more than one avenue to approaching a puzzle or situation.

The updated Gamespot impression questions why none of the intriguing concepts previously demonstrated were on display, and admit that had they not known about those concepts, wouldn't be nearly as interested in the game. Regardless, we DO know about those other concepts, and this recent demo doesn't do anything to deflect that. It's the first final level, and as such, doesn't yet feature those concepts, because the hero is still alive! Gamespot does, however, confirm that the graphics are moody and servicable, if not stunning, and that the framerate has been locked at a good rate, with naturally-animated characters. Once again, I cannot detect any suggestion from them that the game sucks, and they also reaffirm a positive outlook.

Just to cite a small example from the E3 2k4 demo impressions, I really like how interactive the game feels. For example, in one puzzle, the player must somehow (while in spirit form) manipulate the guard, or the environment, in order to open a solid gate that blocks your path (spirits cannot traverse THROUGH walls.) Since both IGN and Gamespot tried to pass (and failed) using the same methods, initially, it seems that the game draws your attention to a spotlight near the guard. Both IGN and GS inhabited the spotlight and made it move around, flicker, etc. The guard, however, wasn't particularly frightened or agitated (required in order to possess him and open the gate), as he just walked up to the light and unplugged it. From there, the playtesters had to seek alternate means of distracting or scaring the guard.

I LIKE that kind of crap. THAT kind of scenario is what makes the game interesting to me. Now, presumably, if these kinds of situations are what were being shown off last year, then that only means there are much better and more involved situations later on. The game seems to feature a decent attention to detail as well. For example, as you possess different animals or whatever, not only will your first person perspective shift accordingly, but the game's graphics will change to reflect the limitations of the various animals' ocular systems. Not to mention the filters in place when in spirit form. Details in the older impressions, I believe.

My only REAL concern as far as possession is concerned is that the game might make it too simple to solve the puzzles. I'm not too keen on the idea that objects/beings that can be possessed are visually represented with special auras and swirls. While I do NOT want to play a game like the original Doom or Doom II where searching for secrets was tantamount to running at an angle against the walls hitting the Manipulate key again and again, nor do I want to be provided with a puzzle who's solution is obviously tied to one of three "glowing" objects in the room. Unless they make MANY objects "possessable" and leave us to intuit or discover the means ourselves. So long as they don't make JUST those objects that'll provide a solution (within a certain sequence of manipulations) capable of being possessed, I suppose I'll be happy.

I'm not sure how to balance this, and am unsure that N-Space WILL balance it. Perhaps objects only begin to glow upon close proximity to them? I don't know. And how will they explain how/why some objects can be manipulated but other, similar objects, in that situation or in one later in the game, might not be. These are concerns that will be addressed when the game goes final, obviously. It'll prove, in the end, whether the concept was fully realized, or not.

Anyway, Nintendo approved the E3 demo, and they, less than any other company, are likely to "blow their wad" prematurely, imho. I don't find it disheartening in the least that this kind of gameplay mechanic wasn't demonstrated at GDC. What they did show off was a shooter sequence that was much more robust (from what I can infer from the various impressions and descriptions) than what was demonstrated at E3. Solid puzzles + solid adventure/exploration + solid shooting = promising title, in my book. I think we can all appreciate that this won't be a run-and-gun.

You know what, I'll even end off on a less than positive note. Below is a pre-merger Gamespy article, dated around E3 2k4. It actually voices many of the same concerns I have, and while it is a less positive impression than the four I posted above, it by no means accuses the game of being trash, particularly of being trash on all counts.
http://cube.gamespy.com/gamecube/geist/516705p1.html
 
Mejilan said:
See? Instead of taking a much need nap and then moving onto my homework, I'm fricken reasearching Geist impressions, of all things. :lol

If you honestly think that these impressions resound with negativity or even imply that EVERYTHING about the game sucks, or that it even FUNDAMENTALLY sucks... well, then I don't know how to communicate with you guys. Amir0x, you couldn't be more wrong with your blanket generalisations claiming that everyone who's played this game hates it.

