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[Salty Rice]

Its really fucked up how many US cops are trigger happy.

Instead of safe i would be scared to be near a police officer in the US.

 

[JaseC]

Officer Mohamed? So which side are the people who usually back police taking in this scenar-

Oh ok.

I'm actually impressed at how utterly nonsensical this is. In the space of a tweet, she both presents and defeats her own argument.

 

[Chichikov]

Most cops today carry Glocks. Glocks do not have a manual safety. If you pull the trigger, it will fire.

Glock touts this as a feature:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glock#Safety

Yeah, but you're really really not supposed to walk around with a bullet in the chamber in it.
In fact, you're not really supposed to walk around with a bullet in a chamber in any gun unless you're about to shoot it.

No idea if that's what the police in the US are trained to do, I hope so, but man, I've see them doing some weird shit with guns.

 

[SolidSnakex]

n/m

 

[Siegcram]

Yup, those signs are right on the money.

Maybe understated, even.

 

[jellies_two]

 

[vewn]

Most cops today carry Glocks. Glocks do not have a manual safety. If you pull the trigger, it will fire.

Glock touts this as a feature:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glock#Safety

Don't put this on the gun - don't aim at things you're not willing to kill.

Yeah, but you're really really not supposed to walk around with a bullet in the chamber in it.
In fact, you're not really supposed to walk around with a bullet in a chamber in any gun unless you're about to shoot it.

No idea if that's what the police in the US are trained to do, I hope so, but man, I've see them doing some weird shit with guns.

Policemen around the globe usually have their guns loaded to be able to respond quickly and not be surprised by attackers. Needing to pull the slide back might make that one second difference where somebody stabs you.

 

[darkinstinct]

I don't understand what the point is she's making. There are 65,000 Somalis in London alone, does that mean that Londoners are likely to be shot be a Somali policeman?

No, London is safe from this imminent danger because they don't wear guns there. But there's a good chance you'll be beaten to death. Those Somali, man, I have heard stories... There's this one Nigerian prince ...

 

[JonnyDBrit]

Even if they did think it was gunfire, wouldn't the expectation be to see that the victim was not carrying a firearm, and since she was a civilian, try to ascertain her safety from a supposed (but actually non-existent) threat?

Good grief, there's nothing in this isn't an absolute failing of the sort of standard that officers of law enforcement should be held to.

 

[Chichikov]

Don't put this on the gun - don't aim at things you're not willing to kill.



Policemen around the globe usually have their guns loaded to be able to respond quickly and not be surprised by attackers. Needing to pull the slide back might make that one second difference where somebody stabs you.

Loaded as in a a clip in or as in a bullet in the chamber?
I am not an expert on the procedure police forces used around the world, but I was in the military and I got to spend some quality time in some rather dangerous places and we were never ever allowed to walk around with a chambered bullet. Even on guard duty in pretty hot areas, places you are way more likely to get stabbed than the twin cities, you would be court martialed if you just chamber a bullet for no good reason.
We were only allowed to chamber a bullet if there was a good chance we're about to shoot something like right now, and after you're done shooting (or whatever reason made you chamber a bullet is not longer at play) the first thing you do is unchamber (that's how you say that?) your gun.

And we had firearms with better safety measures than a most handguns and had more training in their usage than your average police officer (this is not a criticism of police officers by the way, their mission, purpose and required skillset is very different than soldiers).

So if that's indeed the case that cops walk around with a chambered bullet (quick search did not yield something conclusive) then I think it's a terrible terrible policy. Though as I said before, this will not shock me as I have seen cops in the US handle guns in rather questionable ways.

 

[adin75]

Loaded as in a a clip in or as in a bullet in the chamber?
I am not an expert on the procedure police forces used around the world, but I was in the military and I got to spend some quality time in some rather dangerous places and we were never ever allowed to walk around with a chambered bullet. Even on guard duty in pretty hot areas, places you are way more likely to get stabbed than the twin cities, you would be court martialed if you just chamber a bullet for no good reason.
We were only allowed to chamber a bullet if there was a good chance we're about to shoot something like right now, and after you're done shooting (or whatever reason made you chamber a bullet is not longer at play) the first thing you do is unchamber (that's how you say that?) your gun.

