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[Marty Chinn]

Apparently there has been a large number of bannings recently and nobody has figured out why yet. Theories are all over the place from comparing serial numbers with hdds, to looking at save files. It's just sorta freaky right now with how it's going on. Check the forums at Xbox Scene for more info. Anyone run into such a recent banning? Sorta surprised this topic hasn't been brought up here yet.

 

[Lyte Edge]

Apparently there has been a large number of bannings recently and nobody has figured out why yet. Theories are all over the place from comparing serial numbers with hdds, to looking at save files. It's just sorta freaky right now with how it's going on. Check the forums at Xbox Scene for more info. Anyone run into such a recent banning? Sorta surprised this topic hasn't been brought up here yet.

I read somewhere (Gamefaqs I think...so it was hard to believe but had me paranoid) that Microsoft found a way to check Xbox HDs for Halo 2 and/or Halo 2 save files. It would be interesting to know if all of the people that got banned just so happened to have Halo 2 or not.

If I ever get banned from Live, I may just buy a used Xbox instead of an EEPROM so I don't have to worry about it...

 

[Marty Chinn]

In the forum, there was a post mentioning they didn't have Halo 2 and still got banned. But most of the posts don't mention if they do or not.

 

[Lyte Edge]

In the forum, there was a post mentioning they didn't have Halo 2 and still got banned. But most of the posts don't mention if they do or not.

Interesting. I was just online tonight downloading the Ninja Gaiden Hurricane Packs and didn't have any problems myself.

 

[Jonnyram]

Call me paranoid, but this is precisely the reason why I bought a separate Xbox for modding. There's no way I would try to go online with a modded machine, regardless of how stealthy the chip is supposed to be.

 

[bobbyconover]

This is precisely the reason I haven't bought Xbox Live, too. If they're gonna force us to choose between modding and online play, my mind is SO made-up.

 

[Fowler]

My uncle was banned a few days ago. I assumed it was because he was stupid, didn't have a hardware switch on his mod and logged on to Live with the mod on, but hey, maybe he wasn't stupid. I doubt it though. (And for the record, he does not have Halo 2)

I've been playing online a lot recently though and no problems here. I hope I haven't jinxed my Xbox though

 

[impirius]

Nice of them to do that while there's still time for me to return this Live subscription card.

Meh.

Halo 2 XLink, anyone?

 

[boredJonathan]

The folks over at Xbox-Scene have been running a bunch of different tests to see if they could narrow down what was making the XBL service ban people all of a sudden. In general it seems that if you had a ban on your GamerTag in the past they either just outright banning you again, or they have some way of searching your hard drive. Another theory floating around is that there is some way for them to monitor something called the LPC which I guess would tip them off to the mod chip being there, even if it is not turned on.

AS for having Halo 2 saves/game on your system.. it's probably not a good idea if you are going on live since no one really knows what is going on.

And hey, it's their service, and definately the best solution for online gaming if you ask me, so if my box gets banned for having a chip (and nothing else), then I'll just pick up another box. I have gotten to attached to being able to dump video files and run old school emulators on the box to give that up. And getting a seperate box just rules any chance of getting banned out. All I would be curious of is if I could still keep my Gamertag that I have had since beta if they banned it.

 

[Barnimal]

i dont see how pirates can complain about getting banned from LIVE. its ok for you to steal from MS and 3rd parties but they can't steal back from you right? idiots.

 

[M3wThr33]

An easy check would be to download and try to execute an unsigned program. If it runs, it'll set a flag to ban at the next sign on.

Of course, that's just one way to check it.

 

[Marty Chinn]

i dont see how pirates can complain about getting banned from LIVE. its ok for you to steal from MS and 3rd parties but they can't steal back from you right? idiots.

For the millionth time....

MODDING != PIRACY

 

[Bebpo]

For the millionth time....

MODDING != PIRACY

This is true, but I do think the % of people with Xbox mods who pirate games is a lot higher than any system since DC.

 

[johnjohnson]

For the millionth time....

MODDING != PIRACY

But modding is very close to piracy. And if one has save files of halo 2 on his hdd that guy's a pirate and has no rights to complain.