Below are a handful of dated impressions from "solid" and "reputable" websites (as far as they all go, collectively.) I'm avoiding more fan-orientated sites such as PlanetGameCube (though I'd argue they've pretty much earned a measure of credibility, regardless), in an attempt to keep this as untainted as possible.

IGN's 12/03 impressions:
http://cube.ign.com/articles/445/445862p1.html

IGN's 05/04 E3 impressions:
http://cube.ign.com/articles/513/513973p1.html

Gamespot's updated-for-GDC 05/05 impressions:
http://www.gamespot.com/gamecube/action/geist/preview_6120080.html

Gamespot's 05/04 E3 impressions:
http://www.gamespot.com/gamecube/action/geist/preview_6095910.html

I won't quote, because they can easily be taken out of context. IGN's 04 impressions (couldn't find any updated-for-GDC impressions at IGN, only vids and movies) reinforces the generally positive outlook the game earned in their eyes. They mention, in particular, generall sharp graphics, though rather generic artsyle, good mood, and unstable framerates. They obviously like the implementation so far, in particular how there seem to be more than one avenue to approaching a puzzle or situation.

The updated Gamespot impression questions why none of the intriguing concepts previously demonstrated were on display, and admit that had they not known about those concepts, wouldn't be nearly as interested in the game. Regardless, we DO know about those other concepts, and this recent demo doesn't do anything to deflect that. It's the first final level, and as such, doesn't yet feature those concepts, because the hero is still alive! Gamespot does, however, confirm that the graphics are moody and servicable, if not stunning, and that the framerate has been locked at a good rate, with naturally-animated characters. Once again, I cannot detect any suggestion from them that the game sucks, and they also reaffirm a positive outlook.

Just to cite a small example from the E3 2k4 demo impressions, I really like how interactive the game feels. For example, in one puzzle, the player must somehow (while in spirit form) manipulate the guard, or the environment, in order to open a solid gate that blocks your path (spirits cannot traverse THROUGH walls.) Since both IGN and Gamespot tried to pass (and failed) using the same methods, initially, it seems that the game draws your attention to a spotlight near the guard. Both IGN and GS inhabited the spotlight and made it move around, flicker, etc. The guard, however, wasn't particularly frightened or agitated (required in order to possess him and open the gate), as he just walked up to the light and unplugged it. From there, the playtesters had to seek alternate means of distracting or scaring the guard.

I LIKE that kind of crap. THAT kind of scenario is what makes the game interesting to me. Now, presumably, if these kinds of situations are what were being shown off last year, then that only means there are much better and more involved situations later on. The game seems to feature a decent attention to detail as well. For example, as you possess different animals or whatever, not only will your first person perspective shift accordingly, but the game's graphics will change to reflect the limitations of the various animals' ocular systems. Not to mention the filters in place when in spirit form. Details in the older impressions, I believe.

My only REAL concern as far as possession is concerned is that the game might make it too simple to solve the puzzles. I'm not too keen on the idea that objects/beings that can be possessed are visually represented with special auras and swirls. While I do NOT want to play a game like the original Doom or Doom II where searching for secrets was tantamount to running at an angle against the walls hitting the Manipulate key again and again, nor do I want to be provided with a puzzle who's solution is obviously tied to one of three "glowing" objects in the room. Unless they make MANY objects "possessable" and leave us to intuit or discover the means ourselves. So long as they don't make JUST those objects that'll provide a solution (within a certain sequence of manipulations) capable of being possessed, I suppose I'll be happy.

I'm not sure how to balance this, and am unsure that N-Space WILL balance it. Perhaps objects only begin to glow upon close proximity to them? I don't know. And how will they explain how/why some objects can be manipulated but other, similar objects, in that situation or in one later in the game, might not be. These are concerns that will be addressed when the game goes final, obviously. It'll prove, in the end, whether the concept was fully realized, or not.