And we had firearms with better safety measures than a most handguns and had more training in their usage than your average police officer (this is not a criticism of police officers by the way, their mission, purpose and required skillset is very different than soldiers).

So if that's indeed the case that cops walk around with a chambered bullet (quick search did not yield something conclusive) then I think it's a terrible terrible policy. Though as I said before, this will not shock me as I have seen cops in the US handle guns in rather questionable ways.

In Victoria, Australia, our SAP is racked and ready to fire on duty. We use the M&P40, which has no manual safety. Firearm safety is taken very seriously as a result.

At the academy even screwing around with the training guns (essentially a solid plastic replica, no moving parts) is considered a serious safety breach and can very quickly have you shown the gate.

 

[Tovarisc]

Most cops today carry Glocks. Glocks do not have a manual safety. If you pull the trigger, it will fire.

Glock touts this as a feature:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glock#Safety

Yeah, but you're really really not supposed to walk around with a bullet in the chamber in it.
In fact, you're not really supposed to walk around with a bullet in a chamber in any gun unless you're about to shoot it.

No idea if that's what the police in the US are trained to do, I hope so, but man, I've see them doing some weird shit with guns.

Even if you have round chambered you never put finger on the trigger if you don't intent to kill person or object that you are looking / aiming at. Finger safety is always used even if firearm has actual safety too, it takes just split second to move finger to trigger and pull.

When you have your safety off and wave your gun around with finger on trigger you get shit like this here, people getting killed for absolutely no reason.

Loaded as in a a clip in or as in a bullet in the chamber?
I am not an expert on the procedure police forces used around the world, but I was in the military and I got to spend some quality time in some rather dangerous places and we were never ever allowed to walk around with a chambered bullet. Even on guard duty in pretty hot areas, places you are way more likely to get stabbed than the twin cities, you would be court martialed if you just chamber a bullet for no good reason.
We were only allowed to chamber a bullet if there was a good chance we're about to shoot something like right now, and after you're done shooting (or whatever reason made you chamber a bullet is not longer at play) the first thing you do is unchamber (that's how you say that?) your gun.

And we had firearms with better safety measures than a most handguns and had more training in their usage than your average police officer (this is not a criticism of police officers by the way, their mission, purpose and required skillset is very different than soldiers).

So if that's indeed the case that cops walk around with a chambered bullet (quick search did not yield something conclusive) then I think it's a terrible terrible policy. Though as I said before, this will not shock me as I have seen cops in the US handle guns in rather questionable ways.

I imagine it varies from country to country. I can see police in e.g. Israel having their weapons ready to go (bullet chambered) all the time along with military patrols they have in bigger cities. I think in Finland they have mags in their sidearms, but no rounds chambered.

I also was trained in military that you don't chamber round if you don't expect to get into firefight in near future and always make sure there isn't round in the rifle when entering friendly vehicle, tent etc. for obvious safety reasons. Naturally most of these rules / guidelines get thrown out of the window during active war time.

 

[Chichikov]

In Victoria, Australia, our SAP is racked and ready to fire on duty. We use the M&P40, which has no manual safety. Firearm safety is taken very seriously as a result.

At the academy even screwing around with the training guns (essentially a solid plastic replica, no moving parts) is considered a serious safety breach and can very quickly have you shown the gate.

I don't know what to tell you, I had this argument with American gun owners before (IRL and even on this board) and the idea of walking around with a bullet in the chamber never made sense to me.

It doesn't take a whole lot of training to be able to chamber bullet as you bring your firearm up to aim it. I guess it is possible that it will cause a few milliseconds of delay that in some rare cases would be the difference between life and death, but I don't think the safety concerned are worth it.
I mean we don't walk around aiming our guns at people even though having to unholster and aim your gun (even with a chambered bullet) can also be the difference between life and death in some cases (and I would think it's more likely than having to chamber a bullet as pulling a gun, aiming and acquiring a target takes longer in most cases than chambering a bullet).

It's not like the military decided to do it because they hate or afraid than guns, they did because there were A TON of gun related accidents.

Even if you have round chambered you never put finger on the trigger if you don't intent to kill person or object that you are looking / aiming at. Finger safety is always used even if firearm has actual safety too, it takes just split second to move finger to trigger and pull.

