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[The Faceless Master]

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[MightyHedgehog]

I personally don't care all that much about modding (they're going to do it somehow, sometime)...but when people use this shit to cheat on Live, I say ban those fuckers, their GTs, their XBOXes, and their right to fuck with people. That shit can stay on the PC. Part of the reasoning for forking out $50 for a year of Live service is to ensure, as much as humanly possible, that cheating is non-existent..and if it does pop up, then eliminate the problem.

 

[mrklaw]

In most cases, these users have used the modifications to gain an unfair advantage over other players, such as racing modified, faster cars in Project Gotham Racing 2. By doing this, users are breaking the Terms of Use that must be agreed to when a gamertag is created

What about all the people using Action replays, and creating or downloading saves with faster cars etc? MS going to ban all of those too?

I don't see the point of two xboxes though. Up to now you'd have been fine on live with a switch, and you can buy plenty of bioses for the price of another xbox. Its not like banning stops you from using your xbox offline, or over a LAN.

 

[thorns]

What about all the people using Action replays, and creating or downloading saves with faster cars etc? MS going to ban all of those too?

I don't see the point of two xboxes though. Up to now you'd have been fine on live with a switch, and you can buy plenty of bioses for the price of another xbox. Its not like banning stops you from using your xbox offline, or over a LAN.

You can't "cheat" with action replay, you can just unlock all the cars and tracks in the game, you can't have cars going faster than their intended speed.

 

[boredJonathan]

I personally don't care all that much about modding (they're going to do it somehow, sometime)...but when people use this shit to cheat on Live, I say ban those fuckers, their GTs, their XBOXes, and their right to fuck with people. That shit can stay on the PC. Part of the reasoning for forking out $50 for a year of Live service is to ensure, as much as humanly possible, that cheating is non-existent..and if it does pop up, then eliminate the problem.

IAWTP

Point by point, that is excatly how I feel

 

[The Faceless Master]

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[johnjohnson]

Please, don't tell me there was/is a way to play on Xbox Live with a pirate version of games! This guy has an official/lecit built, right? Please, tell me it is so!

 

[Yusaku]

well, that's what happens when people figure out how to get on xbox live with bootleg games and then do things like race around in 6 speed manual transmission 300mph mini coopers and do stuff like ... should i even mention what was probably the straw that broke the camel's back?

No one has EVER gotten on Live with backups.

 

[boredJonathan]

Damn it.. I seriously hope that is a GT of someone from Bungie.

November 9th can not come soon enough. All of this leak shit has made the wait that much more unbearable. (In terms of gaming at least.)

 

[The Faceless Master]

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[Yusaku]

Prove it.

Obviously there was a retail Halo 2 out there for the backup to exist. It's just as likely there are other people with retail copies (in France or where-ever).

 

[Funky Papa]

You can use a modchip to upload files to your Xbox in order to modify data stored on the HDD and then play the game with a legal copy. Cheating on Xbox Live exists, but fortunately is very far away from the one that's played daily on any online PC game (I have yet to see a cheater with my own eyes)

 

[The Faceless Master]

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[Subitai]

The Xbox is your hardware, but XBL is a community system. I'd rather have MS being heavy handed and closing as many doors to hackers as possible rather than trying to accomadate a handful innocent modders.

 

[Yusaku]

no, you prove i'm lying...
how do you modify cars in project gotham?
oh wait, there are relatively simple text .ini files that you can edit that contain stuff like gear ratios etc...

BUT WAIT, HOW CAN YOU MODIFY FILES ON THE GAME DISK

oh, that's right, you'd have to make a copy of it and edit that!

next?

Funky Papa's idea is a lot more believable than people getting on Live with backups.

I don't really care either way. $150 for a second Xbox is still a small price to pay for XBMC.

 

[The Faceless Master]

well, from the looks of that xbox scene thread, they seem to have figured out with a reasonable amount of certainty that MS was banning based on them recording your hard drive's serial number and linking it to the eeprom data, and if one changed but not the other, you get banned... so you have to change your eeprom if you change hard drives, or vice versa...

