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[Raide]

This is pretty much how I feel. I want to discuss the purpose of the bots, and the ramifications for them being in a presumably competitive multiplayer. Most people don't like responding to these questions though, they'd rather this thread only be about the 6v6 player count.

I think this might be the fundamental issue. This is not a competitive MP game. This is a MP game wrapped up in SP like scenarios where players get put on each side to achieve the outcome. Its not straight TDM where the person with the highest K/D ratio wins.

I think the A.I is there to help players feel like there is more than just 12 players running around killing each other in CoD styled maps.

 

[Mahonay]

It would be cluttered if you had the possibility for 24 mechs on a map. The maps would need to be massive and sprawling.

6 on 6 seems sensible to me considering the gameplay. Judging purely on player count, for a game most of us here have not played, is pretty silly. And those that have actually played it, have said it feels great anyway. Take a deep breath everyone. Pass around those chill pills.

This is coming from someone who Titanfall doesn't even really appeal to that much.

 

[antitrop]

Just as a note, there's a story character in Titanfall named "Bish".

 

[Pound_lb003]

lol at "sony jihadist'


what happened to this thread the past 12 hours

It went truly mental. I guess at least it separates the people who can have nice conversations, from those who can't.

I don't like the game, but even I don't see how this has exploded in the way it has. It's a design choice, most sensible people can see that. Perhaps it's not the most impressive bullet point, but if you have 32 friends that you regularly arrange matches with, there is still BF4.

 

[Flo_Evans]

This is pretty much how I feel. I want to discuss the purpose of the bots, and the ramifications for them being in a presumably competitive multiplayer. Most people don't like responding to these questions though, they'd rather this thread only be about the 6v6 player count.

Have they even said how many bots can be on there?

People keep saying they are balancing is for 6v6 but it seems more like it is going to be balanced for 12 titans + x number of foot soilders.

 

[FreddieQuell]

I've personally answered this question probably four times in this thread alone along with other people.

The AI are not meant to replace human players. They are weaker, can't wall run, can't double jump, and can't call in titans. Though not a perfect comparison, they are fundamentally by design closer to creeps in DOTA, than to your average bot replacing a human character.

But what is their purpose? They help with reducing your titan cooldown, but supposedly not enough for it to be worthwhile to farm them. Are they there to facilitate the singleplayer in multiplayer idea? Are they there to make bad players have a good time and feel like they are getting kills? Or maybe to fill up the map and make it seem like there is more happening than there actually is?

 

[mkenyon]

I think this might be the fundamental issue. This is not a competitive MP game. This is a MP game wrapped up in SP like scenarios where players get put on each side to achieve the outcome. Its not straight TDM where the person with the highest K/D ratio wins.

I think the A.I is there to help players feel like there is more than just 12 players running around killing each other in CoD styled maps.

By your limitations, Dota is not a competitive game.

 

[Nags]

It went truly mental. I guess at least it separates the people who can have nice conversations, from those who can't.

I don't like the game, but even I don't see how this has exploded in the way it has. It's a design choice, most sensible people can see that. Perhaps it's not the most impressive bullet point, but if you have 32 friends that you regularly arrange matches with, there is still BF4.

But BF4 doesn't have mechs and wallrunning!

 

[Interfectum]

Will reserve judgement until I see it in action(and not just trailers and promo shit).


But it sounds god awful

Dat hyperbole.

 

[Grief.exe]

I wonder how much they will have to compromise for the PC version for the sake of console parity.
Will they really make the PC version the best one? Or will The One be the best one?

There are rumors swirling that Titanfall will have to run at 720p to attain the 60 FPS on XB1. Pretty much seals the deal right there.

PC version looks to have been the lead platform from the start, we haven't even seen XB1 footage, even at the Microsoft E3 conference.

 

[Nafai1123]

Every game designed is created with the limitations of the system in mind. There is no other way to do it, it is only logical.

So you honestly think that a 6v6 multiplayer game with dedicated servers is CPU bound, despite BF4 running 64 players on the same hardware?

