rahxephon03x
Member
btrboyev said:
Good point. My guess is that both Animal Crossing and Hunters will be an improvement. Nintendo is still learning about online play and I'm sure they are listening to us gamers.
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Nintendo Online = Poorly Implemented
- Thread starter Marty Chinn
- Start date
Good point. My guess is that both Animal Crossing and Hunters will be an improvement. Nintendo is still learning about online play and I'm sure they are listening to us gamers.
Beer Monkey
Member
They should just copy Microsoft. Same for Sony. Pride is a sin.
it is only complex for people who are used to traditional matchmaking.. to be honest if I didn't have all of these "set in my way" obstacles to get over, it would be pretty god damn easy. It wook me around 20 seconds from connecting to selecting my racer last night.. it doesn't get easier than that. it is just complicated when you take into accountwhat I want to do with it.jedimike said:
I disagree with you. First off, it offers no fee AND portability. Live is great, as long as you are at home or a buddies house with internet. You aren't playing Live though at McDonalds or the public library. Now attribute that to being a handheld all you want, but it is still an advantage over live, being able to play online outside of the house that is.Mrbob said:
Also as I said, people are confusing their experience with ease of use or intuitiveness. To play Mario Kart online, you select online, select one of four matchmaking types, wait 20-30 seconds, and start playing. That is pretty damn intuitive. To add a friend (presumably a friend you talk to) you give him a friend code and he gives you his friend code. IT is really quite simple, and never in all of my rants have I claimed otherwise. Those who are saying it is complicated or overly complex have missed the mark entirely. Is it limited? Yes. Is it missing some features that most of us would like? Absolutely. Is it complex or difficult? Not by any stretch of the imagination.
I challenge one of you to explain to me how Mario Kart matchmaking, as is, is challenging.
As Xbox Live evolved more features were added, but basic functionality has always been the same.
One user name per person. User name is automatically saved on your hd and brought up to log on to every Live game. You can put in a four digit password if you want or nothing at all. Once you are online you can search for a custom game or use the Optimatch function to do the same random thing Mario Kart does. It is a bit saddening to see Nintendo can't even match the functionality MS established in 2001. I'm not even comparing it to Xbox Live as we know it right now or upcoming Live on 360. That would just be unfair. MS is setting the bar even higher.
Borghe I'll give you portability but what Mario Kart does Optimatch on Live has done from the beginning. Nintendo has done nothing new except for making the initial startup process more complicated and put less functionality into online game setup.
One user name per person. User name is automatically saved on your hd and brought up to log on to every Live game. You can put in a four digit password if you want or nothing at all. Once you are online you can search for a custom game or use the Optimatch function to do the same random thing Mario Kart does. It is a bit saddening to see Nintendo can't even match the functionality MS established in 2001. I'm not even comparing it to Xbox Live as we know it right now or upcoming Live on 360. That would just be unfair. MS is setting the bar even higher.
Borghe I'll give you portability but what Mario Kart does Optimatch on Live has done from the beginning. Nintendo has done nothing new except for making the initial startup process more complicated and put less functionality into online game setup.
Honestly, 3/4 of my complaints about WFC would be resolved if it had a username system. I mean, sure, you'd wind up with Mario64875, but at least you'd know how to contact the person--and with the idea they've got where both you and your friend have to approve a friend connection, that would also help on the privacy side.
So when I race down as Matlock, someone could see that, add me to their friends list, and I'd get a notification on my friends list that I have one to view/approve.
But feh, it's no big deal in the long run since Mario Kart online is something I'd go through much worse online systems to play.
So when I race down as Matlock, someone could see that, add me to their friends list, and I'd get a notification on my friends list that I have one to view/approve.
But feh, it's no big deal in the long run since Mario Kart online is something I'd go through much worse online systems to play.
and I'll give you less functionality into online game setup.. but what about it is more complicated? as far as less functionality, while it is true, in the end it is very minor and doesn't affect your ability to play or have fun with the game. I'm not defending it in the slightest, just don't think it is as big a deal as I feared it would be or some are making it out to be.Mrbob said:
and playing with specific friends isn't that hard, and doesn't even require youto delete your friends list. simply leave all friends unlocked in your friends list, and then when you want to race a specific person, lock him in your friends list and he will receive priority, just in case you have more friends than just him online and searching for a game.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
Musashi Wins! said:
i fully expect the wifi service for Revolution to be more robust than the DS one.. but who kows.
