-Pyromaniac-
Member
Like the article mentions. You'll never kill piracy, the best bet on reducing it is making things more affordable and easy to access for as many people as possible.
NYTIMES: Internet Pirates Will Always Win
- Thread starter dinazimmerman
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You can for music and apps. Not video though. The networks don't like it.
Yeah, and it's definitely an issue. You can for music now, but apps and videos are a different story.
What works so well about Steam is that it makes you feel like you own whatever you buy (even though you don't really own it). Many DD services miss that giving a sense of ownership is very important when buying digital goods.
Piracy isn't going anywhere. That said, if networks continue refusing to adopt to some sort of reasonable internet delivery method then they are looking at a very bleak future. There are less and less subscribers to cable every month, who do they think will be left to legally watch their shows?
rohlfinator
Member
Article is spot on.
Even if you could eliminate all piracy overnight, a large number of pirates will refuse to pay for entertainment regardless. There is no shortage of free or dirt cheap alternatives -- people who are pirating now will just readjust their media habits to continue to avoid paying.
Even if you could eliminate all piracy overnight, a large number of pirates will refuse to pay for entertainment regardless. There is no shortage of free or dirt cheap alternatives -- people who are pirating now will just readjust their media habits to continue to avoid paying.
You know iTunes does pretty much all of that, except live streaming the minute it airs, which is unrealistic considering the amount of shows iTunes sells.
Ninja Scooter
Member
the entire Television model is based on advertising revenue. You cannot replace this with some sort of alacarte model. How many shows would not even be greenlit if it was based some sort of "pre-order" business model instead of getting advertisers on board? Stuff like Breaking Bad or Mad Men might not exist, at least not in the same high quality format.
I'd love to just have access to such services on a 1 to 1 level with their base operation. The content laws and battles put up by providers/producers here are what keep things like Pandora, Spotify, Hulu and Netflix as either completely useless or severely stunted versions of themselves, because outside competition with Bell/Rogers on Demand would bring them to their knees and they won't allow for that.
GroteSmurf
Member
shitjustgotreal.gif
StrikerObi
Member
It's not about the money.
This is actually pretty accurate.
Some (maybe even most?) video you can. They are getting closer to all video, but right now it's restricted to the specific studios/networks they have arranged that deal with. Also only in the US and I think maybe UK and Canada just got iTunes "in the cloud" for video.
Edit: Looks like it is all video in the US now per this article (at least in the US): http://gigaom.com/video/apple-refreshes-apple-tv-adds-video-to-itunes-in-the-cloud/
It's all very interesting. There is no doubt the current TV subscription models won't be here for much longer. I've wondered about how new TV shows would get greenlit with crowd sourced funding. Until recently, kick starter was not a way for new games to be published, either. Then some established names, with pedigree, put up a good idea, sold the idea well and their kick starter went fucking bananas. And a few have since successfully followed.
Were there enough fans of GoT - the books - to help fund a TV series I wonder? Probably not. In that case, does the model need to be a part crowd sourced model, where the fans kick in $2-$5 per episode, the studio matches that say 1-for-1 with traditional ad based revenue just for the first season? I don't know, at the moment any kind of crowd sourced funding is fraught with danger (creative control, funding properly new ideas that aren't book based, for example and so on), but there must be a middle ground somewhere?
Steam and even iTunes, have shown that ease of content delivery works (as long as your definition isn't '100% eradication of piracy'). As simple as that. A large reason for those platforms working is that living in Australia, I don't have a particularly retarded version of Steam compared to anywhere else in the world (though I understand this isn't the case for everywhere). Whereas if I log on to comedy central to catch up with Jon Stewart, or the HBO website, I'm greeted with a 'this content is unavailable in your region' message. I'm a subscription TV er, subscriber here in Australia (only until FTTH is switched on in my street soon), so I already pay a fee to have comedy central beamed into my house with Jon Stewart on there, why hasn't this licence been extended to include some kind of ability to log into the home network and view the content also? It's preposterous.
One last thing, would it kill TV content providers to treat their material with some respect? Flashing a banner along the bottom of the screen (or over the credits) for 'next big model', 'singaringadinga idol' or some other fucking stupid show during Parks and Recreation is the epitome of having no respect for your content. It's egregious in the extreme.
About the only thing we do know is that piracy isn't going anywhere.
Were there enough fans of GoT - the books - to help fund a TV series I wonder? Probably not. In that case, does the model need to be a part crowd sourced model, where the fans kick in $2-$5 per episode, the studio matches that say 1-for-1 with traditional ad based revenue just for the first season? I don't know, at the moment any kind of crowd sourced funding is fraught with danger (creative control, funding properly new ideas that aren't book based, for example and so on), but there must be a middle ground somewhere?
