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[Meelow]

Because you seemed to imply that Saints Row was a poor example of publishers ignoring the Wii U and, as already noted, Ubisoft are seemingly an exception to this generality.

Dark Souls 2 was announced after the Wii U was released. As was Madden NFL 25.

Activision has Wii U devkits; and Bungie could have them if they wanted to for Destiny.

Crytek have Wii U devkits; but aren't releasing Crysis 3 because of a lack of business drive. Other games listed have similarly skipped the Wii U because of stated lack of business drive.

You want more examples? Thief 4. Witcher 3. Metal Gear: Ground Zeroes.

This idea that there's a slew of third party support waiting in the wings to rush in and surprise everyone is ridiculous. It's as bad as the "there must be stuff coming for Vita" idea.

About Dark Souls 2, it also isn't confirmed for PS4 (yet at least), knowing how Nintendo has a much better relationship now with Namco I think we have a good chance of a Wii U version of it.

As for Destiny I still find it weird how they showed "My body is ready" in the trailer which is a Nintendo meme and also have a Chain Chomp that seems like it was purposely placed for the video.

So either Destiny is coming to Wii U or Activision/Bungie is trolling Nintendo fans (which would just be mean).

Guess we'll have to see.

 

[krypt0nian]

So I just read through my first Sales Age NPD thread in years, and overall I'm really impressed by the maturity that most of the posters exhibited, and the really high level of analysis, and conversation throughout.

That said, there still are a few somewhat....delusional posters, but it's nice to see them taken out line by line, and not just dogpiled on as "stupid". The last page though...sheesh. Back to reality, duders, pls. It's near conspiracy level right now with phantom NPDs preventing announcements, and ignoring the 3rd party trending, even this early on.

It's good that most can see the forest for the trees though. Well done GAF.

Super entertaining thread.

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

4 years ago you'd be laughed at if you predicted the Wii's successor would be barely making 66k 3 months from launch.

 

[paully]

Wii U is on life support.

 

[Phonomezer]

4 years ago you'd be laughed at if you predicted the Wii's successor would be barely making 66k 3 months from launch.

And yet those who predicted that lightning wouldn't strike twice were shut down.

Who didn't see this coming? Honestly.

 

[El_Chino]

So is 605k bad or good for Dead Space 3?

 

[krypt0nian]

And yet those who predicted that lightning wouldn't strike twice were shut down.

Who didn't see this coming? Honestly.

Yup. One of the reasons I stopped reading the NPD threads. Echo chamber supreme.

Seems different now, with far more level heads for the most.

 

[dragonfart28]

4 years ago you'd be laughed at if you predicted the Wii's successor would be barely making 66k 3 months from launch.

Much in the same way that alot of GAF shuts down people who think PS4/720 will need a few years to take off.

 

[metalslimer]

People still seem to be in denial about the Wiiu 3rd party situation when its clear as day what is going on. Or people actually are desperately holding onto the delusion that Nintendo is forcing 3rd parties not to announce games

Much in the same way that alot of GAF shuts down people who think PS4/720 will need a few years to take off.

More like people get shut down for trying to excuse the Wii u disaster as a sign of industry doom.

 

[Darryl]

People still seem to be in denial about the Wiiu 3rd party situation when its clear as day what is going on. Or people actually are desperately holding onto the delusion that Nintendo is forcing 3rd parties not to announce games



More like people get shut down for trying to excuse the Wii u disaster as a sign of industry doom.

GTA V looks to me to be the first major opportunity for an actual third-party loss for Nintendo. One that might have actual future repercussions. They don't need to get every small gritty FPS M-rated title to have a solid console with a high level of third-party support. In the grand scheme of things, Crysis 3 was never going to sell on the Wii U. It was never going to build a future audience for anything. On my radar, it doesn't strike me as missed third-party support. You'd be an idiot to waste your time bringing it to the Wii U, just as you'd be an idiot to waste your time bringing it to the 3DS. I don't pretend the 3DS isn't getting third-party support because a title that should've never came to that platform, didn't end up coming.