When you have your safety off and wave your gun around with finger on trigger you get shit like this here, people getting killed for absolutely no reason.

Yeah, agreed 100%.
I have seen some really scary lack of muzzle and trigger discipline from American cops, especially SWAT units. I have no idea how common that is though as it's all anecdotal.

I imagine it varies from country to country. I can see police in e.g. Israel having their weapons ready to go (bullet chambered) all the time along with military patrols they have in bigger cities. I think in Finland they have mags in their sidearms, but no rounds chambered.

I also was trained in military that you don't chamber round if you don't expect to get into firefight in near future and always make sure there isn't round in the rifle when entering friendly vehicle, tent etc. for obvious safety reasons. Naturally most of these rules / guidelines get thrown out of the window during active war time.

I'm from Israel and what I'm talking about here is based on my experience in the IDF.

 

[Shadowhelper]

I just think its insane people are lumping this in with the proliferation of racist cops killing young minority men. Sorry this is not the same at all.

 

[BruceCLea]

WHAT THE FUDGE?

Is she saying Somalis are defacto murderers? I can't even.

https://youtu.be/zwoGrDa5g2c

 

[Tovarisc]

Yeah, agreed 100%.
I have seen some really scary lack of muzzle and trigger discipline from American cops, especially SWAT units. I have no idea how common that is though as it's all anecdotal.

I'm from Israel and what I'm talking about here is based on my experience in the IDF.

Interesting. I imagine police follow same safety guidelines with firearms then there? I guess this is what you get from assuming based on too little facts, but TIL.

On whole American cops and guns thing. I think we as foreigners get mostly bad picture from their behavior in general to using their firearms because we get exposed more to these negative news than positive news about American police. For that reason I have mental image that American police are quite reckless, shakily trained and very afraid in their jobs.

Doesn't help that on here and other places that isn't news you keep hearing negative stuff about American police.

 

[Easy_D]

Officer Mohamed? So which side are the people who usually back police taking in this scenar-

Oh ok.

That's fucking vile even by Coulter standards.

 

[The Spoony Hou]

Officer Mohamed? So which side are the people who usually back police taking in this scenar-

Oh ok.

This is disgusting. She should be arrested for that.

 

[Raiden]

Officer Mohamed? So which side are the people who usually back police taking in this scenar-

Oh ok.

I cant believe she is really tweeting that and over 6k people are liking the tweet.


Madness.

 

[Javier23]

"It is unknown to BCA agents what exactly happened, but the female became deceased in the alley."

Magic.

 

[vewn]

Loaded as in a a clip in or as in a bullet in the chamber?
I am not an expert on the procedure police forces used around the world, but I was in the military and I got to spend some quality time in some rather dangerous places and we were never ever allowed to walk around with a chambered bullet. Even on guard duty in pretty hot areas, places you are way more likely to get stabbed than the twin cities, you would be court martialed if you just chamber a bullet for no good reason.
We were only allowed to chamber a bullet if there was a good chance we're about to shoot something like right now, and after you're done shooting (or whatever reason made you chamber a bullet is not longer at play) the first thing you do is unchamber (that's how you say that?) your gun.

And we had firearms with better safety measures than a most handguns and had more training in their usage than your average police officer (this is not a criticism of police officers by the way, their mission, purpose and required skillset is very different than soldiers).

So if that's indeed the case that cops walk around with a chambered bullet (quick search did not yield something conclusive) then I think it's a terrible terrible policy. Though as I said before, this will not shock me as I have seen cops in the US handle guns in rather questionable ways.

Had the same experience in the military as you, even on guard duty there is no bullet chambered, for police forces it doesn't seem uncommon tho. It's also much harder to trigger a pistol when holstered (a Glock atleast when using the right holster) than a rifle - unless you carry it in your hands all the time, i guess?.

I'll try to find some stats on shooting accidents of police forces outside the US

 

[F34R]

Yes, firearms are always considered loaded and ready to fire. That being said, in our department, we didn't have a policy on whether your gun had to be loaded or not. I wouldn't go without it being loaded. The need to pull from the holster to defend yourself doesn't need to include pulling the slide back just to chamber a round. The amount of stress going through at a particular instance can really diminish the fine motor skills and/or simply make you not know you don't have a round chambered.

