DownGrader
Member
Technically, it's a portable console. How Nintendo wants to market it in the West is another story. (NCL has made no comments about a "home console" to their Japanese audience.)
Nintendo Switch Dev Kit Stats Leaked? Cortex A57, 4GB RAM, 32GB Storage, Multi-Touch.
- Thread starter Robert at Zeboyd Games
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Technically, it's a portable console. How Nintendo wants to market it in the West is another story. (NCL has made no comments about a "home console" to their Japanese audience.)
If these were genuine development kit specs at one time then I wouldn't be surprised to see some A53 cores included in the retail unit to run the OS, so the 4 main cores would be purely for gaming and nothing else.
Also wonder if this is the handheld spec only. As in you develop for the handheld and the retail unit seamlessly upclocks/increases resolution when the game is ran in docked mode?
Final thing on my mind here is how this dev kit links in with what Eurogamer and others said about the development kits having a loud fan? Fact is that dev kit shouldn't need a loud fan.
Then again I suppose all we've heard recently is that the spec mentioned here is somewhere close to reality (is that correct?). So who knows what differences there are in the real kits.
Also wonder if this is the handheld spec only. As in you develop for the handheld and the retail unit seamlessly upclocks/increases resolution when the game is ran in docked mode?
Final thing on my mind here is how this dev kit links in with what Eurogamer and others said about the development kits having a loud fan? Fact is that dev kit shouldn't need a loud fan.
Then again I suppose all we've heard recently is that the spec mentioned here is somewhere close to reality (is that correct?). So who knows what differences there are in the real kits.
I'm mostly talking about Japanese third party support. Once the 3DS is out they can either go full mobile or console. Or the something in-between that is Switch. As far as the West goes, I don't know. Not like they cared about the 3DS either.
I'm sure Nintendo will be pushing them to at least get their feet wet in the first year or two. Monster Hunter XX Switch port seems to be a given, so does a Sun/Moon port. It's in their own interest to jumo ship before the 3DS fades away. Unless they want to go full mobile or full console the Switch is their best bet.
TyMiles2012
Member
Am I the only one that believes that third parties had to have seen and looked into the Switch hardware themselves supervised by Nintendo and Nvidia before signing up to support? Or am I being too optimistic? The thing is, WiiU got decent support at first, but jumped ship because the PS4 and Xbox One were just around the corner. This generation still has a good 4 to 6 years of life left. PLENTY of time, since the halfway mark is when we start to get more and better games.
They HAVE to know they can work with it before deciding on supporting, I'm sure. Look at Bethesda, FromSoft, etc. FromSoft scoffed at Nintendo before, and Bethesda said they wouldn't support if it couldn't keep up with Xbox One.
I heard a good chunk of games this gen uses uncompressed assets. Nvidia I also heard has notably better compression techniques than AMD, and since cartridges are faster, what about implementing data streaming like Metroid Prime and Soul Reaver? (Just first heard about it on DF Retro) Instead of simply storing to RAM, just rapidly access and remove data on the fly. Nvidia is supplying all the development software, and third parties are very familiar with them since they make PC GPU hardware themselves, I don't think there will be a problem even with 4GB of RAM. We also don't know if this RAM is what's being used for the games only, or if that's the total. The OS will have to take some up as well. Could the Switch OS have it's own dedicated RAM? The WiiU had a separate ARM processor specifically for the OS. The Nvidia blog said that the OS will be optimized for the GPU, and maybe the CPU will be used for games.
The Xbox One OS supposedly uses 3GB of RAM dedicated to the OS, leaving 5GB RAM free specifically for games, so maybe for power consumption, the OS might be VERY lightweight, so a dedicated 512MB or 1GB chip could suffice for the Switch OS? With proper optimization techniques, I think we won't have a problem with 4GB going for games.
They HAVE to know they can work with it before deciding on supporting, I'm sure. Look at Bethesda, FromSoft, etc. FromSoft scoffed at Nintendo before, and Bethesda said they wouldn't support if it couldn't keep up with Xbox One.
