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The Flash S2 |OT2| Jays of Future Past - Tuesdays 8/7c
- Thread starter TheOddOne
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TTOOLL
Member
Yeah, though I like the show I tend to agree. Barry it reaching insane levels of stupidity. Also, the show has been doing a lot of things for the plot's sake and not because they would make sense. It's starting to follow Arrow's path...
Yeah, the drop off for Arrow happened around Season 3 for me.
BLOODED_hands
Member
So I saw a movie with Wells and Nora. It was about the Green River Killer. Just thought it was interesting to see 2 Flash TV actors interacting with another. I'm sure there are others.
The Flash S3 |OT| There's No Point In This Flash
The Flash S3 |OT| Barry Has No Idea What He's Doing
The Flash S3 |OT| Shhh, No Reboots only Rebirth
The Flash S3 |OT| A Mother's Flash
The Flash S3 |OT| There's No Point In This Flash
The Flash S3 |OT| Barry Has No Idea What He's Doing
The Flash S3 |OT| Shhh, No Reboots only Rebirth
The Flash S3 |OT| A Mother's Flash
kylecoley182
Banned
The Flash S3 |OT| Bubblebeards revenge
People keep saying Barry is an idiot after starting Flashpoint, but I thought like it felt like enough. Think about it: Barry has just lost his dad and essentially KILLED himself. Then he finds a version if his dad that he can't even talk to because A) He doesn't know Barry is his son on this Earth and B) Because he's on another Earth thats difficult to access from this Earth. Dude is tired of taking L's at this point after sacrificing so much.
The way I look at it is like the Speedforce telling Barry to be at peace with his mom's death only for his dad to die is kinda like being encouraged by your parents not to be upset at failing a class only to cone to terms with it, try even harder and then fail an even more important class. It breaks you because it doesn't seem like there's an end to the tragedy and he has no control over it.
He's never really wanted Iris as an endgame, he's wanted peace and satisfaction and he thought Iris represetned that. But he realized that he still felt empty by the end of it. Like Eobard said in the beginning of this season on the video: Barry will never be happy, even if he gets what he thinks he wants. Plus, Iris is prime to be taken away from him too.
I think the character development is seen in Barry recognizing he can't handle all of these losses and finally is taking things into his own hands.
Plus, if you think about it: his life on Earth 2 rocked and his mom was still alive and he married Iris. In addition, the show we've been watching is actually an altered timeline as the OG timeline was before Reverse Flash came and killed Barry's mom and Barry in that timeline STILL became the Flash, just five years later.
So yeah, the joking about Barry's reverse of character development I feel like needs to slow down a bit lol
The way I look at it is like the Speedforce telling Barry to be at peace with his mom's death only for his dad to die is kinda like being encouraged by your parents not to be upset at failing a class only to cone to terms with it, try even harder and then fail an even more important class. It breaks you because it doesn't seem like there's an end to the tragedy and he has no control over it.
He's never really wanted Iris as an endgame, he's wanted peace and satisfaction and he thought Iris represetned that. But he realized that he still felt empty by the end of it. Like Eobard said in the beginning of this season on the video: Barry will never be happy, even if he gets what he thinks he wants. Plus, Iris is prime to be taken away from him too.
I think the character development is seen in Barry recognizing he can't handle all of these losses and finally is taking things into his own hands.
Plus, if you think about it: his life on Earth 2 rocked and his mom was still alive and he married Iris. In addition, the show we've been watching is actually an altered timeline as the OG timeline was before Reverse Flash came and killed Barry's mom and Barry in that timeline STILL became the Flash, just five years later.
So yeah, the joking about Barry's reverse of character development I feel like needs to slow down a bit lol
kylecoley182
Banned
perfect
Too bad the show never slowed down enough to actually get something like this through.
MHWilliams
Member
The reason people are talking about the reverse is because we have ample examples of how messing with time turns out.
Season 1
- The first time he rewrites history in Out of Time and Rogue Time. Bad shit happens.
- The Season 1 finale includes Barry -1 warning himself not to mess with his mother's death and the wormhole results from Wells trying to screw around and return to his time. The team literally has a discussion about timeline alterations in this one.
