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[koam]

A lot of you people are just plain ol' stupid. If the Rev isn't more powerful than the Gamecube, than what would be the point of it? They could have easily just released the rev controller for the Gamecube and that's all. Obviously, them releasing a new console in addition to a new controller means that the Revolution has a significant graphical upgrade from the Gamecube.

To put things in perspective, almost no one expected the Gamecube to be more powerful than the "emotion engine super console with toy story graphics".

 

[Timen]

Well, I guess that's a whole lot more than most people on this board. I would be surprised if anybody around here has any real development experience at all with Revolution up until now.

 

[Doc Holliday]

What does brand perception have to do with whether somebody is buying a console for its power? If that was the case, Xbox and GC would be outselling PS2. PS2 would be "known" and IS commonly known to not be as powerful as the other systems. Yet, it continues to outsell the competition.

Sorry, i think you misunderstood what i was saying. I meant one of the many reasons PS2 was able to bury the DC, was brand name. Nintendo will be launching the rev after a 2 consoles that many think were underwhelming. The Sony brand was huge in selling the ps2, the same way the Nintendo brand has sold a shit load of gameboys. BTW, ask many casual gamers and you will be surprisedhow many think the gc by far is the weakest system of the bunch.
However nintendo really pulled a great move twith the rev controller. They might make the graphics war irrelevant. They need to be on point with the advertising, system launch, and they need create some killer games in time for launch.

 

[vitaflo]

This is a fine business strategy, but I don't see how any gamers (i.e., most people on this board) can't be disapointed by this turn. Do people here really want simpler games? I mean all this talk about people not interested in games or occasional players seems like a big FU to "regular" gamers. Basically Nintendo is conceding that market to Sony/MS, and turning in another direction. I don't think it's a bad move by Nintendo business wise, but I'm surprised some gamers on this board are so happy about the strategy. I guess many people might just be jaded about gaming as it exists today....

Why am I happy? Because it gives me something different to play. Why would I be happy if all three companies were producing the same basic games just with different titles? And why should any "hardcore" gamer care if Nintendo goes off in some other direction? According to alot of people here they've been off in their own little world for a while now anyway. It's not like they're the sole provider of all games in video gaming. There's two other consoles that fit the "normal" hardcore bill. Go play them.

 

[jman2050]

[nothing]---------------------------------------X-----------[everyting]

but don't take my word for it.

Oh Johnny

:lol :lol :lol

 

[Maleficent]

I grew up like the rest of you playing Nintendo games and loved every moment of it. I will get a Rev. like the rest of you, but I don’t see Nintendo ever getting back to that cool or must have thing. It’s all about the tech these days with the majority of the gaming crowd. I hope I’m wrong but I don’t see Nintendo making another home console after the Rev.. I see developers using the 360 as there baseline for games and Nintendo losing even more 3rd party support with a weaker console power wise.

 

[Pimpwerx]

There needs to be a crying emoticon. For you if Rev expands the market. You'll have a hard time trying to tell new gamers that youre the "real" gamer

Why? I tell Nintendog fans the same fucking thing. You're not playing games, sweetheart. PEACE.

 

[Doc Holliday]

One thing that might really hurt nintendo is that the gaming media is for the most part composed of hardcore players ie. seanbaby. I really hope they give the rev better treatment than the GC did.

 

[Chrono]

edit: eh nm.

 

[ThunderEmperor]

to hell with you guys :lol

im just kidding. although i've decided to keep my mouth shut for the most part. makes no difference though anyways, my word means nothing here anymore anyways. ; )

hey johnny pm me.

 

[methodman]

Playing on a new type of interface will change how people view the entire system. So that is why it will change how people play, as well as review games for the thing compared to the other two. The GC was just like the xbox and ps2, cept it was looked down upon for being too kiddy, but now the rev is probably (in many peoples opinion) the sleekiest and sexiest looking console coming out. The games, IMO, will look like Halo on the Xbox compared to Halo on the PC, the only difference being the higher resolution. Not that big of a deal, because I had more fun playing it on the xbox than on the PC (16-players in one room baby).

