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[PlanetSmasher]

I'm assuming the more demons I have in my party the less xp I earn after battles as it's an even split, correct?

Also, I've just hit level 10 and I'm unsure how to spend my app points. So far I've spent them on +1 MC skill slot, +1 demon skill slot, and 6 demon party slots. The latter which I regret, I shouldn't have spent that many. So what's the consensus on most worthwhile upgrades this early in the game?

I got the passive MP regeneration skill, which is really nice for the hero considering how rare MP heal items are. You may also want to invest in Fundraiser.

Also, IS EXP an even split? I thought it was a set amount, and your backup demons just get a percentage of that at the end of combat.

 

[Forkball]

Holy hell, Medusa nearly wiped out my entire team in one go, but my protag managed to finish her off in his last desperation attack. ZAN+3 THANK YOU DEMONS. Even if you dominate all battle, a single turn could screw everything up.

 

[Jinfash]

For me it's been MC skill slots and Demon skill slots. I spent some on Fundraiser, but so far that hasn't been THAT great. I may get the MP-walk skill though.

I got the passive MP regeneration skill, which is really nice for the hero considering how rare MP heal items are. You may also want to invest in Fundraiser.

Also, IS EXP an even split? I thought it was a set amount, and your backup demons just get a percentage of that at the end of combat.

Yeah, MP walk is the only other thing I'm considering at this point.

As for XP, I hope I'm wrong. I mean, I know for a fact that backup demons get les XP but does their number impact the split for either the active party or backups? That's what I'd like to know.

 

[SteeloDMZ]

I just realized that if you pass a turn during a fight, you don't lose it and goes to the next demon. That's very helpful if you want to exploit demon's weaknesses.

 

[Dresden]

How much does MP recovery restore? I'll probably get the skill mutator next.

 

[Ourobolus]

I just realized that if you pass a turn during a fight, you don't lose it and goes to the next demon. That's very helpful if you want to exploit demon's weaknesses.

You lose HALF a turn. If your press turn icon is blinking, that means it's a half-turn. If you have a blinking press turn icon and you take an action it uses the half-turn first. So if you Pass twice, you use a full turn.

It's the same for when you exploit a weakness or get a critical. You only expend half a turn instead of a full turn.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

I just realized that if you pass a turn during a fight, you don't lose it and goes to the next demon. That's very helpful if you want to exploit demon's weaknesses.

Kind of. If you Pass, it uses up half of the turn. So if you're on a flashing Press Turn icon and you pass, it'll consume the rest of it. But if you Pass on a normal one, it's basically the same as getting a Once More for that turn.

 

[jello44]

I just realized that if you pass a turn during a fight, you don't lose it and goes to the next demon. That's very helpful if you want to exploit demon's weaknesses.

Yup, the glory that is the Press Turn System.

 

[Freyjadour]

Running into a roadblock against

Spoiler

Medusa

. I can get her to the final critical HP point but she always wipes my entire party by using her special attack three times in a row once that last bit of dialogue plays.

Maybe I just need to just hire a third demon with Zan and just brute force my way through the fight like I did with

Spoiler

Minotaur

.

Not particularly pleased that that seems to be the only clean strategy for these early bosses.

 

[CSX]

Trying to figure out how to spend app points is more frustrating than strategize your fusions

 

[PlanetSmasher]

Not particularly pleased that that seems to be the only clean strategy for these early bosses.

Yeah, it's not exactly fun to fight bosses who can wipe your entire party in a single turn when you have full HP across the board.

It's especially not fun to fight two of them just ten minutes apart from each other. Hopefully once the game opens up a bit, it loosens up a little on the instakill nonsense. Nocturne was never this bad with it outside of Matador.

 

[Dresden]

Hopefully once the game opens up a bit, it loosens up a little on the instakill nonsense.

Heh.

 

[Urban Scholar]

Heh.

Surely it would've been better to type in all caps never. Aahaha

 

[chickdigger802]

out of curiosity, what does 'easy' do in this game?