Season 2
- Capturing the Reverse-Flash in Season 2 is a major disruption to the timeline, to the point where they have to let him go. This is the RF prior to Barry's mother dying and that decision is a big part of the episode.
- Flash Back introduces the Time Wraiths as further, "Hey, don't screw with the past too much" evidence. This episode is the only time things even remotely work out and requires the help of the entire team to pull it off.
- The season finale see the Time Wraiths again!
The Speedforce was literally setting Barry up for the death of his father. It told him straight out, "More stuff is going to happen. It's going to be hard, but you need to roll with it." It reinforced the fact that his mother's death is part of what put him onto the road of being the Flash and without him, so many more people would've died. It essentially warned him away from this exact moment.
Emotionally, right after his father died, sure. But given everything that's happened and all of the strong reinforcement showing that messing with time has disastrous effects, Barry decision to save his mother is foolhardy at best. And we the viewers believed Barry had moved beyond that, given his decision not to save his mother, to freeing the Reverse Flash from prior to her death, and ultimately his coming to terms with her death at the end of The Runaway Dinosaur.
It absolutely feels like Barry has taken a step back as a person and a hero. And that's probably the story, but hey, I understand people feeling disappointed and saying, "Not this again."
Season 1
- The first time he rewrites history in Out of Time and Rogue Time. Bad shit happens.
- The Season 1 finale includes Barry -1 warning himself not to mess with his mother's death and the wormhole results from Wells trying to screw around and return to his time. The team literally has a discussion about timeline alterations in this one.
Season 2
- Capturing the Reverse-Flash in Season 2 is a major disruption to the timeline, to the point where they have to let him go. This is the RF prior to Barry's mother dying and that decision is a big part of the episode.
- Flash Back introduces the Time Wraiths as further, "Hey, don't screw with the past too much" evidence. This episode is the only time things even remotely work out and requires the help of the entire team to pull it off.
- The season finale see the Time Wraiths again!
The Speedforce was literally setting Barry up for the death of his father. It told him straight out, "More stuff is going to happen. It's going to be hard, but you need to roll with it." It reinforced the fact that his mother's death is part of what put him onto the road of being the Flash and without him, so many more people would've died. It essentially warned him away from this exact moment.
Emotionally, right after his father died, sure. But given everything that's happened and all of the strong reinforcement showing that messing with time has disastrous effects, Barry decision to save his mother is foolhardy at best. And we the viewers believed Barry had moved beyond that, given his decision not to save his mother, to freeing the Reverse Flash from prior to her death, and ultimately his coming to terms with her death at the end of The Runaway Dinosaur.
It absolutely feels like Barry has taken a step back as a person and a hero. And that's probably the story, but hey, I understand people feeling disappointed and saying, "Not this again."
kylecoley182
Banned
Next season I think Jay is going talk some sense into Barry, then all of this non sense will go away.
PHOENIXZERO
Member
<salt>
And according to Google it turns out no one else actually suggested it before me.
</salt>
I rather enjoyed the finale. I can understand the beef with the last few minutes and Barry going back in time and whatnot, but I wonder if this is a case of Neogaf being really critical and the general public thinking it was solid, or if I'm in the minority of thinking it (and the rest of the season for that matter) was pretty good overall.
Wait, did I miss that? I scrolled up and thought he was the first one to suggest it. Ooops.<salt>
And according to Google it turns out no one else actually suggested it before me.
</salt>
EDIT - Hooooly shit I didn't scroll up far enough, hahaha. Sorry about that. It's now fixed in my OP.
There are plenty of people on gaf that really enjoyed the finale as well as the season as a whole. From what I've seen more people are positive on it than negative. I was watching the collider aftershow for the flash finale and some of them were saying they thought season 2 was better than the first. Opinions are varied but most were positive.
MHWilliams
Member
Having issues with the end does not preclude enjoying the finale.
BLOODED_hands
Member
Outside of the superpowered serial killer and his merry band of psychopaths, including two of his very best friends. Who we see killing his father-in-law.
Maddocks
Member
Took my fake credit away? you can't lock up the darkness!
But yeah, I only said Crisis because someone else posted it and I like it so much it should be the title name.
