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[neondriver]

Maybe a stupid question, but:
Is it also possible for private persons to buy a devkit?
Or which requirements need to be fullfilled?

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

I think Nintendo's console will be capable of doing 720p games, but the problem that exsist is the console won't be able to have as much going on, on screen compared to the PS3 and 360 . If a dvelopers wants to have its game run at that resolution it very well could do so, but at the cost of some resources. It could depend on the game, a fighting game doesn't use as much geometry as other genre's do. So rendering at a higher resolution should be possible.

I expect a console that matches 360 in polygon performance, but fails in comparison when it comes to pixel pipe lines. I don't see the Revolution having more than a 128MB of main memory, with some embedded memory for GPU and a-ram. Developers are saying the main memory is highly optimised, suggesting its very fast. It-sram has got smaller making it possible for embedded memory on the GPU to be atleast 6-8mb.

Revolution will have the lighting, textures, all the special effects the other consoles can produce, but just not in abundance. Its effiecent design vs raw power.

 

[Shogmaster]

I think Nintendo's console will be capable of doing 720p games, but the problem that exsist is the console won't be able to have as much going on, on screen compared to the PS3 and 360 . If a dvelopers wants to have its game run at that resolution it very well could do so, but at the cost of some resources. It could depend on the game, a fighting game doesn't use as much geometry as other genre's do. So rendering at a higher resolution should be possible.

I expect a console that matches 360 in polygon performance, but fails in comparison when it comes to pixel pipe lines. I don't see the Revolution having more than a 128MB of main memory, with some embedded memory for GPU and a-ram. Developers are saying the main memory is highly optimised, suggesting its very fast. It-sram has got smaller making it possible for embedded memory on the GPU to be atleast 6-8mb.

Revolution will have the lighting, textures, all the special effects the other consoles can produce, but just not in abundance. Its effiecent design vs raw power.

Why do this to yourself, man? Expect far less and you won't be so dissapointed. Expecting X360 level of polygon count is just setting yourself up for a big fall.

 

[Timen]

I expect them to come up with cool new games.

 

[Cosmozone]

Bitterness? You better have a fucking good explanation for this stupidity.

Fucking... Stupidity...

You misunderstood me. Perhaps my "fault" to some degree but I refuse to take full responisibility for that. Everybody knows that "You will say wow" tells you nothing. I never expected anybody would assume I wanted to use it as a serious argument. But yet you did, and you saw a chance to agonize over Revolution's lower specs once again. It was an ironic comment, nothing more.

The situation is the graphics capabilities of the Revolution aren't even known aside them being lower than those of the other next-gen consoles. The typical GAFer couldn't tell even if the specs are known and without them it's pretty much shooting in the dark. You could as well say "You will say wow" and that's what I did.

 

[Amir0x]

I didn't say the physics engine, I said the physics of the game.

I presume the point of having all that extra power being used to improve game physics is to make it a more "real world" experience. How things move, how things bounce, how things explode, how things fall and how you as a gamer can interact with those things etc.. etc.

You can create the most realistic physics engine in the world but it means little if the only interaction and way to effect that world is a dpad and a fire button.

Enhancing the physics of a game can have as much to do with how you interact with that world as it does creating that world and its laws.

You can have a standard controller and press a button to throw a ball, the ball bounces realistically into a puddle and creates a very realistic splash, drips of water flying off the ball realistically and realistically landing on the wall where they realistically run down while the ball comes to a stop with the few remaining drops of water dripping off/rolling down into a small puddle where it stands (in a very realistic manner). Very nice I'm sure......


or

You can have a different controller, but this one is able to control the speed of the throw (through many variations), the angle of the throw (in a full 3d plane), how much force was behind the throw when you let the ball go (which would be translated into high how it bounced as well as how far) and if you put spin on the ball when you let it go, in a manner more closely related to how you would throw a ball in the real world. The only thing is, you just get a simple splash when it hits the water and nothing else.