I recall devil survivor oc it was pretty much just an exp boost and didn't really change difficulty of the game.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

Heh.

I can prepare for Hama and Mudo. I can't prepare for "lol I just used Snake Eyes three times in one turn and it did 250 damage to a demon with full HP".

Nocturne felt so much more balanced than this. :[

 

[Tamanon]

After a while you start seeing patterns during the negotiations, so they aren't entirely random.

Tell that to the zombies who responded to the "Are you a monkey?" question by attacking me for both answers!

 

[Velkyn]

Yeah, it's not exactly fun to fight bosses who can wipe your entire party in a single turn when you have full HP across the board.

Nocturne on the hardest difficulty had random encounters in the first half or so of the game that spent their first turn mudo-ing your entire party. It's kind of SMT tradition at this point.

I'm still not on the third stratum of Naraku, and I'm having a blast. This is definitely competing with SMT 2 and Nocturne for my favourite mainline SMT game already.

 

[Urban Scholar]

I can prepare for Hama and Mudo. I can't prepare for "lol I just used Snake Eyes three times in one turn and it did 250 damage to a demon with full HP".

Nocturne felt so much more balanced than this. :[

I'm sorry but ahahaha no, I disagree with this so much. Fights ever few foot steps(random) and the conditions were more or less the same

 

[Fake Charlemagne]

Nocturne felt so much more balanced than this. :[

I'm still not terribly far in, but if there is one piece of criticism I could level towards the game so far, it's this.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

I'm sorry but ahahaha no, I disagree with this so much. Fights ever few foot steps(random) and the conditions were more or less the same

Nocturne's enemies didn't all have multi-hit attacks that can crit four or five times in the same Press Turn though. That's the part that bugs me, these random "we can hit your entire party for a ton of damage, or hit two or three of your demons for 3x their max HP each" attacks.

Fights may have been more frequent in Nocturne, but once you beat Matador the difficulty curve smoothed out to something reasonable. SMTIV has been in straight-up Matador mode from minute one and hasn't let up for a second. I died six times in the FIRST ROOM of the game.

 

[decoyplatypus]

I'm assuming the more demons I have in my party the less xp I earn after battles as it's an even split, correct?

Also, I've just hit level 10 and I'm unsure how to spend my app points. So far I've spent them on +1 MC skill slot, +1 demon skill slot, and 6 demon party slots. The latter which I regret, I shouldn't have spent that many. So what's the consensus on most worthwhile upgrades this early in the game?

I did pretty much the same as you although I may have taken a few more skill slots before I got up to six stock expansions. In fact, I've still only taken additional skill slots and demon stock expansions. For a few hours the extra stock seemed like overkill, but I've quickly reached the point where I have six or seven front-line demons (who rotate in based on MP or what kinds of enemies I'm seeing), a support demon, and then fusion fodder. I'm happy with my purchases.

Anyone going MAG build: fuse a Suparna as soon as you hit level 15. It learns Spirit Drain, which means you won't have to waste point APP points on MP walk, and you won't have to trek back to base quite so often.

I'm sorry but ahahaha no, I disagree with this so much. Fights ever few foot steps(random) and the conditions were more or less the same

It's been a few years since I've played Nocturne, but I remember its random encounters being less frequent than fights in SMT4, even when dodging reasonably avoidable enemies.

 

[Incendiary]

Cheat basically rolls a die to fake out the demon. So if a demon wants like 300 macca and you don't want to pay it, you can choose "Cheat" for a chance to not pay it. However, if you fail, the demon attacks you.

So far I've only been able to cheat demons once per recruitment attempt. Every time I've tried a second time they've attacked me, but I could just be unlucky. But cheating's very helpful if they ask for an item you don't have or don't want to give up.

Nocturne felt so much more balanced than this. :[

I think you're misremembering Nocturne. To me, so far this feels nearly the same as Nocturne in terms of difficulty. The only difference is physical demons are more useless due to their lower MP. Everything else is pretty much the same to me in terms of balance. In fact, considering I haven't run into any Hama or Mudo yet I'd say it's slightly more balanced in favor of the player.