 

[The Faceless Master]

~

 

[Apharmd Battler]

No offense, but this is why I have a seperate modded XBox that never has or will be connected to XBL. I saw something like this coming a LONG time ago. People who are complaining, are you surprised. Heck think two steps ahead and you KNOW what's next. They'll start putting code in retail games to check the internal workings of your XBox as well. I always envisioned the day where you buy a game ad it updates the dash automatically, or checks the system and gives an error message either banning you from XBL, or making the game inoperable on your console. Remember the demo of Star Wars Battlefront that shipped with the Star Wars trilogy DVD box set? Hmmmmm.

I mean, I know there are cool reasons for owning a modded XBox (XBMC, emulators, etc.). But we all know the MAIN reason why people mod consoles in the first place? So you can complain abut it all you like, but I for one like the fact that M$ is actively protecting their interests and maintianing the security and integrity of the XBL network. I'm sure everyone has read the license agreement in the dashboard (i kid, i kid).

My personal suggestion is that you have seperate consoles for XBL and modding. If you don't havethat kinda loot, then you've got a decision to make.

 

[borghe]

But we all know the MAIN reason why people mod consoles in the first place?

Yet another amazingly ignorant response.

Let me clue in the f***ing clueless... the MAIN reason I modded my XBox is because I could turn it into a HTPC. An HTPC for $150 is a STEAL. Furthermore, an HTPC that can do 1080i to my HDTV.

How many legit games have I played on my xbox in almost three years: 3
How many pirated games have I played on my xbox in 3 years: 0
How many hours of fansubbed anime have I watched on my xbox in just 6 months: hundreds

believe it or not you f***ing numbskulls, people mod their xboxes for reasons OTHER than piracy.

now while I do agree that hurting the few people who really don't care about piracy to thwart the pirates and hackers DOES make sense from a business sense, can we stop with the modding = piracy talk already. the business strategy DOES make sense but there are some people who WILL be screwed over that don't deserve to be.

 

[jedimike]

Well, I'm pulling my chip and hard drive tonight. I enjoy my XBL more than anything I can do with my mod. 90% of the time, I boot into the original bios anyway.

 

[borghe]

Well, I'm pulling my chip and hard drive tonight. I enjoy my XBL more than anything I can do with my mod. 90% of the time, I boot into the original bios anyway.

have you switched your bios or your hard drive? if not I probably wouldn't pull the chip.. this basically just sounds like a way to go after systems that have already been banned for modding.

 

[jedimike]

have you switched your bios or your hard drive? if not I probably wouldn't pull the chip.. this basically just sounds like a way to go after systems that have already been banned for modding.

yah, I have a 120GB hard drive in there now... never messed with the original bios though.

 

[Vark]

"How many hours of fansubbed anime have I watched on my xbox in just 6 months: hundreds"

IIRC isn't that in of itself a legal gray area?

 

[Shompola]

Yet another amazingly ignorant response.

Let me clue in the f***ing clueless... the MAIN reason I modded my XBox is because I could turn it into a HTPC. An HTPC for $150 is a STEAL. Furthermore, an HTPC that can do 1080i to my HDTV.

How many legit games have I played on my xbox in almost three years: 3
How many pirated games have I played on my xbox in 3 years: 0
How many hours of fansubbed anime have I watched on my xbox in just 6 months: hundreds

believe it or not you f***ing numbskulls, people mod their xboxes for reasons OTHER than piracy.

now while I do agree that hurting the few people who really don't care about piracy to thwart the pirates and hackers DOES make sense from a business sense, can we stop with the modding = piracy talk already. the business strategy DOES make sense but there are some people who WILL be screwed over that don't deserve to be.

I have friends, friends of friends etc who get mod chip for ONE reason only. That is to play pirated games. For them emu and shit is just a bonus. A great majority of people with moddes xboxes use them for pirated games. So MS doesn't give a shit if 0.001% of modded pc's don't run A SINGLE pirated application and why should they? What the fuck do they owe you anyway.