To me the second option enhances the "physics of the game" far more than the first.

You're talking about IMMERSION vs. PHYSICS. The "or" example you used has very little to do with physics, it has to do with immersion. And when you do talk about how it'd impact gameplay (in terms of how it is applied to the gameworld), guess what - you're talking about PHYSICS. How would the game calculate how the ball bounces in the "game world"? Guess. Physics. When you're calculating how the ball is reacting in the real world - which has far reaching gameplay implications - it's physics. Not revmote bullshittery, physics. You can flick a wand, or throw harder or softer all you want. If the gameplay system sucks or if the physics engine is not comparable... it's going to suffer dramatically compared to competition. Revmote is NOT going to change that. If Revolution is significantly underpowered compare to PS3/360, we're only touching the tip of the iceberg of the advantages PS3/360 will have over the system. Gameplay will be dramatically affected.

The first example you used represents some aspects of a physics engine. It, cleverly enough, ignores all the near endless gameplay implications for quality physics, but let's put that aside for a moment. Even ignoring that, in terms of how things effect gameplay, how the world reacts to your interaction, it's mostly based on physics.

This is so much based on speculation now though that it's pointless to continue. The truth is, no one actually knows how much Revolution will be underpowered compared to PS3/360. But the only thing we DO know is that you don't have a full grasp of what physics mean.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

yep but i've seen the spaceworld video and the animation is superb.. way better than TP

That's comparing an early graphical demo, though, to a playable game.

Yes. And in every single case of a game that wasn't embarrasing shovelware from Japanese devs wanting a quick cash-in

I just wonder why you point out the lazy Japanese games particularly when things like Tony Hawk and GUN were two of the early examples?

Held back by a terrible framerate, directly related to technology.

Ehh, you can have things like a shitty frame rate and draw distance on any technology if you put things like polygons-per-object at a higher priority. I've been disappointed about this common choice for nearly 6 years now.

 

[Amir0x]

I just wonder why you point out the lazy Japanese games particularly when things like Tony Hawk and GUN were two of the early examples?

My dislike of current gen up-ports from western devs is no secret either. Only used this example specifically because of the images AniHawk posted (to be sarcastic, no doubt). Obviously, if Iwata only takes into consideration the absolute bottom of the bottomless pit, then maybe his comment would ALMOST ring true. But there are PS2 games that look like PSOne games, and the same general principle applies. That's not how you make valid comparrisons.

Ehh, you can have things like a shitty frame rate and draw distance on any technology if you put things like polygons-per-object at a higher priority. I've been disappointed about this common choice for nearly 6 years now.

Obviously. What I was implying was that HAD Shadow of the Colossus had the same graphics engine but was ported to Revolution (heh), it could conceivably have a better framerate. And I would still not be satisified with that for 'next-gen' standard. But it would likely take a somewhat downgraded graphics engine to achieve the same on PS2 as it is.

Naturally, if your focus is out of whack and you sacrifice framerate for higher whatever, it's gonna hold true for generations to come.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

Why do this to yourself, man? Expect far less and you won't be so dissapointed. Expecting X360 level of polygon count is just setting yourself up for a big fall.

I never said polygon count, but polygon performance. Raw polygon numbers can be matched , the difference would be in what can be displayed on screen after textures, lighting, a.i and other special effects are applied. I think that is where CPU power comes in, aswell as memory bandwidth.

I expected the DS to be technically around 64/PS1 capabilities, but consoles are different. I can't consider what Matt has posted on his site as concrete news. He assumed what devs had was final. Turns out he was wrong. I know you would rather have me hold on to the 2x-3x comment from Kaplan, but evidence suggest her comments are inaccurate. Our knowledge of what the Revolution may be capable of is back to zero, to many damn SDK revisions with the first three not having a hint of Revolution hardware in them.