 

[Tamanon]

I like Demilingual as an app. But I think it only appears after you try to talk to a demon you normally wouldn't be able to talk to.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

I think you're misremembering Nocturne. To me, so far this feels nearly the same as Nocturne in terms of difficulty. The only difference is physical demons are more useless due to their lower MP. Everything else is pretty much the same to me in terms of balance. In fact, considering I haven't run into any Hama or Mudo yet I'd say it's slightly more balanced in favor of the player.

I think that's the problem - enemies being strong isn't a bad thing, it's how WEAK the player's party is. It's like you're made of paper. Early-game enemies in Nocturne may have had Hama and Mudo spells to throw around, but their sheer damage output wasn't that high outside of Matador's hit-all spells.

Meanwhile, in SMTIV, even the weakest enemies can somehow output near fatal damage without the slightest bit of effort, meaning if you don't get a pre-emptive attack and start hitting weaknesses in the FIRST press turn, you're going to get countered and lose at least one party member. There's really nothing you can do to defend against hit-all spells that do a minimum of 90 damage per hit and can hit up to six times per turn.

 

[PK Gaming]

I just realized that if you pass a turn during a fight, you don't lose it and goes to the next demon. That's very helpful if you want to exploit demon's weaknesses.

I think it's luck based, since I haven't gotten to consistently work.

How much does MP recovery restore? I'll probably get the skill mutator next.

40 big ones, and that's just level 1. It's definitely worth it though.

 

[Elaugaufein]

I am going to ask a very weird question here. Could someone who's redeemed the ebgames preorder code for the hoodie send me a picture of what it looks like in the add-on content menu please.

Thanks.

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

I knew when Issachar was introduced and then discarded at the beginning of the game that he was too fleshed out not to play some important role down the line, but I didn't suspect

Spoiler

it would be in the role of having to be killed because he became a demon.

Sad stuff.

So far I've only been able to cheat demons once per recruitment attempt. Every time I've tried a second time they've attacked me, but I could just be unlucky. But cheating's very helpful if they ask for an item you don't have or don't want to give up.

I've been able to cheat demons more than once in a recruitment, so I think it's just luck. I wouldn't be surprised if a successful cheat decreases your chances for subsequent successful cheats though.

 

[Ace Harding]

First time SMT player. At level 7, exploring the 3rd floor of the beginning dungeon.

Am I supposed to just accept dying in this game, pay the macca (which I never have), and keep going? Or is it better to just load a previous save? Or just a choice, depending on where you are and when your last save was? I'm finding myself just saving frequently and reloading if I die. I'm just not sure if there's some drawback (other than paying macca) that I don't know about. Macca seems really hard to come by in this game so far.

I've been playing this like Etrian Odyssey, which I was playing just before this. So I'll dive into the dungeon, get a little more mapped out, get some xp, maybe pick up a relic, try to recruit a demon, then head back up to town to recover before diving back down.

I'm finding this a reeeeally slow start. I'm around 3 hours in, and not really getting it yet. I mean I see the light at the end of the tunnel - messing around fusing demons, getting a lot of new skills to use, developing my character - seems like that will be cool down the line. But right now I don't have buffs/debuffs, enemies are pretty one-dimensional, and they're also really strong so I die a lot. And there's no real story to speak of. Its like Etrian Odyssey with a less-satisfying combat system and none of the fun of mapping.

I assume it gets better, I'm just a little disappointed with the start.

 

[Incendiary]

I like Demilingual as an app. But I think it only appears after you try to talk to a demon you normally wouldn't be able to talk to.

So far I'm at level 11 and I've taken Demolingual, +1 skill slots for MC and demons, +2 stock slots, and I think that's it outside story-related apps. It feels like app points are really rare and not coming fast enough considering how many options I have. I want to buy things like Fundraiser or the extra EXP apps, but it seems like such a waste compared to saving up for extra skill slots.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

I think SMT4 is actually easier than Nocturne. The save system helps, but I just feel like I have more options at my disposal than I ever did in Nocturne's opening acts.