I heard a good chunk of games this gen uses uncompressed assets. Nvidia I also heard has notably better compression techniques than AMD, and since cartridges are faster, what about implementing data streaming like Metroid Prime and Soul Reaver? (Just first heard about it on DF Retro) Instead of simply storing to RAM, just rapidly access and remove data on the fly. Nvidia is supplying all the development software, and third parties are very familiar with them since they make PC GPU hardware themselves, I don't think there will be a problem even with 4GB of RAM. We also don't know if this RAM is what's being used for the games only, or if that's the total. The OS will have to take some up as well. Could the Switch OS have it's own dedicated RAM? The WiiU had a separate ARM processor specifically for the OS. The Nvidia blog said that the OS will be optimized for the GPU, and maybe the CPU will be used for games.
The Xbox One OS supposedly uses 3GB of RAM dedicated to the OS, leaving 5GB RAM free specifically for games, so maybe for power consumption, the OS might be VERY lightweight, so a dedicated 512MB or 1GB chip could suffice for the Switch OS? With proper optimization techniques, I think we won't have a problem with 4GB going for games.
No.
Seriously guys, calm the fuck down.
Who is that kind sir?
Assuming your numbers are correct.
So 1 GB of LPDDR4 is 9 times weaker than 1 GB of GDDR5 or is that not how it works?
JoshuaJSlone
Member
A game is a game. If I play Bravely Third on TV, it's not just handheld third party support.
Mr. Wonderful
Member
Nintendo will be able to do fantastic things with 4GB of RAM. Just look what they were able to do with the Wii U's 1.xGB. We won't be able to even notice.
It's third party ports that will suffer. Not just now, but especially 3 years or so from now.
It's third party ports that will suffer. Not just now, but especially 3 years or so from now.
Eolz
Member
I'm not sure what you mean by that.
They would have been told what to expect (more or less) before/when getting devkits (even early ones), but usually don't have a lot of influence over nintendo hardware (apart from some JP pubs and only on a limited scale), unlike what happens with Sony/MS.
edit:
no limitations to port most games, but the ports themselves will be limited. One being right doesn't mean the other is wrong.
Just a verified insider with a near spotless (to my knowledge) track record.
Skittzo0413
Member
Yeah I'm curious about this too. RAM is something Nintendo always manages to get right, so I'd wager there are some specific technical advantages to the Switch's design which lets them get away with lower amounts/bandwidth.
EDIT:
The thing is, there are some people in this very thread (and others) claiming the Switch will not be capable of receiving certain games due to low RAM bandwidth, lack of storage, etc. Not that those games will be limited, but that there is no possible way they can come. Which Matt is saying is incorrect.
The Last One
Member
The specs are very good, so far, specially if we take the hybrid nature into consideration. Switch will end up being a portable beast.
But even though, I'd suggest you guys wait until further confirmation from Nintendo.
We still don't know if the "custom" aspect of this Tegra is relative to the Cortex A57 or A72; we still can't mesure the benefits of the Pascal architecture, nor the RAM amount avaiable just for games (3.2gb is great, imo, if true).
Oh, and one last thing. 2015 NVidia technology is NOT, by any means, "old" tech.
But even though, I'd suggest you guys wait until further confirmation from Nintendo.
We still don't know if the "custom" aspect of this Tegra is relative to the Cortex A57 or A72; we still can't mesure the benefits of the Pascal architecture, nor the RAM amount avaiable just for games (3.2gb is great, imo, if true).
Oh, and one last thing. 2015 NVidia technology is NOT, by any means, "old" tech.
Nintendo of America has done some serious damage here, has it not. NoE (Germany) called it a "Gaming Platform". I don't know what NCL called it but I have the hunch they wouldn't call it a home console first and foremost. The two markets are so different when it comes to video game systems right now and their attitude towards handhelds and home consoles so the messaging here must be a nightmare.