 

[GitarooMan]

Why am I happy? Because it gives me something different to play. Why would I be happy if all three companies were producing the same basic games just with different titles?

I don't understand. Since the Atari gen, we have been getting something different to play each gen. PS3 and X360 aren't going to be different? All of a sudden now we're getting the same thing over and over with PS3 and X360?

And why should any "hardcore" gamer care if Nintendo goes off in some other direction?

Maybe they would like to see Nintendo continue to make great games aimed at gamers, not simplistic games aimed at non-gamers? There are plenty of reasons to care, why do people care about games at all?

There's two other consoles that fit the "normal" hardcore bill. Go play them.

I'll certainly play all three new systems. I'm not saying people are wrong to support Rev, I'm just saying I'm surprised people would rather see Nintendo do this than make a cutting-edge, hi-def system with deep games and a great control scheme. I also don't understand why you have to get all defensive. I'm just bringing up some issues. Every console has their strengths and weaknesses

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

Iwata's comments are just to damn cryptic to understand what he means. Nintendo can't afford to have a console so underpowered that it put portability in jeopardy. I think Nintendo is going for performance over power, being able to reach theoretical peaks and having efficient hardware.

 

[_PsiFire_]

I'm getting tired of Nintendo's cheap ass. Why don't they use the fuckin money they're getting from the damn Mario re-re-re-releases and invest all of that cash into the console's specs?????????????

You're telling me the sales numbers of the re-re-re-re-re-re-releases were EXPECTED? That's BONUS money! Put it into the hardware, goddamnit.

So, you want Nintendo to blow 4 billion dollars (like MS did with the XBOX) of there 6, to have ONLY a 2 million userbase advantage over MS??

Yeah, that's smart there fella.

 

[..pakbeka..]

What about RE4 this generation? The game looks almost as good as any next generation game (real time gameplay-wise) and I'd be happy if REV. games look 3 times better than RE4. AM I RITE!?

yes you are

 

[gamergirly]

Why? I tell Nintendog fans the same fucking thing. You're not playing games, sweetheart. PEACE.

Why should they be offended? You're playing graphic games with your mind

Iwata's comments are just to damn cryptic to understand what he means. Nintendo can't afford to have a console so underpowered that it put portability in jeopardy. I think Nintendo is going for performance over power, being able to reach theoretical peaks and having efficient hardware.

Yeah, Nintendo is really confusing. Like the whole Super Mario 128 supposing to appear at E3. Thats what they hint at or indirectly say, but when you get to the moment it's a completely different story. The only reason why we're so confused or troubled about what Revolution is all about is because there is alot more to what theyre saying.

What are they giving up power in exchange for? It doesnt make any sense since we dont know why.....

 

[ThunderEmperor]

[nothing]---------------------------------------X-----------[everyting]

but don't take my word for it.

please spill what you know via pm.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Iwata's comments are just to damn cryptic to understand what he means. Nintendo can't afford to have a console so underpowered that it put portability in jeopardy. I think Nintendo is going for performance over power, being able to reach theoretical peaks and having efficient hardware.

Much like gamecube's hardware. Im also pretty sure they're heading in this direction, it will be plenty powerful to be "next gen" thats for sure. Gamecube is the closest to achieving its theorical peaks thanks to its 1t-sram memory.

Plus, remember that it was nintendo that approached capcom about REmake's technology, what if.. they developed a technology that would render pre-rendered backgrounds with fast enough streaming to change view in real-time so it wouldnt be a fixed camera angle? (its possible). "Hollywood"'s the name of the chipset

Naw, just pure speculation there.

 

[Kroole]

I'm just saying I'm surprised people would rather see Nintendo do this than make a cutting-edge, hi-def system with deep games and a great control scheme.

