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[CertifiedFP]

West Francia is somehow almost entirely east of Middle Francia now.

fucking KARLINGS, RHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Spoiler

Germanic Pagan Moral Authority: -50 (-2000 failed prepared invasions, -10 Holy Site desecrated, +300 Infidel temple looted)

 

[Megasoum]

So I'm watching Quill18's Heart of Iron Canada playthrough where he play an independent democratic Canada (so not part of the Allies) against a boosted Germany (aka Turbo Germany)

The moment where he finds out the Soviet Union capitulate and slowly zooms out the map is one of the funniest thing I've seen in a while Lmao

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ox31HoC1k_M&feature=youtu.be&t=3m15s

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Third Rome and Death or Dishonor both launching on the 14th.

 

[frontovik]

Looking forward to both. Third Rome more.

 

[Vinter]

Third Rome and Death or Dishonor both launching on the 14th.

Really looking forward to Third Rome. Will be the first time I play as a country from that area.

 

[Kayhan]

What is the state of Hearts of Iron 4 these days?

I bought it at launch but haven't played it much. It has been out a while so I am wondering how the veterans in here feel about the game.

 

[CzarTim]

What is the state of Hearts of Iron 4 these days?

I bought it at launch but haven't played it much. It has been out a while so I am wondering how the veterans in here feel about the game.

There's some great mods now. But between the AI and air interface, I have trouble getting into it. Really looking forward to the next update for those reasons.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

What is the state of Hearts of Iron 4 these days?

I bought it at launch but haven't played it much. It has been out a while so I am wondering how the veterans in here feel about the game.

Needs work but I don't ever get the urge to go back to HoI3 so make of that what you will.

The upcoming patch is finally sectioning off the Sahara and some other impassable areas so we won't need the No Man's Land mod anymore. Whether it addresses most of the core issues or not will depend on how good the AI performance is. They've said they put a lot into it, but I'm not getting my hopes up too high.

Current main issues with the game:

- AI still has front management issues including shuffling units around too much.
- AI still doesn't know it's not supposed to send convoys full of soldiers through enemy controlled waters.
- Peace conferences are still wonky and produce lots of bordergore.
- AI still isn't very good at knowing when certain National Focuses don't make sense, or when joining a faction doesn't make sense.
- Air and Naval combat, and the interfaces therein, are serviceable but not particularly fun.

In a vacuum, the AI isn't really below average in comparison to other Paradox titles. Like EU4 and CK AI is still dumb as a doornail with combat, Stellaris shipped a version of the game where the AI forgot to declare war, etc. When people play Kaiserreich mod, their expectations based on historical knowledge disappear and so they tend not to be bothered by a lot of the quirks like joining factions when it's dumb to do so or countries going on ridiculous conquest sprees. But in terms of versimillitude for the WWII setting it has a ways to go.

They're bringing an air UI overhaul, which is needed, but in terms of core system they haven't announced many changes to how the combat actually plays out, so we'll have to see how much impact just a UI overhaul brings. It should make it less tedious, which is an improvement, but it's unlikely to now have magically transformed into being an actually good part of the game in absolute terms.

 

[Uzzy]

Hearts of Iron 4 is getting some free DLC to celebrate the 1st anniversary of its release. Just some Polish audio, some new portraits and new division icons that you'll never see because you all correctly use NATO symbols.

 

[Forerunner]

The country usage is interesting. I have +200 hours and I still haven't played Germany, Soviet, or Britain.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Nice. I'm praying super hard that the new update is a great one.

 

[Forerunner]

Played a bit of DoD, air combat is much improved. Now I actually have a general idea of wtf is happening. Playing as Hungary for my first play through. Austria didn't want to join, so we had to do it the hard way. Now I have to finish restoring the empire for my achievement.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Played a bit of DoD, air combat is much improved. Now I actually have a general idea of wtf is happening. Playing as Hungary for my first play through. Austria didn't want to join, so we had to do it the hard way. Now I have to finish restoring the empire for my achievement.

The cheevo is harder than you might expect because it insists on upholding several tenuous Hapsburg claims - like controlling Lorraine and being the King of Jerusalem and shit.