I overall enjoyed this season, but it wasn't as good as S1.
My main problem is the Versus Zoom episode, which is one of the most idiotic things I've watched.
I also don't get the race thing. I know it's been discussed briefly here, but if Barry ended up beating Zoom's ass anyway, why not start from there...?
And it seemed like he was a bit slower on the hamster wheel, but had no problem whopping Zoom afterwards, while he was taking L's left and right from Zoom for the entire season.
My main problem is the Versus Zoom episode, which is one of the most idiotic things I've watched.
I also don't get the race thing. I know it's been discussed briefly here, but if Barry ended up beating Zoom's ass anyway, why not start from there...?
And it seemed like he was a bit slower on the hamster wheel, but had no problem whopping Zoom afterwards, while he was taking L's left and right from Zoom for the entire season.
KonradLaw
Member
They must come from the same people Olicity shippers do, which is Loonytown
Nah nothing wrong with thinking that. I like season one better but if someone told me they like 2 better then that's fine too. Besides I didn't think the quality of the season was any lower than the first season I just liked the story better in season one. Still alot of great stuff in season 2 with the only real negative in the main plot being the way zoom got barry's speed or at least that's my opinion anyway.
brotkasten
Member
I wonder what's going to happen with the Reverse Flash in the first episode. Barry only knocked him out in the finale, instead of outright killing him. I'm actually surprised that Barry was strong enough for that, but the RF should be up and running in no time again.
That's what I said, but it's not really satisfying, because we've never seen Reverb being like Cisco in that regard.
I really, really wish they had put JWS into the first, classic Jay outfit. Which brings me to the point again, where did he get the design and suit from?
That looks miles better than the kindergarten drawing suit we got on JWS.
And excuse me for focusing on the costumes a little, but I've been listening to "Fixing the Hobo Suit" again and it made me think of it a little more.
I would like to Point out that Jay and Hunter are from two different Earth's with vastly different clothing style and culture.
What Jay is wearing might be considered "absolutely awesome and fabulous" on his Earth.
brotkasten
Member
That's actually a good point. I like it. I still think the flash symbol looks bad, but I'll take it.
The issue isn't his actions persay. The issue is that the show never gave us Barry's POV after his dad died and instead he was just being an angry asshole to everyone.
brotkasten
Member
Is the New52 aesthetic only reflected in the costumes or is it a world thing (like more advanced or futuristic)? Excuse the dumb question, but I don't read the comics.
Just guessing from the look of the costume which is based on Jay's New 52 look (who was younger ironically), we have no idea what the world is like. Earth-2 and Earth-3 don't seem to be directly related to their comics counterparts.
In the comics Earth-2 is JSA and Earth-3 is the evil Doppelgängers so a bit of a flip there.
Basically in the shows... everything's reversed.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
I don't think the JWS Garrick is that reminiscent of the New 52 design:
vs.
vs.
Brighter, lightning bolt is higher, the blue comes up the sides rather than being jeans. Leans closer to the 52 than the classic.
Would've been weird trying to play with that continuity. Might have been nice, but too messy, this way they can cast their JWS cake and eat him too.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
Jay's traditional outfit in the comics isn't usually dark, though.
vs the phony:
And the lightning bolt isn't like any other Jay Garrick. It's higher up on the chest, but the New 52 design is still a giant bolt that extends down past the waist.
It's its own thing.
Mr. E. Yis
Banned
Flash Season 3 |OT| Dumb-Ass Momma's Boy
BLOODED_hands
Member
The Flash S3 |OT| How Barry Met His Mother
Nobody wants to be reminded of that show.
BLOODED_hands
Member
The Flash S3 |OT| Two & A Half Time Remnants
I'm probably never topping Jays of Future Past
-Plasma Reus-
Service guarantees member status
So season 3 is ending with Barry going back again and stopping S1 flash from attempting to save his mom, right.
That thing that happened at the end of S1 needs to come to fruition.
That thing that happened at the end of S1 needs to come to fruition.
try end of the first episode
Season 20 ends with an army of Barry fighting there and Eobard saying fuck it, I'm out of here.
mugurumakensei
Member
Nah, season 3 is ending with Wells leaving again only to come back in yet another form for S4.
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