I'd love for the Revolution to be cutting-edge in both graphics and presentation but it won't happen because cause frankly, Nintendo can't really afford it. Just imagine what kind of money they have to throw around to not only get the best HW but also to overtake both Sony and Microsoft. It wouldn't come cheap and might even ruin Nintendo.

I'm quite happy that Nintendo is doing something different with the Rev if that means they'll stick around longer and thus atleast try and innovate once more.

 

[vitaflo]

I don't understand. Since the Atari gen, we have been getting something different to play each gen. PS3 and X360 aren't going to be different? All of a sudden now we're getting the same thing over and over with PS3 and X360?

Remember when you played in the arcade back in the 80's (maybe you don't, i don't know how old you are) but every game you played was pretty much different from every other? I miss that. These days most games fit into specific genres, and they're all variations on a theme. As time goes on and games get more expensive you're going to see less risks taken.

Yes there are going to be new experiences on PS3 and X360. But for every Katamari there's 50 run-of-the-mill FPS games. I'm sure there will be generic me-too games on Rev as well, but Nintendo is at least giving more opportunity at new gaming experiences because of the controller. For some people, better graphics don't make a better experience. If Nintendo made some uber console that had 10x the power of PS3 that's fine, but it wouldn't be why I'm excited about it.

Maybe they would like to see Nintendo continue to make great games aimed at gamers, not simplistic games aimed at non-gamers? There are plenty of reasons to care, why do people care about games at all?

You don't think they'll have Zelda and Metroid on the system? This isn't an either/or proposition. A lot of GC games were simplistic games aimed at non-gamers (Mario Party, hell, Mario Anything). It's not a new philosophy of theirs, they're just expanding on it.

I'm just saying I'm surprised people would rather see Nintendo do this than make a cutting-edge, hi-def system with deep games and a great control scheme. I also don't understand why you have to get all defensive.

I wasn't being defensive. You asked a question and I answered it. Like I said, Nintendo could go make a super cutting edge system. Fine by me. So long as they keep the controller, and their comitment of trying new things with gaming. My comment had nothing to do with graphical prowess.

 

[heidern]

Here's a link top the full g4 Iwata intereview.

And's here's a transcription of the bit regarding hardware power.

If you are just going to compare the spec sheets and spec numbers Revolution may not have the equal or higher number as the ps3 or xbox 360 may have, but the fact of the matter is if people are going top connect our machine and their machine to the ordinary TV set at home and try to compare the differences I really dont think that they can tell such a huge difference between the machines.

Nintendo been eager to expand the gaming population in, order to do so we have to invite the people who are not currently playing videogames at all so in this challenge if we are simply going to say "look we have better graphics" I really dont think they will be intrigued to play with videogames. After all they are not interested in videogames at all so that the comparison doesn't make any difference for them, for their judgement to either buy or not buy the videogames at all. Rather in order to invite them to the world of gaming we have to dispatch the message: "this is something relevent for you, this is interesting for you, so that why dont you touch it and if you touch it I'm sure you're going to love it!" That kind of message is more important than saying this is more beautiful graphics simply can.

 

[citrus lump]

I don't really read Iwatas' comments as a negative thing towards graphics. To me it sounds like he's saying, "No HDD, no blue ray, no hd- but the games will look VERY comparable to what we've seen thus far of next gen."

And as far as Johnny Nighttrain goes, I think he's redeemed himself. His hints on the controller were spot on. I say in johnny we trust. :lol

 

[MadOdorMachine]

Johnny, not everyone doubted what you said before. Any chance you can tell us if there will be any type of visor that is either included or sold separately with the Revolution? Also, can you give us any details on how strong third party support will be?

 

[GitarooMan]

Remember when you played in the arcade back in the 80's (maybe you don't, i don't know how old you are) but every game you played was pretty much different from every other? I miss that. These days most games fit into specific genres, and they're all variations on a theme. As time goes on and games get more expensive you're going to see less risks taken.