 

[kaizoku]

You know the whole SotC thing....I wasn't even on about its technical prowess as such, more like where the game takes you. Take away the story. The graphics and scale of the game alone are breathtaking, wonderful accomplishments.

Mainly because of the great art direction and presentation. On emotive levels its more impressive than any X360 game there is.

So to this degree what Nintendo is saying is true, we have reached a stage where graphics and scale have come so far that the difference between DOA x360 and Soul Calibur PS2 is neglible.

Watching HD PGR3 is no more breathtaking to me than watching GT4 replays despite the difference in graphics and HDTV.

Kameo isn;t the best example, but take the field with tonnes of enemies, technically impressive, sound graphics HDTV quality. You charge down with your horse and confronted with loads of bad guys. If you imagine it had been done better in every sense - it still would pale in comparison to taking on a collosi on your horse on the measly PS2 in terms of emotion and feeling.

Graphics really do not matter quite so much now, art direction however is vital. Grandia III vs that x360 RPG for another example of superior technology and graphics failing to hit the same notes. But hell if we imagine they DID get it right like PGR3, the difference would probably not be that big a deal anyway because Grandia III graphics have reached a level where the wow factor stops. From here on out, to improve on that wow-factor needs art direction and presentation.

Heck even CoM and Mother 3 can be used in this argument. Revolution IS a next gen console, even if its the weakest of the 3, it doesnt matter so much or have any serious limitations. What matters is how developers use their skills to entertain us.

 

[SnakeXs]

You know the whole SotC thing....I wasn't even on about its technical prowess as such, more like where the game takes you. Take away the story. The graphics and scale of the game alone are breathtaking, wonderful accomplishments.

Mainly because of the great art direction and presentation. On emotive levels its more impressive than any X360 game there is.

So to this degree what Nintendo is saying is true, we have reached a stage where graphics and scale have come so far that the difference between DOA x360 and Soul Calibur PS2 is neglible.

Watching HD PGR3 is no more breathtaking to me than watching GT4 replays despite the difference in graphics and HDTV.

Kameo isn;t the best example, but take the field with tonnes of enemies, technically impressive, sound graphics HDTV quality. You charge down with your horse and confronted with loads of bad guys. If you imagine it had been done better in every sense - it still would pale in comparison to taking on a collosi on your horse on the measly PS2 in terms of emotion and feeling.

Graphics really do not matter quite so much now, art direction however is vital. Grandia III vs that x360 RPG for another example of superior technology and graphics failing to hit the same notes. But hell if we imagine they DID get it right like PGR3, the difference would probably not be that big a deal anyway because Grandia III graphics have reached a level where the wow factor stops. From here on out, to improve on that wow-factor needs art direction and presentation.

Heck even CoM and Mother 3 can be used in this argument. Revolution IS a next gen console, even if its the weakest of the 3, it doesnt matter so much or have any serious limitations. What matters is how developers use their skills to entertain us.

My main problem with your particular arguement on this affair is this: Good devs vs not so good devs.

Ok, take all the positive games you mentioned. Now imagive if they had vast amounts more power to harness. Imagine what ICO Team's next project could possibly be. The world is in their hands.

Sure some rushed game will just be your average last-gen title (ie nothing to run home about) + some polys, but when you take an amazing dev. team, they'll do much more than throw some shiny textures and mass amounts of polys around.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Question...

Where the predictions that said the x360/ps3 cpu's wouldn't be ideal for physics correct? Or was it bullshit?

 

[kaizoku]

My main problem with your particular arguement on this affair is this: Good devs vs not so good devs.

Ok, take all the positive games you mentioned. Now imagive if they had vast amounts more power to harness. Imagine what ICO Team's next project could possibly be. The world is in their hands.

Sure some rushed game will just be your average last-gen title (ie nothing to run home about) + some polys, but when you take an amazing dev. team, they'll do much more than throw some shiny textures and mass amounts of polys around.