Steam and even iTunes, have shown that ease of content delivery works (as long as your definition isn't '100% eradication of piracy'). As simple as that. A large reason for those platforms working is that living in Australia, I don't have a particularly retarded version of Steam compared to anywhere else in the world (though I understand this isn't the case for everywhere). Whereas if I log on to comedy central to catch up with Jon Stewart, or the HBO website, I'm greeted with a 'this content is unavailable in your region' message. I'm a subscription TV er, subscriber here in Australia (only until FTTH is switched on in my street soon), so I already pay a fee to have comedy central beamed into my house with Jon Stewart on there, why hasn't this licence been extended to include some kind of ability to log into the home network and view the content also? It's preposterous.
One last thing, would it kill TV content providers to treat their material with some respect? Flashing a banner along the bottom of the screen (or over the credits) for 'next big model', 'singaringadinga idol' or some other fucking stupid show during Parks and Recreation is the epitome of having no respect for your content. It's egregious in the extreme.
About the only thing we do know is that piracy isn't going anywhere.
I dont get the rationale of calling people who pirate scumbags. There are in some cases no other option but to pirate and its not the fault of the consumer that access to these shows/music/etc has not been made widely available.
I think alacarte could still work if its reasonable. Im not going to pay $5/episode and still have 10-15 commercials thrown in my face. I think people would be glad to pay for programming if it is 1) available online 2)day and date with the cable providers 3) no expiration date on content
I think alacarte could still work if its reasonable. Im not going to pay $5/episode and still have 10-15 commercials thrown in my face. I think people would be glad to pay for programming if it is 1) available online 2)day and date with the cable providers 3) no expiration date on content
Wafflecakes
Member
There is always an option. No one no matter who poor or rich is entitled to content someone else created.
(not saying providers are not also at fault....however, them doing wrong doesn't make others who do wrong less wrong)
Messypandas
Member
The problem is you have many more people partaking in what is a global community appreciation of TV shows and films. If you have half the world fawning over an amazing new film or TV show 6 months before the rest of the community can legally purchase it you're going to open yourself to the vulnerability of piracy. Its not an entitlement issue, its a simple fact that the market has changed and you need to adapt to survive.
I remember getting interested in IASIP through the use of GIFS and quotes on this board. The show didn't even broadcast here so I had to import the dvd's off amazon which wouldn't play on any of my DVD players because of region issues. Its fucking stupid how hard they can make it for legit consumers and they wonder why people turn to the allure of piracy?
I remember getting interested in IASIP through the use of GIFS and quotes on this board. The show didn't even broadcast here so I had to import the dvd's off amazon which wouldn't play on any of my DVD players because of region issues. Its fucking stupid how hard they can make it for legit consumers and they wonder why people turn to the allure of piracy?
Yeah, my statement is granted you can subscribe to services like Spotify/whatever where you live. One of the main reasons for piracy is regional unavailability.
Fair enough. As a subscriber I forgot that free users have to listen to ads.
The reason: lots of lawyers.
ReturnOfTheRAT
Member
All these forms of entertainment are wants. You do not need to consume them. Pirating or stealing for your personal gratification doesn't make it okay.
I pay 2 bucks a day for all the channels i have now, so no that's not fair.
a la carte channels are inevitable, with all the contract disputes that go on now
DarkHeartedKill
Member
What I don't like is when the companies claim piracy is costing them money. It's not, they are just getting lost revenue, it's not as if someone downloading a video directly costs the company. What costs the company money is how hard they're trying to stop it, even though they still make ridiculous profits.
Why do people always say in these threads that "Steam showed blah blah works and reduces piracy." What? Since when was PC game piracy reduced? For every article where someone suggests it's declining, I can show you two where people say it's as bad as ever. And what does Steam do that iTunes or Google Play or Origin or Amazon or any other digital service doesn't that implies they "got it right?"
Just because you like Steam and buy stuff there doesn't mean they've solved the great piracy conundrum. Nothing of the sort. You're projecting your own experiences onto millions.
Just because you like Steam and buy stuff there doesn't mean they've solved the great piracy conundrum. Nothing of the sort. You're projecting your own experiences onto millions.
NullPointer
Member
We have spent a tremendous amount of time and effort to create this electronic revolution revolution: Digital representations and dynamic systems that can be endlessly copied, modified and transmitted at the speed of light.
How glorious. Now, first on the agenda - how do we make this digital representation so that it can't be copied or modified or distributed. Great.
It seems like only people who aren't trying to take the wetness out of water are the 'pirates'.
How glorious. Now, first on the agenda - how do we make this digital representation so that it can't be copied or modified or distributed. Great.
It seems like only people who aren't trying to take the wetness out of water are the 'pirates'.
so Amazon on demand basically. the services do exist.
