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[Durante]

Rest in peace, Valve as a cutting-edge games studio.

I'd argue that The Lab is far more "cutting-edge" in terms of gaming as a medium than another entry in an FPS franchise would be, but I realize that I'll encounter heavy opposition on that here on GAF

That quote makes me question the source. Valve said they won't do exclusives and it wouldn't make sense for them to do so.

Yeah, that particular point is highly questionable. I mean, "exclusively to Steam" I could even buy to some extent. Exclusive to Steam machines? Nope.

I know that Valve is portrayed as this anarcho-syndicalist commune, and to some extent it might be true, but if Gabe says "no Steam machine exclusives from Valve" that means "no Steam machine exclusives from Valve". Period.

 

[TemplaerDude]

Yep. HL is all about not taking away control from the player and forcing them to watch set pieces. The player has complete freedom to simply look the other way even if there's this epic thing going on. You certainly wouldn't be stacking blocks and building crude levers to catapult yourself around with physics puzzles in a ND game. Nor would you go to them for a silent protag.

Cool guys never look at explosions.

 

[fastmower]

The work structure of Valve honestly bewilders and depresses me.

 

[Yukinari]

That crazy dude who made the thread about making the steam controller mandatory might just get his wish with the steam machine.

Like its such bullshit that i believe Valve would do something like that. Force its users to use their hardware.

 

[dogen]

Disappointing that valve doesn't care about it's original fans' expectations anymore.

 

[Tunesmith]

That's just the throwaway opinion at the end. The reason why you might want to consider this source as valid is that everything he/she describes about working at Valve matches everything we know about their studio and office guide/manifesto. They make it clear that at no point is Gabe going to swoop down and ask you to work on HL3 or something. You have to find your way, and that's what makes a HL sequel so challenging - you would need somebody at the studio (besides Gabe, I guess) that is:

1. Charismatic enough to attract other developers there with the right skillsets
2. Motivated enough to push forward a HL3 project
3. Convincing enough to have everyone believe that this project will ship.
4. Skilled enough in all the right ways to work on the project personally beginning-end.
5. Brave enough to do all of this knowing that if it ends up just being you, you're at the bottom of the stack and possibly out of a job.

They're not like a traditional studio; you don't just get 4 concept artists assigned to make a pitch. Presumably whomever was building the game would need to get it far enough along with a very small number of people, but quickly and to a level of excitement that it draws in a large part of the studio to see it to the finish line. Sort of like showing half of "Portal" functional or something.

I think the source is totally right on it getting more difficult every time, too. Why spend your time/risk your position within the studio if you're not convinced it will finish?

If there was some aspect of traditional development there - Gabe asked for it, jobs were secure, or said person was lucky enough to start out with an intrinsic designer/programmer team - I think it would be a lot more likely to at least get somewhere. As it is I guess it depends a lot on what the hidden political structure is.

Just quoting because your post hits the nail in the head.

 

[TheMan]

Interesting look into how they operate- basically it has to arise organically and gain traction. I thought all it would take would be for Lord Gaben to raise a finger and decree that HL3 must be created. Sounds like nothing of interest ever got off the ground.

I would bet the biggest reason why the project never took off is because it would NEVER live up to the hype. I thought VR would make that possible but I think the constraints are just too big with VR at the moment.

 

[Back-In-Black]

Source sounds legit and just confirms everything I've suspected, Valve's office culture prevents HL3 from ever happening. Honestly, at this point I no longer care let the franchise just die already.

Interesting look into how they operate- basically it has to arise organically and gain traction. I thought all it would take would be for Lord Gaben to raise a finger and decree that HL3 must be created. Sounds like nothing of interest ever got off the ground.

I would bet the biggest reason why the project never took off is because it would NEVER live up to the hype. I thought VR would make that possible but I think the constraints are just too big with VR at the moment.

You should read the Valve Office Manual leaked a few years back, it kinda explains why nothing gets released at Valve.

 

[ashecitism]

Also this part:

That's why they won't talk about it anymore. Every time they talk about it, the hunger comes back. That's why they ignore it. The pain subsides with time.