I'm surprised they didn't break it into 2 achievements - 1 for restoring the AH monarchy and reclaiming 1914 borders, and another for the far more ambitious goal of restoring all Hapsburg territories, including Spain, parts of Italy, NL, Latin America etc.

 

[Megasoum]

Just noticed that EU4 is 75% off and HO4 is 50% of on Steam today.


I'm thinking about picking up EU4 even if I'm still mad intimidated by it lol...

Are any of the expansions must haves?

 

[Forerunner]

The cheevo is harder than you might expect because it insists on upholding several tenuous Hapsburg claims - like controlling Lorraine and being the King of Jerusalem and shit.

I'm surprised they didn't break it into 2 achievements - 1 for restoring the AH monarchy and reclaiming 1914 borders, and another for the far more ambitious goal of restoring all Hapsburg territories, including Spain, parts of Italy, NL, Latin America etc.

Yeah, my play through went to shit. I got pulled into ww2. I declared war on Bulgaria, but for some reason France guaranteed their independence, so I ended up on the Axis. It wouldn’t have been so bad, but Germany decided it was a good time to declare war on USSR.

So we went from this:

To this:

So we are pretty much fucked. Thanks Germany.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Just noticed that EU4 is 75% off and HO4 is 50% of on Steam today.


I'm thinking about picking up EU4 even if I'm still mad intimidated by it lol...

Are any of the expansions must haves?

Art of War and Common Sense are the 2 most important. If you've money to burn, Rights of Man and The Cossacks are the next 2.

If you like what you get, you can pick up the rest of the DLC packs later. Music/sprite packs etc are all unnecessary.

 

[Mgoblue201]

I would also recommend The Cossacks, Common Sense, Rights of Man, and Art of War (plus maybe Res Publica). That will give you 80 to 90 percent of the full experience. And the rest of the features aren't consequential enough to warrant the price you'll pay for the remaining expansions unless you already like the game a lot.

 

[Basileus777]

Paradox should really roll the old DLC into the base game at this point, I can't imagine being a new player and not being completely overwhelmed and put off by all the dlc.

And I say this as someone who (unwisely) owns pretty much all of the EU4 dlc, with most of it at launch prices.

 

[Mgoblue201]

I've only ever bought two of the expansions (The Cossacks and Common Sense) at launch. Since I don't really care if the game is up to date, I usually just wait until the sales. Up until recently I was still playing on the 1.19 patch trying to finish a two month old Albania campaign.

I think it's probably a good idea to roll some of the older DLC into the base game, but the complaints about Paradox's DLC policy are overblown. The game is perfectly playable without any DLC for only $10, and you can get a nearly feature complete game for $40. Paradox probably doesn't help themselves by making it more confusing than it needs to be though, since the features are split across so many expansions and it's not evident at first what's essential and what isn't.

 

[Megasoum]

I've only ever bought two of the expansions (The Cossacks and Common Sense) at launch. Since I don't really care if the game is up to date, I usually just wait until the sales. Up until recently I was still playing on the 1.19 patch trying to finish a two month old Albania campaign.

Hmm... So right now on Steam (those are all CDN prices).

Base game, 12.99$ (on sale from 52$)

Extreme Edition: 59$ includes:
Includes additional DLC:
- Horsemen of the Crescent Unit Pack
- Star and Crescent DLC
- Conquest of Constantinople Music pack
- Women in History

EU4 with Third Rome and HOI4 with Death & Dishonored bundle for 59$

EU4 Collection which includes 43 items (I assume it's everything) is 157$ (!!!)

Finaly they have CK2, EU4 and HOI4, all base games bundle is 82$

 

[Basileus777]

I think it's probably a good idea to roll some of the older DLC into the base game, but the complaints about Paradox's DLC policy are overblown. The game is perfectly playable without any DLC for only $10, and you can get a nearly feature complete game for $40.

It's really not overblown. It's a confusing mess to most people getting into any of their games that have been around a bit. Most of their expansions are overpriced, but it's a lot easier to live with that if you're playing it regularly as they come out and not trying to sort out the mess years later. Paradox does games as a service at a premium price and in a really confusing way.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

The overwhelming number of DLCs and confusing nature of it all was why I was so happy when HoI4 moved to a discrete expansion model. Like 2 packs a year, but no tiny flavour shit. But now they're moving back in a confusing direction by releasing DoD as a $10 "Country Pack", but it still does have some new mechanics for some reason. Well doesn't that just make it a small expansion? And it's taking up a slot in the Expansion Pass so why call it something else?