Titles like Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Just Dance, Skylanders, Disney's Infinity, and the sports titles are the ones that I find significant to the health of a console. It seems like in the mind of many people here, those titles are non-games and don't count towards the third-party tally.

 

[dragonfart28]

More like people get shut down for trying to excuse the Wii u disaster as a sign of industry doom.

Is there credence to the thought that the industry is on its way out?

 

[blackseedboy]

So is 605k bad or good for Dead Space 3?

for a dead franchise... not bad...

 

[pieatorium]

GTA V looks to me to be the first major opportunity for an actual third-party loss for Nintendo. One that might have actual future repercussions. They don't need to get every small gritty FPS M-rated title to have a solid console with a high level of third-party support. In the grand scheme of things, Crysis 3 was never going to sell on the Wii U. It was never going to build a future audience for anything. On my radar, it doesn't strike me as missed third-party support. You'd be an idiot to waste your time bringing it to the Wii U, just as you'd be an idiot to waste your time bringing it to the 3DS. I don't pretend the 3DS isn't getting third-party support because a title that should've never came to that platform, didn't end up coming.

Titles like Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Just Dance, Skylanders, Disney's Infinity, and the sports titles are the ones that I find significant to the health of a console. It seems like in the mind of many people here, those titles are non-games and don't count towards the third-party tally.

What about stuff like Tomb Raider, big budget franchise reboot seems like a good opportunity to build an audience. Same for dmc.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

GTA V looks to me to be the first major opportunity for an actual third-party loss for Nintendo. One that might have actual future repercussions. They don't need to get every small gritty FPS M-rated title to have a solid console with a high level of third-party support. In the grand scheme of things, Crysis 3 was never going to sell on the Wii U. It was never going to build a future audience for anything. On my radar, it doesn't strike me as missed third-party support. You'd be an idiot to waste your time bringing it to the Wii U, just as you'd be an idiot to waste your time bringing it to the 3DS. I don't pretend the 3DS isn't getting third-party support because a title that should've never came to that platform, didn't end up coming.

Titles like Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Just Dance, Skylanders, Disney's Infinity, and the sports titles are the ones that I find significant to the health of a console. It seems like in the mind of many people here, those titles are non-games and don't count towards the third-party tally.

Exactly im not sure why the dont count.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

PS3 is a lot closer than I expected it to be. Next month will be interesting to see how GOW:A and GOW:J do to their respective platforms.

 

[Darryl]

What about stuff like Tomb Raider, big budget franchise reboot seems like a good opportunity to build an audience. Same for dmc.

Tomb Raider doesn't seem positioned to build an audience on anything. If it was trying to, it'd probably be releasing next-year. It looks positioned to take advantage of the most profitable time of the PS3/360. I'm not even aware if they planned on turning this one into a series or not.

No idea on DMC. It's one of those games that I just don't think about and I don't really want to do research into it. I wasn't aware it was that significant anymore.

 

[pieatorium]

Tomb Raider doesn't seem positioned to build an audience on anything. If it was trying to, it'd probably be releasing next-year. It looks positioned to take advantage of the most profitable time of the PS3/360. I'm not even aware if they planned on turning this one into a series or not.

No idea on DMC. It's one of those games that I just don't think about and I don't really want to do research into it. I wasn't aware it was that significant anymore.

Tomb Raider is a big IP the first singled out by square as important after the eidos buyout iirc. They have definately been building this up as the reboot of the franchise.

 

[Manmademan]

Is there credence to the thought that the industry is on its way out?

none whatsoever.

 

[QaaQer]

Titles like Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Just Dance, Skylanders, Disney's Infinity, and the sports titles are the ones that I find significant to the health of a console. It seems like in the mind of many people here, those titles are non-games and don't count towards the third-party tally.

Of course they count, but so do all those other games. If left unchecked, it can becomes death by a thousand cuts.

 

[AniHawk]

none whatsoever.

we did just see three new systems launch and fail after their first month or two on the market.

also, the industry might not be so much dying as much as it is migrating to other platforms.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Titles like Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Just Dance, Skylanders, Disney's Infinity, and the sports titles are the ones that I find significant to the health of a console. It seems like in the mind of many people here, those titles are non-games and don't count towards the third-party tally.

