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[soundwave05]

Now that we have a clearer view on what type of system the Revolution is, the above scenario seems like what actually may have happened.

People keep asking "well what have IBM/ATi been doing all this time?" ... I think Nintendo was indeed basically working on a "GameCube 2" successor.

This console was canned at some point in 2004 I believe. Nintendo cut ties with Factor 5 and Silicon Knights in 2004 ... this decision was likely made because Nintendo had dramatically changed direction.

Work on Revolution begun right around Mr. Iwata officially announcing Revolution at E3 2004. They continued to work on the controller up until this summer as per Mr. Miyamoto's comments. This timeline seems to make sense.

In 2004, IGN was hearing that GameCube 2 would be a $300 console, obviously something changed along the way.

Low GameCube sales and the DS likely prompted Nintendo to change their philosophy.

 

[malek4980]

This needed a new thread like a woman needs an adam's apple

 

[soundwave05]

This needed a new thread like a woman needs an adam's apple

Sounds like you've had some experience in that area :lol

 

[CB3]

soundwave05
Just doesn't get it.
Over and over and over again.


:lol :lol :lol

 

[Gahiggidy]

Prove it. Go do some investigative reporting and get the guys at Factor 5, ATi, et. al. to go on the record backing up your scenario. Otherwise, its just blind speculation.

 

[Rhindle]

You're correct about what happened in 2004, in terms of Nintendo changing course. I'm pretty sure you're not correct about where they were headed before that.

 

[soundwave05]

Prove it. Go do some investigative reporting and get the guys at Factor 5, ATi, et. al. to go on the record backing up your scenario. Otherwise, its just blind speculation.

Yeah, I'll get right on it, lol.

I think Revolution itself probably has only been in development for about 1 1/2 years.

 

[FortNinety]

Hey, I finally got in on another 12 page thread on the very first one!

Hi mom!

 

[MegaByte]

I think Revolution itself probably has only been in development for about 1 1/2 years.

I think it's the total opposite. I think Revolution has been in development since N64DD, and stuff like Stage Debut were offshoots of that. The patents seem to point towards this. That doesn't mean Revolution was exactly what they had in mind for their primary console, however, just one set of many ideas they were throwing around.

 

[Chittagong]

Now that we have a clearer view on what type of system the Revolution is, the above scenario seems like what actually may have happened.

People keep asking "well what have IBM/ATi been doing all this time?" ... I think Nintendo was indeed basically working on a "GameCube 2" successor.

This console was canned at some point in 2004 I believe. Nintendo cut ties with Factor 5 and Silicon Knights in 2004 ... this decision was likely made because Nintendo had dramatically changed direction.

Work on Revolution begun right around Mr. Iwata officially announcing Revolution at E3 2004. They continued to work on the controller up until this summer as per Mr. Miyamoto's comments. This timeline seems to make sense.

In 2004, IGN was hearing that GameCube 2 would be a $300 console, obviously something changed along the way.

Low GameCube sales and the DS likely prompted Nintendo to change their philosophy.

Props. I think this is exactly what happened. I even recall some chatter about Nintendo having two alternative routes for their next console. Might have been rumors without substance, but this seems logical and explains why they aren't further with the project at this point.

 

[Duderz]

Interesting speculation, Soundwave. Also goes hand in hand with the rumored specs we got a year or so ago about the 2 different machines.

 

[soundwave05]

Well the other thing is when Nintendo dropped Silicon Knights, I believe Denis stated that Nintendo was going in a different direction.

Seems like that directional shift happened in 2004.

I do agree that the basic idea for a "gyro" type controller has been in development at Nintendo for a while and may have actually been intended for release on the GameCube (Marionette? Iwata's promised "new accessories" for the GC which never were released?).

However I don't think it was until 2004 or so that Nintendo started to consider the idea of a console based basically entirely around this type of controller tech.

 

[conker]

This needed a new thread like a woman needs an adam's apple

Women have adam's apples.

They usually don't protrude as much as men's though.

I myself have a huge ol' adams apple to go with my deep voice.

There's a pretty decent wiki on it.

 

[ImNotLikeThem]

Yeah I would definitely say something akin to this happened, and most likely in 2004. I'm sure the DS had some part in this as well, but that would explain both Silicon Knights and Factor 5 in such a short time "dropping out" so to speak. This is a HUGE gamble for any company, Nintendo most of all, but if they felt it was the best for them then that is thier decision.

 

[Joe]

Prove it. Go do some investigative reporting and get the guys at Factor 5, ATi, et. al. to go on the record backing up your scenario. Otherwise, its just blind speculation.

you, of all people is criticizing someone for posting blind speculation?

edit: if i had to guess i'd say revolution brainstorming first started around the development of the gamecube. nintendo probably thought to themselves "we're doing this SHIT again?? over 10 years of the same fucking shit!".