I feel like someone should shop this on the "These things, they take time" .gif

Doesn't make sense for them to leave stuff in their code though, especially when they know people look for them.

Interesting look into how they operate- basically it has to arise organically and gain traction. I thought all it would take would be for Lord Gaben to raise a finger and decree that HL3 must be created. Sounds like nothing of interest ever got off the ground.

You should read the Valve Office Manual leaked a few years back, it kinda explains why nothing gets released at Valve.

From several ex-employees we know that manual isn't exactly true. There is a hidden layer of management, highschool cliques etc. Even this article mentions it, I just didn't quote that part. "Influencers" as the person says. Also from Keighley's Gameslice we know Gabe personally cancelled Stars of Blood. So he can call shots if he wants to.

 

[ashecitism]

crap, didn't want to dp

 

[dh4niel]

When Marc Laidlaw left that was the final nail in the coffin for me.

 

[Evil Monkey DTT]

Remember when valve was Pixar, now they are just a joke of a company from the gamer point of view. Hats and steam money seems to be all we will get from them.

 

[CHC]

All pretty obvious, it's never happening. I get the impression, from his interview as well as from earlier pieces, that Valve is very cliquey. Theoretically anyone is free to do whatever they want, but the pressure is just there to move in a certain direction and it's hard to go against that.

Even if they started on earnest today, we still wouldn't see it for another 5 years.

Still makes me a little upset that just totally bailed and left things on a cliffhanger, but really who cares at this point. I understand the pressure and the window that they had to deliver something that was simply an effective follow-up has long since closed now.

 

[Nheco]

The Half-Life is a lie. Give up.

Valve, rent out the license. Go all Marvel and give multiple studios a shot at adding to the world of Half-Life. One finishing a quick episode that is Half Life Episode 3, and another making a Half Life 3. :\ The Walking Dead stories game company could be better than nothing.

Be careful with your wishes, let's say they rent the license to... TELLTALE. It's episodic, imrite?

 

[Back-In-Black]

From several ex-employees we know that manual isn't exactly true. There is a hidden layer of management, highschool cliques etc. Even this article mentions it, I just didn't quote that part. "Influencers" as the person says. Also from Keighley's Gameslice we know Gabe personally cancelled Stars of Blood. So he can call shots if he wants to.

Oh know doubt. The manual essentially reads like communism in its pure form, but as history has shown humans are incapable of achieving/living in such a society. The manual talks about everyone being free and open to work on whatever they want with nobody managing them, but I think we all know there is a hidden layer of management that holds power somewhere within the Valve hierarchy, which according to the manual, doesn't exist.

 

[SpaceWolf]

At this point, I still continue to maintain my cult-like belief that Half Life 3 is being worked on and will eventually be released.

 

[Clinton514]

I'm done waiting or caring about anything else they do.

 

[Ghost_Messiah]

IMO it's the weight of stratospheric expectations that has killed momentum on Half Life 3. It's near-impossible for Valve to deliver the game fans want so it seems like these prototype projects being started and abandoned is the norm and nothing they're producing is meeting the mark so development has just stalled. I'd love to see HL3 one day but I think Valve just can't produce something that'd satisfy the fans.

Would love to see "Half Life 3 announced" on GAF one day but like the source of this interview I'm sceptical that it'll ever happen.

 

[Shaanyboi]

If you're Valve and you're making boatloads of cash not only because of Steam, but with stuff like DOTA2 where continued monetization is encouraged, what incentive do you have to make a single release AAA shooter in an era where that genre has so wildly changed that you risk disappointing everyone?

 

[BlondeTuna]

It sounds like Valve needs an individual who is passionate for the franchise, can leverage new technologies, and can inspire others through leadership, if we are ever going to get another entry in the series.

As a console gamer, I fully support a Half Life 3 tied to Steam OS or Steam Machines, if that's the platform and business model that can get this project underway.

 

[Ahasverus]

If you're Valve and you're making boatloads of cash not only because of Steam, but with stuff like DOTA2 where continued monetization is encouraged, what incentive do you have to make a single release AAA shooter in an era where that genre has so wildly changed that you risk disappointing everyone?