As already noted, Ubisoft are a lone exception in committing to the platform with franchises like Assassin's Creed, Watch_Dogs and Just Dance.

Call of Duty: Black Ops 2 has still sold less than 100K on the platform in the US - the title's biggest market - and ergo, may have sold less than that number globally. It wouldn't surprise me if Activision don't make a Wii U SKU for the next installment any more than if they do make one.

I'm not sure why you're listing Grand Theft Auto when it's one of the most notable absences in terms of third party titles.

As for the annual sports titles, it isn't getting Tiger Woods 14. Madden NFL 25 has been announced for other platforms already. Frankly, I wouldn't even be surprised if EA skipped the platform with FIFA, considering the sales in the UK and continental Europe have been even poorer than the US.

Even if it does ultimately get ubiquitous titles, that doesn't indicate healthy support. Placing titles that are ubiquitous on all platforms on the system isn't a sign of confidence nor commitment to the platform. This "support" was present on the Wii. 57K Januaries and 66K Februaries do not instil confidence and drive commitment.

But if you really want to pretend the system is getting healthy third-party support because it's getting The Croods game and Activision's Walking Dead game, so be it.

Also, ignoring that the intent of Tomb Raider is to reset the franchise for future entries and pretending it's just some sort of quick cash-in is silly.

 

[Darryl]

Tomb Raider is a big IP the first singled out by square as important after the eidos buyout iirc. They have definately been building this up as the reboot of the franchise.

It'd be kinda lonely flopping about on the Wii U, with no one purchasing it and no one even caring if it was there to begin with. People will care about GTA V not being there.

 

[Phonomezer]

I think the lack of Tomb Raider hurt the Wii U most of all. A new installment of a gaming legacy, remade and rebuilt for a new generation. The fact that the reboot isn't an established franchise on the current-gen systems would've given the Wii U version a greater chance of success, especially if they played on the systems strengths (more RAM, screen, etc).

Has Bioshock Infinite been announced for Wii U?

 

[shinra-bansho]

Tomb Raider is something no one cares about now?

Is there credence to the thought that the industry is on its way out?

The PS3 + 360 so far in 2013 have outsold the combined 6th gen system sales in 2006 for the equivalent period at the time of the 360 launch.

we did just see three new systems launch and fail after their first month or two on the market.

also, the industry might not be so much dying as much as it is migrating to other platforms.

I don't think handhelds serve as any sort of barometer for home consoles.

 

[Pie and Beans]

It'd be kinda lonely flopping about on the Wii U, with no one purchasing it and no one even caring if it was there to begin with. People will care about GTA V not being there.

People will care about a sum total of games not being on there. Sure there'll be a major "oh wow thats not on there", but even just this Q1 and Q2 is already highlighting big WiiU problems in that area with no Crysis 3, no Dead Space, no Tomb Raider, no Revengeance, no Bioshock, no Dragon's Dogma, not even a Naruto.

With shocking sales reports coming in of software not shifting, console install base not growing with any speed that situation aint gonna reverse itself, and in the limited time frame there is between the cross-gen initiative and when everything makes the final jump to hardware the WiiU can't keep up with.

If nothing else, Nintendo should have set up a team to port (and try and make it the best version) GTAV like Microsoft did for Minecraft. Another example of Iwata and co not reacting fast enough.

 

[Rolf NB]

NPD. US. Not worldwide. Let's focus.

Likelihood of support from globally operating publishers is a topic that can only be discussed on a global level.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

I think alot of people talking 3rd parties are also forgetting Nintendo's first parties. The Wii U is possibly going to be a system this fall with, watch_dogs, assassin creed, COD, madden, Disney infinity, skylanders, Mario Kart, 3D Mario action game, Windwaker HD, Pikmin 3, and the W101 possibly Bayonetta 2. It may not be getting witcher or destiney but that line up right there isnt a slouch and could be in alot of peoples interest to have those AAA third party games, with unmatched exclusive first party Nintendo titles.

And Im not sure if 3rd parties are "hiding games" for Wii U but capcom...A third party did say this for Wii U

Noted Jimmy. We've got MH Tri Ultimate and RE: Revelations announced for Wii U with more fun you'll hear about "in the not-so-distant future (tm)".