Don't forget the 3DS won't just drop dead come March. So NoA could've meant it like that. I don't know.
The Switch is not JUST a home console. That's its whole deal. Besides, 3DS games in HD should work totally fine on the TV too. Consequence being me making peace with the fact we won't see games with heavy touch focus on it.
Insane Metal
Member
That's interesting.
Okay but that was always going to be the case. It's kind of hard to circumvent the laws of thermodynamics.
Can't Nintendo have 4GB LPDDR4 for games and a single 1GB ram for the OS? Or would that complicate the motherboard setup and make it costlier?
The thing is, you and many others want to have a unit with very high expectations, but on the other hand you dont want to pay to much. I mean its ok to buy a new iphone for 700 euro's. Or to buy a ps4 with vr at the same price? I doesnt make sense. The more it has, to more expensive it will be.
Fourth Storm
Member
Not on a chip per chip basis. Typically, it takes many GDDR5 chips to get to that bandwidth. PS4 has 8. Switch will likely have a single lpDDR4 module if the rumors are accurate (I'm not sure if there are multiple chips per module--I think there might be).
It's a great step up from 3DS, a generational leap and then some. For Wii U it looks like a half-step. It's better than both platforms being underpowered I suppose.
It's interesting that we have some trusted insiders saying that ports should work no problem (OsirisBlack/Matt), but we also have some insiders saying not to expect Western 3rd party support to change much (Emily/John Harker iirc).
Sometimes it's expensive and weak, like 3DS and Wii U.
The Last One
Member
Oh, you are expecting no limitation at all between a portable device and a full home console hardware? Hahahahahahhahah
I'm start to thinking this is NOT about Nintendo fans pushing the goalpole, but some people putting it unreasonably far away to begin with.
It'd cost more and use more power. Doesn't sound like a good idea at all to me. Kind of curious if their setup is 2x2gb or 1x4gb LPPDR4 though. Do we know what the devkit has?
Probably because it's possible but it's not going to happen because western publishers don't think their games will sell well on it.
Dark Cloud
Member
It will be ignored. Nintendo doomed...yada yada yada. We have all the confirmed info of everything the Switch is right now.
And for some reason there seems to be some wildly high expectations for the specs of this system when Matt said months ago it wasn't going to get any big western party support. I think Emily said the same too.
Skittzo0413
Member
Actually I think Matt said not to expect 3rd party support to change much. That doesn't mean there are technical barriers to ports, just that it will likely depend on third party priorities and projected RoI, like with the Wii U.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
More like, "Samsung garbage auto-correct trying to fix things that aren't broke, how does it work."
The last one was intended to be "$199 I'll be ecstatic." I know what the word means.
4 GB seems logical to a machine that is midway last gen and this gen in raw power numbers.
Regarding Pascal / A72
I'm glad that at least some people comment on this, but most fail to notice that in both cases most of the gains performance / efficiency (versus Maxwell / A57) come from the use of newer fab process, so people should worry less about this and care if the SoC is 16nm Finfet or not.
It's interesting that if those are word by word Dev Kit specs it mentions 1Ghz max, since that could imply that maybe Switch can work at full 1Ghz in some cases (Dock mode? I'm a bit sceptical till more substantial info, but its an interesting detail)
I have commented elsewhere that those specs even if fake seemed close to what we were going to get, and all in all I'm quite happy, my main concerns at this moment are.-
* I really hope the SoC it's on 16nm Finfet
* Memory at 25GB seems somewhat low, hope that has been speced up or some extra work has been done in the memory subsystem.
* Confirmation that there is a Dock Mode with full clock speeds
Regarding Pascal / A72
I'm glad that at least some people comment on this, but most fail to notice that in both cases most of the gains performance / efficiency (versus Maxwell / A57) come from the use of newer fab process, so people should worry less about this and care if the SoC is 16nm Finfet or not.