Yeah I have tried to address that. DOA, PGR are some examples where the wow factor is not sky rocketing due to better graphics and HDTV.

Basically you are agreeing with me. Its not about pure raw power anymore, its about the developer's art direction, which of course uses the power of the machine, but the minimum has been met. We will only be impressed by high polygon towns and characters for so long. From here on out its all about beautiful forests, sweeping meadows etc.

Which game makes my eyes gleam more, Ridge Racer 360 or RR PSP? Why does Mario Kart DS look more appealing than Mario Kart Arcade or Double Dash?

Of course more power = more possibilities, but I do feel we have come to a point where the emphasis on graphical power is dimisnished.

 

[Koren]

Where the predictions that said the x360/ps3 cpu's wouldn't be ideal for physics correct? Or was it bullshit?

It isn't only predictions, some developpers complains about it (X360), according to Arstechnica, for example. AGEIA is happy with Cell, though.

It depends on the kind of physical problem, though, and it should be sufficient. You have just to be careful with branching, and maybe give clues to the processor (I've been told that Cell was allowing this).

It will never be a huge problem, of course. It will only be less powerful than other kinds of processors in specific applications, and maybe you can find different solutions to solve the problems.

 

[c_k_i_t3]

cheap dev kits mean more smaller developers will make games for the REV, a small
developer (with a staff of 16 people) Crossbeam studios announce today that they are making two games for the REV.
The first game is called ORB and the second is called Thorn according to their site:
http://www.crossbeamstudios.com/index.shtml

Here are some artwork:

Thorn:

ORb:

 

[SnakeXs]

cheap dev kits mean more smaller developers will make games for the REV, a small
developer (with a staff of 16 people) Crossbeam studios announce today that they are making two games for the REV.
The first game is called ORB and the second is called Thorn according to their site:
http://www.crossbeamstudios.com/index.shtml

Here are some artwork:

Thorn:

ORb:

So, a 16 year old girl is the art director at Crossbeam, huh?

Jokes aside, it's good to see another (XBLA) outlet for small teams who really want to create something without huge financial backing.

 

[SuomiDude]

a small
developer (with a staff of 16 people) Crossbeam studios announce today that they are making two games for the REV.

Actually Orb was announced 3 weeks ago already (could be even more). I think Thorn was also known, at least as an unnamed project. There's also Darkness, their third project, but theyt're mainly focusing on Orb right now.

 

[Merlin]

Interesting. Both games are Revolution exclusive. There's more info on them and art at their site:

http://www.crossbeamstudios.com/projects.shtml

 

[Merlin]

From Crossbeam's website. Sounds like Rev is perfect for small devs like this...

CSE was formed in 1999 by a group of friends in high school to create PC games. That's it, there was no higher calling and back then, we just wanted to try it

Today, CSE has a staff of 16 people working on 3 projects for various platforms, most notable, Nintendo Revolution. We are striving to create games that can introduce the player to new worlds and new adventures. We want to tell great stories with innovative gameplay and memorable characters.

You will not find us whining about polygon counts or bragging about the number of enemies we throw at you in a single scene, there's more important things for us as developers. While we'll get you the graphics needed for the best possible experience, there's more to that experience than what your eyes and ears tell you, and we aim to incorporate those other parts of you, you sense of touch, your brain, even your emotions.

Stick around, we're just getting started.

~The Staff of CSE

 

[cybamerc]

Somehow I doubt Crossbeam Studios is a licensed Rev developer.

 

[Oblivion]

Didn't they say they need to find a publisher first?

 

[littlewig]

reading the forums at CSE webpage, it doesn't look like they have dev kits yet.

I wonder how willing Nintendo will be do give developers without publishers development kits. It's obvious it will be a while, but I hope Nintendo doesn't willingly keep dev kits away from small developement teams.