They sure arent talking about it.

If you want to address the whole situation go ahead but dont pick specfics and unproven evidence and act like people are delusional about the situation.

 

[cyberheater]

Wii U is on life support.

Yep it's tanking hard. At what point do we start calling it a flop.

 

[Pie and Beans]

I think alot of people talking 3rd parties are also forgetting Nintendo's first parties.

Nintendo has been making that very easy themselves this "launch window".

The WiiU isn't offering any benefit to COD or AC4 over peoples already purchased systems (and in COD's case actually a detriment with multiplayer population), and only the PS4/Durango versions will be given any wow boost. Bayonetta 2 probably isn't this year, people don't really care about Pikmin, and Wind Waker is a port. Maybe Nintendo will give W101 a huge advertising campaign but I doubt it, and its not really looking like some breakout hit either.

So you're left with Mario and more Mario to shift units. Diminishing marketbase of people that are gonna be okay with that nostalgia tickle routinely tugged every calendar year. Maybe Retro will have something fantastic and new to appeal and prove the point of that GamePad because even Mario Galaxy never truly demonstrated the point of the wiimote.

Yep it's tanking hard. At what point do we start calling it a flop.

If the Gamecube was a flop, its now tracking behind that with no end to such a poor performance in sight. So: now.

 

[AniHawk]

I don't think handhelds serve as any sort of barometer for home consoles.

really? the wii craze followed the ds craze fairly well.

 

[cyberheater]

If the Gamecube was a flop, its now tracking behind that with no end to such a poor performance in sight. So: now.

I didn't know it was that bad. Great to know I bought a flop.

 

[Darryl]

People will care about a sum total of games not being on there. Sure there'll be a major "oh wow thats not on there", but even just this Q1 and Q2 is already highlighting big WiiU problems in that area with no Crysis 3, no Dead Space, no Tomb Raider, no Revengeance, no Bioshock, no Dragon's Dogma, not even a Naruto.

With shocking sales reports coming in of software not shifting, console install base not growing with any speed that situation aint gonna reverse itself, and in the limited time frame there is between the cross-gen initiative and when everything makes the final jump to hardware the WiiU can't keep up with.

If nothing else, Nintendo should have set up a team to port (and try and make it the best version) GTAV like Microsoft did for Minecraft. Another example of Iwata and co not reacting fast enough.

Those titles very clearly target a specific audience, one that already has roots in PS3/360.
Why would anyone buy these titles? It is going to take established franchises* and exclusive offerings to get people onto a new platform, just as it always has and how it always will. It would take those two things regardless of if it was the Wii U out right now or the PS4. Releasing these titles will do very little sales, will hardly contribute to the game console ecosystem, and would serve only as check boxes for arguing forum-goers.

*probably should point out that I meant the major franchises before i get nitpicked, there's a clear difference that i've already been trying to point out

 

[shinra-bansho]

really? the wii craze followed the ds craze fairly well.

Both capitalized on a blue ocean strategy and brought in new audiences into their respective markets (that have now seemingly vacated the markets).

But I don't think the failure of new dedicated handhelds - and the general decline of the dedicated handheld market in the West as a whole can serve to indicate the health of the home console market.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Nintendo has been making that very easy themselves this "launch window".

The WiiU isn't offering any benefit to COD or AC4 over peoples already purchased systems (and in COD's case actually a detriment with multiplayer population), and only the PS4/Durango versions will be given any wow boost. Bayonetta 2 probably isn't this year, people don't really care about Pikmin, and Wind Waker is a port. Maybe Nintendo will give W101 a huge advertising campaign but I doubt it, and its not really looking like some breakout hit either.

So you're left with Mario and more Mario to shift units. Diminishing marketbase of people that are gonna be okay with that nostalgia tickle routinely tugged every calendar year. Maybe Retro will have something fantastic and new to appeal and prove the point of that GamePad because even Mario Galaxy never truly demonstrated the point of the wiimote.



If the Gamecube was a flop, its now tracking behind that with no end to such a poor performance in sight. So: now.