 

[deadhorse32]

Big hints :

- The day Factor 5 drop Nintendo ("We like powerfull hardware. GC 4 LIFE"..."we are making pilotwing for the REV"......"we are now Sony BIATCH. PS3 4 LIFE" )
- Miyamoto (or Iwata) saying the DS is an experiment for next-gen (i guess it means underpowered hardware with funky control). I guess that if DS bombed HARD the Rev would have been vastly different
- Silicon Knight not sharing the same vision
- Rev being small
- ....

 

[Chrono]

- Miyamoto (or Iwata) saying the DS is an experiment for next-gen

I'm starting to develop this insane hatred for the DS. Seriously. I mean I already bought a few games for it, though not hardware (I'll get that when the re-design is out), but every time I think DS I can't help but blame that ugly machine for taking away the greatest game of all time - aonuma's epic Zelda that could've set the standard for a next-gen game. ARGH.

 

[SpokkX]

good choice by nintendo, the only way the can surive is to be different..

Rev will be to Ps3 what DS is to PSP

sounds good to me, since DS is a lot more fun than PSP (at least so far)

 

[Nightbringer]

NES, SNES, N64 and GCN are traditional consoles.

NES: 62 milions
SNES: 39 milions
N64: 32 milions
GCN: 20 milions

Revolution is a new type of console that everyone can buy and doesn´t compete directly against Xbox360 and Playstation3.

 

[[Nintex]]

NES, SNES, N64 and GCN are traditional consoles.

NES: 62 milions
SNES: 39 milions
N64: 32 milions
GCN: 20 milions

Revolution is a new type of console that everyone can buy and doesn´t compete directly against Xbox360 and Playstation3.

NES : Perfect product at the right time, excellent games
SNES : Fighting Sony and Sega, excellent games
N64 : Fighting sony ended up with 40% market share because of excellent games
GCN : Super Mario sunshine underwhelming the windwaker disaster , no online , creating cheap and short junk(luig's mansion) , Dumping RARE, medicore junk... instead of excellent games...

 

[Raven.]

good choice by nintendo, the only way the can surive is to be different..

Rev will be to Ps3 what DS is to PSP

sounds good to me, since DS is a lot more fun than PSP (at least so far)

just say good bye to nextgen physics...


As for revolution being the right path for nintendo... Honestly anyone saying nintendo couldn't have done better is practically kidding themselves. I mean nintendo launched GC this gen, and without loss and at a low price, IIRC, and it wasn't too far from xbox(a console so top of the line, so cutting edge, so ridiculously expensive it would have nearly bankrupted many a company, a console whose lifespan had to be cut short due to losses :lol ), you didn't have to compare it with the n64, heck not even with the first next-gen console the dreamcast which came like 2 years earlier.

What nintendo has done now would be akin to them having launched the GC in 2001 with sub-DC suped-up n64 gphx. Though, not as bad given we've gone past most gphx anomalies/downsides from the first 3d generation.

Just to let it sink in better(assuming those specs are real.)... I mean this is going beyond cheap and it is simply going for entirely outdated h/w, the difference between rev to x360/ps3 is WORSE THAN THAT BETWEEN DC and XBOX :lol , but unlike the DC it is not launching years prior but a YEAR AFTER x360. They could've gone with much better h/w and still've sold it at a profit and at a low price(see GC).

There's only one explanation for this in my mind, and it is the success of the DS, especially in the face of the psp. Nintendo realized that they could release h/w that was way beyond cheap, completely outdated and not even remotely competitive, and still get similar sales. Those who bought the DS, voted with their wallet, this is the outcome.
edtd

 

[HyperZone<3]

I think Nintendo is going to be doing their best to spoil the party for M$ and Sony.

If Nintendo launches a low-cost(and still marginally profitable) piece of hardware at launch, while Sony and M$ are still eating losses with hardware that could cost the customer twice as much as Ninty's system, its seriously going to slice into the other guy's businesses. If Nintendo gets a substantial piece of the casual market, then 360 and PS3 will be fighting over the hardcore customers, and the cost outlays of running a "traditional console" require as many customers as possible to recover the cost spent on the system.

I think Nintendo will return to a "traditional" console sometime in the future. But first they are going to do everything they can so sap the profit from M$'s and Sony's coffers.

 

[quetz67]

Miyamoto (or Iwata) saying the DS is an experiment for next-gen (i guess it means underpowered hardware with funky control).

What you guys dont get is that the DS is a generation ahead of the GBA. Just the fact that it's power doesnt compare to another portable gaming system with a production price about 3-4x as high, doesnt mean it is underpowered.