Edit -

Seems like one of the Staff members answered it already

Well, it certainly makes getting the kit easier if it's cheaper, but so far Nintendo seems unwilling to even cast a look towards unproven developers, hence our working on a demo on PC, to show that we know what we're doing.

But after working for 5 years with practically 0 monetary gain, having the dev kit be cheaper most certainly helps make Orb mroe of a possability.

 

[antipode]

It sounds like they're having trouble becoming a dev...

http://www.crossbeamstudios.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=240

Well, it certainly makes getting the kit easier if it's cheaper, but so far Nintendo seems unwilling to even cast a look towards unproven developers, hence our working on a demo on PC, to show that we know what we're doing.

But after working for 5 years with practically 0 monetary gain, having the dev kit be cheaper most certainly helps make Orb mroe of a possability.

 

[John Harker]

Why are 16 people working on 3+ projects?

"Working on" just must mean "drawing art for."

When you only haev 16 dedicated people, it would make a lot more sense to have them all focus on one programming one project at a time, no? To, ya know... get it done on schedule, and to its highest quality?

 

[cybamerc]

These types of "devs" pop up around every hardware launch. They're opportunists looking for a way to get their company in the media and by picking the least supported system they're hoping to increase the news value. I doubt they'll ever get a game done.

 

[SuomiDude]

Why are 16 people working on 3+ projects?

"Working on" just must mean "drawing art for."

When you only haev 16 dedicated people, it would make a lot more sense to have them all focus on one programming one project at a time, no? To, ya know... get it done on schedule, and to its highest quality?

They're focusing on Orb, but since they've been thinking about all kind of stuff for many, many years, they have a concept for all of them almost finished. Now they've started programming a demo (Orb) for E3 which they're going to show to some people and hope that they'll get a publisher deal.

 

[Shogmaster]

I never said polygon count, but polygon performance. Raw polygon numbers can be matched , the difference would be in what can be displayed on screen after textures, lighting, a.i and other special effects are applied. I think that is where CPU power comes in, aswell as memory bandwidth.

That's just nonesense dude. Xenos can transform far far more than the 500M it can set up and draw. "Raw" polygons perfromance is well over a trillon. And that 500M figure is perfectly reachable in games if they don't use crazy complex shaders. Rev just won't be doing those kind of numbers with it's given it's modest transistor and clockspeed budget.

 

[GaimeGuy]

I still find it amazing how everyone talks as if we know anything about the guts of the system. :lol

 

[gamergirly]

I still find it amazing how everyone talks as if we know anything about the guts of the system. :lol

It's almost like everything has been "set in stone". What's missing from this thread? "Confirmation" :lol

 

[DeathbyVolcano]

Exactly. People, we've still yet to see any screens of ANY Revolution game. Don't pay any attention to old reports (and even these) about the dev kits and their performance. The final ones come out and I'm sure everything will work out okay.

 

[GitarooMan]

Exactly. People, we've still yet to see any screens of ANY Revolution game. Don't pay any attention to old reports (and even these) about the dev kits and their performance. The final ones come out and I'm sure everything will work out okay.

Isn't saying "everything will work out okay" essentially doing the same thing? (i.e. making assumptions)

 

[Gahiggidy]

Does anyone doubt that Nintendo will have the best dollar/per polygon perfermance of the three consoles?

 

[Leatherface]

Isn't saying "everything will work out okay" essentially doing the same thing? (i.e. making assumptions)

 

[Merlin]

Isn't saying "everything will work out okay" essentially doing the same thing? (i.e. making assumptions)

Yes, but it's nicer to be positive than negative...

 

[No6]

From Crossbeam's website. Sounds like Rev is perfect for small devs like this...

Why? Why wouldn't a 360 devkit + XBLA be even more perfect for small devs? Why wouldn't a small developer want to use the system with the most power? It's not like they're required to use the system to its fullest abilities.