Goodwill. The budget would be just pocket cash for them.

 

[Barryman]

I'd argue that The Lab is far more "cutting-edge" in terms of gaming as a medium than another entry in an FPS franchise would be, but I realize that I'll encounter heavy opposition on that here on GAF

I don't care about "cutting-edge" tech demos. Gaming as a medium has lost its way if that's what is considered innovative.

 

[Helznicht]

Valve has 2 games consistently in the top 20. They don't want to Nintendo their content creators.

 

[Tainted]

The last Valve developed game I cared about was Portal 2 which is nearly 6 years ago now. They are simply the company who make Steam to me, I'm long past the point of thinking they will ever make another game which I will play.

 

[Blader]

It's just a fucking video game. It's absurd to me that Valve, at no point in the last *decade*, just wouldn't come out and say it's not happening anymore. You don't "owe" fans anything, but to deliberately tease people with ambiguous comments (or no comments, as it were) about an HL3 is, frankly, just pointlessly mean.

 

[Back-In-Black]

It's just a fucking video game. It's absurd to me that Valve, at no point in the last *decade*, just wouldn't come out and say it's not happening anymore. You don't "owe" fans anything, but to deliberately tease people with ambiguous comments (or no comments, as it were) about an HL3 is, frankly, just pointlessly mean.

But, that's the problem, no one in Valve knows if its happening. At any point a small team could start working on it but then give up when faced with traction and the shifting tides of their office culture. HL3 isn't so much as dead as stuck in a state of perpetual conceptualization. I think the last hope of the game ever coming out died when Marc Laidlaw left Valve, he seemed to be the only one genuinely interested in seeing the game come out and the story finished.

 

[Teeth]

Goodwill. The budget would be just pocket cash for them.

No good deed goes unpunished.

Odds of goodwill are much lower than scathing backlash.

 

[pswii60]

I'd be more interested in a Portal 3 at this point. What happened to the talent behind the sublime Portal 2?

 

[Sad Affleck]

That crazy dude who made the thread about making the steam controller mandatory might just get his wish with the steam machine.

That would be me and let's hope so! I would install SteamOS immediately for a Half-Life sequel.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

I think the writing was on the wall once it got a few years passed the point where they had a majority of the leg work done and could reasonably recycle a majority of the assets from episode 1 & 2 for a quick 5-6 hour wrap up campaign where you go to the combine dimension and are all out of gum or w/e.

And really even if they showed any desire to make it, it doesn't seem like Valve in its current state is horribly interested in releasing a game that doesn't include crates and digital knives that cost twice as much as they do irl. Not that I blame em, that's what I'd stick to if I was in that position.

 

[Not Spaceghost]

Caring about valve as a developer of games is kind of futile, they already struggle to support the games they have out that aren't dota2.

CSGO gets updates but it's usually a horrible update that gets fixed later the same week because of massive community backlash. Hell the updates themselves are getting even more scarce, last year we only had 1 operation.

The guy really makes it sound like the only way to get things done at valve is to find a project a lot of people are already attached to. That kind of mentality is what has lead us to a position where there are disproportionate amounts of people on one project than another.

Valves interest in monetizing almost everything is also absolutely frustrating, valve would rather protect their in game economy of weapon skins and hats than allow people to open up the boxes that drop for free. Multiple solutions have been proposed to them too, like if you open a box without a key then you're never allowed to trade or sell the item, but they don't care because it would lead to diminished value on items in their eyes which means they'd be making less profit from skins.

DOTA2 officially released in 2013 and since then they've put out:

Steam machines
Steam OS
Steam Link
Steam controller
The VIVE
The Lab

Steam machines have basically been ignored completely
Steam OS is kind of useless to most people
Steam Link is a very niche product that ultimately ended up gaining more traction than the steam machines.

The steam controller seems to be doing ridiculously well which is awesome, i personally don't really like the controller but I'm happy that there is finally a "PC controller" that works seamlessly with most of the games on steam.