Anyway, Nintendo approved the E3 demo, and they, less than any other company, are likely to "blow their wad" prematurely, imho. I don't find it disheartening in the least that this kind of gameplay mechanic wasn't demonstrated at GDC. What they did show off was a shooter sequence that was much more robust (from what I can infer from the various impressions and descriptions) than what was demonstrated at E3. Solid puzzles + solid adventure/exploration + solid shooting = promising title, in my book. I think we can all appreciate that this won't be a run-and-gun.

You know what, I'll even end off on a less than positive note. Below is a pre-merger Gamespy article, dated around E3 2k4. It actually voices many of the same concerns I have, and while it is a less positive impression than the four I posted above, it by no means accuses the game of being trash, particularly of being trash on all counts.
http://cube.gamespy.com/gamecube/geist/516705p1.html


Great post, I enjoyed the read.
 
Mejilan said:
See? Instead of taking a much need nap and then moving onto my homework, I'm fricken reasearching Geist impressions, of all things. :lol

If you honestly think that these impressions resound with negativity or even imply that EVERYTHING about the game sucks, or that it even FUNDAMENTALLY sucks... well, then I don't know how to communicate with you guys. Amir0x, you couldn't be more wrong with your blanket generalisations claiming that everyone who's played this game hates it.

Below are a handful of dated impressions from "solid" and "reputable" websites (as far as they all go, collectively.) I'm avoiding more fan-orientated sites such as PlanetGameCube (though I'd argue they've pretty much earned a measure of credibility, regardless), in an attempt to keep this as untainted as possible.

IGN's 12/03 impressions:
http://cube.ign.com/articles/445/445862p1.html

IGN's 05/04 E3 impressions:
http://cube.ign.com/articles/513/513973p1.html

Gamespot's updated-for-GDC 05/05 impressions:
http://www.gamespot.com/gamecube/action/geist/preview_6120080.html

Gamespot's 05/04 E3 impressions:
http://www.gamespot.com/gamecube/action/geist/preview_6095910.html

I won't quote, because they can easily be taken out of context. IGN's 04 impressions (couldn't find any updated-for-GDC impressions at IGN, only vids and movies) reinforces the generally positive outlook the game earned in their eyes. They mention, in particular, generall sharp graphics, though rather generic artsyle, good mood, and unstable framerates. They obviously like the implementation so far, in particular how there seem to be more than one avenue to approaching a puzzle or situation.

The updated Gamespot impression questions why none of the intriguing concepts previously demonstrated were on display, and admit that had they not known about those concepts, wouldn't be nearly as interested in the game. Regardless, we DO know about those other concepts, and this recent demo doesn't do anything to deflect that. It's the first final level, and as such, doesn't yet feature those concepts, because the hero is still alive! Gamespot does, however, confirm that the graphics are moody and servicable, if not stunning, and that the framerate has been locked at a good rate, with naturally-animated characters. Once again, I cannot detect any suggestion from them that the game sucks, and they also reaffirm a positive outlook.

Just to cite a small example from the E3 2k4 demo impressions, I really like how interactive the game feels. For example, in one puzzle, the player must somehow (while in spirit form) manipulate the guard, or the environment, in order to open a solid gate that blocks your path (spirits cannot traverse THROUGH walls.) Since both IGN and Gamespot tried to pass (and failed) using the same methods, initially, it seems that the game draws your attention to a spotlight near the guard. Both IGN and GS inhabited the spotlight and made it move around, flicker, etc. The guard, however, wasn't particularly frightened or agitated (required in order to possess him and open the gate), as he just walked up to the light and unplugged it. From there, the playtesters had to seek alternate means of distracting or scaring the guard.

I LIKE that kind of crap. THAT kind of scenario is what makes the game interesting to me. Now, presumably, if these kinds of situations are what were being shown off last year, then that only means there are much better and more involved situations later on. The game seems to feature a decent attention to detail as well. For example, as you possess different animals or whatever, not only will your first person perspective shift accordingly, but the game's graphics will change to reflect the limitations of the various animals' ocular systems. Not to mention the filters in place when in spirit form. Details in the older impressions, I believe.