SotC keeps being brought up as proof of the Rev's future success, but to me it points the opposite direction: Team ICO no doubt had to use significant internal resources to squeeze power out of the PS2. Had SotC been made for the PS3/360, Team ICO could have spent those resources upping the resolution, framerate, AND improving the game in various other ways.

The N-hive keeps pointing at RE4 as proof of the GC's abilities (which actually had numerous visual/environmental weaknesses which were made less obvious by the visual strengths), but seem to be forgetting that RE4 was made by a AAA-dev in 2005.

 

[TheDrowningMan]

With development costs spiralling out of control and even big-hitters like EA suffering hefty losses, Nintendo's low cost policy may well see them return to the fore sooner than anyone could've expected. As long as the games are great, I really don't care if the visuals are somewhat worse than the competitors.

 

[DeathbyVolcano]

Isn't saying "everything will work out okay" essentially doing the same thing? (i.e. making assumptions)

Well that was the point I was trying to make. I'm cautiously optimistic on the subject of the Revolution's power. Nintendo can work miracles with hardware. I know it won't be as great as Xbox 360 or PS3, because of a number of reasons (HD being one), but I think when it comes down to actually sitting down and playing it, people will hardly notice a difference. Of course this is GAF and everyone will scream foul if it is a tad weaker, but it's a good thing GAF is not the world.

Or is it?

 

[Taker666]

Why? Why wouldn't a 360 devkit + XBLA be even more perfect for small devs? Why wouldn't a small developer want to use the system with the most power? .

I presume he means it would be perfect for them due to dev kits only costing $2000 which is supposed to be thousands cheaper than the Xbox360's.

 

[choplifter]

Does anyone doubt that Nintendo will have the best dollar/per polygon perfermance of the three consoles?

Yes, I doubt it.

If Nintendo and IGN comments on Revolution are taken at face value, if Revolution is really 2 or even 3 times more powerful than Gamecube, and assuming Revolution sells for $199 or even $149, it will probably have the worst dollar/per polygon performance of the three new consoles.

Xbox 360: 500 million
PS3: 500 million to ~1 billion
Revolution: 100 million

I'm even being very generous to Revolution by giving it 100M polygons. Gamecube was 6-12M according to Nintendo, and top GCN developers indicated 15 to 20 million in their games. so I've given Revolution 5 times Gamecube's best figure.

Xbox 360 costs ~$320 for the base unit including tax. Revolution will cost $162 to $215 including tax. assume PS3 will cost $430 for the base unit. maybe $535 if Sony is to be believed about expensive. still, PS3 and Xbox360 are a better value in terms of polygon performance, even given Revolution extra estimated performance.

even if we make Revolution even more powerful, say 1/2 of an Xbox 360, it still would be a lesser value in power.

with that said, Revolution could be the MOST value in terms of gameplay control, depth, fun, etc.

 

[Lunney]

You just know you're talkin' to an american gamer when they say "dollar per polygon".

 

[No6]

I presume he means it would be perfect for them due to dev kits only costing $2000 which is supposed to be thousands cheaper than the Xbox360's.

But the few thousand they save on the devkits (which may not even be necessary for XBLA going by how MS is willing to port arcade games for an increased share of the revenue) would be lost on the increased manpower required to squeeze the power needed to make their game look like a decent 2005 GC game.

 

[littlewig]

But the few thousand they save on the devkits (which may not even be necessary for XBLA going by how MS is willing to port arcade games for an increased share of the revenue) would be lost on the increased manpower required to squeeze the power needed to make their game look like a decent 2005 GC game.

You are really underestimating the power of Revolution. You make it sound like people are working with a extremely difficult hardware architecture that has the power of the PSX...

Revolution is easily to develop for, I doubt it will be difficult to reach it's max potential.

 

[Blackcherry]

Yes, I doubt it.

If Nintendo and IGN comments on Revolution are taken at face value, if Revolution is really 2 or even 3 times more powerful than Gamecube, and assuming Revolution sells for $199 or even $149, it will probably have the worst dollar/per polygon performance of the three new consoles.