Seriously guys just stop. It's a design decision and good or bad we will be able to determine that for ourselves when we actually play it.

 

[mkenyon]

There are rumors swirling that Titanfall will have to run at 720p to attain the 60 FPS on XB1. Pretty much seals the deal right there.

Graphics do not make a competitive shooter great.

Q3A and Tribes: Ascend are still the best shooters to play.

 

[ethomaz]

I was really impressed about Titanfall at the reveal and some later videos/details but I'm losing each day the hype I have before.

For example today I'm more hyped for Destiny than Titanfall... I guess it will be a way better game for me.

 

[GavinGT]

Will reserve judgement until I see it in action(and not just trailers and promo shit).


But it sounds god awful

I really doubt something like this would be uttered if this game was on Sony platforms also.

We'd be seeing things like "can't wait!". You know, stuff that's normally said about pre-release games that have been given universally high praise.

 

[Sojgat]

But what is their purpose? They help with reducing your titan cooldown, but supposedly not enough for it to be worthwhile to farm them. Are they there to facilitate the singleplayer in multiplayer idea? Are they there to make bad players have a good time and feel like they are getting kills? Or maybe to fill up the map and make it seem like there is more happening than there actually is?

For all these reasons, I would guess.

 

[Grief.exe]

Graphics do not make a competitive shooter great.

Q3A and Tribes: Ascend are still the best shooters to play.

That is a perfectly fine position to take. The original poster asked which version was likely to be definitive, graphical capability would go into that discussion.

 

[Error404]

This. This. And this.

Seriously, why are people acting like there's gonna be mindless perfect dark AI bots running around the map taking up player spots? The devs said the AI have they're own function, their own agenda. What that function is? I have no idea but the game is designed around it. I'm intrigued.

C'MON guys, this is the NEXT GEN. This is when the devs pull out new ideas, new game mechanics, and new design philosophies. They're supposed to. We WANT them to. Open your minds and try to remember that.

People are looking at this player/AI count and judging it based on current gen design standards. this new gen we're going to see the line between single/multi-player, player/AI, PvP/PvE blur and possibly disappear. Even though they say TItanfall is "multiplayer only", they still might've found a new way to include in-game storytelling and scripted events. Whatever they're doing, they found that 6v6 works best. How bout we play the damn game first before deciding to agree or disagree with them. Titanfall isn't going to be just CoD with mechs. We should be excited about that.

isn't the whole point of multiplayer playing with and against other people though

 

[x-Lundz-x]

There are rumors swirling that Titanfall will have to run at 720p to attain the 60 FPS on XB1. Pretty much seals the deal right there.

PC version looks to have been the lead platform from the start, we haven't even seen XB1 footage, even at the Microsoft E3 conference.

Now that will be a GAF thread worth watching.

 

[FreddieQuell]

I think this might be the fundamental issue. This is not a competitive MP game. This is a MP game wrapped up in SP like scenarios where players get put on each side to achieve the outcome. Its not straight TDM where the person with the highest K/D ratio wins.

I think the A.I is there to help players feel like there is more than just 12 players running around killing each other in CoD styled maps.

Maybe that is the issue. I'm looking at this expecting for it to at least aim to be competitive, when maybe it's not trying to be that game. That would explain a lot actually.

And this might be a bit flippant, but with your last statement, does that mean that Titanfall is just CoD 2.0 and they're trying to wrap it up as something more?

 

[mkenyon]

That is a perfectly fine position to take. The original poster asked which version was likely to be definitive, graphical capability would go into that discussion.

I'd say whatever platform gets the competitive community. Hoping that'll be PC.

But just being able to run a game at 120fps in the first place already kind of seals the deal. That alters the way it plays more than resolution.

 

[Raide]

By your limitations, Dota is not a competitive game.

In a thread obout Titanfall, calling the game a competitive MP game is not really correct if you focus around what the developers are trying to do. DOTA has nothing to do with this.

Maybe that is the issue. I'm looking at this expecting for it to at least aim to be competitive, when maybe it's not trying to be that game. That would explain a lot actually.