Yes there are going to be new experiences on PS3 and X360. But for every Katamari there's 50 run-of-the-mill FPS games. I'm sure there will be generic me-too games on Rev as well, but Nintendo is at least giving more opportunity at new gaming experiences because of the controller. For some people, better graphics don't make a better experience. If Nintendo made some uber console that had 10x the power of PS3 that's fine, but it wouldn't be why I'm excited about it.

You don't think they'll have Zelda and Metroid on the system? This isn't an either/or proposition. A lot of GC games were simplistic games aimed at non-gamers (Mario Party, hell, Mario Anything). It's not a new philosophy of theirs, they're just expanding on it.

I wasn't being defensive. You asked a question and I answered it. Like I said, Nintendo could go make a super cutting edge system. Fine by me. So long as they keep the controller, and their comitment of trying new things with gaming. My comment had nothing to do with graphical prowess.

These are all very valid points. I think the potential is all there it's just that trying new things with gaming may not always automatically be better. For me, the fact that the new Zelda and Metroid will not be as visually impressive as they could have been (assuming Rev is slightly underpower with no hi-def) is a bit of a disappointment for me, but I'm sure the gameplay will be solid. I just sometimes get frustrated that people (not anyone here in particular) see Nintendo as the only innovator in the industry and put them on a pedestal. All the companies have done innovative things (Xbox Live, hi-def gaming, dual analog, etc.), not just Nintendo. I won't argue that Nintendo hasn't done more than others, but they are not alone.

I guess in a sense I see Nintendo taking one step back and one step forward. The focus on simpler games is sort of a step back (IMO). The backwards compatiblity is a clear nostalgia play, but doesn't really add new content. The controller may be a step forward, though.

On an unrelated note, I think that the Rev is clearly aimed at Japan first (rightfully so), where the game market has been weakening for years. In the US, games are as strong as ever, so I wonder if the Rev's simpler focus will strike as much of a chord with large groups of US gamers, where the current state of video gaming is pretty strong. Sorry for the rant. I also see you were not being defensive, I was misunderstanding your response

 

[drohne]

can i take your resistance to the idea of revolution as a between-generations console as evidence that some nintendo fans still care about graphics? because i'd hate to see you revert to the "graphics don't matter" mantra once the obvious becomes...even more obvious.

oh johnny don't. :lol

 

[imastalker co.]

Also, can you give us any details on how strong third party support will be?

well, if there's one thing i've been trying to stress since day one, is that developers are developing for the Revolution based on principle alone. i'd hope that that comment makes sense to you guys now. the support is definitely there on all levels. the controller is gonna allow for enchancments to be made to just about every genre, and that makes developers very excited. not to mention all the new genres that will be created.

can i take your resistance to the idea of revolution as a between-generations console as evidence that some nintendo fans still care about graphics? because i'd hate to see you revert to the "graphics don't matter" mantra once the obvious becomes...even more obvious.

oh johnny don't. :lol

hey, im as much a graphics whore as much as anyone else here. having said that, gameplay is always the bottom line to me. but that's definitely not to say that i don't appreciate good eye candy.

in any case, if out of nowhere (and i really mean that), the Revolution can't hold its own against the PS3 and 360, well, you definitely won't hear me saying "graphics don't matter".

 

[Tim the Wiz]

Why can't the Revolution's innovation be coupled with comparable if marginally underpowered hardware in comparison to the 360/PS3? (PS2 > DC or XB > PS2; who really knows at this point?) Why can't the system entail simple games with Animal Crossing (which is far from shallow in any case) and deep games like Metroid Prime 3 and Zelda? Why do people similar to those who thought the PS2 would be more powerful than the GameCube, or that the Xbox would be an instant failure assume things based on speculation of fact and try to justify it as certain fact?

Personally, I think everyone is getting way ahead of themselves.