People are also on the verge of rioting every time a new DLC gets announced. People had different ideas about what the expansions would be, and a lot of folks are not happy that a large portion of the sticker price is flavour for minor nations. All in all it's a bit of a mess. I want them to continue doing expansion passes, but as a retroactive thing. Every 2-3 expansions, they could bring out a new expansion pass which is just a reduced-cost bundle of the previous DLCs. That way there's no specific pressure to have the DLCs conform to your initial promises and there's no customers getting pissed off that their expectations were met, but you still get the benefit of having nice neat bundles for newcomers.

 

[Megasoum]

I guess it's a bit of the nature of the beast with that kind of game but I don't like the DLC model they are using.

I actually don't really mind games that have a ton of DLCs but all the general improvements should be rolled into the free patches.

Like... adding new content in paid DLC is fine but if you happen to fix some UI element in one of the expansions then it should be included in the free patch.


Basically anybody who has the base game has the same base functions as the person who bought all the DLCs... The DLC person just has more content (more countries, more random events, whatever).

I'm even fine with having new features locked behind paid DLC to some extent but from what I gather it really sounds like some basic QoL improvements are coming with some of the DLCs and this is BS...

A new player should note be "forced" to buy all the DLCs to have the right experience.


This is a very dodgy and oversimplified example but I see it a bit like racing games that have car packs (like Forza for example)... You need to buy the DLCs to be able to buy and drive those cars but the patches still includes all those cars so that you can see other players using them while in multiplayer.

 

[frontovik]

Decided to jump back into HoI IV as Germany after taking a break for several months...

Firstly, is it still possible to wreck everyone with 20 width Infantry/Artillery divisions?

Secondly, any point in maintaining a navy/air force? I was able to steamroll most nations in Europe/Asia with my land army...

Finally, what's the priority for constructing military/civilian factories?

 

[Basileus777]

I guess it's a bit of the nature of the beast with that kind of game but I don't like the DLC model they are using.

I actually don't really mind games that have a ton of DLCs but all the general improvements should be rolled into the free patches.

Like... adding new content in paid DLC is fine but if you happen to fix some UI element in one of the expansions then it should be included in the free patch.


Basically anybody who has the base game has the same base functions as the person who bought all the DLCs... The DLC person just has more content (more countries, more random events, whatever).

I'm even fine with having new features locked behind paid DLC to some extent but from what I gather it really sounds like some basic QoL improvements are coming with some of the DLCs and this is BS...

A new player should note be "forced" to buy all the DLCs to have the right experience.


This is a very dodgy and oversimplified example but I see it a bit like racing games that have car packs (like Forza for example)... You need to buy the DLCs to be able to buy and drive those cars but the patches still includes all those cars so that you can see other players using them while in multiplayer.

I don't really have a problem with them locking new mechanics behind a DLC (as long as they aren't removing features from the base game which they have actually done several times in the past). But having a game with 8+ expansions all full of minor iterative features just gets ridiculous. Anything older than 2 years should just be part of the base game the same way that World of Warcraft no longer requires you to buy every single expansion throughout its history anymore. Selling a new player EU4 without even Art of War's features is ridiculous.

 

[Megasoum]

I don't really have a problem with them locking new mechanics behind a DLC (as long as they aren't removing features from the base game which they have actually done several times in the past). But having a game with 8+ expansions all full of minor iterative features just gets ridiculous. Anything older than 2 years should just be part of the base game the same way that World of Warcraft no longer requires you to buy every single expansion throughout its history anymore.

Yeah for sure...

Like if we take the current example... I'm really not sure I would love the game (like I said in my first post I'm still super intimidated by the game lol) so I don't necessarly want to drop like 50-60$ to get the base game with 2-3 DLCs but at the same time I feel like just getting the base game for 12$ might not give me the true picture of what the game actually is.

I bet that at my level the base game would still be more than enough but anyway... It's psychological.