My only REAL concern as far as possession is concerned is that the game might make it too simple to solve the puzzles. I'm not too keen on the idea that objects/beings that can be possessed are visually represented with special auras and swirls. While I do NOT want to play a game like the original Doom or Doom II where searching for secrets was tantamount to running at an angle against the walls hitting the Manipulate key again and again, nor do I want to be provided with a puzzle who's solution is obviously tied to one of three "glowing" objects in the room. Unless they make MANY objects "possessable" and leave us to intuit or discover the means ourselves. So long as they don't make JUST those objects that'll provide a solution (within a certain sequence of manipulations) capable of being possessed, I suppose I'll be happy.

I'm not sure how to balance this, and am unsure that N-Space WILL balance it. Perhaps objects only begin to glow upon close proximity to them? I don't know. And how will they explain how/why some objects can be manipulated but other, similar objects, in that situation or in one later in the game, might not be. These are concerns that will be addressed when the game goes final, obviously. It'll prove, in the end, whether the concept was fully realized, or not.

Anyway, Nintendo approved the E3 demo, and they, less than any other company, are likely to "blow their wad" prematurely, imho. I don't find it disheartening in the least that this kind of gameplay mechanic wasn't demonstrated at GDC. What they did show off was a shooter sequence that was much more robust (from what I can infer from the various impressions and descriptions) than what was demonstrated at E3. Solid puzzles + solid adventure/exploration + solid shooting = promising title, in my book. I think we can all appreciate that this won't be a run-and-gun.

You know what, I'll even end off on a less than positive note. Below is a pre-merger Gamespy article, dated around E3 2k4. It actually voices many of the same concerns I have, and while it is a less positive impression than the four I posted above, it by no means accuses the game of being trash, particularly of being trash on all counts.
http://cube.gamespy.com/gamecube/geist/516705p1.html

All that work.

Amir0x said:
- Poor Controls
- Poor AI
- Poor Art Direction
- Mediocre Visuals
- "INTRUIGING CONCEPT, POSESS A DOG"

That's what the previews/impressions come down to. At the end of the day, ALL previews/impressions aren't going to outright slander a game until the day it releases. They will always try to find positive aspects. Point is, it's painfully obvious just how positive it all is.

Mejilan, face it. You're going out of your way to try to find any semblance of positive aspects. And in the end it all comes down to people being nice about the concept, but flaming the shit out of the mechanics.
 
Read the impressions I posted. A nice sampling of old and new.

Your generalised summary isn't accurate, and is by no means a valid basis to dismiss my optimism or that of any other here. You occasionally think way too highly of yourself and your opinions, on this board. :lol

I'm going to take a nap now. Bye.
 
Mejilan said:
Read the impressions I posted. A nice sampling of old and new.

Your generalised summary isn't accurate, and is by no means a valid basis to dismiss my optimism or that of any other here. You occasionally think way too highly of yourself and your opinions, on this board. :lol

I'm going to take a nap now. Bye.

I read the impressions. Your impressions can be summed up in "THE CONCEPT SOUNDS SO COOL WOOOO."

The previews, however, are entirely consistent. They say positive things about the concept, but rail on things like difficult to manage/uncomfortable controls, underwhelming art direction/visuals, and generally sloppy AI.

If you think a game can be good based on concept alone, be my guest. I ain't stopping you; you probably like an awful lot of games I think are shitty. But me? No optimism when it's so obvious the gameplay is hurtin' thus far.
 
Actually, Amir0x, it's you who are going out of your way to pull out and blow up all of the criticisms. GameSpot's and IGN's previews were positive, if in a qualified way.

