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NPD January 2012 Sales Results [Up2: MW3 Sales, (Down ~50% Over BLOPS, But Still #1)]

Metallix87

Member
Nintendo notes that Super Mario 3D Land has now sold 1.7 million copies and Mario Kart 7 has now sold 1.3 million. The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword has also sold 1.3 million. On the hardware side, the 3DS has now sold more than 4.25 million units in the United States.

Where is this information from?
 

Amir0x

Banned
And how far did you have to walk in the snow to get to school?

You may be sarcastic, but the point and schism is a fundamental one. It's about rewarding talent vs. rewarding time investment, and talent should always win out. In the end, I think it's a worthy debate and it has nothing about being out of touch with the modern community. It's about a very directed opinion about game design philosophy, and which has better merits.

And besides, even if you disagree, it's nearly impossible to disagree with the declining ambition and quality of the series. Even if you LIKE it, at the very least the series is doing nothing but running in place.

Have yearly iterations of sports games killed that genre?

We can subjectively debate what Activision is bringing to the table with each iteration but the truth is, we can do that with all sports games also.

Innovation doesn't need to be attained with each version. With CoD4, the series had a massive innovation and really took off. It would be very unwise of Activision to mess with that formula for the sake of innovation. The product is clearly in a very desirable state thus it's best to tweak it without making drastic changes that could backfire and hurt the franchise.

It's not about innovation per say. It's about polishing and improving upon systems in place, retooling balance and engines in a fundamental and large fashion. At this point the Call of Duty series is just rehashing with slightly different themes to give the appearance of a large change, but assets are continually being reused, gameplay is being tweaked in only the most minor fashion, and the yearly iteration is proving fundamentally broken.

yearly sports iterations are kind of a unique case, given the constant changing of rosters and thus the need to keep the series relevant for each new sports season, but FPS titles do not require such a thing. Activision is doing it because the series is huge and it is the cheapest way to maximize profit while an overeager and accepting gaming public gobbles it down wholesale. They KNOW they can put the lowest possible effort out and get the maximum possible return, and they'll keep doing it because we -don't- demand more.
 

Petrae

Member
2012 prediction thread says the 3DS was at 4.1m at the end of 2011, so maybe 150k, not sure.

That is correct. The raw number was slightly less than 4.1MM units for 2011 total. Given the "more than 4.25 million" stat, I'd pin the actual number at between 125K-150K. Not great.
 

alphaNoid

Banned
So based on 360 numbers its selling well for 7 years in, and will probably be #1 this month again.. but that -29% drop from last year indicates that its time for a new gen right?

2013?
 

Miles X

Member
Ah I see, thanks.

The original tweet wasn't as clear: http://twitter.com/#!/aarongreenberg/status/167750643501629440

· Holding 49 percent share of current-generation console sales, total retail spend on the Xbox 360 platform in January (hardware, software and accessories) reached $301 million, the most for any console in the U.S. This marks the eleventh consecutive month Xbox 360 has held more than 40 percent of the current-generation console market share. (Source: NPD Group, January 2012)

Hmmm, seems like it is 49%
 
Have yearly iterations of sports games killed that genre?

We can subjectively debate what Activision is bringing to the table with each iteration but the truth is, we can do that with all sports games also.

Sports games have a limited number of areas in which to innovate though since it needs to adhere to the rules/rosters of the actual sport. So it's not too far-fetched to expect more innovation than sports games.
 

szaromir

Banned
· Holding 49 percent share of current-generation console sales, total retail spend on the Xbox 360 platform in January (hardware, software and accessories) reached $301 million, the most for any console in the U.S. This marks the eleventh consecutive month Xbox 360 has held more than 40 percent of the current-generation console market share. (Source: NPD Group, January 2012)

Hmmm, seems like it is 49%

It's not explicitly stated if it's console unit sales % or platform $ revenues %.
 
I hope Nirolak reads it - it is stated that total $ spend on Xbox 360 platform (hardware, software and accessories) was 49% for the month, not that 360 sold 49% of all console units! Therefore one cannot conclude how much Wii+PS3 sold.

Market share refers to the hardware units, the info about revenue is unrelated.

Edit-Hmm, now thinking I'm wrong about that. They mention market share being over 40% for 11 months but having #1 selling hardware for 13 months.
 

Kusagari

Member
Not sure whether Twisted Metal will make it or not.

KoA, FF13, SC5 will definitely be above it as new releases. And then you've got Resident Evil, Syndicate, and UFC along with the holdovers.
 