'nough said. Nintendo limited its online features on purpose, to make their audience first online experience as simple as possible. Mario Kart and Animal Crossing will bring 2 million players online in less than a month. It took Microsoft 4 years to achieve that. Nintendo is making much smarter moves than you give them credit for. Besides, wait for the Revolution to make a fair comparison.borghe said:
Beer Monkey
Member
I think the wi-fi aspect is overrated; 30 feet is a seriously short range. Last night I walked around my house and I have actual dead spots. It's a small house, too. Is every McDonalds putting up multiple antennas? I know some coffee houses that are certainly too large to cover unless the antenna is in the dead center of the establishment.
Borghe I don't want to go back and forth with you on this issue anymore. I know where you stand on this issue as a stout DS defender and as an Xbox Live champion myself (The superior service) I won't budge. 
In retrospect this thread is interesting to read now:
http://www.ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=65991&page=1
In retrospect this thread is interesting to read now:
http://www.ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=65991&page=1
30 feet has nothing to do with the DS and everything to do with your house and router. I played last night from upstairs and across the house and still had two bars on my DS and no lag. probably about 40-50 feet total distance and floors and walls between.
if you are finding deadspots in your house, either stay out of them or adjust your router to eliminate them.
edit - oh, and I am using a Linksys WRT54G. I was using a Netgear WGR614. worst. router. EVER!
if you are finding deadspots in your house, either stay out of them or adjust your router to eliminate them.
edit - oh, and I am using a Linksys WRT54G. I was using a Netgear WGR614. worst. router. EVER!
Mrbob said:Borghe I don't want to go back and forth with you on this issue anymore. I know where you stand on this issue as a stout DS defender and as an Xbox Live champion myself (The superior service) I won't budge.
In retrospect this thread is interesting to read now:
http://www.ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=65991&page=1
The first post is the only part of that thread that isn't retarded spin. 'course, the same could be said of 90% of the threads on GAF.
radioheadrule83
Banned
I did mean to say before btw.. the real complaint here is that Mario Kart's online play is poorly implimented, not on the gameplay side so much, but more on the actual connecting side (no ability to direct connect to specific friends with a simple click, dissatisfying game setup / chat lobby)...
its not really that Nintendo online is poorly implimented at all. The gamespy tech is pretty damn robust. Mario Kart doesnt do half the things it can actually do.
And the actual network is turning out pretty damn good. Think of how vast it is (hotspots and all) and how quickly it sprang out of nowhere. Europe and Japan aren't online with MK yet are they?
Lets see if you have trouble finding someone to play then.
its not really that Nintendo online is poorly implimented at all. The gamespy tech is pretty damn robust. Mario Kart doesnt do half the things it can actually do.
And the actual network is turning out pretty damn good. Think of how vast it is (hotspots and all) and how quickly it sprang out of nowhere. Europe and Japan aren't online with MK yet are they?
Lets see if you have trouble finding someone to play then.
I wonder how much of this was them just getting it out for xmas release. Then again if Tony Hawk's is more robust, I suppose it's no excuse.
I'd start writing emails to nintendo and complaining. I can handle MK being a bit shoddy since it's their first online game and all, but if Rev is anything like this I'm going to seriously be pissed.
I'm also with Matlock on the username thing. If they had that, and I could see and select with of my friends were actually online to play, etc, I'd be a lot happier with it.
I'd start writing emails to nintendo and complaining. I can handle MK being a bit shoddy since it's their first online game and all, but if Rev is anything like this I'm going to seriously be pissed.
I'm also with Matlock on the username thing. If they had that, and I could see and select with of my friends were actually online to play, etc, I'd be a lot happier with it.
Taker666 said:
Yeah and those fees besides Live and the console exist solely for Xbox Live. Roll eyes that argument is weak. You forgot about the electric bill and the TV and surround sound system needed to play the games as well. May as well add it to the list. Oh and lets not forget about the money in gas it costs me to drive to the store and back to buy a game.
Beer Monkey
Member
Then why can I carry my notebook all over the house and never lose service?
Linksys BEFSW11
frame and sheetrock.
two things. first, it had EVERYTHING to do with getting out for the holidays. Mario KArt neded to be out this christmas with Zelda being delayed. The problem here is according to rumor, The MKDS team only knew about it going online since GDC. For them to have done all of this in around half a year is pretty impressive.vitaflo said:
Tony Hawk is more robust, but they were also able to port much of their existing matchmaking portion, especially because their existing matchmaking was already based on gamespy's middleware.
ACWW will be even more limited (friend codes only), but arguably in ACWW keeping people "safe" is even more important than THAS or MKDS.
I expect Metroid Hunters to be WFC's first "matured" online title.
I should say doesn't ONLY have to do with your DS.. my bad. connectivity is a meeting between the NICs radio and the APs radio. MY only point is that I've played my DS from far away. If you are hitting deadspots or having distance issues I would try repositioning the router. The DS is capable of connecting further than what you are getting.beermonkey@tehbias said:
digitalKiva
Member
The Nintendo WiFi service is 4 days young and is currently designed to operate on a portable. Live has been around for a long while and is designed to operate on a console. So comparing the two services is just a stupid comparision at this point.