 

[vitaflo]

For me, the fact that the new Zelda and Metroid will not be as visually impressive as they could have been (assuming Rev is slightly underpower with no hi-def) is a bit of a disappointment for me, but I'm sure the gameplay will be solid. I just sometimes get frustrated that people (not anyone here in particular) see Nintendo as the only innovator in the industry and put them on a pedestal. All the companies have done innovative things (Xbox Live, hi-def gaming, dual analog, etc.), not just Nintendo. I won't argue that Nintendo hasn't done more than others, but they are not alone.

I can see how someone who is really into improved graphics or physics, what have you, being disappointed. It just needs to be said that not all of us care about graphics. I was impressed by MGS4's graphics, but what interested me from what I saw about that game was having an old man as a main character in a game. That was cooler to me than any graphical treatment, again because it gives a new gameplay experience you don't usually see.

I think Nintendo gets the "innovator" card just because they've been around the longest, and have helped progress the industry. But they also get the "gimmick" card for the same reasons. They try a lot of things, and not everything flies.

 

[bigNman]

I am sure the graphics will be considered a generational leap over GameCube. Thats good enough for me. Combined with wi-fi, new controller, flash storage and cheaper price than the competition I think its sure to be a great deal.

 

[Vandiger]

I expected Gamecube 1.5, I have never understood fanboy's expectations of Revolution even competing with Xbox360 or PS3 since they've been putting more importance to backwards compatiblity, the new controller, small size, affordability, get "non-gamers", etc. Common sense is needed here

 

[Spike]

the revolution's case is too small to accomodate big hot chips, it doesn't support hd resolutions, and virtually every nintendo employee you ask has been downplaying the importance of graphics. now the president of nintendo has come right out and said that it won't be as powerful as xbox 360 or ps3. and some of you still won't draw the obvious conclusion. :/

You know what ATI specializes in? Mobile graphics technology that offers almost the same performance as their regular cards in a low-power consumption and very small footprint.

There will be very little discernable differences between the three consoles.

 

[John Harker]

TI also has a product in development code-named "Hollywood," fyi.

And I also have a really funny/interesting story about a Nintendo meeting/conference that was being held today in NYC and myself... but I don't know how I should tell it, I don't want to get in trouble, heh.

 

[imastalker co.]

did we all forget about what Nintendo has done in the past with their consoles as far as pricing and power goes? did we all forget about what Iwata said at GDC.

you know, just saying and all, if you guys are gonna play the common sense card.

 

[dark10x]

did we all forget about what Nintendo has done in the past with their consoles as far as pricing and power goes? did we all forget about what Iwata said at GDC.

you know, just saying and all, if you guys are gonna play the common sense card.

The DS has since been released and was a smashing success. The Gamecube...not quite as much.

 

[Bluemercury]

TI also has a product in development code-named "Hollywood," fyi.

And I also have a really funny/interesting story about a Nintendo meeting/conference that was being held today in NYC and myself... but I don't know how I should tell it, I don't want to get in trouble, heh.

Well then why did you even bring that to the table.....

 

[Pellham]

That's a different translation. Iwata said the spec sheets may not match. Then again, GCN had the weakest spec sheet.

uh? the PS2 was weaker than the GCN and X-Box. I mean besides comparing specs, you can just tell by the look of the games.

 

[ThunderEmperor]

TI also has a product in development code-named "Hollywood," fyi.

And I also have a really funny/interesting story about a Nintendo meeting/conference that was being held today in NYC and myself... but I don't know how I should tell it, I don't want to get in trouble, heh.

spill the beans. come on

 

[TheJollyCorner]

please spill what you know via pm.

:lol :lol :lol don't get your hopes up

 

[John Harker]

Well then why did you even bring that to the table.....

Haha, I was hoping someone else would talk about it if they knew anything about it!

I had no idea there was one going on today till I stumbled upon it.

 

[jarrod]

Superficial system spec comparison time!

PlayStation 3 = Xbox

Xbox 360 = GameCube

Revolution = PSP

...all being within the same ballpark, but there's a clear order too.

 

[imastalker co.]

