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[Fragamemnon]

FSU gets its way with the NCAA just like it usually does with the Florida Gators.

NCAA changes ruling for FSU

The NCAA will allow Florida State to use its Seminoles nickname in postseason play, removing the school from a list of colleges with American Indian nicknames that were restricted by an NCAA decision earlier this month.

Good deal. I wasn't looking forward to spending hundreds of dollars to replace my current FSU stuff. I'm glad they are dealing with on a case-by-case basis and I hope that the schools that keep a good rep and have affected mascots can get equal treatment. Showing preferential treatment just because they are a big-name school and threated lawsuit would make the NCAA look worse than it already does, if such a thing is possible.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

maybe now they can get back to the business of recruiting future criminals to their football team.

 

[Archaix]

maybe now they can get back to the business of recruiting future criminals to their football team.

Come on now, it's not all about potential criminals. They recruit a lot of people that have years of criminal experience, too!

 

[Matlock]

Bullshit. Either cut 'em all, or none.

Crookedass NCAA.

 

[acidviper]

Come on now, it's not all about potential criminals. They recruit a lot of people that have years of criminal experience, too!

FSU = Free Shoe University

 

[Archaix]

Bullshit. Either cut 'em all, or none.

Crookedass NCAA.

The Florida Seminole tribe has an agreement with Florida State University allowing them to use,and supporting the use of, the Seminole name. Using a native american theme for a mascot is not inherently offensive. Something like the MLB Indians logo or the name Redskins is different.

 

[StrikerObi]

Hell yeah we do!

F-L-O-R-I-D-A S-T-A-T-E!

 

[Matlock]

The Florida Seminole tribe has an agreement with Florida State University allowing them to use,and supporting the use of, the Seminole name. Using a native american theme for a mascot is not inherently offensive. Something like the MLB Indians logo or the name Redskins is different.

Then I redact my prior statement. If the Sem's are cool with it, then let 'em go.

 

[Teddman]

Something like the MLB Indians logo or the name Redskins is different.

Why would you consider the Redskins name inherently offensive?

 

[StrikerObi]

Then I redact my prior statement. If the Sem's are cool with it, then let 'em go.

The sad part is that we have ALWAYS had this agreement with the Seminole Tribe. It's not like just signed it to get our name back. We have been friendly with the Seminole Tribe for years upon years, and the NCAA chose to ignore this originally and label us racists. Judgmental asshats.

 

[Archaix]

Why would you consider the Redskins name inherently offensive?

Because it's a racial slur.

Granted, most people of native american descent don't really give a damn about it, but it's still offensive in nature.

edit: Just out of curiousity, how many high schools are there that still use "indian" names? The school I graduated from does(the Mohawks...we had a tan white guy dress up as our mascot, plus paid royalties to FSU so that we could use their theme song as ours), and most people I encountered while at college seemed so shocked that there were high schools still out there with nicknames like that.

 

[Teddman]

Because it's a racial slur.

Granted, most people of native american descent don't really give a damn about it, but it's still offensive in nature.

I don't agree. By your logic, calling someone "black" is a racial slur. It's a reference to skin color, but it's not considered offensive.

Not to mention the origins of the team's name, in recognition of the team's head coach... Who himself was Native American:

The Washington franchise originally was located in Boston and was called the Braves until it was purchased by George Preston Marshall in 1932. He changed the name to the Boston Redskins in honor of the team's head coach, William "Lone Star" Dietz, who was an American Indian. The team moved to Washington in 1937 and was renamed the Washington Redskins.

 

[Archaix]

I don't agree. By your logic, calling someone "black" is a racial slur. It's a reference to skin color and is not considered offensive.

Not to mention the origins of the team's name, in recognition of the team's head coach... Who himself was Native American:

It's actually closer to calling somebody "colored" or "negro". It's not nigger, but it's not really acceptable either. Both of which, by the way, likely would have been acceptable had the Washington franchise had a black head coach in the thirtees.

 

[Teddman]

It's actually closer to calling somebody "colored" or "negro". It's not nigger, but it's not really acceptable either.

That's a complete mischaracterization, it's not analogous to any of the terms you've listed. The term "Redskin" has virtually no connotation to the public these days, besides as a player on a football team. Somebody says Redskins, you think football team. It's hardly used in parlance otherwise... Not true of your comparisons.

 

[Archaix]

That's a complete mischaracterization, it's not analogous to any of the terms you've listed.

Yes, it really is analogous. "Redskin" and "negro" or "colored" would fall under the exact same classification. It's a term that was born out of ignorance and a lack of acceptance. Over time, it became unacceptable to use. If there were more native american people around(You know, if we didn't try to kill them all off), it'd be just as ignorant to call somebody "Redskin" as it is to call somebody "Negro". That's the only reason it has no connotation in today's world, because it simply isn't a large enough group to let the public know how offensive it is.

 

[Teddman]

That's the only reason it has no connotation in today's world, because it simply isn't a large enough group to let the public know how offensive it is.

Ridiculous... "Let's go give a term an offensive connotation when it doesn't currently have one!" What's next, change the name of Notre Dame's Fighting Irish?

I'm glad the judge involved with the 2003 Redskins Trademark case had a different viewpoint:

"There is no evidence in the record that addresses whether the use of the term "redskin(s)" in the context of a football team and related entertainment services would be viewed by a substantial composite of Native Americans, in the relevant time frame, as disparaging," she wrote.

 

[pxleyes]

Hell yeah we do!

F-L-O-R-I-D-A S-T-A-T-E!

holy shit, they learned to spell. the end is near.

 

[SteveMeister]

And not only that, folks in the DC area *LOVE* the Redskins. We're rabid fans, we revere the team and support them even when they're not playing as well as we'd like.

People don't name sports teams after things they hate. They name them after things they think are cool, things they think are tough. Things that evoke honor, bravery, all those good qualities. So while it's a shame that people get offended by them, it's also a shame because the people who named the team and love the team had no ill intent.

 

[Archaix]

Ridiculous... "Let's go give a term an offensive connotation when it doesn't currently have one!" What's next, change the name of Notre Dame's Fighting Irish?

I'm glad the judge involved with the 2003 Redskins Trademark case had a different viewpoint:

First of all, yes, the Fightin' Irish should be changed. But that's just because it's damned stupid and the leprechaun is condescending.

And second, the judge was wrong. That's all there is to it. Once again. Colored and negro didn't have any offensive connotation. That's because the people who used them did so out of ignorance. Redskin is the exact same way. You can keep saying that it's not offensive, but you're simply doing so out of ignorance.

It's not offensive enough to piss off most people. But you can guarantee that if a team were called the "Negroes" or the "Darkies" there's be a whole hell of a lot of anger. This is only because there'd be a whole hell of a lot more angry people, not because those terms are any more offensive.

edit: SteveMeister- I agree. There was no intent on being offensive. But lack of intent doesn't mean it still can't be offensive.

 

[Phoenix]

So while it's a shame that people get offended by them, it's also a shame because the people who named the team and love the team had no ill intent.

Well its like naming a water polo team the "Wetbacks". While you may not have intended to offend anyone, don't be surprised if people get upset about it.

 

[SteveMeister]

Well its like naming a water polo team the "Wetbacks". While you may not have intended to offend anyone, don't be surprised if people get upset about it.

Right -- that's why I said it's a shame on both accounts.