The fact that all i had to do was put MKDS in my system... select to go online.. type in my WEP encryption numbers ... click connect is pretty damn impressive. I was online in a race no less then 5 minutes after unwrapping the game.
The service will grow and have tons more features in future titles and especially on the Revolution.
The fact that all i had to do was put MKDS in my system... select to go online.. type in my WEP encryption numbers ... click connect is pretty damn impressive. I was online in a race no less then 5 minutes after unwrapping the game.
The service will grow and have tons more features in future titles and especially on the Revolution.
Mrbob said:
But you're speaking from the perspective of a gamer who already plays online and has everything set up. What's the penetration rate for Xbox Live among Xbox users? around 13%?
Why aren't the other 87% playing it online if it's such good value and easy to set up?
If everyone has broadband as you seem to imply and already pays those fees then what is stopping them from using Xbox Live?
I guess the test for which is easier to use will be when we see some numbers.
I presume that if more than 13% of the DS userbase goes online then you will admit it's a more user friendly service than XBox Live.
Taker666 said:But you're speaking from the perspective of a gamer who already plays online and has everything set up. What's the penetration rate for Xbox Live among Xbox users? around 13%?
Why aren't the other 87% playing it online if it's such good value and easy to set up?
If everyone has broadband as you seem to imply and already pays those fees then what is stopping them from using Xbox Live?
I guess the test for which is easier to use will be when we see some numbers.
I presume that if more than 13% of the DS userbase goes online then you will admit it's a more user friendly service than XBox Live.
It means nothing. People like cheap. With all the costs rising with everything in the world I can't blame people for being penny pinchers. Me? I'll pay a little extra for a extremely well done fleshed out service.
but again as many have said, the comparison of Live to WFC isn't entirely apt.. there will be things better on each system, but at the end they are geared for different users.Mrbob said:
the real test will be Revolution. If WFC (which will extend to rev) is just as capable at gaming as live is, that free part will be a big deal to many. not to mention built in wireless enhanced by the penisdongle functionality.
FortNinety
Member
I must admit that I'm shocked by how sloppy Nintendo Online is thus far. With all the time they had to work on things and with so many resources to look at out there, I'm really suprised.
clearacell
Member
TTP said:
:lol
with all the time? you do know that their online initiative is all of about 8 months old from inception, right? it's not like they've been working on this for even a year.FortNinety said:
also take into account that it isn't the service you guys are talking about but the implementation of it in Mario Kart.
Let's give Nintendo the benefit of the doubt here. This is their first true online game ever. Expecting Nintendo to come out of the gate with an Xbox Live type of service is ludicrous. They need some time to figure out how to cater to the online clueless as well as those who swear by Xbox Live. If Metroid Hunters comes out and doesn't have some sort of lobby setup, then I'll start to complain about it.
Still, comparisions to Xbox Live are unfair right now. Not because one is handheld and one is console, but because Xbox Live has been around since 2001, and WFC launched last week. You can't say that WFC doesn't have many features as Live, because Tony Hawk does a lot of crap online, it's just that Nintendo didn't do that for Mario Kart. Everything is just implemented differently.
Mario Kart and the other DS online games are just a prelude to the real launch of Nintendo WFC, and that's with the Revolution. It'll have online games at launch with a service that's already been through its paces. If Nintendo can't get things together by the Revolution launch, then we can start worrying about it.
Give Nintendo credit for actually having an online service, as opposed to Sony.
Still, comparisions to Xbox Live are unfair right now. Not because one is handheld and one is console, but because Xbox Live has been around since 2001, and WFC launched last week. You can't say that WFC doesn't have many features as Live, because Tony Hawk does a lot of crap online, it's just that Nintendo didn't do that for Mario Kart. Everything is just implemented differently.
Mario Kart and the other DS online games are just a prelude to the real launch of Nintendo WFC, and that's with the Revolution. It'll have online games at launch with a service that's already been through its paces. If Nintendo can't get things together by the Revolution launch, then we can start worrying about it.
Give Nintendo credit for actually having an online service, as opposed to Sony.
siamesedreamer
Banned
For me, having the friends list thing for NWi-Fi is pretty pointless since you can't communicate with them. I could pretty much care less about that. The thing that gets me though is how easy it was to get online. Seriously, it just finds the network and all you have to do is put in the WEP code and you're off. I never dreamed it would be that easy.
Razoric said:
On the contrary, with a free service you'll have many more idiots online to ruin your fun. Enjoy! Your point is not valid yet though because Nintendo has not come up with a competent free service.