Then why bitch in every music game thread about PS2 not getting supported or shitty ports?

What does this have to do with anything?

Also, there are two PS2 games in the OP, one of which outsold the PC version.

You were heavily criticizing this generation's pricing, hence everyone assumed you couldn't afford a console (most of this board's population still lives with parents/goes to school, etc, it's pretty normal having financial restrictions).

I still don't get the connection between making financial decisions and the pricing of a tech device. You can afford a console, but don't want to spend money on it. It doesn't necessarily mean that particular item is overpriced. You just don't want it.

Yes, it's a simple value proposition. Could I have afforded a PS3 at $599? Yes. But I, like most people, decided that the amount of money was not worth what was being awful. Im sure you remember sales at $599 were pretty damn terrible.

That doesnt mean we didnt want it or couldnt afford it, just that it wasnt worth the expense.

Its a pretty simple concept.

Im sure you like cookies. I could offer you a single cookie for $20. Id bet you could easily spend $20 and not think about it....but would you accept my offer of $20 for a cookie? Probably not. Just seems wasteful.

As the years go by, the value of the console actually decreases. Yes, there are more games, less bugs, whatever....but it's not as new. The technology isnt as impressive. The features are common place. When the PS3 came out, it was one of the only blu-ray options. Now, you can get a new blu-ray player for $49.99 at wal-mart.

The price of the PS3 started too high, and dropped too slowly. And thats why the sales have never been good.


X360 prices have also sucked, for the consumer, but MS has managed to convince people that Kinect is valuable enough to justify the price.


Theres nothing left to justify running out to buy a PS3 at the current price. Move flopped, it wont push sales. Games are still coming, and will make existing owners happy, but theres nothing special enough to make people run out to buy one. The only thing left to do is lower the price, because that gets the system on the right side of what people consider a good value.

As someone else mentioned, the only thing that could boost PS3 would be a new slim, at $149.99.
 

apana

Member
Third parties were really stupid about the Wii but ultimately it is up to Nintendo to provide games for their platform and they dropped the ball as well. Plenty of blame to go around guys.
 

antonz

Member
Thanks for the correction. Looks like about 180K now that I'm actually, you know, using a calcuator. Still well short of where I thought it would be.

The thing with Nintendo is they are very conservative with their numbers even when they have exact figures. Over 4.25 million to Nintendo could be 4.3 million or 4.35 million. They seem to stivk to the 250K intervals once it gets over million. Just like the 4.1 was reported as reaching 4 million
 

Ramblin

Banned
You may be sarcastic, but the point and schism is a fundamental one. It's about rewarding talent vs. rewarding time investment, and talent should always win out. In the end, I think it's a worthy debate and it has nothing about being out of touch with the modern community. It's about a very directed opinion about game design philosophy, and which has better merits.

And besides, even if you disagree, it's nearly impossible to disagree with the declining ambition and quality of the series. Even if you LIKE it, at the very least the series is doing nothing but running in place.

I wasn't trying to be sarcastic, I was just poking fun at you for the whole man vs man stuff. I'm not certain talent should always win. I think rewarding time investment helps make it fun for less talented players. Of course talented players will always have the advantage because they can invest the time.
 
Yes, it's a simple value proposition. Could I have afforded a PS3 at $599? Yes. But I, like most people, decided that the amount of money was not worth what was being awful. Im sure you remember sales at $599 were pretty damn terrible.

That doesnt mean we didnt want it or couldnt afford it, just that it wasnt worth the expense.

Its a pretty simple concept.

Im sure you like cookies. I could offer you a single cookie for $20. Id bet you could easily spend $20 and not think about it....but would you accept my offer of $20 for a cookie? Probably not. Just seems wasteful.

As the years go by, the value of the console actually decreases. Yes, there are more games, less bugs, whatever....but it's not as new. The technology isnt as impressive. The features are common place. When the PS3 came out, it was one of the only blu-ray options. Now, you can get a new blu-ray player for $49.99 at wal-mart.

The price of the PS3 started too high, and dropped too slowly. And thats why the sales have never been good.


X360 prices have also sucked, for the consumer, but MS has managed to convince people that Kinect is valuable enough to justify the price.


Theres nothing left to justify running out to buy a PS3 at the current price. Move flopped, it wont push sales. Games are still coming, and will make existing owners happy, but theres nothing special enough to make people run out to buy one. The only thing left to do is lower the price, because that gets the system on the right side of what people consider a good value.

