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Ron Reagan Jr. to speak at the Democratic National Convention?

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Phoenix

Phoenix

Member
Ron Reagan Jr. is a well spoken and clearly well educated individual. I watched his interview series on CNN and found him to be VERY personable.
 
B

Belfast

Member
Ronny Jr. rocks. And he's a total advocate for stem-cell research like his mom (or at least, how she feels about it now and how it can potentially help those suffering from alzheimers). Jr. made an interesting point in his Larry King interview, though, that its funny Reagan's first two children turned out conservative and his second two so liberal. But liberal or conservative, he's proven that he's a very well-educated and informed person.
 
T

The Fronde

Member
If people's lives can potentially be saved by using tissue that's already dead and gone, I must say that I am for it. I don't mean to trivialize human life, but to me the potential to really save lives outweighs the moral issue of harvesting otherwise disposed-of tissue.

Sorry, I just felt like saying that.
 
O

Outlaw Pro Mod

Member
If people's lives can potentially be saved by using tissue that's already dead and gone, I must say that I am for it. I don't mean to trivialize human life, but to me the potential to really save lives outweighs the moral issue of harvesting otherwise disposed-of tissue.

Sorry, I just felt like saying that.
Click to expand...

Good points.
 
V

videogamer

Banned
The Fronde said:
If people's lives can potentially be saved by using tissue that's already dead and gone, I must say that I am for it. I don't mean to trivialize human life, but to me the potential to really save lives outweighs the moral issue of harvesting otherwise disposed-of tissue.

Sorry, I just felt like saying that.
Click to expand...

The fruits of stem cell research will probably take decades to ever appear. Just look at how long all the other medical research to get out.

Anyways, if our government doesn't want to fund stem cell researchers that use unapproved cell lines, there will always be research in other countries. Eventually, the US can take advantage of other countries' research.

IMHO, Bush doesn't seem to like science too much the way it is. He seems to prefer research that favors his ideas, even if it is a minority. For instance, the government wants to count farmed salmon in the salmon counts. Farmed salmon are more homogenous genetically and are not a viable long term solution to declining fish stock. Also, another repeated complaint is that the government packs committees with people who agree with it ideologically. Take the example of biochemist Elizabeth Blackburn (the co-discoverer of telomerase!), who was actually given her spot by the Bush admin, but wasn't renewed 2 years later.
 
R

Ripclawe

Banned
The Fronde said:
If people's lives can potentially be saved by using tissue that's already dead and gone, I must say that I am for it. I don't mean to trivialize human life, but to me the potential to really save lives outweighs the moral issue of harvesting otherwise disposed-of tissue.

Sorry, I just felt like saying that.
Click to expand...

well you are trivializing human life, and lets be honest here, embryonic stem cell research is still going on, just the federal government is not allowed to fund it, private places are doing it here and stem cell research is taking place all over the world.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2004-04-20-stem-cell-cover_x.htm
 
T

The Fronde

Member
The fruits of stem cell research will probably take decades to ever appear. Just look at how long all the other medical research to get out.
Click to expand...

Well, as long as abortion is legal, I'll support SCR. I guess you're right about just using research done by others though. That slipped my mind. Still though, U.S. support could bring a lot to the field, maybe shortening the amount of time before we see viable results.

Rip, I'm not disputing that it's being done.

Also, what you call trivializing I call being pragmatic. I don't see us reaching an understanding about this.
 
X

xsarien

daedsiluap
Ripclawe said:
well you are trivializing human life,[/url]
Click to expand...

No he isn't.

If people's lives can potentially be saved by using tissue that's already dead and gone,
Click to expand...

By your logic, then, dead bodies being harvested for organs is an equal trivialization. If some good can come out of a discarded embryo, then I'm all for it, shame the White House isn't.
 
V

videogamer

Banned
Ripclawe said:
well you are trivializing human life, and lets be honest here, embryonic stem cell research is still going on, just the federal government is not allowed to fund it, private places are doing it here and stem cell research is taking place all over the world.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2004-04-20-stem-cell-cover_x.htm
Click to expand...

However, the federal government is THE big source of funds for research. At least in the labs that I know of, if you don't have NIH funding, then you probably won't survive very long. The NIH pays for the vast majority of labs' budgets. That's why they make such a big deal over NIH/federal funding.

Even though there are other sources of funds besides the federal government, some people find this to be an incredible opportunity and that the Bush adminstration is again acting from its particular ideological stance.
 
R

Ripclawe

Banned
xsarien said:
No he isn't.



By your logic, then, dead bodies being harvested for organs is an equal trivialization. If some good can come out of a discarded embryo, then I'm all for it, shame the White House isn't.
Click to expand...