If free is the big factor why isn't PS2 online kicking Xbox Live's ass?
Mrbob said:
From playing Halo 2 online I'd say it doesnt matter if the service is free or not.
Your point is valid about Nintendo's online service though. But since it's only one game on a portable system I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. If its like this on Revolution though I wont be very happy.
I'd say that has more to do with no organization, no real big push for going online. Nintendo is at least trying to reach the mainstream market and is pushing online big-time (nintendowifi.com, commercials, ease of use, etc). Sony basically released a N/A and said, here you go, later.
Yeah but like I said the more people who play the more idiots who come out. 
But I would like to get back to the PS2 for a second. 100 million PS2 users who have access to free online gaming and yet online gaming is more popular on a paid service with 20 million people. Guess the free thing doesn't pan out too well if it is poorly implemented. We can talk about potential till we are all blue in the face but I would rather talk about true functionality. MS is delivering in a huge way with Live and upcoming on the 360 while Nintendo and Sony scramble to get basic things done right.
You're talking to a lifelong PC gamer and an initial naysayer to Xbox Live before release.
Xbox Live > PC online
But I would like to get back to the PS2 for a second. 100 million PS2 users who have access to free online gaming and yet online gaming is more popular on a paid service with 20 million people. Guess the free thing doesn't pan out too well if it is poorly implemented. We can talk about potential till we are all blue in the face but I would rather talk about true functionality. MS is delivering in a huge way with Live and upcoming on the 360 while Nintendo and Sony scramble to get basic things done right.
You're talking to a lifelong PC gamer and an initial naysayer to Xbox Live before release.
Xbox Live > PC online
radioheadrule83
Banned
beermonkey@tehbias said:
The DS' reach in local multiplayer is something like 30 feet (at a kind of max with min obstacles), but with a router, your DS shouldnt have to reach at all. It should be engulfed and meet the range of your router, which should be much more than 30 feet. If that isnt happening with your particular router, then lord knows why, but its not normal. Perhaps your notebook and router chipsets are more compatible with each other than DS is.
Mrbob said:Yeah but like I said the more people who play the more idiots who come out.
But I would like to get back to the PS2 for a second. 100 million PS2 users who have access to free online gaming and yet online gaming is more popular on a paid service with 20 million people. Guess the free thing doesn't pan out too well if it is poorly implemented.
You either need a slim PS2 or the modem on PS2. Which is particularly hard to find for average joe in Europe. Having ethernet in the original Xbox was key to establishing MS as a visionary in the area.
Not only that but the PS2 doesnt have one cohesive online brand and service. Although DS online titles take the same online middleware approach, the wifi IDs are married to the usernames of official Nintendo website users everywhere, and there is a seperate site and brand for the online service itself and the stats. Its a bit different really imo.
Doesn't Animal Crossing only allow you to play with friends? I guess it would just work so that if someone on your friend list has hosted a game, you can join if the game is not full. And that's it I think.Error2k4 said:
To all: the friend list on DS is the same for all games right? I assume you can just play newer games with the same friends as the ones on the MKDS friends list without adding them again, but I haven't read anything about it.
You shouldn't compare WFC to Live.
Compare it to PSP's wi-fi if you have to.
SOCOM: FTB is far better implemented in terms of a handheld online experience. And is it difficult? Not by a stretch.
And I clearly think this is because Zipper Interactive is experienced in the way of online gaming (as opposed to Nintendo).
Compare it to PSP's wi-fi if you have to.
SOCOM: FTB is far better implemented in terms of a handheld online experience. And is it difficult? Not by a stretch.
And I clearly think this is because Zipper Interactive is experienced in the way of online gaming (as opposed to Nintendo).
no offense, but this line of thought is borderline braindead. so the answer is to have fewer players online? when does that EVER sound like a good idea? "Our service is better because we have fewer players." Didn't think so.Mrbob said:Yeah but like I said the more people who play the more idiots who come out.
as for "more idiots" coming on WFC, arguably the situation is improved over Live in regards to that. no having to hear someone talk like an idiot or deal with banning/muting them. impossible for a griefer to seek you out and attempt to ruin your game. aside from doing shit like driving the wrong way it is virtually impossible to be griefed in MKDS. In that respect, Nintendo's system DOES improve the quality of play, despite the potential for more idiots to come on board.
the question for you though is, have you played MKDS online? Because the consensus from those who have played it online definitely seems to overwhelmingly be "matchmaking is limited but the game is fun as hell." in the end isn't THAT the most important part. you can sit here all day talking shit about WFC till you're blue in the face, but doing so without actually playing the games on it makes you still seem a tad uninformed, no matter how well put together your points are.
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