As someone else mentioned, the only thing that could boost PS3 would be a new slim, at $149.99.

I get your point, I was simply implying that current prices aren't that high, keeping in mind what others were saying (inflation, tech progress, etc.). An arcade 360 can be had for pretty cheap nowadays (but keep in mind that I live in Europe, the 360 is a bit cheaper than in the US, Microsoft could and will price-cut again).

If you're saying that right now consoles cost too much (compared to what they might cost to produce at this moment), I agree. Especially in the US, Microsoft did a very good job of re-launching its console while actually increasing the price tag. But a couple years ago no one could have afforded to sell consoles with prices as low as what you suggested.
 
The thing with Nintendo is they are very conservative with their numbers even when they have exact figures. Over 4.25 million to Nintendo could be 4.3 million or 4.35 million. They seem to stivk to the 250K intervals once it gets over million. Just like the 4.1 was reported as reaching 4 million

and dont forget the over 3 million december the wii had that ended up being 3.8
 

Petrae

Member
The thing with Nintendo is they are very conservative with their numbers even when they have exact figures. Over 4.25 million to Nintendo could be 4.3 million or 4.35 million. They seem to stivk to the 250K intervals once it gets over million. Just like the 4.1 was reported as reaching 4 million

Fair point. I don't know that conservatism holds true for January, though. I'll be willing to concede an extrapolation of 200K without solid evidence from Nintendo, but not any more than that.
 

Miles X

Member
Providing attach rates are the same as they were at the end of 2011

Xbox 360 - 9.1 x 32,930,000 = 299,633,000
Wii - 7.7 x 38,890,000 = 299,453,000

Of course the attach rates could be rounded, HW could be a little lower/higher for either console, but this shows 360 has sold more unbundled SW this gen in the US than Wii.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
Sorry, I think I misread the OP, I'm not sure anymore. Sorry for the confusion. It's unclear either way, though probably about unit sales.

I'll just put it back for now since it fits with the complete sales collapse being reported for the month in general.
 

HylianTom

Banned
These threads fucking suck btw. I remember when NPD threads caused server errors, and we got an abundance of numbers and analysis.

Now we're lucky if we get a PR release (two days after the thread is made). Fucking thing sucks!

I miss the gifs. So damn good. I'd wait all afternoon and then giggle like a little schoolgirl at MamaRobotnik's magical animations..
 

Tookay

Member
Third parties were really stupid about the Wii but ultimately it is up to Nintendo to provide games for their platform and they dropped the ball as well. Plenty of blame to go around guys.

Yep that's true. I remember the rage that went on here when the Nintendo's releases started to slow down and Reggie starting teasing the big holiday game for 2008, which it turned out to be Animal Crossing City Folk.
 

mboojigga

Member
So based on 360 numbers its selling well for 7 years in, and will probably be #1 this month again.. but that -29% drop from last year indicates that its time for a new gen right?

2013?

Wrong. It means we will see a price drop this year and then people will be like how the fuck is this thing still selling like they did in 2011.
 

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
Numbers and titles in top 10 expected since no one brought out a damn thing until the 31st.
 

donny2112

Member
Of course the attach rates could be rounded, HW could be a little lower/higher for either console, but this shows 360 has sold more unbundled SW this gen in the US than Wii.

The first part of your statement disproves the second part of your statement. There's enough error involved with all the numbers that it's not clear if one is above the other. Suffice it to say that they're about the same now and 360 will undoubtedly sell more by the end.
 

Miles X

Member
The first part of your statement disproves the second part of your statement. There's enough error involved with all the numbers that it's not clear if one is above the other. Suffice it to say that they're about the same now and 360 will undoubtedly sell more by the end.

Yeah I know, was just using the first scenario that puts X360 (possibly) on top.
 

antonz

Member
Wrong. It means we will see a price drop this year and then people will be like how the fuck is this thing still selling like they did in 2011.

Thats not guaranteed to happen either. 360 and PS3 are on a reverse curve than the Wii and Standard console generations. They will both hit their peak sales and then decline regardless of progress in cuts etc.

The difference is the high cost of the 360 and PS3 had their curve start small then grow as it got cheaper but the curve will inevitably curve back in.The Wii simply due to its price exploded up then curved in.
 
Microsoft continues to dominate as Wii/PS3 circle the drain. ~280k sales combined is horrendous. Best thing is 2K12 still repping in the Top 10. That series is just a sports juggernaut now.