The VIVE is doing well on the VR spectrum I believe and it's really cool hardware that valve is probably actually going to carefully nurture. The lab is a super cool demo that takes advantage of their new hardware.

Honestly I don't think it's likely we'll see anything game related from valve that isn't going to be VR first for a long time.

If we ever see HL3 or anything related to half life, it's likely going to have some VR component built into it.

I guess if I wanted to look at it from a positive light then I would say "valve wants to make sure their games have the longest legs possible and won't develop sequels for them until the game are just absolutely beyond updating when it comes to deploying overhauls for them" and I honestly kind of really believe that. They like to make sure their games can run on the widest possible range of machines. That's their method of promoting accessibility.

 

[robotrock]

I'd be more interested in a Portal 3 at this point. What happened to the talent behind the sublime Portal 2?

Portal 2 ended pretty well though

 

[Durante]

I don't care about "cutting-edge" tech demos. Gaming as a medium has lost its way if that's what is considered innovative.

It explores an entirely new type of interactivity, and presents (polished) examples of what can be done with it in a gaming context. I can see no way in which a FPS sequel can compete in terms of "innovation", but as I said, I expect there to be vehement opposition to that point of view.

 

[Metalmarc]

Is the number 3 Gabe's unlucky number? hence why no l4d3, no portal 3 , team fortress 3, no dota 3 no half life 3, not even a episode 3 of half life

Or is he just waiting to release them all at once in orange box 2,first (the reverse of orange box one) imagine that All at once that would be incredible, and extremely pricey, until they sold them separately

 

[Abilidebob]

If L4D3 doesn't release or gets announced this year I'll eat all my digital hats.

 

[Voras]

It's actually kind of a relief to know that Half-Life is completely dead. I really did want some sort of closure for the series considering the cliff hanger they pulled with Episode 2 but it was seeming less and less possible as time went on. I really wish Valve had just come out and told everyone they have no intention of finishing the story instead of stringing people along.

I imagine Vavle is mostly done as a creator of traditional games, they make too much money from Steam and their microtransactions to bother with it. At best we might see another Left 4 Dead with buyable hats this time or another Counter Strike to replace GO at some point years from now when it's getting too old.

Pour some out for a company that used to make great games. What a shame.

 

[Ahasverus]

No good deed goes unpunished.

Odds of goodwill are much lower than scathing backlash.

First of all, it's HL3.
Secondly, it's Valve. They wouldn't make a bad game if they tried.

There's 0 chance people chose no HL3 to a merely decent HL3.

 

[Bad7667]

If L4D3 doesn't release or gets announced this year I'll eat all my digital hats.

I'm with you. There is no way L4D3 doesn't get announced, and probably released, this year. It seems out of all of Valve's IP, Left 4 Dead is the only one with actual proof that it's in actual development.

 

[MaKTaiL]

but the game has never really mattered to console customers

What???? It's more like "Valve doesn't care about console costumers". They could easily win a lot of money by releasing Team Fortress 2 and Counter Strike Go on Xbox One and PS4, and even more if they decided to release a remastered version of the two Left 4 Dead games and even the Orange Box. I would buy them all. They haven't done it by now because they don't really care.

Valve is definitely laziest dev out there nowadays, if you still consider them devs. Steam earns them a lot of money so they don't feel like ever doing good games anymore apparently. It's a shame though. I loved the company back then but what remained of them now is shameful at best.

 

[DAHGAMING]

I have always been hopefull of the next HL, but as the years go on It gets less and less likely it will happen. Even if it was released this year I dont think the name is a big deal in the grand scheme anymore, of course to us who have played the series means alot, but to alot of the younger generation its either a game they have herd of but not played or not even herd of it at all. My bro was 2 when it was released hes now 14, he knows the series through myself but alot of his friends im sure wouldnt know what it is. I dont know how well it can compete with other big games now days and Valve must think the same, it is now a risk if they went all in onit.

 

[Eusis]

I consider it a running joke at this point. Maybe Valve will actually complete something there someday, maybe? But as it is I think of it more as something to joke about as being hinted at since it left on a cliffhanger, they DID plan a third episode, and frankly it's still more likely than something like Mega Man Legends 3 as HL was a keystone for the company initially and there's a realistic chance versus bad baggage from the eshop demo failing to hit.