Your thinking to close minded right now, yea I agree those titles may not be much. But all of those together is an incredible line up. Someone that wants to play mario kart will buy a Wii U. Someone that wants to play the newest COD but also sees they can play WW, and Mario too will buy a Wii U.

The Wii U isnt offering any benefit to ac4 or cod? Well its a bit early to tell that. I know you like talking crazy sometimes so Ill just let that be.

That Wii U lineup this year is gonna be way better than ps4/720 by a long run in terms of quality software and value.

 

[Manmademan]

Your thinking to close minded right now, yea I agree those titles may not be much. But all of those together is an incredible line up. Someone that wants to play mario kart will buy a Wii U. Someone that wants to play the newest COD but also sees they can play WW, and Mario too will buy a Wii U.

The Wii U isnt offering any benefit to ac4 or cod? Well its a bit early to tell that. I know you like talking crazy sometimes so Ill just let that be.

That Wii U lineup this year is gonna be way better than ps4/720 by a long run in terms of quality software and value.

you're missing the point. anyone that cares about playing the latest COD, Assassin's creed, whatever already owns a PS3/360, and the WiiU version isn't going to be any more technically advanced. There's no reason to buy a WiiU to play "the latest call of duty" when one's existing system will play it exactly the same.

so the draw of the wiiU is down to whether or not someone wants to pay $350 to play mario kart or the new mario- and as we've seen before with the N64 and the GC, the audience willing to do this is very small.

 

[Pie and Beans]

The Wii U isnt offering any benefit to ac4 or cod? Well its a bit early to tell that. I know you like talking crazy sometimes so Ill just let that be.

That Wii U lineup this year is gonna be way better than ps4/720 by a long run in terms of quality software and value.

Layups. Scoops. So, first up: AC3 and COD already happened on WiiU. General populace didn't give a shit. Didn't buy. Woeful numbers.

Next we're so sure the PS4 and Xbox720 are going to have little quality software and not have "way better value"? Unlike Nintendo, Sony and MS have gotten very good at the turnaround on HD software and have been preparing for their new consoles for quite some time. Even the Vita had a better launch window line-up than the WiiU, so I'm not concerned.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

you're missing the point. anyone that cares about playing the latest COD, Assassin's creed, whatever already owns a PS3/360, and the WiiU version isn't going to be any more technically advanced. There's no reason to buy a WiiU to play "the latest call of duty" when one's existing system will play it exactly the same.

so the draw of the wiiU is down to whether or not someone wants to pay $350 to play mario kart or the new mario- and as we've seen before with the N64 and the GC, the audience willing to do this is very small.

Im not missing the point. I just dont agree. Call me wrong but its not unreasonable to take a look from my viewpoint as possibility.

Layups. Scoops. So, first up: AC3 and COD already happened on WiiU. General populace didn't give a shit. Didn't buy. Woeful numbers.

Next we're so sure the PS4 and Xbox720 are going to have little quality software and not have "way better value"? Unlike Nintendo, Sony and MS have gotten very good at the turnaround on HD software and have been preparing for their new consoles for quite some time. Even the Vita had a better launch window line-up than the WiiU, so I'm not concerned.

Layups.Scoops. If ps4/720 had a better lineup than what I put for Wii U I would be surprised. I expect it to be a "Launch" lineup of games.

 

[Hindle]

Dead Space 3 did way better then I was expecting.

 

[Manmademan]

Im not missing the point. I just dont agree. Call me wrong but its not unreasonable to take a look from my viewpoint as possibility.

so from your point of view, someone who already owns an Xbox360, with vastly superior online capability and far more active community re: COD, would consider paying $350 to buy a WiiU to play the next call of duty on...why?

I'm trying to figure out your reasoning here, because it's nonsensical. will people buy the wiiU for mario? sure, but there are not a lot of these. will they pay $350 to play the same games their existing consoles will play with no improvements and worse online? no.

 

[test_account]

Layups.Scoops. If ps4/720 had a better lineup than what I put for Wii U I would be surprised. I expect it to be a "Launch" lineup of games.

What do you mean with "Launch" lineup? You mean launch window, games that are released in the upcoming months after the release day? Every system have those, and we also get confirmation on which games that are available at day 1.