And this might be a bit flippant, but with your last statement, does that mean that Titanfall is just CoD 2.0 and they're trying to wrap it up as something more?

From a group of people that have CoD in their blood, they surely want to make something just as big. They must be replying on what they know about CoD and wrapping it up in new stuff. I like the idea of Titanfall because its not just CoD. I got burned out on straight arena shooters back in the Quake and UT days. I much prefer objective based stuff.

 

[mkenyon]

In a thread obout Titanfall, calling the game a competitive MP game is not really correct if you focus around what the developers are trying to do. DOTA has nothing to do with this.

Speaking with Edge, Respawn Entertainment’s Drew McCoy talks about the games that had a influence on the development of TitanFall. According to him, they are looking at Quake, Tribes, Doom and Street Fighter and taking them as inspiration for their game.

“Tribes for motion,” he says, “Doom and Street Fighter for Titan combat. I loved rocket-jumping, learning routes in Unreal Tournament team maps, the grapple in Tribes: Vengeance; I loved figuring out what the physics was like and how I could use it to my advantage. I think a lot of games have narrowed things down to your reaction times – who can pull the trigger faster? – and we want to open it up a bit.

If that's not a competitive shooter, I don't know what is.

 

[GuitarAtomik]

But what is their purpose? They help with reducing your titan cooldown, but supposedly not enough for it to be worthwhile to farm them. Are they there to facilitate the singleplayer in multiplayer idea? Are they there to make bad players have a good time and feel like they are getting kills? Or maybe to fill up the map and make it seem like there is more happening than there actually is?

All of the above. Plus, again, think about the macro design functions of creeps in a MOBA. Left to their own devices, they will clash against another group of creeps to a stand still, but thin out the enemy creeps a little and yours will eventually have the advantage until they can take the tower or in this case, whatever the objective is. Now, the AI in Titanfall is obviously more complicated and capable than creeps in a MOBA, but that's the idea. You and the other players are hero units, the AI ate the grunts. Dko5 also mentioned they help lead players to objectives and points of action as well.

 

[Flo_Evans]

I've personally answered this question probably four times in this thread alone along with other people.

The AI are not meant to replace human players. They are weaker, can't wall run, can't double jump, and can't call in titans. Though not a perfect comparison, they are fundamentally by design closer to creeps in DOTA, than to your average bot replacing a human character.

So they are like drones/turrets/dogs. That really doesn't answer the question of why this is better than playing against humans. And it really doesn't jive with this being a really tight squad based competitive shooter.

Are you meant to take a commander role and guide these dudes around or are they autonomous? Do they respawn or do you have a set number?

Are they capable of achieving objectives or just stand around and shoot at stuff? Killing them gives you points what about saving them?

 

[Seanspeed]

So many people with preconceived notions of what a game should/needs to be.

 

[DrROBschiz]

I really doubt something like this would be uttered if this game was on Sony platforms also.

We'd be seeing things like "can't wait!". You know, stuff that's normally said about pre-release games that have been given universally high praise.

None of the critics have even bothered mentioning Sony platforms

WTF are you even getting at

I am mostly curious more than anything. Maybe my assumptions about the game and the actual game are just a mismatch

I think a lot of people had preconceived notions about the scale of the actual game.

 

[NullPointer]

So many people with preconceived notions of what a game should/needs to be.

Happens with every game but I've never seen it to this extent before.

 

[Nags]

There are rumors swirling that Titanfall will have to run at 720p to attain the 60 FPS on XB1. Pretty much seals the deal right there.

PC version looks to have been the lead platform from the start, we haven't even seen XB1 footage, even at the Microsoft E3 conference.

I see. PC version should be the best then.

So... none of the footage shown has been running on The One?
Isn't it getting a little close to release? This worries me.

 

[mkenyon]

So they are like drones/turrets/dogs. That really doesn't answer the question of why this is better than playing against humans. And it really doesn't jive with this being a really tight squad based competitive shooter.

Are you meant to take a commander role and guide these dudes around or are they autonomous? Do they respawn or do you have a set number?

Are they capable of achieving objectives or just stand around and shoot at stuff? Killing them gives you points what about saving them?