It's interesting that if those are word by word Dev Kit specs it mentions 1Ghz max, since that could imply that maybe Switch can work at full 1Ghz in some cases (Dock mode? I'm a bit sceptical till more substantial info, but its an interesting detail)
I have commented elsewhere that those specs even if fake seemed close to what we were going to get, and all in all I'm quite happy, my main concerns at this moment are.-
* I really hope the SoC it's on 16nm Finfet
* Memory at 25GB seems somewhat low, hope that has been speced up or some extra work has been done in the memory subsystem.
* Confirmation that there is a Dock Mode with full clock speeds
Yeah I know, I'm not saying they're contradictory. It just feels like the discussion of power may not be very relevant in the end if people are already saying not to expect improved support. But we'll see.
Chopper Dave
Member
Seriously there is no quantity of posts from random jagoffs on the net that will amount to someone with actual knowledge of the situation. Having an idea of the RAM needed for the average multiplat game on switch is going to need more than the ability to know 8>4 or list your phone's specs. People are tripping on their way to jump to conclusions. Open insight from devs is a few months away at any rate. People can have fun with the last stretch of speculation I guess.
lwilliams3
Member
Ok. Thanks for the links.
Considering the architecture (Maxwell/Pascal Nvidia SoC), graphically advanced Switch games will probably look more akin to high-end games on the PS4 and Xbox One consoles than PS3/Wii U and X360. The GPU features are more similar to the newer consoles than the older ones. Not saying that the Switch's raw performance will equal what we're seeing on the PS4/Xone.
It is a very different situation than the Wii U really. Wii U was hampered by significant hardware issues that literally made it impossible for Publishers like EA to bring their products over.
Switch can handle basically everything now engine wise. Now it will be up to business decisions as to what happens of course but that is a step up from impossibility due to hardware. So while the situation may not markedly improve there is bound to be some improvement
The Last One
Member
And if the hardware sells, the thirds will come. Maybe not in a sense some people are expecting, but it will come, eventually...
The traditional AAA third-party kinda support is not the only way to get them aboard. And I believe the system will still get the sports and the yearly best sellers porta.
If the Switch end up having the same strong support, new IPs and great games as, say, the DS and 3DS, we may be in front of some very special Nintendo product.
The traditional AAA third-party kinda support is not the only way to get them aboard. And I believe the system will still get the sports and the yearly best sellers porta.
If the Switch end up having the same strong support, new IPs and great games as, say, the DS and 3DS, we may be in front of some very special Nintendo product.
Osiris
I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
Dark Cloud
Member
Isn't the Switch guaranteed atleast 3DS/Vita type of support from third parties?
Aside from that most will wait to see if it sells and if it does then it will get more support.
I still imagine Nintendo is getting deals done with Japanese third party devs to get some big games like Final Fantasy.
Aside from that most will wait to see if it sells and if it does then it will get more support.
I still imagine Nintendo is getting deals done with Japanese third party devs to get some big games like Final Fantasy.
Why are you skeptical of 1Ghz docked clock speed? Even on 20nm X1 can run at 1Ghz in shield TV.
The first and third are rumored, the latter more heavily. No one has any info on RAM subsystems, either there is none, it's compromising to share, or its not in these Dev2 kits.
WhiteWaterM00se
Member
Because using the CPU power to make it look good on a 6" screen is different than making it look good on a 60" screen.
It doesn't stack up to platforms released 3 years ago- which I get since it's portable and seems like an outstanding portable but I don't know why anyone would have any illusions about games looking a lot worse than Xbone and PS4 counterparts.
edit: how did EA come up? Was there a press release stating that Frostbite was going to run on this thing?
Not really surprising. Being capable of receiving downscaled versions of Western third party software doesn't necessarily mean they would be worthwhile financially from the publisher's perspective. Look at how the Xbox One isn't even a factor in most Japanese publisher's plans even though it nearly has the same hardware as the PS4.
Idd this is the problem with many gaffers.
They wants a ps4 pro power with 3TB of space and output 4k game experience and 10h battery life. But only wants to pay 200/250$ for it.
Get real
The Last One
Member
Gloom time!
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