It's a bad idea in my opinion.

 

[Duxxy3]

Every police force in the country needs re-training. They no longer do the job they were intended to do.

 

[hirokazu]

I kinda feel angry reading that but then again, I'm in Australia and it's pretty obvious to most people here the reason why this sort of thing happens all the time in the US and not here.

So I don't actually lose out from her terrible opinions and shouldn't be too mad. ¯\_(&#12484_/¯ America, sort your shit out.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

I kinda feel angry reading that but then again, I'm in Australia and it's pretty obvious to most people here the reason why this sort of thing happens all the time in the US and not here.

So I don't actually lose out from her terrible opinions and shouldn't be too mad. ¯\_(&#12484_/¯ America, sort your shit out.

Nothing Coulter says is worth even a moment's examination. She's the literal embodiment of early internet trolls, just saying some inflammatory shit because she knows people react. It's been her thing forever, and it amazes me that anyone even gives her the time of day.

 

[Izuna]

Slap?

If it was a loud noise, is it not a bang?

 

[Hitmeneer]

Yes, firearms are always considered loaded and ready to fire. That being said, in our department, we didn't have a policy on whether your gun had to be loaded or not. I wouldn't go without it being loaded. The need to pull from the holster to defend yourself doesn't need to include pulling the slide back just to chamber a round. The amount of stress going through at a particular instance can really diminish the fine motor skills and/or simply make you not know you don't have a round chambered.

It's a bad idea in my opinion.

I mean, no disrespect as I never touched a gun and hopefully never will need too and being a cop is not a easy job, but if someones fine motor skills are that much effected in that situation that he / she can not load a gun, maybe that person should already not be able to use guns in those situations? I don't say everyone has to be a cold handed killer, without fear, but if he / she already has problems using (loading) a gun properly in these situations, he/she should not be able to fire one?

 

[Kenstar]

I don't know what to tell you, I had this argument with American gun owners before (IRL and even on this board) and the idea of walking around with a bullet in the chamber never made sense to me.

It doesn't take a whole lot of training to be able to chamber bullet as you bring your firearm up to aim it. I guess it is possible that it will cause a few milliseconds of delay that in some rare cases would be the difference between life and death, but I don't think the safety concerned are worth it.
I mean we don't walk around aiming our guns at people even though having to unholster and aim your gun (even with a chambered bullet) can also be the difference between life and death in some cases (and I would think it's more likely than having to chamber a bullet as pulling a gun, aiming and acquiring a target takes longer in most cases than chambering a bullet).

It's not like the military decided to do it because they hate or afraid than guns, they did because there were A TON of gun related accidents.

Yeah, agreed 100%.
I have seen some really scary lack of muzzle and trigger discipline from American cops, especially SWAT units. I have no idea how common that is though as it's all anecdotal.


I'm from Israel and what I'm talking about here is based on my experience in the IDF.

I'm assuming you had your guns out in your hands on guard and on patrol right?

Police have theirs holstered 99% of the time and are less likely to be shot at from 100m out and more likely to be attacked physically up close, the time it takes to pull your charging handle is probably quicker than drawing a handgun from a holster.

I dont have a problem with carrying in condition 0 (Chambered and cocked) as much as i have a problem with police pulling their guns for every little thing like 'furtive movements' and wallet reaches and 'feared for mah life'

having it condition 0 also allows for one handed use if someone grabs/pins you or your left hand is injured, etc

 

[F34R]

I mean, no disrespect as I never touched a gun and hopefully never will need too and being a cop is not a easy job, but if someones fine motor skills are that much effected in that situation that he / she can not load a gun, maybe that person should already not be able to use guns in those situations? I don't say everyone has to be a cold handed killer, without fear, but if he / she already has problems using (loading) a gun properly in these situations, he/she should not be able to fire one?

I didn't word that properly. Insert > "It is sometimes taught that fine motor skills can be affected" That doesn't necessarily mean it does. You want to use the least amount of movements you can to accomplish a goal. The bad guy doesn't come unloaded, doesn't have to wait for a threat, then pull from the holster, while scanning the area for victims, other threats, is it safe to shoot, etc. When I have to respond to a threat, the more things needing to be done to respond gives me less and less chances to live.