Dota.

 

[antitrop]

For example today I'm more hyped for Destiny than Titanfall... I guess it will be a way better game for me.

They're completely different types of games that appeal to completely different shooter audiences, neither one is for everyone. Nothing wrong with that.

It's pretty clear to see that traditional Halo fans will gravitate towards Destiny, while traditional CoD fans will be looking to Titanfall for their next big thing.

 

[Pound_lb003]

But BF4 doesn't have mechs and wallrunning!

I deeply apologise these game-changing, paradigm-shifting, standard-setting mechanics won't be in your 64 player experience. But let's be honest it's still a fairly proficient, gritty, perk based, competitive, first person shooter.

Also, Titanfall doesn't have helicopters or german shepherds. How has no one picked up on that!? Brb gonna make a thread. Them helicopter's are equally game-changing, paradigm-shifting and standard-setting.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

isn't the whole point of multiplayer playing with and against other people though

It's stil a multiplayer game where you do those things.

 

[Raide]

If that's not a competitive shooter, I don't know what is.

When I think competitive shooter, I am thinking of CS, or Quake etc. Just players and all based around skills and map knowledge. Usually based around who gets the most kills or which team gets the most flags/points etc.

Titanfall has competitive shooter elements but they are trying to push the SP aspect as well, that's why I feel its not a straight MP competitive shooter.

 

[GavinGT]

None of the critics have even bothered mentioning Sony platforms

WTF are you even getting at

I am mostly curious more than anything. Maybe my assumptions about the game and the actual game are just a mismatch

I think a lot of people had preconceived notions about the scale of the actual game.

It's the likeliest reason this game has become the lightning rod that it is. Plenty of people are trying their best to dismiss it.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

To be fair, comp play in BF4 is essentially dead at this point.

The bugs, lag, broken modes, poor maps, and overall direction Dice took the game did not fare well for the fledgling community.

BF4 comp scene had no chance with the game the way they built it. It was definitely built for a casual experience. Too much is handled client side and hit detection/lag compensation/net code is terrible in the game.

 

[Zornack]

Dota.

Creeps serve a purpose in DotA. They get stronger and give XP and gold. What do Titanfall creeps add? All I've seen the developers say is they're there to give bad players something to kill.

 

[Ippo]

So many people with preconceived notions of what a game should/needs to be.

really is ridiculous Monday morning game design at its best. Only being on the xb1 console wise people have to look for reasons to pick it apart to justify their respective console purchase.

 

[antitrop]

It's the likeliest reason this game has become the lightning rod that it is. Plenty of people are trying their best to dismiss it.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=730510

 

[Raide]

So they are like drones/turrets/dogs. That really doesn't answer the question of why this is better than playing against humans. And it really doesn't jive with this being a really tight squad based competitive shooter.

Are you meant to take a commander role and guide these dudes around or are they autonomous? Do they respawn or do you have a set number?

Are they capable of achieving objectives or just stand around and shoot at stuff? Killing them gives you points what about saving them?

At this point nobody knows but Respawn must know that, in the end, its the players that need to achieve things, not the A.I grunts. As the player, you do take a more commanding role, since you will ultimately complete or fail the objective. The A.I seems to be there to draw you into something bigger than just team deathmatch.

I am guessing the better you do, the more effective the A.I is which makes your job easier. Jut like helping the creed in DoTA.

 

[x-Lundz-x]

really is ridiculous Monday morning game design at its best. Only being on the xb1 console wise people have to look for reasons to pick it apart to justify their respective console purchase.

The 360 version was cancelled?

 

[Sojgat]

So they are like drones/turrets/dogs. That really doesn't answer the question of why this is better than playing against humans. And it really doesn't jive with this being a really tight squad based competitive shooter.

Are you meant to take a commander role and guide these dudes around or are they autonomous? Do they respawn or do you have a set number?

Are they capable of achieving objectives or just stand around and shoot at stuff? Killing them gives you points what about saving them?