 

[Yusaku]

Anyone who thinks modding is akin to piracy clearly has never laid eyes upon the Xbox Media Center (which I just made my new dashboard). Right now my Xbox is streaming live video from some Japanese radio station.

 

[boredJonathan]

But modding is very close to piracy. And if one has save files of halo 2 on his hdd that guy's a pirate and has no rights to complain.

I don't think anyone would argue against that. But unfortunately it is a grey area, and not black and white. I think that is what gets people on the defensive. You can have your box modded and seriously not be doing anything illegal.

 

[impirius]

Owning two VCRs is close to piracy... DUN DUN DUNNNNNNNNNNNN

 

[johnjohnson]

I don't think anyone would argue against that. But unfortunately it is a grey area, and not black and white. I think that is what gets people on the defensive. You can have your box modded and seriously not be doing anything illegal.

Sure, but how high is the percentage of ppl modding their console only for playing legit imports? 1%? Or is it even less?

Or is there any other legal thing that can be done with a modded xbox?

 

[johnjohnson]

Owning two VCRs is close to piracy... DUN DUN DUNNNNNNNNNNNN

Isn't there some sort of copy protection (macrovision?) on vhs? Of course if you have a device that overrides this copy protection between the two VCRs it is extremely close to piracy.

 

[Jonnyram]

Or is there any other legal thing that can be done with a modded xbox?

Well all the following activities are probably in legal grey areas anyway, but:
- emulation
- media playback
- home development
- HDD installation/playback of bought games

 

[thorns]

Modding IS piracy. Nobody would bother with developing or buying modchips:

1.) If they couldn't play pirated xbox games.
2.) If they couldn't play pirated movies
3.) If they couldn'tt play pirated music
4.) If they couldn't play pirated ROMs

and just because YOU are the odd-one that doesn't do ANY of the above doesn't mean the 99.9% of the modders don't do it. The reason why modding is so popular IS piracy.

 

[boredJonathan]

Sure, but how high is the percentage of ppl modding their console only for playing legit imports? 1%? Or is it even less?

Or is there any other legal thing that can be done with a modded xbox?

Have you ever heard of XBMC? (XBox Media Center) It rocks. Remember how a year or two back, and hell even now, people are talking about having this set top box that lets you watch videos and play games, and will be magically linked to your PC, (and really act like a PC it self)? That is what XBMC is.

Lets use a perfectly legit answer. Red vs. Blue. Instead of watching the video on my monitor, which is obviously at a higher resolution, I FTP into my box and dump the video to XBMC. Takes seconds since it's on my homenetwork. I then turn on my modded XBox and sit down on my couch and watch the latest Red vs. Blue with a decent sound system, and on a faily nice TV. A much better situation if you ask me. Plus, you can set it up as a media server, so instead of playing all of my iTunes collection I can stream them to my box running XBMC and again have them playing through a nice sound system.

I havn't fooled around with this, but other dashboards have IRC clients built in, and stream internet radio stations, along with getting RSS feeds.

I honestly think that you'd be surpised how many people do not used their modded XBox to do illegal things. Of course there is the ability, and of course people do it. But to say that there is hardly any legitimate reason to mod your XBox is a bit short sighted.

 

[impirius]

The best reason to have a modded Xbox: http://www.xboxmediacenter.com/
It'll play anything you throw at it. It can play off the hard drive, from a disc, or even streaming from a computer on your home network. It's such a beautiful piece of software!

As far as Macrovision goes, you're right for VCRs sold in mid-2001 or later, but selling VCRs that weren't hosed by Macrovision wasn't made illegal until the DMCA.

 

[Midas]

Hmm, that's weird. Why cant I download XBMC from their hompage...?

 

[boredJonathan]

Hmm, that's weird. Why cant I download XBMC from their hompage...?

Um.. did you click on FILES???

 

[border]

XBMC is technically illegal software anyway, since it was more-than-likely made with an unlicensed Xbox Development Kit. That's why you can't download it from anywhere other than IRC or Torrents.