 

[Kon Tiki]

heh, I use softmod and 2 hdds. One for the softmod and a virgin one for XBL. No way they can get me, since the softmod one is blocked from the network.

 

[borghe]

"How many hours of fansubbed anime have I watched on my xbox in just 6 months: hundreds"

IIRC isn't that in of itself a legal gray area?

technically yes, but practically no. fansubbed anime that isn't licensed for distribution in the US is perfectly fine, even if not 100% legal (like 99% legal). The problem comes from that you can't technically break a copyright in a country that isn't covered by the copyright. When an anime is licensed for US distribution, then it is 100% illegal to download even fansubs of that anime.. luckily there are wonderful anime like Naruto with over 100 episodes (and formerly One Piece and Slam Dunk before those were licensed).

I have friends, friends of friends etc who get mod chip for ONE reason only. That is to play pirated games. For them emu and shit is just a bonus. A great majority of people with moddes xboxes use them for pirated games. So MS doesn't give a shit if 0.001% of modded pc's don't run A SINGLE pirated application and why should they? What the fuck do they owe you anyway.

yeah, and you don't, right? :\

as for what they owe me, it is quite simple really.. the ability to play on live without worry of being banned simply because I choose to use my xbox for other legal and non-XBL service violating uses. And paying $200 for the system and $50/year for the service, you are damn straight that they owe that to me.

 

[suikodan]

This is why I go for the:

Modded XB for offline only.
2nd XB for onlne only.

Pricey, but 0% of XBL Banning.

I have the same situation but my 2nd Xbox's DVD drive works like shit. It always freeze, even online.

 

[Nerevar]

This is precisely the reason I haven't bought Xbox Live, too. If they're gonna force us to choose between modding and online play, my mind is SO made-up.

IAWTP.

Not like xbox live could compete with my PC online anyway.

 

[The Faceless Master]

technically yes, but practically no. fansubbed anime that isn't licensed for distribution in the US is perfectly fine, even if not 100% legal (like 99% legal). The problem comes from that you can't technically break a copyright in a country that isn't covered by the copyright. When an anime is licensed for US distribution, then it is 100% illegal to download even fansubs of that anime.. luckily there are wonderful anime like Naruto with over 100 episodes (and formerly One Piece and Slam Dunk before those were licensed).


yeah, and you don't, right? :\

as for what they owe me, it is quite simple really.. the ability to play on live without worry of being banned simply because I choose to use my xbox for other legal and non-XBL service violating uses. And paying $200 for the system and $50/year for the service, you are damn straight that they owe that to me.

so by that logic, would that mean it's okay to download a game that's only licensed in japan?

 

[Hellraizah]

Those of you proning the Xbox Media Center as 100% legal, can you please point out what type of music and/or videos you are playing on this ?

If you got the rights for the video, it's that you bought the VHS or DVD, and please, you all know that the videos you listen to are downloaded and thus, illegal, since it's copyrighted material you didn't pay for. If you DO have the DVD in hand, though, why don't you just listen to it normally instead of going from your PC to the Xbox ?

And emulation isn't legal. It doesn't become legal because the game has been out for X couple of years. Once again, for emulation to be legal, you have to own the rights for the games, and if you do (means that you have bought and own these games), why don't you play them directly on the console they were meant to be played ?

On Microsoft's part, they have to rights to restrain someone from using a service they offer if the person in question isn't using it the way they want him to use it.

 

[DaCocoBrova]

Who the fuck cares!!?

People mod their sh!t... Big deal! Why do these threads always end up on some Modders VS. Morality Police shit?!

That said, I finally got HDLoader to work on my PS2 this weekend. All done w/ over the counter sh!t (thumb drive and Action Replay MAX). Life is grand.

 

[Pfucata]

It's not "modders" versus "morality police here" -- if you mod, then accept that you're not allowed to play on Xbox Live. It's everybody who thinks they deserve to play XBL even though they've made their mod...