The PSP sells good, OK, but the DS sells better, and that it not only because of double and touchscreen but because it is still much more affordable for the masses.

btw. I have a PSP and no DS, but thats because price wasnt a deciding factor for me. And maybe MP:H makes me buy a DS too (like PS3 plus Rev probably)

 

[Willie Dynamite]

Those who bought the DS, voted with their wallet, this is the outcome.

Glad I bought a DS then.

 

[Mr Mike]

This is pointless. "I think they were making GameCube 2"? Please.

 

[Scrow]

Dumping RARE

given what Rare produced for Xbox, do people still think they were much of a loss? They've entered next-gen on a better foot, but I still don't have the confidence in them that I once had.

edit: speaking of which, has there been any mention of what their next projects will be?

 

[Inumaru]

Nintendo brings out the blind/deaf/dumb speculators like nothing else in the history of the world. Why is this?

 

[SantaC]

GameCube 2 is coming in 2006.

 

[human5892]

Soundwave: yes.

 

[lollerskates]

I think Nintendo is going to be doing their best to spoil the party for M$ and Sony.

If Nintendo launches a low-cost(and still marginally profitable) piece of hardware at launch, while Sony and M$ are still eating losses with hardware that could cost the customer twice as much as Ninty's system, its seriously going to slice into the other guy's businesses. If Nintendo gets a substantial piece of the casual market, then 360 and PS3 will be fighting over the hardcore customers, and the cost outlays of running a "traditional console" require as many customers as possible to recover the cost spent on the system.

I think Nintendo will return to a "traditional" console sometime in the future. But first they are going to do everything they can so sap the profit from M$'s and Sony's coffers.

whoah how many times can you fit "M$" in a single post?

 

[Scrow]

whoah how many times can you fit "M$" in a single post?

only 3 it seems

 

[jarrod]

NES, SNES, N64 and GCN are traditional consoles.

NES: 62 milions
SNES: 39 milions
N64: 32 milions
GCN: 20 milions

Revolution is a new type of console that everyone can buy and doesn´t compete directly against Xbox360 and Playstation3.

SNES was 49M btw.

 

[quetz67]

given what Rare produced for Xbox, do people still think they were much of a loss? They've entered next-gen on a better foot, but I still don't have the confidence in them that I once had.

edit: speaking of which, has there been any mention of what their next projects will be?

Grabbed by the Ghoulies 2 in 2008, Banjo Kazooie Live and Rehashed 2009, new Killer Instinct for Xbox 1080 launch

 

[Shiggy]

edit: speaking of which, has there been any mention of what their next projects will be?

Banjo-Threeie (they started development after GbtG)
Sabreman Stampede (Do you know Donkey Kong Racing? That's how it should've been called some years ago)

 

[Scrow]

Sabreman Stampede (Do you know Donkey Kong Racing? That's how it should've been called some years ago)

oh cool, i always wondered what happened to that. Diddy Kong racing was great, so it'd be cool to see what they can do with the kart genre once again.

 

[Shiggy]

oh cool, i always wondered what happened to that. Diddy Kong racing was great, so it'd be cool to see what they can do with the kart genre once again.

Well, bothg ames aren't confirmed, but the Sabreman team was involved in Kameo, so I think they got back to their own game now (which was announced in Scribes last year).

 

[Particle Physicist]

the difference between rev to x360/ps3 is WORSE THAN THAT BETWEEN DC and XBOX :lol

how can you say this when we know absolutely nothing about the GPU ? all we know is the supposed amount of ram and the supposed speed of the CPU.

 

[quetz67]

oh cool, i always wondered what happened to that. Diddy Kong racing was great, so it'd be cool to see what they can do with the kart genre once again.

A game that might make me buy a 360

 

[SKOPE]

I think Nintendo is going to be doing their best to spoil the party for M$ and Sony.

If Nintendo launches a low-cost(and still marginally profitable) piece of hardware at launch, while Sony and M$ are still eating losses with hardware that could cost the customer twice as much as Ninty's system, its seriously going to slice into the other guy's businesses. If Nintendo gets a substantial piece of the casual market, then 360 and PS3 will be fighting over the hardcore customers, and the cost outlays of running a "traditional console" require as many customers as possible to recover the cost spent on the system.

I think Nintendo will return to a "traditional" console sometime in the future. But first they are going to do everything they can so sap the profit from M$'s and Sony's coffers.

Can I live in utopia too?

 

[HyperZone<3]

firstly, its easier then typing Microsoft.