The DS has since been released and was a smashing success. The Gamecube...not quite as much.

your point being? and before you say anything. don't forget that in the past Nintendo has released consoles that are....

* More powerfull than the competetion
* Smaller
* included a revolutionary controller
* was $100 cheaper
* took a loss on the hardware at launch

revolutionary controller aside, they did with the GameCube as well. that's 2 times in a row that they've pulled this off, exactly why can't they do it again?

i really think that those of you who feel Revolution will be weaker due to the fact that DS is weaker than PSP really have the wrong idea altogether. consoles and portables.... well, when it comes to Nintendo atleast, tend to have completely different priorities when being designed.

so before you guys go on and on about how the system is going to be noticeably weaker because...

A. It's smaller
B. it's expected to be cheaper
C. their direction with the DS

all i can say is...
- look at Nintendo's history of console design. when have they ever had a console that didn't hold their own against the competetion? remember, consoles, not portables. two very different things.
- watch Iwata's GDC keynote again.
- ATI specializes in making small graphics cards.
- GameCube's 12 Million Polys Vs. PS2/xbox's 70 Million + Polys

those of you who keep talking about how it's common sense that it's gonna be weaker because of what nintendo has been saying. exactly what are you basing this on? was it when Iwata said that system would hold it's own graphically against the other 2 systems? was it when Iwata said that graphics are important to him, but that graphics aren't enough to provide new experiences? or are you just taking kaplans word for it ; )

i mean, i don't see how you guys can say it's common sense.

 

[..pakbeka..]

I'm pretty sure they said the gamecube would be weaker back in 2001

 

[Spike]

i mean, i don't see how you guys can say it's common sense.

Don't you? :lol

 

[imastalker co.]

alright, point taken. but you know, im trying to give people the benefit of the doubt here. although yes, i should know better.

 

[SantaC]

I guess Nintendos still to be unveiled revolution surprises has nothing to do with power then. Should be interesting to see what it is.

 

[Ark-AMN]

from the translation, it kind of sounded that he was talking about HDTV's when he referred to the difference in graphics, but he said that it wouldn't be so noticeable if you play on a regular TV. Thats at least what i kind of got out of it

 

[papercut]

Developers are pretty much in agreement that the Rev. isn't as powerful as the other two consoles, and that's going by the interviews I've been reading on game sites. How much less powerful it is seems to still be up in the air though.

I'm guessing the difference will be noticeable, but not drastic. And as good as ATI may be with notebook parts, the fact of the matter is that you still run into heat issues with small cases. However, given that the Rev. will launch probably a year after the 360, ATI should be able to close the gap between the two performance-wise to the not-so-drastic point.

 

[Mr. Blonde]

No, not fixed. The PS2 was not far behind technologically speaking. It was more than capable of matching and, occasionally, exceeding the other machines on the market. To suggest otherwise is foolish and fanboy-ish.

The PS2 does compete with XBOX and Gamecube from a technology standpoint.

DS does not compete with PSP from a technology standpoint, but it clearly does not matter.

I'm not suggesting that Revolution is going to follow the same route as the DS either. I was simply suggesting that Nintendo themselves has experienced success without top end hardware with the DS.

Don't forget that PS2 was more powerful than the systems that came out before it, while Revolution probably will be less powerful than X360.

 

[soundwave05]

I don't think the gap between Rev and X360/PS3 will be nearly as large as the DS-PSP gap.

That's not what Iwata said.

Chances are the graphics will be more or less the same, you just won't get the higher HD resolutions on the Revolution.

 

[dark10x]

alright, point taken. but you know, im trying to give people the benefit of the doubt here. although yes, i should know better.

Fine. I'm putting all of my faith in you. The Revolution will be nearly as powerful as XBOX360 and PlayStation 3 (possibly even equal).

I figure it's better to anticipate the worst than expect the best, but I'm throwing that aside and expecting the best. Anything less will be a huge disappointment. They better deliver.

You say you know almost everything? That's why I'll put my faith in you and expect far more than I did previously.