Or just a choice, depending on where you are and when your last save was?

This one.

I'm finding this a reeeeally slow start. I'm around 3 hours in, and not really getting it yet. I mean I see the light at the end of the tunnel - messing around fusing demons, getting a lot of new skills to use, developing my character - seems like that will be cool down the line. But right now I don't have buffs/debuffs, enemies are pretty one-dimensional, and they're also really strong so I die a lot. And there's no real story to speak of. Its like Etrian Odyssey with a less-satisfying combat system and none of the fun of mapping.

I assume it gets better, I'm just a little disappointed with the start.

I don't know how you can get disappointed really, I think the start is brilliant, every system works in tandem and the story is delightfully developed. However, it opens up around 6 to 7 hours in.

Hint: if you're dying, fuse and recruit new demons and start down a different path. The game has so many options that you should never take any difficulty lying down.

 

[Pooya]

finally started playing, the game looks pretty nice on XL.

 

[Incendiary]

Meanwhile, in SMTIV, even the weakest enemies can somehow output near fatal damage without the slightest bit of effort, meaning if you don't get a pre-emptive attack and start hitting weaknesses in the FIRST press turn, you're going to get countered and lose at least one party member. There's really nothing you can do to defend against hit-all spells that do a minimum of 90 damage per hit and can hit up to six times per turn.

Yeah, after I posted I realized that counterpoint. Everything in this game is fine and dandy if you get a pre-emptive strike or at least get to attack first. If the enemy gets to attack first, though, it's likely they're going to kill one of your demons outright unless you get lucky or all your demons are high-HP bruisers.

On the other hand, having a stock of demons you can switch out on the fly is pretty helpful. I don't remember if that option was in Nocturne, but it literally saved my ass during one of the horde fights because I was able to bring in a demon that was strong against the horde's main attack and had a spell to take advantage of their weakness.

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

So is there only that one area, and one door in the DLC Challenge Quest?


And it sucks that I can't try to make the demons join my team.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

Yeah, after I posted I realized that counterpoint. Everything in this game is fine and dandy if you get a pre-emptive strike or at least get to attack first. If the enemy gets to attack first, though, it's likely they're going to kill one of your demons outright unless you get lucky or all your demons are high-HP bruisers.

On the other hand, having a stock of demons you can switch out on the fly is pretty helpful. I don't remember if that option was in Nocturne, but it literally saved my ass during one of the horde fights because I was able to bring in a demon that was strong against the horde's main attack and had a spell to take advantage of their weakness.

You could definitely switch demons out in Nocturne. Your party reserves were increased slowly as part of the plot (as opposed to being a skill you manually upgrade), but that was part of the main concept of the game - switching demons out to deal with anything the game threw at you.

If they just tweaked the enemies' damage output a bit, or made it so enemies can't smirk and then immediately use multi-hit attacks to crit your entire party three times, it might make things a little better. But battles are just woefully one-sided in SMTIV - either you wipe the floor with them right off the bat or they tear you to shreds. There are no long battles of attrition, and it's basically impossible to make a comeback once an enemy gets the advantage over you.

 

[Freyjadour]

I think that's the problem - enemies being strong isn't a bad thing, it's how WEAK the player's party is. It's like you're made of paper. Early-game enemies in Nocturne may have had Hama and Mudo spells to throw around, but their sheer damage output wasn't that high outside of Matador's hit-all spells.

Meanwhile, in SMTIV, even the weakest enemies can somehow output near fatal damage without the slightest bit of effort, meaning if you don't get a pre-emptive attack and start hitting weaknesses in the FIRST press turn, you're going to get countered and lose at least one party member. There's really nothing you can do to defend against hit-all spells that do a minimum of 90 damage per hit and can hit up to six times per turn.

I think my primary complaint is that Nocturne had a strategic element to its boss fights that consisted of more than just: "Don't have a party full of Bufu/Zan/Agi/Zio Demons? Fuck you."