1) We've shown that XBMC is illegal in binaryform
2) To my knowledge, the only legal HTPC use for the Xbox would be the Friendtech Media Center:

http://xbox.upgrade123.com/article39.html

but no one uses it because it replaces your BIOS too.

 

[Kon Tiki]

If you DO have the DVD in hand, though, why don't you just listen to it normally instead of going from your PC to the Xbox ?

Same reason we put games on the hdd, easy access. I have ripped most of my dvds to divx so I can watch them from the hdd with easy. Only use the DVDs when I want to see the extras.

 

[Blame!]

XBMC is technically illegal software anyway, since it was more-than-likely made with an unlicensed Xbox Development Kit. That's why you can't download it from anywhere other than IRC or Torrents.

Modding also allows people to play DVDs in progressive scan, or play DVDs from other regions....two other semi-legit uses. As long as people aren't trying to run hacked/pirated versions of games (or hacked savegames), I don't think that they should be banned. Do you think that Windows should also terminate internet access if it detects an unlicensed MP3 on your hard drive?
Ahhhh, the sweet sound of statistics retrieved from the rectal cavity...

weren't you the dude with the big ass halo 2 review on opa-ages? yeah, STFU then.

 

[Kon Tiki]

Do you think that Windows should also terminate internet access if it detects an unlicensed MP3 on your hard drive?

I believe that is a feature in Longhorn.

Seriously tho, it is not interent access being denied, it is access to a service. In your example, windows would not be the termining factor but your ISP. And yes, you ISP can deny you access to there service.

 

[The Guivre]

As I flip over my Xbox and gaze at the bottom of it I notice a little note from our pals at MS. " DO NOT OPEN taking apart or modyifying the XBox may lead to electric shock, fire or damage to the XBox and void your warranty."

Perhaps they'd prefer if people didn't mess around with the XBoxes we've paid good money for. I can understand the view that the XBox is your's to do with as you please, and indeed as it's been said, some of the things you can make an XBox do are not only legal but also offer a cheaper solution to some tech needs.

I paid the original price for my Xbox so from the get go I was not cracked on the idea of doing anything to it. But from my perspective newer XBox owners are getting a much better deal. So the thought of getting a second Box doesn't seem all that bad to me.

As true as some cases may be about the number of Moded but not illegally used XBoxes there's really not much more to do than gripe about it. The major gaming companies aren't really renowned for their great understanding of innocents caught at the wrong place at the wrong time. Just ask some of the Wookies and Twi'Leks that took a swim in the vacuum of space surrounding Naboo.

I can sympathize with the people who've cracked open their boxes and all, I've got a close friend who did just that, and I know he doesn't cheat with it or any of that stuff, and I hope that he doesn't get banned. But if he does, well, I'll feel bad for him but I'm not going to march on Microsoft's head quarters with my little sign or whatever held over my head. In the end, it's been made known that mods, piracy and all that fun stuff is risky business, and as always people eventually lose whether they deserve it or not. They knew the risks and that's that.

 

[Yusaku]

^^^ Again, you don't have void your warrantee to mod the Xbox.

I always envisioned the day where you buy a game ad it updates the dash automatically, or checks the system and gives an error message either banning you from XBL, or making the game inoperable on your console. Remember the demo of Star Wars Battlefront that shipped with the Star Wars trilogy DVD box set? Hmmmmm.

There are lots of games that automatically update the dash. Every Live game for example. Van Helsing has similar content to the SW Trilogy DVD, too.

 

[xexex]

excuse me if already mentioned, and I know this might not make sense at all, but one thing that came to mind, what if some of these people had 2 or more Xbox's hooked up to their network, and one was modded. maybe MS checks to see if anyone on Xbox Live also has a modded Xbox on their network. then bans the non-modded Xbox Live box?

 

[Shompola]

Who the fuck cares!!?

People mod their sh!t... Big deal! Why do these threads always end up on some Modders VS. Morality Police shit?!

That said, I finally got HDLoader to work on my PS2 this weekend. All done w/ over the counter sh!t (thumb drive and Action Replay MAX). Life is grand.