There is a huge difference between a dead body by natural or unnatural causes, getting organs from that and an embryo that has a potential to be born just thrown away by a clinic.
 
X

xsarien

daedsiluap
Ripclawe said:
There is a huge difference between a dead body by natural or unnatural causes, getting organs from that and an embryo that has a potential to be born just thrown away by a clinic.
Click to expand...

Would you rather it just be thrown away without the cells being harvested?
 
V

videogamer

Banned
Ripclawe said:
There is a huge difference between a dead body by natural or unnatural causes, getting organs from that and an embryo that has a potential to be born just thrown away by a clinic.
Click to expand...

Is there any serious way that these embryos will be implanted and born? They probably would be thown away anyways. Why don't the opponents of the use of embryos actually target the practice of destroying embryos instead of embryonic stem cell research? That way, federally funded stem cell research can go on while the other issue is being debated.
 
J

JackFrost2012

Banned
Drinky Crow said:
Geezus, Rip, are you completely incapable of an opinion independent of the GOP's current talking points?
Click to expand...

He'll get back to you on that as soon as he checks the official GOP stance on admitting complete adherence to the talking points.
 
I

Incognito

Troll
There is absolutely NO REASON why stem-cell research should be limited as it is right now. It's fucking ridiculous.

I mean, 60 fucking lines of research? Absolute and utter bullshit. This is yet another reason why I can't wait to vote Bush out of office.
 
V

videogamer

Banned
HalfPastNoon said:
There is absolutely NO REASON why stem-cell research should be limited as it is right now. It's fucking ridiculous.

I mean, 60 fucking lines of research? Absolute and utter bullshit. This is yet another reason why I can't wait to vote Bush out of office.
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Well, it's not really that limited... it's just that the federal funding is limited to a select cell lines.
 
I

Incognito

Troll
eggplant said:
Well, it's not really that limited... it's just that the federal funding is limited to a select cell lines.
Click to expand...

yeah, it's limited to 60 lines. estimates place the number of stem cells in the world available for research over 100,000 and under 1,000,000. yet our government only funds the research of 60? ridiculous.
 
V

videogamer

Banned
HalfPastNoon said:
yeah, it's limited to 60 lines. estimates place the number of stem cells in the world available for research over 100,000 and under 1,000,000. yet our government only funds the research of 60? ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Where did you get those numbers?
 
I

Incognito

Troll
Frist's plan would allow stem cells to be extracted from surplus embryos currently in stock and due for destruction in clinics and labs around the country, a supply that numbers between 100,000 and 1 million.
Click to expand...

i don't know if you'll be able to access this article. it's a time.com members exclusive, but i'll post the link, anyway.

Stem Cell
 
V

videogamer

Banned
HalfPastNoon said:
i don't know if you'll be able to access this article. it's a time.com members exclusive, but i'll post the link, anyway.

Stem Cell
Click to expand...

That number has to do with the number of embryos that the government will let scientists use in this particular situation, which won't necessarily yield the same number of cell lines.
 
I

Incognito

Troll
eggplant said:
That number has to do with the number of embryos that the government will let scientists use in this particular situation, which won't necessarily yield the same number of cell lines.
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true, but it'll still yield a significant amount of lines.
 
F

fart

Savant
scientific ethics should be decided by peer review and qualified boards of respected members of the scientific community, not knee jerk politicking and religious fervor (SEPARATION OF MOTHERFUCKING CHURCH AND STATE BITCHES)
 
S

sc0la

Unconfirmed Member
Mrs. Reagan is also very strong on her opinion that stem cell research should not be quashed.

For another example of son being politicaly inverted from the father (though you could argue that Reagan Jr. is doing this for his father) see Abe Lincoln's son.

Lincoln's son fiercely battled any sort of organization of black rail workers (porters specifically). There was a saying at the time that Lincoln freed the slaves and his son "re-enslaved them".
 
Phoenix

Phoenix

Member
Ripclawe said:
There is a huge difference between a dead body by natural or unnatural causes, getting organs from that and an embryo that has a potential to be born just thrown away by a clinic.
Click to expand...

You do realize that most methodologies used to help couples who are having difficulties having kids - get pregnant involve the use and discarding of a significant number of embryos as well. Are you against that as well?
 
S

sc0la

Unconfirmed Member
fart said:
aaah

we need a GAF dictionary :/
Click to expand...
Hahah

We probably do, but this isn't something standard. If one wanted to quote and refer to the post above them they would put the arrows above the quote.... if they were being practical about it that is ;)
 
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