Xbox 360: 500 million
PS3: 500 million to ~1 billion
Revolution: 100 million

I'm even being very generous to Revolution by giving it 100M polygons. Gamecube was 6-12M according to Nintendo, and top GCN developers indicated 15 to 20 million in their games. so I've given Revolution 5 times Gamecube's best figure.

Xbox 360 costs ~$320 for the base unit including tax. Revolution will cost $162 to $215 including tax. assume PS3 will cost $430 for the base unit. maybe $535 if Sony is to be believed about expensive. still, PS3 and Xbox360 are a better value in terms of polygon performance, even given Revolution extra estimated performance.

even if we make Revolution even more powerful, say 1/2 of an Xbox 360, it still would be a lesser value in power.

with that said, Revolution could be the MOST value in terms of gameplay control, depth, fun, etc.

Polygons?!? OMFG

 

[choplifter]

Polygons?!? OMFG

yes, I was answering his question about it. does that mean Revolution is all about polygons? no of course not.


maybe Revolution won't do any polygons at all, and will use only displacement maps :lol

 

[GaimeGuy]

Jesus christ you guys. :lol

 

[kaizoku]

Why? Why wouldn't a 360 devkit + XBLA be even more perfect for small devs? Why wouldn't a small developer want to use the system with the most power? It's not like they're required to use the system to its fullest abilities.

SotC keeps being brought up as proof of the Rev's future success, but to me it points the opposite direction: Team ICO no doubt had to use significant internal resources to squeeze power out of the PS2. Had SotC been made for the PS3/360, Team ICO could have spent those resources upping the resolution, framerate, AND improving the game in various other ways.

The N-hive keeps pointing at RE4 as proof of the GC's abilities (which actually had numerous visual/environmental weaknesses which were made less obvious by the visual strengths), but seem to be forgetting that RE4 was made by a AAA-dev in 2005.

SotC is not proof of future success...its not even specific to Rev. I'm just suggesting that the power of graphics has come to a point where the wow factor stops or at least the difference is negligible. PGR vs GT4, DOA vs Soul Calibur.

Current gen graphics - some brilliant views and experiences which take your breath away. The minimum has been met, todays graphics can show us wonderful things, tomorrows graphics will be even better. Which means Rev is powerful enough to be able to take our breath away regardless of how good the competition is.

Sure the other two might be even more amazing, but thats beside the point. It wont make the Rev any less potent in terms of showing us beautiful sights and scenarios.

This isnt even about direct comparisons, we all know Rev cant match up to the other consoles for raw power, my point is it doesnt have to.

 

[Taker666]

But the few thousand they save on the devkits (which may not even be necessary for XBLA going by how MS is willing to port arcade games for an increased share of the revenue) would be lost on the increased manpower required to squeeze the power needed to make their game look like a decent 2005 GC game.

Depends on the games they intend to make.

If I was a very small dev I'd probably try making lots of simple budget games rather than going for a big title.

Just port over a few of those mouse controlled PC flash games. Simple 2d games with decent art that make use of the mouse like functions of the revmote.

 

[Vieo]

Bah!

edit: Seriously though. We'll always agree to disagree. No point in arguing.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

That's just nonesense dude. Xenos can transform far far more than the 500M it can set up and draw. "Raw" polygons perfromance is well over a trillon. And that 500M figure is perfectly reachable in games if they don't use crazy complex shaders. Rev just won't be doing those kind of numbers with it's given it's modest transistor and clockspeed budget.

Then sir you are more informed then I previously thought you were. I didn't know you knew transistor counts and clock speeds. May I ask how you come to know so much more?

I hope your not going off that month old article posted by Matt-IGN, the so called final dev kits that were souped up GC's.

 

[Gahiggidy]

How can a GPU codenamed "Hollywood" be weak? That doesn't make sense.