 

[Mgoblue201]

I agree that Paradox makes it unnecessarily confusing, with paid features randomly strewn throughout the various expansions. However, I disagree with the most common complaint that the price of entry is too steep. Even if one bought nothing but the base game, it's still a perfectly playable experience. Most customers either don't look beyond the total price tag or they are still in the mindset that every expansion must be essential to play the game. It's difficult to communicate that much of the content that's been developed for the game is available for free without the expansions.

I suspect that as long as EU4's daily player base remains strong and the expansions continue to sell, Paradox won't deviate from their current policy. CK2, despite five years of development time and $250 of DLC, doesn't show many signs of falling off either (CK2 expansions might also be easier to understand, since much more than EU4, they're built around a single theme). However, I do agree that we've already reached the point where EU4 expansions are unwieldy and Paradox should do more to consolidate them.

I guess it's a bit of the nature of the beast with that kind of game but I don't like the DLC model they are using.

I actually don't really mind games that have a ton of DLCs but all the general improvements should be rolled into the free patches.

Like... adding new content in paid DLC is fine but if you happen to fix some UI element in one of the expansions then it should be included in the free patch.

Most of that is included in the free patches. However, there's bound to be some disagreement over what should what should be free and what should be in the expansion. Transfer occupation is the most egregious example. It is such a fundamental part of the game now that there's no reason it should be an expansion feature. The army builder also probably should have been a free feature.

 

[Megasoum]

I agree that Paradox makes it unnecessarily confusing, with paid features randomly strewn throughout the various expansions. However, I disagree with the most common complaint that the price of entry is too steep. Even if one bought nothing but the base game, it's still a perfectly playable experience. Most customers either don't look beyond the total price tag or they are still in the mindset that every expansion must be essential to play the game. It's difficult to communicate that much of the content that's been developed for the game is available for free without the expansions.

I suspect that as long as EU4's daily player base remains strong and the expansions continue to sell, Paradox won't deviate from their current policy. CK2, despite five years of development time and $250 of DLC, doesn't show many signs of falling off either (CK2 expansions might also be easier to understand, since much more than EU4, they're built around a single theme). However, I do agree that we've already reached the point where EU4 expansions are unwieldy and Paradox should do more to consolidate them.

Most of that is included in the free patches. However, there's bound to be some disagreement over what should what should be free and what should be in the expansion. Transfer occupation is the most egregious example. It is such a fundamental part of the game now that there's no reason it should be an expansion feature. The army builder also probably should have been a free feature.

Yeah... Shits gets confusing

In the meantime I'm playing some Stellaris.... Those early game Fallen Empires can be real bitch... I'm still early game and have 1 fleet of about 400 attack power (had a bit of trouble get my cash to flow early one)...

My neighbor just declared war and jumped right onto my home system

The dude has 1 titan, 20 Battlecruisers and 3 escort ships...

I have 2 Destroyers and 6 Corvettes haha

I'm just gonna unpause and watch my whole civilization gets wiped out of the galaxy

 

[Megasoum]

Welp... So I just bought:

Europa Universalis IV Conquest Collection

+

Art of war bundle (expansion plus content pack)

+

Common Sense bundle (expansion plus content packs)


For a grand total of something like 45$ CDN which is not too bad for the game, the 2 expansions and like 20 smaller packs.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Welp... So I just bought:

Europa Universalis IV Conquest Collection

+

Art of war bundle (expansion plus content pack)

+

Common Sense bundle (expansion plus content packs)


For a grand total of something like 45$ CDN which is not too bad for the game, the 2 expansions and like 20 smaller packs.

You should definitely get your money's worth in hours played. Welcome.

 

[Forerunner]

Czechoslovakia is difficult. First thing I did was the fort tech tree and did the typical three rows of inf and arty. After that I spammed even more forts. I invited both Yugoslavia and Romania into my faction. Germany still ran us over.

 

[Megasoum]

Is there a good way to scale the UI up in EU4?

I found the GUI scale setting in the settings.txt file which kinda works but the UI looks terrible when scaled up.

Everything is so small with the default UI in 1440p!

 

[Omikron]

I am just used to the UI scale @ 1440p and honestly don't mind it at all... I am using the Stellaris font mod, which I think improves the overall readability quite a lot.