Next month will be good. Most interesting thing is to see how bad Vita will tank in the US. My guess? Sony's PR is going to be extra entertaining.
 

Kusagari

Member
Microsoft continues to dominate as Wii/PS3 circle the drain. ~280k sales combined is horrendous. Best thing is 2K12 still repping in the Top 10. That series is just a sports juggernaut now.

Next month will be good. Most interesting thing is to see how bad Vita will tank in the US. My guess? Sony's PR is going to be extra entertaining.

Vita: best selling new technology device released in 2012.
 

mboojigga

Member
Thats not guaranteed to happen either. 360 and PS3 are on a reverse curve than the Wii and Standard console generations. They will both hit their peak sales and then decline regardless of progress in cuts etc.

The difference is the high cost of the 360 and PS3 had their curve start small then grow as it got cheaper but the curve will inevitably curve back in.The Wii simply due to its price exploded up then curved in.

Yet everyone is basing all this because of December decline? Sony can't afford another price drop. We saw the results of that from the sales to the report from last week. MS on the other hand has an adavantage to drop the price at anytime which I think may come in the summer around E3. The system, accessories and software are still selling. It is only the month of January. I don't believe we have major concerns about performance in just one month of the year as far as MS goes. Sony on the other hand.....
 

T.M. MacReady

NO ONE DENIES MEMBER
I dont get people who say "Fuck CoD".

People like it. Some are kinda douchey, so what? People like Zelda, and plenty of Zelda fans are douchey too. Just because something is overwhelmingly popular doesn't mean its a bad thing.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
I'll give it until tomorrow afternoon (for me, so about 12-15 hours) and then roll with Nintendo's numbers unless we get something more specific.
 

Tookay

Member
I dont get people who say "Fuck CoD".

People like it. Some are kinda douchey, so what? People like Zelda, and plenty of Zelda fans are douchey too. Just because something is overwhelmingly popular doesn't mean its a bad thing.

Hey! As a Zelda fan I take offense to that.

We're not douchey. Just weird.
 
It's kind of sad that Media Create threads seem to get more attention then NPD threads these days. The seal on the information leaks is bullshit.
 

Gaborn

Member
You're assuming that if the Wii has bombed out of the gate, the other 2 wouldn't have picked up the slack at all.

Not necessarily. I'm suggesting that if the Wii had bombed the other two would not have picked up the slack in a meaningfully significant way. I think it's obvious to anyone who paid the slightest attention that a good portion of the Wii's audience is unique to the Wii because it's part of the "expanded" audience. The Ellen watchers that love Wii Fit. The elderly and rehab facilities that saw the potential in Wii Sports. People that never played games before and saw no real interest in doing so.

Then you have to look at Move and especially Kinect. Does anyone think if the Wii was not the success it was that either of these would have been implemented? Would Microsoft have put the resources, marketing and support behind Kinect if there wasn't a demand for motion control gaming?

The concept of an ever expanding industry is an interesting one. An industry can be healthy without continuous expansion. Perhaps the fault lies in the production side of things.

Some specialty industries can work without an expanding audience. Model trains for example, or oenophiles. Gamers need expanded audiences for the same reason people that love independent films need big block buster movies too. The more money developers and publishers make on titles for a broader audience the more they're willing to serve core gamers with titles that don't have a broad appeal, but deeply resonate with a select part of their customer base.

One could argue that will better tools and resources, studios would be able to turn product in shorter cycles thus letting them run lean and have a better success at profitability. If your costs are not in line with the industry footprint, perhaps at some point, you stop blaming growth and evaluate the ecosystem.

I think it's simpler than that, and you're not correctly applying the lessons of the Wii. I think any industry that slips into stagnation tends to contract and contraction in business is often death. I think there is a disenchantment with traditional gaming among some people who just want something NEW, who want something that feels like a new, fresh experience. They want the wonder they felt when they played Final Fantasy 7 for the first time, or first explored Mario 64's overworld. They want the satisfaction of playing Halo for the first time, there's nostalgia, but I think there is also a fatigue of similarity.

If you look at the history of the industry we seem to have revolutionary generations where new features are introduced (the NES revitalizing gaming, the PlayStation/Saturn/N64 introducing 3D) and then we have evolutionary generations (SNES vs Genesis refining 2D gaming, PS2, Xbox, GC refining 3D gaming). I think that this generation was supposed to be more revolutionary, it was supposed to do something very different and it just felt too similiar on the PS3 and 360 to the last generation.
 
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