Modding also allows people to play DVDs in progressive scan, or play DVDs from other regions....two other semi-legit uses. As long as people aren't trying to run hacked/pirated versions of games (or hacked savegames), I don't think that they should be banned. Do you think that Windows should also terminate internet access if it detects an unlicensed MP3 on your hard drive?

and just because YOU are the odd-one that doesn't do ANY of the above doesn't mean the 99.9% of the modders don't do it

Ahhhh, the sweet sound of statistics retrieved from the rectal cavity...

 

[johnjohnson]

Um.. did you click on FILES???

From their faqs:

Q: Where can I download executable binary (compiled) versions of XboxMediaCenter for Xbox?
A: Not from this site or any other site that are in affiliation with us, (don't ask us where either). (but note that yes you do need a XDK compiled/binary version of XBMC to run on it your Xbox).
We only host and maintain the XboxMediaCenter source code ( what is "source code?" (link) ).
*For legal reasons, no Xbox™ binaries will be released from us or distributed by us until a legal non-MS compiler is available (so please do not ask for any files not posted here). (Note! XDK compiled binaries are NOT released or distributed by the XboxMediaCenter team). Do not ask or e-mail us requesting any Xbox files or asking where they can be downloaded from, thanks. Note! Yes we know that there are pre-compiled versions of XBMC being distributed on internet, FTP-servers and IRC however those do not originate from us and we have no control over them, you see XBMC being an open source project means that anyone can compile and distribute it.

So the only way to have this stuff running on the Xbox is to pirate the xbox developement tools or download a compiled version from some obscure p2p that are made with pirated xbox developement tools. Doesn't exactly sound legal to me.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

XBMC is technically illegal software anyway, since it was more-than-likely made with an unlicensed Xbox Development Kit. That's why you can't download it from anywhere other than IRC or Torrents.

Modding also allows people to play DVDs in progressive scan, or play DVDs from other regions....two other semi-legit uses. As long as people aren't trying to run hacked/pirated versions of games (or hacked savegames), I don't think that they should be banned. Do you think that Windows should also terminate internet access if it detects an unlicensed MP3 on your hard drive?
Ahhhh, the sweet sound of statistics retrieved from the rectal cavity...

Well, technically speaking, the EULA (and its terms) you 'agree' to when you use an XBOX is violated once you open it up and put it to other uses. Not saying I agree with the bannings, but what else can they do? Not enforce it?

 

[MVS]

This is why I go for the:

Modded XB for offline only.
2nd XB for onlne only.

Pricey, but 0% of XBL Banning.

 

[boredJonathan]

So the only way to have this stuff running on the Xbox is to pirate the xbox developement tools or download a compiled version from some obscure p2p that are made with pirated xbox developement tools. Doesn't exactly sound legal to me.

I realize this is picking nits, but anyone can compile it, so that does not in fact mean that it was compiled illegally. Of course, I'm not naive and I realize that the majority of people are probably using code that was compiled illegally. But you'd be hard pressed to prove that the software was compiled illegally.

The software itself is legit.

 

[SantaC]

You are going to be owned by MS! lol they have new security updates.

News Wire - Xbox Live Security Updates
Luke {Hep}
19/Oct/2004


Major Nelson spoke out today about the reason behind why Xbox Live has had some scheduled maintenance lately. It seems to be Xbox Live security enhancements are causing the interruptions; at least the interruptions are worth the hassle.

This gives me more time to finish some of those cool offline games I’ve been playing anyway.

The Xbox Live team has noticed and received reports from the Xbox Live community about users connecting to the Xbox Live service using modified Xbox consoles. In most cases, these users have used the modifications to gain an unfair advantage over other players, such as racing modified, faster cars in Project Gotham Racing 2. By doing this, users are breaking the Terms of Use that must be agreed to when a gamertag is created. The Xbox Live team will not tolerate this unfair activity and have taken steps to protect our community from this cheating.

Xbox Live has recently initiated additional security measures to ensure that those connecting to Xbox Live with modified hardware will be removed from the system. Modified consoles will be banned, and information about those banned machines will be tracked to prevent them from connecting to the service again.