 

[Bl@de]

Good. The Steam plattform should be their focus. And not some shooter. They are better at that.

 

[tci]

Sounds about right.

Valve have no proper command structure and focus. Their success is their demise imo. Without actually been told to do a project, no one in Valve will dare to work on HL3. Nothing have happened since 2007 in the HL-universe (Portal does not count).

The market have changed. Valve have changed. Half Life is dead.

I am a massive fan of HL. But I have given up and moved on. Everyone should do the same. It will never happen sadly. The game will forever end with a major cliffhanger.

 

[World SkiFree]

I'm still waiting for SiN Episodes: 2-9 ...

At this point, I wish Valve would just release an Ep. 3 to HL2 using the "current" HL2 engine and all, including an approximate runtime of other two episodes. I think that would be pretty neat, if they had/have a interesting story arc and conclusion. A freebie for all Steam users. I know this is a somewhat common proposed solution to this dilemma, but I'm very fond of it.

Like another poster said, I love Half-Life (day one purchase for both games) but my interest in the series has waned considerably over the years. I would still jump on any new release though ... and these HL3 threads will at least earn some lurking time from me.

 

[Timeaisis]

Honestly, Valve makes more money on their other ventures, they don't need HL3.

I think it would work more as an "exclusive" Steam game when and if the time comes, as a strategy to counteract other storefronts.

 

[Nzyme32]

Sounds about right.

Valve have no proper command structure and focus. Their success is their demise imo. Without actually been told to do a project, no one in Valve will dare to work on HL3. Nothing have happened since 2007 in the HL-universe (Portal does not count).

The market have changed. Valve have changed. Half Life is dead.

I am a massive fan of HL. But I have given up and moved on. Everyone should do the same. It will never happen sadly. The game will forever end with a major cliffhanger.

A bit over the top to proclaim that nothing can happen with such a structure. They have demonstrably been able to adapt quickly to quite a lot of things and get a whole lot done, whether that was reacting to Win 8 and hardware, VR and the poaching of their own staff as Oculus became more distant, Controller developments, their own games as a service etc. The article of one source isn't even necessary. The simple fact is HL is not a big priority right now as a game or it is under development in some form internally in a very experimental manner. The HL film is also way off by the sounds of things with the focus on Portal. It's that simple.

 

[Newboi]

I find it hard to believe that there was not enough enthusiasm within the company to work on HL3. I would figure you would have plenty of younger talent eager to make a name by creating a successful sequel to one of the most critically acclaimed franchises ever. Would it be more of a likely issue that prototypes aren't being approved by Gabe, thus full production can't happen?

There's also the big issue of the Source 2 engine. Has it officially been released to the masses yet? It seemed in the past like the development of Source 2 was holding back the release of future valve games.

 

[Nzyme32]

I find it hard to believe that there was not enough enthusiasm within the company to work on HL3. I would figure you would have plenty of younger talent eager to make a name by creating a successful sequel to one of the most critically acclaimed franchises ever. Would it be more of a likely issue that prototypes aren't being approved by Gabe, thus full production can't happen?

There's also the big issue of the Source 2 engine. Has it officially been released to the masses yet? It seemed in the past like the development of Source 2 was holding back the release of future valve games.

Depends how you define "the masses". It is used for a few of the VR things and for Dota 2 entirely now, but the SDK isn't released, and it doesn't sound like that will happen till after "unannounced projects" are released and they can get it in a good enough state for public use rather than internal

 

[RedSwirl]

Valve won't make HL3 if/until it can be used as a vehicle or test bed for some kind of new technology or service Valve thinks will further its business. Almost all Valve's major releases have been made at least partly for this purpose

Valve isn't really a game company, it's an R&D company.

 

[Newboi]

Depends how you define "the masses". It is used for a few of the VR things and for Dota 2 entirely now, but the SDK isn't released, and it doesn't sound like that will happen till after "unannounced projects" are released and they can get it in a good enough state for public use rather than internal

Thanks for the clarification!