Also, with steeply rising costs to hardware makers (Sony's first PS3 year is gonna be rough) it makes sense to me that Nintendo would remove itself from the competitive part of the field and try to find a new, more profitable niche. The handheld business is still paying the bills, so why not?

And unless Nintendo is content to stay a player in a novelty business forever, it makes sense that they could attempt a return to a more traditional console in the future. Will the Rev's sucessor follow down the same underpowered path, or will we see the Gamecube 2 in 2010?

And if Nintendo wanted to be mean to the other guys, and more importantly, spur their own business, it makes sense to me that they would undercut the price structure being offered by Sony and Microsoft. Not many people ever got rich by being nice.

 

[Mifune]

I seem to remember the successor to GameCube being poised to go toe-to-toe with the new MS and Sony machines in the features and spec wars. Also, it was definitely said that the new Nintendo system would release at the same price as its competitors.

So yeah, I agree that the Revolution didn't become Nintendo's focus for "next-gen" until fairly recently. Good post, soundwave.

 

[Gahiggidy]

Yeah, I'll get right on it, lol.

Go4it. Don't underestimate the power of email.

I think Revolution itself probably has only been in development for about 1 1/2 years.

Well, at leasst two... but that doesn't mean they had anything in the works before that. I know we've heard NOA execs say things like "we're always working on the next console" but that could just be BS.

 

[gamergirly]

Sounds like you've had some experience in that area :lol

:lol

 

[Unresponsive Bee Victim]

Oh god, I feel an SNES CD type of deal coming on here.

 

[Raven.]

how can you say this when we know absolutely nothing about the GPU ? all we know is the supposed amount of ram and the supposed speed of the CPU.

The spec comments hinting at it being slightly beyond xbx in the gphx department. Come on now the system hasn't even got 128MB of ram, and the cpu's said to be extremely low-clocked underpowered cpu around 1Ghz. The comments basically suggest a suped-up flipper(3MB edram, like hello?!?) with at most modern-day features, and looking at the rest of the specs even those of the gpu ain't hinting at miracles happening with regards to that part(3MB edram, IIRC, something like 2x gc flipper's speed. ).

 

[Particle Physicist]

The spec comments hinting at it being slightly beyond xbx in the gphx department. Come on now the system hasn't even got 128MB of ram, and the cpu's said to be extremely low-clocked underpowered cpu around 1Ghz. The comments basically suggest a suped-up flipper(3MB edram, like hello?!?) with at most modern-day features, and looking at the rest of the specs even those of the gpu ain't hinting at miracles happening with regards to that part(3MB edram, IIRC, something like 2x gc flipper's speed. ).

did you not read the ign article?

"Readers are advised to make two notes before continuing with this article. The first is that developers are still working with incomplete Revolution hardware. Most studios are, in fact, developing on "GameCube-based kits," according to major software houses we spoke to, which have asked to remain anonymous. The second is that developers are still without final specifications for Revolution's ATI-developed graphics chip, codenamed Hollywood. "


let me repeat that.. developers are still without final specifications for Revolution's ATI-developed graphics chip...


im not waiting for a miracle. but saying something like 'the difference between rev to x360/ps3 is WORSE THAN THAT BETWEEN DC and XBOX' when we know nothing about the actual specs of the machine is just plain retarded.

 

[Raven.]

did you not read the ign article?

"Readers are advised to make two notes before continuing with this article. The first is that developers are still working with incomplete Revolution hardware. Most studios are, in fact, developing on "GameCube-based kits," according to major software houses we spoke to, which have asked to remain anonymous. The second is that developers are still without final specifications for Revolution's ATI-developed graphics chip, codenamed Hollywood. "


let me repeat that.. developers are still without final specifications for Revolution's ATI-developed graphics chip...


im not waiting for a miracle. but saying something like 'the difference between rev to x360/ps3 is WORSE THAN THAT BETWEEN DC and XBOX' when we know nothing about the actual specs of the machine is just plain retarded.

Heh, I'll wait and see. But having dev.s use suped-up gamecubes, and practically the rest of the final h/w being hinted at being basically something quite similar, ain't inspiring. As I said assuming the specs and dev. hints which were mentioned were real, this would indeed be the case. As far as our information goes this looks like the most likely scenario, of course the gpu may not actually be such a thing

 

[Particle Physicist]

Heh, I'll wait and see. But having dev.s use suped-up gamecubes, and practically the rest of the final h/w being hinted at being basically something quite similar, ain't inspiring. As I said assuming the specs and dev. hints which were mentioned were real, this would indeed be the case. As far as our information goes this looks like the most likely scenario, of course the gpu may not actually be such a thing

obviously the machine is underpowered when compared to the 360 and ps3.. but how can we start making judgments of its actual power when we dont have specifics?