It’s important to the Xbox Live team that we work to provide an environment that is free of cheating and gives all players an opportunity to compete fairly online, and that's why I wanted to ensure that the community knows this. Xbox Live constantly monitors for users attempting to bypass security measures and gain unfair advantages over other players, and will take additional action as needed.


Supposedly those with modified Xbox consoles can now be detected and banned switch or no switch.

http://www.aussiexbox.com.au/templa..._id=86902498110031005&se_id=135&site_id=11003

 

[MightyHedgehog]

This is why I go for the:

Modded XB for offline only.
2nd XB for onlne only.

Pricey, but 0% of XBL Banning.

Exactly. If it's worth it to modify your system, then making a second, 'legit-usage' system purchase sounds reasonable.

 

[border]

Well, I don't recall agreeing to any sort of Xbox EULA....though maybe it's in the Live EULA. If it's in there, then they do have the right to kill your account or ban your or whatnot, but I wasn't really concerned with "rights". I just mean that it would be nice if they would let people be, so long as they weren't disrupting the fairness of Live...

 

[MightyHedgehog]

The EULA is listed (such that you have to scroll down to read it in its entirety) when you sign up for Live.

 

[johnjohnson]

I realize this is picking nits, but anyone can compile it, so that does not in fact mean that it was compiled illegally. Of course, I'm not naive and I realize that the majority of people are probably using code that was compiled illegally. But you'd be hard pressed to prove that the software was compiled illegally.

The software itself is legit.

Just a sec... the only way to compile the xbmc is by using Visual Studio .net and the official Xbox Delevoper Kit version 5778 or 5849 (it's written in their faq). While there is a small probability that a legit copy of Visual Studio .net is available to many of the guys compiling the stuff, I highly doubt many of them have a legit version of the Xbox SDK, as it is only available to Microsoft approved developers / programmers.

The source code is legit, but the compiled version?

 

[Burger]

You are all fucking saints ??

Get over it.

 

[Jonnyram]

You are going to be owned by MS! lol they have new security updates.
http://www.aussiexbox.com.au/templa..._id=86902498110031005&se_id=135&site_id=11003

Oh boy. This is great news for hardware sales

 

[boredJonathan]

JThe source code is legit, but the compiled version?

If thats true, then I would agree that the software then is illegal. Shame too cause it's an awesome program. This would then make all homebrew applications illegal... again, a shame since it's not all piracy.

 

[johnjohnson]

If thats true, then I would agree that the software then is illegal. Shame too cause it's an awesome program. This would then make all homebrew applications illegal... again, a shame since it's not all piracy.

I only report what they state on their homepage. As long as there is no legal way to make xbox binaries out of sourcecode every open source xbox project will have this problem. But, there seems to be a project underway for creating a free, legal, open sourced SDK for building xbox software.

 

[border]

They say that it is possible to make Xbox software using other compilers, but the programs don't run efficiently enough to provide proper emulation or glitch-free video playback. Unless you use an Xbox SDK compiler, you will be pretty much crippled.

The EULA is listed (such that you have to scroll down to read it in its entirety) when you sign up for Live.

Okay, that's what I was thinking. I was pretty sure that any EULA that doesn't actually require you to "Agree" (eg, agreement is implied through the opening of the box) is invalid. I don't have Live, so I never encountered any sort of standardized EULA.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Okay, that's what I was thinking. I was pretty sure that any EULA that doesn't actually require you to "Agree" (eg, agreement is implied through the opening of the box) is invalid. I don't have Live, so I never encountered any sort of standardized EULA.

Yeah. If you don't go onto Live with a modded system, I don't think there's anything to worry about. I, myself, don't have a modded system...but I will when this sucker's given up the ghost...and then continue the Live action on a new system...hopefully, that Crystal XBOX.

 

[boredJonathan]

They say that it is possible to make Xbox software using other compilers, but the programs don't run efficiently enough to provide proper emulation or glitch-free video playback. Unless you use an Xbox SDK compiler, you will be pretty much crippled.

Well then here is hoping that those compilers improve to the point to where this program can be distrubuted in a legitmate way. To attempt to tie this back into the topic at hand, I assume that is MS is doing HD scans that this means any homebrew software you had on your drive would be incentive enough to ban your tag.