I was pretty miffed with how easy

Spoiler

Minotaur

became after adding just one additional Bufu Demon (2 => 3). I was going to chalk it up to the first 7 hours heavily favoring MAG MC and move on, but to hear that it's a recurring pattern is disappointing to say the least.

 

[FantasyFreak07]

Man, the Game Over screen is too long...

 

[Toki767]

Man, the Game Over screen is too long...

Press X to skip.

 

[Elaugaufein]

I think it's luck based, since I haven't gotten to consistently work

Its been consistant for me. It uses "half" ie same as it was in DDS/Avatar Tuner.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

I think my primary complaint is that Nocturne had a strategic element to its boss fights that consisted of more than just: "Don't have a party full of Bufu/Zan/Agi/Zio Demons? Fuck you."

I was pretty miffed with how easy

Spoiler

Minotaur

became after adding just one additional Bufu Demon (2 => 3). I was going to chalk it up to the first 7 hours heavily favoring MAG MC and move on, but to hear that it's a recurring pattern is disappointing to say the least.

I'm hoping it changes once the game opens up a bit more. I am not enjoying the boss fights thus far, since it really does feel like buff spells are useless and there are no demons with good resistances to give you a good defense against bosses. It's all just "do as much damage as you can as fast as you can or the boss will wipe you".

Man, the Game Over screen is too long...

Yes. Yes it is. We get it, game, we're in hell. Just skip straight to Charon after the second or third time the player dies - we don't need to see that slow, painful pan up to his desk every time.

 

[chickdigger802]

I think the key difference between this is dark souls for me is, hey if i messed up in DS, its usually my fault.

If my attack just happens to MISS here though, my party could be wiped, or i lose like 1 or 2 guys.

hmmm...

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

How exactly does evolution work?

 

[Volcynika]

Press X to fly through Game Over sequence

Trufax.

 

[CSX]

How exactly does evolution work?

Once a demon that can evolve reaches a certain level , it will ask u if you will let it evolve. Then say yes. Very few demons evolve though I believe

 

[PlanetSmasher]

Press X to fly through Game Over sequence

Trufax.

It really shouldn't even need to come to that though. They obviously know it takes too long, so maybe they should've trimmed it down a bit. Just because you can speed the text up a bit doesn't mean they still didn't make a Too Human-esque game over sequence in a game where you're likely to die at least two or three times per play session.

 

[Volcynika]

It really shouldn't even need to come to that though. They obviously know it takes too long, so maybe they should've trimmed it down a bit. Just because you can speed the text up a bit doesn't mean they still didn't make a Too Human-esque game over sequence in a game where you're likely to die at least two or three times per play session.

But it's extremely fast anyways. And they probably wanted it to make some sense rather than a message box appearing say "Pay play coins/macca to revive." First time is just long to introduce you to the sequence. And SMT can punish you even after dying

 

[coopolon]

Once a demon that can evolve reaches a certain level , it will ask u if you will let it evolve. Then say yes. Very few demons evolve though I believe

Is it a set level or a range? If set, when is angels level?

 

[PlanetSmasher]

But it's extremely fast anyways. And they probably wanted it to make some sense rather than a message box appearing say "Pay play coins/macca to revive." First time is just long to introduce you to the sequence.

I understand the first time being long to introduce players to the sequence, as well as the ones where he reveals the debt option and the play coin option, or when his buddies unlock Easy Mode for you.

But they could've skipped the painfully long static art pans and multiple dialogue prompts for subsequent deaths. It's just not a good design choice in a game where the player is going to die a lot. The more frequently the player is going to die, the faster the game over screen should be to ensure they're back in action as quickly as possible.

 

[FantasyFreak07]

Yeah it's the lead up to Charon/ Mysterious Man that annoys me. Hey, at least that's more incentive not to die.

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

Once a demon that can evolve reaches a certain level , it will ask u if you will let it evolve. Then say yes. Very few demons evolve though I believe

Doesn't happen to be a list of the Demons that do is there :$

 

[Samyy]

Doesn't happen to be a list of the Demons that do is there :$

The only one that did for me is Angel