 

[MarkusRJR]

so from your point of view, someone who already owns an Xbox360, with vastly superior online capability and far more active community re: COD, would consider paying $350 to buy a WiiU to play the next call of duty on...why?

I'm trying to figure out your reasoning here, because it's nonsensical. will people buy the wiiU for mario? sure, but there are not a lot of these. will they pay $350 to play the same games their existing consoles will play with no improvements and worse online? no.

Yeah the audience for CoD, AC, etc would already own a 360 or PS3. There is no reason for them to plop down $350 for a Wii U when they can get a comparable experience (or even a better one) on a cheaper machine or one they already own. It's only going to get worse when the PS4/720 hit the scene, as they'll both have way more impressive versions of said games while the Wii U is stuck with worse versions.

The only reason I could see someone picking up a Wii U right now is for the exclusives, which just aren't here atm. Maybe they'll be here around the holidays, but by then the PS4/720 hype will be taking away a lot of the spotlight from Nintendo.

 

[Deprive]

Nintendo really should have not put so much in to that controller. Don't think anyone should write the Wii U or Vita off until end of 2014 tho. But man Nintendo is gonna be in for it, if one of the next systems is $399.

 

[Celine]

If the Gamecube was a flop, its now tracking behind that with no end to such a poor performance in sight. So: now.

I disagree with your conclusion but I don't expect you to understand why.

 

[Ydahs]

I don't know if the controller is the issue though. I think it falls more upon marketing and an utter lack of games. Nintendo banked too much on Mario and Nintendoland, as well as the false hope of third parties carrying the system until they got their own titles out.

They're tanking big time at the moment and need a world of momentum following E3, which in itself is a big ask considering the competition present this year.


I don't think the console's a flop, but I do think it's on target to being a huge money drain for Nintendo if they can't manage to substantially turn things around by the middle of next year.

 

[krypt0nian]

Nintendo really should have not put so much in to that controller. Don't think anyone should write the Wii U or Vita off until end of 2014 tho. But man Nintendo is gonna be in for it, if one of the next systems is $399.

I see both of them launching sub-$400 usd.

 

[Pie and Beans]

I disagree with your conclusion but I don't expect you to understand why.

Because you're pledging to the miracle turnaround Nintendo can achieve in 8 months before new consoles erupt forth and steal all the limelight with whatever new tech theyre bringing to the table. Because you feel perhaps Wii Fit U will be a sensation, or this third go around of Pikmin will be the one to set the world alight.

It is already a flop. Whether it can un-flop itself this holiday and next year, thats the challenge. But right now, we know that for its first foreseeable year on the market, the WiiU is a flop.

 

[CadetMahoney]

Bayo2 will be one of those games that will get a ton of attention of gaf.

This will be followed up by "GETTING A WIIU THIS WEEKEND JUST FOR THIS!" type threads

Then sales figures will come out and we'll get "STUPID DUDEBROS!" type posts.

pretty much dude.

hahaha pretty much.

 

[SniperHunter]

Dead Space 3 did way better then I was expecting.

Dead space 3 sales figures blew me away

 

[JoeM86]

Call of Duty: Black Ops 2 has still sold less than 100K on the platform in the US - the title's biggest market - and ergo, may have sold less than that number globally. It wouldn't surprise me if Activision don't make a Wii U SKU for the next installment any more than if they do make one.

To be fair, it's not like it'd have sold millions on the Wii U considering the Wii U came out just days after the launch of Black Ops 2.

A more logical comparison would be a percentage of owners of the console having the game, rather than just raw figures. It's a bit ridiculous to compare about low sales of a game on a new console which obviously doesn't have scores of millions for the install base

 

[pieatorium]

To be fair, it's not like it'd have sold millions on the Wii U considering the Wii U came out just days after the launch of Black Ops 2.

A more logical comparison would be a percentage of owners of the console having the game, rather than just raw figures. It's a bit ridiculous to compare about low sales of a game on a new console which obviously doesn't have scores of millions for the install base

360's launch month was 326k,, Call of Duty 2 sold 251k for it as a launch game.