Meanwhile in my most recent game, the new Siberian Frontier thing is super OP for custom nations starting in the Americas. Think I am going to polish off a few of those custom nation achievements that I got close to finishing another time, but screwed up because I am terrible at video games.

 

[hobblygobbly]

In my endless games I've never seen Castile and Portugal fall on such hard times to Morocco, lol.

 

[Vinter]

Played around with Muscovy in the new expansion and they are really powerful. Honestly feel like they could add some more disasters or more unrest events, because you have to be really careless to fuck up as it is now. Playing other nations you can see Muscovy blobbing like crazy in every game.

 

[Mgoblue201]

I wonder if Paradox changed something about HOI4's diplomacy. I was playing as Yugoslavia and kept receiving ominous popups about how Britain and Germany might interfere if I maintained my neutral foreign policy. And then within days of each other both nations declared war, even though I was guaranteed by the Soviet Union. From the Allies perspective the decision doesn't make any sense. And if I can hold out against the Axis (which will be difficult), the Soviets might succeed in taking Berlin. Either way, Germany shouldn't start a war with the Soviet Union just to attack Yugoslavia. I'm not sure what the AI logic is there.

 

[DrSlek]

I've set myself a goal in my current game of CK2.

Start as Gotland and create a norse merchant republic. If you wont trade, we'll raid.

 

[ag-my001]

I've set myself a goal in my current game of CK2.

Start as Gotland and create a norse merchant republic. If you wont trade, we'll raid.

I like doing the same as Denmark. Tons of coastline, holy site, and kingdom level title all in one. Have fun raiding Rome and Venice repeatedly.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

I wonder if Paradox changed something about HOI4's diplomacy. I was playing as Yugoslavia and kept receiving ominous popups about how Britain and Germany might interfere if I maintained my neutral foreign policy. And then within days of each other both nations declared war, even though I was guaranteed by the Soviet Union. From the Allies perspective the decision doesn't make any sense. And if I can hold out against the Axis (which will be difficult), the Soviets might succeed in taking Berlin. Either way, Germany shouldn't start a war with the Soviet Union just to attack Yugoslavia. I'm not sure what the AI logic is there.

I think it's scripted events with AI weights attached for Yugoslavia in particular. No changes to the actual diplomacy systems more broadly.

 

[KingSnake]

It's scripted. Playing as The Netherlands, going Communist and joining Comintern and Germany still attacks you well before normally breaking the Ribbentrop-Molotov treaty.

 

[Mgoblue201]

Do those events only appear if I'm neutral? Will they not trigger if I join the Comintern?

 

[RedSparrows]

In my endless games I've never seen Castile and Portugal fall on such hard times to Morocco, lol.

Wow. This is why i love EUIV.

 

[KingSnake]

Do those events only appear if I'm neutral? Will they not trigger if I join the Comintern?

I have to try for Yugoslavia, but for The Netherlands they trigger unless you're actually allied with Germany.

 

[Mr. Luchador]

A lot of my goodwill for Paradox has gone out of the window after the terrible reason for their price hikes in the last few months.

 

[jtb]

China doesn't have a focus tree? That sucks.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

China doesn't have a focus tree? That sucks.

Only the seven major nations plus Poland had custom ones at launch. Others added with dlc packs. China is almost certainly in the next pack.

If you're desperate, grab one from the steam workshop.

 

[Forerunner]

Yeah, the next DLC is supposedly going to be Asia focused. So I’d imagine China is going to get a lot of focus in it.

After that I’d probably say they would do Scandinavian DLC (Denmark, Sweden, Norway, and Finland). Or they could do a Mediterranean DLC (Greece, Turkey, Bulgaria, and focus more on the war in North Africa).

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

I don't think they've explicitly said Asia focus, but when they showed popularity statistics the RoC and PRC are both high up there and people clearly want it. Now that allies and euro minors have been fine it's obviously the next place to go.

 

[Zeknurn]

Yeah it's a no-brainer. China was an interesting area during the second world war and it makes sense to focus on it.

 

[Purkake4]

I'd see a South America one somewhere between there.

Also Africa and Middle East at some point.