Still I think it's interesting that no one has found out excatly what is tipping them off, and if there is any way around it. Some people report success with a certain setup, and others try and duplicate it to no luck. The conspiracy theorist are thinking MS is getting smart and reading the forums to find out what people are doing to circumvent their ban.

But more I am suprised that no one knows how they are finding out. Seems like it'd be pretty obvious to figure out.

 

[border]

Well, if they are just banning user accounts that previously circumvented the ban by getting a new Xbox or nw EEPROM, then it would probably seem totally cryptic and random. I don't really understand why they banned by EEPROM before, instead of banning by EEPROM and user account.

I would be curious to see what the result is for a first-time user that has a "stealth" chip, and has not added any new files to the hard drive. If they can detect that, then I would say that the battle is pretty much over. I will probably uninstall my software mod once I'm on an internet connection that will let me use Live, so I'm curious if they will be detecting and banning previous mod users.

Refurbished systems are not that expensive, but it is a pretty big hassle to have to keep and maintain two systems in your entertainment center.....particularly given the mammoth size of the Xbox.

 

[boredJonathan]

Here is the massive (16 pages!) forum topic over on xbox-scene. I've been following it on and off, and I think they are getting to the point where they think that if you just have a modchip, but really havn't touched the drives or anything that you would be fine. Time will tell though, because as I said they are doing various tests of different circumstances to see if they can narrow it down.

 

[Fowler]

So wait, when you're banned, is your Xbox banned or your Gamertag banned? In theory if I am banned the next time I play on XBL, will I need a new Xbox and a new XBL account or just a new Xbox?

 

[n3mo_toad]

Modding IS piracy. Nobody would bother with developing or buying modchips:

1.) If they couldn't play pirated xbox games.
2.) If they couldn't play pirated movies
3.) If they couldn'tt play pirated music
4.) If they couldn't play pirated ROMs

and just because YOU are the odd-one that doesn't do ANY of the above doesn't mean the 99.9% of the modders don't do it. The reason why modding is so popular IS piracy.

1.) I did it to play imported games and demos, and so I could take my legit games to LAN parties without risking destroying my discs as usually happens. I also did it for the ability to hack games like DOA3 (which is just cool), and to play around with the ton of homebrew software available. Either way, I use an entirely different system to go on LIVE, as I have no desire to cheat/get my ass banzored. I've never used XBMC, though, because it seems to complicated to install.
2.) What the heck do you think a computer is for
3.) What the heck do you think a computer is for
4.) What the heck do you think a computer is for

(2-4 are kinda a joke, btw)

Besides, does YOUR xbox start up with the GameCube's boot sequence? I bet it doesn't.

 

[boredJonathan]

So wait, when you're banned, is your Xbox banned or your Gamertag banned? In theory if I am banned the next time I play on XBL, will I need a new Xbox and a new XBL account or just a new Xbox?

Before it used to be just the EEPROM of the Harddrive. You could nab one of those from various places and replcae the EEPROM and you'd be good to go. Seems now though that if you are getting several bans against you that they eventually just block the GameTag. I don't think someone has tried to take one of these completely banned accounts to a fresh box, so it might just be that they are banning something unchangeable in the box.

 

[Yusaku]

Lets use a perfectly legit answer. Red vs. Blue. Instead of watching the video on my monitor, which is obviously at a higher resolution, I FTP into my box and dump the video to XBMC. Takes seconds since it's on my homenetwork.

Why not just put it on a Samba shared folder and stream it from your Xbox?

 

[boredJonathan]

Why not just put it on a Samba shared folder and stream it from your Xbox?

Actually I do.

For the sake of example, although reading it again in context it does not make much sense to say it then, I wanted to include that I could FTP into my XBox using XBMC. But you are right, the shared folder is a much easier option.

 

[Yusaku]

Well, technically speaking, the EULA (and its terms) you 'agree' to when you use an XBOX is violated once you open it up and put it to other uses. Not saying I agree with the bannings, but what else can they do? Not enforce it?

There's soft-modding.