Lysandros
Member
Okay. So is it confirmed that they removed 'nothing' from desktop variant besides cutting down L3 cache amount?
PS5 Die Shot has been revealed
- Thread starter LivingD3AD
- Start date
Thirty7ven
Banned
Guess this is what happens when you can design your architecture exclusively for gaming performance.
ethomaz
Banned
Lysandros
Member
He did, i don't agree with NXgamer on this specific case.
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ethomaz
Banned
In terms of size doesn't seems like, cache is more in line with Renoir, except that just the PS5's FPU is smaller.
ethomaz
Banned
I don't agree too... I just shared because he is guessing and not really confirming AVX256 is removed.
Locuza changed his initial guesses too.
It is more likely others parts of the FPU were reworked/removed.
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Lysandros
Member
Okay, thanks. Well, that makes sense if they removed the FADD block.
John Wick
Member
He only has selective concern.......
It is interesting that the PS5's chip layout is similar to the PS4 Pro's butterfly design and not to the vanilla PS4. This could mean that they applied what they learned designing the PS4 Pro and that a theoretical PS5 Pro needs to use completely different chip layout, making it somewhat less likely.Nice comparisons showing the die shots of last gen and current gen.
*Images not scaled to size.
John Wick
Member
They didn't swear they had those features. Maybe try listening to the video or reading the article. If you can find where he states it as a fact post it here?
FrankWza
Member
I would have an easier time believing this if they kept "most powerful console ever"and didn't change to " most powerful xbox" within a month of release.
Lysandros
Member
Yeah, maybe he just doesn't know about the later posts. I hope this won't add further fuel to misinformation.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
No, not disingenuous and not trying to victimise you. This is the bit I was referencing in your post:
I am not playing both sides and I am not trying to add fuel to the fire. I am not trying to get people to antagonise you either.
The few posts I have read from you in this thread so far have been about taking shots and the discussion, stirring the pot, waiting and hoping for fanboys to say stupid stuff to give you some amusement.
In here and elsewhere you and a few others have seemingly a clear picture of me and this kind of bullying tactic ("most disingenuous poster on GAF" is apparently one of the prizes I won there) is making That thread somewhat unwelcoming (my comments in the Xbox OT are not meant to shit it up at all, despite the point ai raised about GPU being best left to other threads despite done with not the intention I was accused of... I could have avoided that to say the least).
While those people point out how absurd those Sony Pony's are asking people for receipts to prove good faith from those accused to be concern trolls, they seem eager to believe in the "spending quite a bit of money just to have a troll system free card" which seems odd at best. Either I am lying and I do not own an XSX or I decided not to buy an Xbox One or One X al this time only to review my approach and spend quite a bit on XSX, LIVE, and games to play the two sides better?
I have not insulted you, told you to shut up, called you names, or whatever. So, you can keep such subtle bullying accusations to yourself please.
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John Wick
Member
It's funnyu how your concern only applies to one side eh?Trying to insinuate "concern trolling" , things like stupid, shut up, leave the forum and etc are being antagonistic.
Anyway, neither of you could answer why you derailed the thread to be about the xsx die which we saw almost a year ago. Nice job deflecting
Well, AVX256 is just a guess and pure speculation (and the first logical thing that comes to my mind if you have a fixed power target), but there are also other 256-bit instructions on an AMD CPU, not just AVX256
Just as an example: 128-bit and 256-bit VPX Instructions (amd.com) but actually, FMA4 was removed with Zen ^^
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DJ12
Member
Terms like RDNA 3 features, is putting the cart before the horse, maybe he should've said this PS5 feature is likely to appear in RDNA 3, maybe that could've been more palatable to you (I doubt it)
But click bait videos aside, and you obviously haven't watched any of them, he indicated every one of the things you mentioned was a rumour and to be taken with a pinch of salt.
What I imagine happened is he reached out to ask his sources why PS5 was outperforming the Series X and got a few guesses in return. Hardly worth burning him at the stake for really. But whatever fits the narrative you've built for yourself.
Iced Arcade
Member
It's doing pretty good considering 
ResilientBanana
Member
So the Zen 3 rumors were bullshit? I'm shocked.
John Wick
Member
It's funny how your concern only applies to one side eh? Your subtle attempts at being neutral make you even more of a warriorTrying to insinuate "concern trolling" , things like stupid, shut up, leave the forum and etc are being antagonistic.
Anyway, neither of you could answer why you derailed the thread to be about the xsx die which we saw almost a year ago. Nice job deflecting
John Wick
Member
He gets everything from Locuza and then tries to spin as though he's the brains
Rea
Member
You're welcome, i can't stand some people are spreading FUD, from which they heard was someone else's guess and take it to their hearts like a "Second coming".
Garani
Member
Pretty much any rumor was bullshit. And now we see that everything said by Cerny during the talk is actually in there., Surprise!
TheTechnician
Banned
side note here - Locuza is one of the good guys. If he delivered ammo for either of the Fanboys it was 100% unintentional - if anything he gave the Sony camp some ammo by soing his latest "Xbox X = RDNA2 ? Video..
because he discovered that not every aspüect of their chip is full rdna2.