IGN's E3 preview said:
Visually, Geist impresses at times, sporting really sharp textures up close. There are some lighting effects that combine with this to produce a fairly detailed looking environment. However, the art doesn't do much to intrigue and things like the HUD are actually downright unpolished looking.

Right now, Geist is still just an interesting concept with unsteady execution. The controls, most of all, need work. A good console first-person shooter just can't survive without this groundwork laid.

Are there criticisms? Yes. But this was a year ago. Based on last week, we get...

GameSpot's GDC preview said:
The character models, though not exceedingly detailed, moved around nicely in a pretty natural fashion. Similarly, the lab we found ourselves wandering around in wasn't exactly bristling with brilliant textures, but it still helped create an enjoyable, creepy atmosphere.

The first level seemed perfectly serviceable as first-person shooters go...

We'll be sure to bring you more on this promising game as its release draws closer.

How you can imagine that a piece like this is "negative" I have no idea.

I played both demos. I saw the issues in both. But the demos weren't nearly long, detailed, or close enough to completion for me to make any final judgment. Based on what I played (and it's as much as anybody has played right now) I'm sticking to my guns that Geist will not be at all "bad." Whether it will be excellent or just garden-variety "good" is the only real question.

EDIT: And that question will be answered not by the concept but by the final design of the levels and puzzles. Geist isn't about run-and-gun, it's about creative problem solving. If they can nail that experience with intelligent open-ended puzzles they'll have a winner.
 
Kobun Heat said:
Actually, Amir0x, it's you who are going out of your way to pull out and blow up all of the criticisms. GameSpot's and IGN's previews were positive, if in a qualified way.

Of course I'm blowing up the criticisms, because they are MAJOR. Just because the preview decides to "skim over them" - as most previews generally DO - doesn't mean they aren't significant.

Kobun Heat said:
How you can imagine that a piece like this is "negative" I have no idea.

They're about as negative as a preview is ever going to get. Which is to say, most previews DON'T make final judgments and give the game much "leeway", deciding instead to focus on a positive slant. That's just the way previews are, because so much depends on a final build.

Kobun Heat said:
I played both demos. I saw the issues in both. But the demos weren't nearly long, detailed, or close enough to completion for me to make any final judgment. Based on what I played (and it's as much as anybody has played right now) I'm sticking to my guns that Geist will not be at all "bad." Whether it will be excellent or just garden-variety "good" is the only real question.

Well, you stick to your guns. When I'm right, as I inevitably will be, I'll just sit back and smile.
 
No, really people, go play Messiah. You possess people and have them open doors and stuff. And platforming, you all love platforming, right? Mario likes to platform, don't you?
 
Of All Trades said:
No, really people, go play Messiah. You possess people and have them open doors and stuff. And platforming, you all love platforming, right? Mario likes to platform, don't you?

But can you posess a dog? Or a light bulb?

I don't think so!

Messiah owned.
 
Amir0x said:
Well, you stick to your guns. When I'm right, as I inevitably will be, I'll just sit back and smile.

Yeah it's either that or we both eat crow on a message board while playing an awesome game. Really, being negative about Geist is really win/win at this point. :lol
 
duckroll said:
Yeah it's either that or we both eat crow on a message board while playing an awesome game. Really, being negative about Geist is really win/win at this point. :lol

Of course. If it's good - then shit - I'll be playin' that bad boy for a long time. But I think you and me both know how it'll really end up. We can read between the lines. :)
 
If Nintendo/N-Space don't mind, I'd like to spoil the fourth level for you all:

go down the hallway. You'll hear a guard say he's hungry. Possess the plate of food and poison it. The guard will eat it and then he'll have to go to the bathroom. Go down the hall into the storeroom closet and posess either the toilet paper or the newspaper. The guard will unlock the door and lead you into the next area.
 
Dissapointing that the developer had to hide behind "we don't want others stealing our ideas" regarding not showing off any of the unique gameplay at GDC.

Taking that aside, n-space still has a lot of work to do just getting the game somewhat graphically acceptable.
 
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