I personally don't give a shit if someone here pirates all their games.
It's more like some modders here are crying and nagging now thanks to the new LiVE bannings. I just find it funny they sound like MS owes them anything. I don't think MS is violating anything, so stop crying people.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

excuse me if already mentioned, and I know this might not make sense at all, but one thing that came to mind, what if some of these people had 2 or more Xbox's hooked up to their network, and one was modded. maybe MS checks to see if anyone on Xbox Live also has a modded Xbox on their network. then bans the non-modded Xbox Live box?

How would they know if the other user was not logged into live? I don't think xbox's are set to take calls....

Anyway, I have a modded xbox which I banned myself on by accident, I got a new eeprom and I have a new HDD installed as well (eeprom loaded after HDD) so I'll try the login and see if I get the banning. I guess my account should be on their blacklist if that's how they are working it.

 

[DaCocoBrova]

maybe MS checks to see if anyone on Xbox Live also has a modded Xbox on their network. then bans the non-modded Xbox Live box?

That's one vulnerable network... Invasion of privacy as well.

 

[border]

maybe MS checks to see if anyone on Xbox Live also has a modded Xbox on their network. then bans the non-modded Xbox Live box?

Why would you be running two Xbox systems at the same time?

 

[Deleted member 1235]

Why would you be running two Xbox systems at the same time?

2 different people. but the idea is a bit nonsense.

It's more like some modders here are crying and nagging now thanks to the new LiVE bannings. I just find it funny they sound like MS owes them anything. I don't think MS is violating anything, so stop crying people.

Please, all modders know the deal, but it's a nuisance if you used to have a workaround that could be flawed now. Getting banned from live so close to Halo 2 would suck, of course there willl be clamouring, especially if there is a way to avoid it.

 

[Che]

Modding IS piracy. Nobody would bother with developing or buying modchips:

1.) If they couldn't play pirated xbox games.
2.) If they couldn't play pirated movies
3.) If they couldn'tt play pirated music
4.) If they couldn't play pirated ROMs

and just because YOU are the odd-one that doesn't do ANY of the above doesn't mean the 99.9% of the modders don't do it. The reason why modding is so popular IS piracy.

Many many use it to play imports you know... It really pisses me off how MS is invading our privacy to find the "evil pirates". I hope they try to do this on the computers. I'd love to see the reactions.

 

[The Faceless Master]

actually, banning so close to halo 2 is genius...

xbox-console-sales++

i mean, who wouldn't run out to buy a second xbox just for halo 2?

 

[Wario64]

Damn, guess I gotta learn how to take this chip out of my Xbox. I bought an Xbox for Halo 2 XBL alone

 

[Lyte Edge]

You'd think MS wouldn't care about Live, since you have to have legit copies of the games to play online, and everyone playing online is paying them $50 a year for the service. I don't really see the point of banning people from it, but I'm not trying to say that those of us with modded Xboxes are somehow being treated unfairly. It's just that this is so stupid since Live has nothing to do with XBox piracy.

Also, how exactly does one "cheat" on XBL anyway? I've never heard of it ever happening.

Damn, guess I gotta learn how to take this chip out of my Xbox. I bought an Xbox for Halo 2 XBL alone

I'd wait it out and see what happens before just taking all the modded stuff out. Besides, if you went online already and Microsoft is just going down a "list" of people with modded systems and banning them, it would be too late anyway.

There's been scares like this before with XBL. I just went online again today and have had no problems. We'll see what happens.

 

[The Faceless Master]

~

 

[Lyte Edge]

Again, cheating HOW? I don't mean playing online with a copied game, I mean actual in-game cheating. How has that been done...it seems impossible to do on Live.

Anyway, it seems that this whole banning thing is only applying to people that were banned in the past and got new EEPROMS. Never happened to me; I'm not going to worry about it now.

 

[Scoobert]

The MS press release says it. Theres a small group of people who know hot to cheat online in Live. They like to use hacked cars in PGR2, among other things. It seems more people know about it though. MS is trying to shut all that down before it gets out of hand.