This thread is too funny, probably 2 or 3 of the people in it rightly know what the fuck they're talking about the rest have their tartans and war paint on screaming "MY COMPANY'S(which I'm not monetarily invested in I simply BOUGHT the machine) MACHINE IS BETTER".
it doesn't even matter what this die has or doesn't have, all that matters is what the developers use.
People talking about semantics in advertising, it's hilarious.
People raisin their blood pressure over a fucking black and white picture.
The die shot is blue and black, but does anyone else see a little bit of gold maybe a touch of white? Maybe it's the lighting?
it doesn't even matter what this die has or doesn't have, all that matters is what the developers use.
People talking about semantics in advertising, it's hilarious.
People raisin their blood pressure over a fucking black and white picture.
The die shot is blue and black, but does anyone else see a little bit of gold maybe a touch of white? Maybe it's the lighting?
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3liteDragon
Member
LiquidRex
Member
I think the cut in FPUs is understandable as that's why there's the GE, again when Sony designed the PlayStation 1 they decided that having FPU processor was just a waste, as FPUs are for complex calculations such as statistical analysis, but for 3D Graphic processing it's time consuming due to the complexity and thus they omitted it completely. So to get those fancy graphics on screen fast, they engineered the Geometry Transformation Engine, which performed less complex math calculations very fast. (Hint: the GTE also had some light calculation functions) 
But this is my take on it, I'm just learning.
But this is my take on it, I'm just learning.
ethomaz
Banned
FPU was a waste in PS1 era... after all we were coming from 2D to very simple 3D models.I think the cut in FPUs is understandable as that's why there's the GE, again when Sony designed the PlayStation 1 they decided that having FPU processor was just a waste, as FPUs are for complex calculations such as statistical analysis, but for 3D Graphic processing it's time consuming due to the complexity and thus they omitted it completely. So to get those fancy graphics on screen fast, they engineered the Geometry Transformation Engine, which performed less complex math calculations very fast. (Hint: the GTE also had some light calculation functions)
But this is my take on it, I'm just learning.
Game development changed and FPU is pretty much used today... Cerny even highlighted the use of native AVX256.
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Lysandros
Member
For God's sake Michael Cerny already confirmed native AVX-256 extensions in Road to PS5.
Edit: Native thus not "2x128-bit", it has to be 1x256-bit (at the very same 256-bit FPU width) in order to be considered native. Someone correct me if i am mistaken.
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Quake I's feats included being one of the first complex games requiring the use of an FPU so that tells you how new it all was. PS2's GS still has remnants of that fixed point past too.I think the cut in FPUs is understandable as that's why there's the GE, again when Sony designed the PlayStation 1 they decided that having FPU processor was just a waste, as FPUs are for complex calculations such as statistical analysis, but for 3D Graphic processing it's time consuming due to the complexity and thus they omitted it completely. So to get those fancy graphics on screen fast, they engineered the Geometry Transformation Engine, which performed less complex math calculations very fast. (Hint: the GTE also had some light calculation functions)
But this is my take on it, I'm just learning.
alabtrosMyster
Member
So now we know, the PS5 doesn't even do math!
Lysandros
Member
Maybe it's just better at literature.
Garani
Member
It's magical!
LiquidRex
Member
So the cut is the FADD, I'm still learning so what is FADD & could the cut be related to the GE.... I'm sure Cerny wouldn't remove features that would hinder performance/improve it.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
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splattered
Member
So basically what this seems to boil down to is what i got banned in the speculation thread for saying... PS5 is more based off of RDNA1 architecture and was ready for release probably at least a year before XSX... PS5 tools had MUCH more time to mature. XSX was waiting for more RDNA2 features to implement so tools are way behind. Hence why we are seeing PS5 keeping up at the moment. Once XSX hits its full stride and the tools have a chance to mature more it very well may had an advantage period moving forward. *tooools
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
I am not sure it is saying that though.
NXGamer
Member
I never said removed, I was discussing the entire Pipeline instruction for this or other areas of instruction sets.
This the danger of these discussions and getting hung up on what ends up in Custom Silicon, the cuts, changes, additions all aim to deliver on the ever present compromises the team need.
Supporting AVX2 extensions is fine, but it likely will not support all as per Zen2 OR at the same rate, the fact is that will be a known entity from the Architects and it will still deliver on what it needs as a games Console. The funny element here is the "perceived" fear of the PS5 not having full desktop Zen 2 which was never on the cards.
Outrunner
Member
What did you win, son? Did you win the console wars? Will make sure to write about on my book about the brave soldiers that fought keyboard war about what toy had the better specs.
LiquidRex
Member
Microsoft have a talk today, I think it's main focus will be ML, but there could be more on what's to come moving forward with the architecture.
FlyyGOD
Member
Maybe I should become an insider and spew nonsense as long as I say " take it with a pinch of salt" ill still keep my credibility . You can make the most outlandish claims and say "take this with a grain of salt" and everything is ok right? Always these anonymous sources that are never vetted.
Riky
$MSFT
Microsoft have a talk today, I think it's main focus will be ML, but there could be more on what's to come moving forward with the architecture.
It was mentioned in the Xbox podcast, what Jason sort of let slip is that they will be able to show later in the year what the RDNA2 hardware support actually achieves in reality.
Cherrypepsi
Member
I love how everyone is a silicone engineer all of a sudden and can immediately identify weak spots in the chip design.
Hudo
Member
Didn't someone get shot? Who died?