Steam just made it super easy to just buy a game and play it. In most cases its easier to just let steam do all the work then trying to mess around with cracks and shit like that from a pirated game. People will spend the money for instant gratification and easiness. And of course piracy is gonna happen more. Broadband has exploded in the past 10 years, a hell of a lot more people have internet access now than 10 years ago.
DarkHeartedKill
Member
Steam Summer Sale sure helps reduce piracy. I wouldn't go through all the trouble of finding a crack and crap for a game when I can get it for over 60% off sometimes.
Ninja Scooter
Member
people who pirate get it for 100% off all the time. Why would 60% off appeal to them? Maybe casual pirates but I doubt there are very many casual PC game pirates. Once you start why wouldn't they just pirate everything?
Still don't understand how this differentiates Steam from anyone else. All the digital distributors have big sales, particularly the ones who sell games (Steam, Amazon, iTunes, Origin, etc).
Can't beat piratism. It is practically impossible. You can spend a lot of money fighting it... all for naught.
Is piratism right? No, not really but it is too late to do anything..
Arguably we need to move onward. Make things that cannot be pirated. Free-to-Play systems. Advertisement-financed TV shows (and not something like YouTube does as that can be circumvented via AdBlocker, the ads need to be in the show/film itself). And so on.
Any mass crackdown on piratism will only lead on violation of free-speech (accidentally, as a side-effect, something like that) and is unacceptable.
And ultimately fighting the piratism is the wrong approach. As always, doing something to symptoms and effects is not the solution, treating the root cause is what should be done. In this case, creating a society where piratism wouldn't happen in the first place (of course such society probably wouldn't, couldn't be capitalistic either...).
Is piratism right? No, not really but it is too late to do anything..
Arguably we need to move onward. Make things that cannot be pirated. Free-to-Play systems. Advertisement-financed TV shows (and not something like YouTube does as that can be circumvented via AdBlocker, the ads need to be in the show/film itself). And so on.
Any mass crackdown on piratism will only lead on violation of free-speech (accidentally, as a side-effect, something like that) and is unacceptable.
And ultimately fighting the piratism is the wrong approach. As always, doing something to symptoms and effects is not the solution, treating the root cause is what should be done. In this case, creating a society where piratism wouldn't happen in the first place (of course such society probably wouldn't, couldn't be capitalistic either...).
Ninja Scooter
Member
HBO doesn't seem to give a shit about stopping piracy because they make shit tons of money as is and know that their programming is appointment television. People want to watch be on their couch, in front of their HDTVs on Sunday nights watching so they can talk about it at the water cooler the next day, not sitting in front of their lap top or on their phone watching a crappy SD feed. Makes it easy to get away with this when your shows are as high quality as HBOs though.
I'm in Canada. I am oblivious to such services.
Sales from the three stores besides steam are often pretty restricted with regards to the region they run in (read: mostly for the US). Furthermore, lots of these services are only available/work best in the US... Also steam, now that it is pretty decent, benefits from the reputation and communtiy good will valve has built up by offering all the free DLC for their games.
Try living in europe. Don't want to pirate? Enjoy the latest episode of Breaking Bad 6 months later than the US! Enjoy never getting to see a lot of other shows! And remember, Piracy=Stealing and entertainment is not a need!
It's the same thing trying to watch certain European content here in NA.
If we ever get it, it's never day and date.
HBO might not care publicly, but you can be damn sure Time Warner, HBO's parent company will trip over themselves and trample their own grandmother if it means putting a stop to piracy.
Liberty4all
Banned
Everyone and I do mean literally everyone I knows uses torrets. They don't care about the ethics behind it. For most of the public the reasonable price is 0. I don't know how to change that way of thinking. I'm not sure there really IS any way anymore. Maybe if studios can figure out a way to embed advertising that can't be bypassed even on pirated copies?
Terrible idea. Any measure like this would be stripped out by pirates. It's just even more of a hindrance for legitimate customers.
Liberty4all
Banned
That's naive. Its not just kids and teens. It's basically anyone that knows how to use a torret client ... Just like how it was basically anyone that knew how to use Napster.
It's about perception. The vast majority of people out there don't see anything wrong with torreting movies and tv shows. Personally I pay for a very basic cable package i got on a crazy promotion but I don't know anyone else that does aside maybe from folks over the age of 50.
The person I know who pirates the most is also one of the most well-off developers I've ever seen (he's not an architect or lead, just a plain dev) who makes $185 per hour. He can afford anything and has easy access to all content but will always pirate simply because he can. A Steam/Zune/iTunes like system for most media will certainly help reduce piracy among certain people but there will still be others that will continue to do it regardless.
entremet
Member
That's because the customers for the major TV companies are the advertisers not the direct viewer.
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