Imagine a COD campaign, but with a MP match happening within it, with human players on either side of the conflict. The AI teammates on both sides create the cinematic narrative experience surrounding the competitive battle.

It's not necessarily better than fighting against human players, it's just a new thing. I think that's what Respawn are trying to create.

 

[Seanspeed]

Meh. I'm more excited about Assetto Corsa, really.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Happens with every game but I've never seen it to this extent before.

Im not sure why my initial reaction is in this space.

Maybe I just secretly want another sci-fi shooter like 2142 or Battlefront

Maybe Next Gen seems synonymous with bigger larger and more open games.

If you think about about it even games like Battlefield are limited. I remember I had this idea of how crazy BF3 would be after the jets reveal thinking about how awesome a massive dogfight would be only to find that a max of 4 planes would spawn on the few maps that had them.

My point being that perceived limitations are a scary thought for those of us expecting more out of next gen.

Thats not a slight against Titanfall. Just a theory about the negative reactions. Titanfall is kind of a Next Gen posterchild right now ya know.

 

[Grief.exe]

I see. PC version should be the best then.

So... none of the footage shown has been running on The One?
Isn't it getting a little close to release? This worries me.

Why would they show footage from the One when the PC will have the superior graphics capability? Just purely from a marketing standpoint.

Companies actually rarely show off the actual console versions these days. They just preview the game on a decent PC with a controller plugged in.

BF4 comp scene had no chance with the game the way they built it. It was definitely built for a casual experience. Too much is handled client side and hit detection/lag compensation/net code is terrible in the game.

With the direction they are going, BF5 is going to be markedly worse.

I really only get it to play with some of my college friends who are diehard fans. Literally none of them are playing right now and they all bought Premium as well.

Ironic that even the casual players don't want to touch that shit.

 

[FreddieQuell]

All of the above. Plus, again, think about the macro design functions of creeps in a MOBA. Left to their own devices, they will clash against another group of creeps to a stand still, but thin out the enemy creeps a little and yours will eventually have the advantage until they can take the tower or in this case, whatever the objective is. Now, the AI in Titanfall is obviously more complicated and capable than creeps in a MOBA, but that's the idea. You and the other players are hero units, the AI ate the grunts. Dko5 also mentioned they help lead players to objectives and points of action as well.

All those reasons I listed feel like negatives in my eyes. And comparing the ai to creeps is still odd to me, since there is so much of the game directly connected to creeps. And I haven't felt the Titanfall ai has similarly deep ramifications to the game as a whole.

 

[Nags]

I deeply apologise these game-changing, paradigm-shifting, standard-setting mechanics won't be in your 64 player experience. But let's be honest it's still a fairly proficient, gritty, perk based, competitive, first person shooter.

Also, Titanfall doesn't have helicopters or german shepherds. How has no one picked up on that!? Brb gonna make a thread. Them helicopter's are equally game-changing, paradigm-shifting and standard-setting.

I like things that you can drive/pilot in large scale MP games
The forklift is my favorite in BF3!
No friendly dogs in any BF game though
CoD truly has the upper hand in that department.

 

[Raide]

Imagine a COD campaign, but with a MP match happening within it, with human players on either side of the conflict. The AI teammates on both sides create the cinematic narrative experience surrounding the competitive battle.

It's not necessarily better than fighting against human players, it's just a new thing. I think that's what Respawn are trying to create.

That's a damn good way to explain it.

 

[antitrop]

Creeps serve a purpose in DotA. They get stronger and give XP and gold. What do Titanfall creeps add? All I've seen the developers say is they're there to give bad players something to kill.

Killing them reduces the calldown timer on your Titan, there is that. DKo5 also alluded to the fact that we don't know everything about their purpose, yet.

 

[Ippo]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=730510

or that thread of most anticipated games of 2014 and op completely leaves titanfall off. The anti hype is full effect. Closer to release will we see more negative rumor threads?

 

[mkenyon]

really is ridiculous Monday morning game design at its best. Only being on the xb1 console wise people have to look for reasons to pick it apart to justify their respective console purchase.

Oh stop.

A lot of the people in this thread are buying it for PC.