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UK voting intention: Conservatives at 42%, 6% of brexiters regret their vote

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https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/786852839968636928

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Paints a thoroughly depressing picture of politics in this country today.

In addition, the Economist says 6% of Brexit voters regret their vote, with the amount of people regretting it increasing when their perceptions of Leave's chances of winning were lower.

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WHEN Michael Gove, as justice secretary, was campaigning for Vote Leave ahead of the European Union referendum on June 23rd, he claimed that the people of Britain had “had enough of experts”, referring to the long list of countries and organisations that had warned that Britain would be better off remaining in the EU. New analysis from the British Election Study, polling more than 10,000 voters, has found that Mr Gove was partially right, at least among his supporters. Those who voted to Leave typically preferred the wisdom of ordinary people to that of experts.

With a victory for gut feelings over hard facts, the triumphant Leave side has told those who chose Remain to stop complaining about the Brexit result: their victory was slim, but it was a victory. However, those who opted to Leave have stronger feelings of remorse about their vote. Whereas only 1% of Remainers regret their choice, 6% of Leavers do (a further 4% are undecided, compared with 1% of Remain voters). That would have been enough to have changed the outcome of the referendum to a win for Remain. The theory that many Leavers voted as a protest against the political elite, as well as experts, gets more credibility from the study. Leaver remorse is strongest among those who didn’t expect their side to win: one in ten of them regret their vote.

One of the many significant obstacles facing the politicians who must now negotiate Britain’s new place in the world is trade. As part of the EU, Britain has trade agreements in place with more than 50 countries. New agreements cannot start being negotiated until two years after Article 50 is triggered (the legal means by which a country leaves the union). Striking new trade deals is a notoriously slow process and the terms eventually agreed are likely to be less favourable to Britain than those it enjoys through its membership of the EU, the biggest trading block in the world. With a complicated road to Brexit ahead, the “Bregret” among Leavers may grow as the realities of their choice become clearer.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2016/10/daily-chart-6
 
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Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Just to stress, given these figures, if the referendum were held again today and turn-out was the same, the result would be:

Remain: 50.7%
Leave: 49.3%

and we've not even triggered Article 50 yet.
 

Lagamorph

Member
I don't understand how anyone, not even a single person, who voted Remain could regret their vote given what the leave result has done/is doing.
 

Jonnax

Member
The £ has lost 15% of its value.
I'm guessing half the country have tons of savings where it doesn't make a difference to their quality of life.
But when something costing £100 costs £115, it's the poor that's going to be affected
 

PJV3

Member
Just to stress, given these figures, if the referendum were held again today and turn-out was the same, the result would be:

Remain: 50.7%
Leave: 49.3%

and we've not even triggered Article 50 yet.


Add WTO tarrifs to pound related price rises and there may be trouble ahead.
 

Boney

Banned
635878871872560502-87379949_image.gif


It still blows my mind how much of a shit show this was. Cameron handing the executioner's guillotine, going ahead with leave despite the academic opinion and tight vote win. Protest voters being the ones that tipped the scale. Either leave voters are old sacks that will see their savings disappear one day to the next or working class that will see themselves screwed not to mention all of the sane people that will get hit even harder by limiting opportunities by restricting travel, study, work and trade opportunities. Not to mention the rise of conservative nationalists that have even more ass backwards policies to ensure the UK dissapear of the phase of the earth and giving legitimacy to criminal zealots doing hate crimes.

Worst timeline.
 

platocplx

Member
Fucking terrifying how much weight people put into the opinion of ordinary people. Its probally one of the worst things about humanity imo.

People will literally discredit a study that surveys over 1000's of people or someone who has spend their lives doing some subject vs the opinion of one of their friends because its emotionally attached and personal to them.

So if their friend say A is good but the rest of the world is saying B is good, they will almost always stick with A.

Just to stress, given these figures, if the referendum were held again today and turn-out was the same, the result would be:

Remain: 50.7%
Leave: 49.3%

and we've not even triggered Article 50 yet.

this goes to show that when referendum voting is left up to the public, it shouldnt be based solely on a majority wins, It should be based on a super majority.
 

bionic77

Member
Rather put your trust in ordinary people instead of experts?

What the fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck?

The dumbs are taking over. :(
 
America, we know you don't give a shit about the rest of the world. But look at what happens when Trump wins.

Don't fuck up. Be better than the Brits.
 

Hazzuh

Member
It isn't necessarily too late for regrets. Lots of people changing their minds opens the door for a closer relationship with the EU. At this point I'd be happy if we end up in a position that is basically the same as right now just a little worse.
 

Apt101

Member
Wow. Depressing. I don't know what else to say. The ramifications to this thing is going to felt for so long.

America, we know you don't give a shit about the rest of the world. But look at what happens when Trump wins.

Don't fuck up. Be better than the Brits.

That's not true, we give a shit about the UK, South Korea, and a tiny bit about Japan and Canada.
 
Fucking terrifying how much weight people put into the opinion of ordinary people. Its probally one of the worst things about humanity imo.

People will literally discredit a study that surveys over 1000's of people or someone who has spend their lives doing some subject vs the opinion of one of their friends because its emotionally attached and personal to them.

So if their friend say A is good but the rest of the world is saying B is good, they will almost always stick with A.



this goes to show that when referendum voting is left up to the public, it shouldnt be based solely on a majority wins, It should be based on a super majority.
Agreed on super majority, but honestly they are stupid regardless. The public elect officials who's job it is to be informed, they should be making the choices. The electorate at large are not well informed enough to make decisions in this form.
 

PJV3

Member
It isn't necessarily too late for regrets. Lots of people changing their minds opens the door for a closer relationship with the EU. At this point I'd be happy if we end up in a position that is basically the same as right now just a little worse.

How depressingly British.


same
 
Here's why education for the masses is so important. Plus soft skills like debating, reading comprehension skills, and critical analysis of information and statistics.
 

GamingKaiju

Member
Good. Hopefully these leave voters continue to regret there decision more and more because this is an absolute shit show right now.

I'm beginning to wonder if May and co are deliberately trying screw up Brexit so bad that the we go back to the polls and vote remain in a 2nd snap vote.

I'm glad to see UKIP are losing support.
 

bionic77

Member
I never seen Idiocracy.

Something tells me this was a subplot of Idiocracy.
I think it is more that people are extremely selfish assholes but you might be right too.

The end result is the same.

We are doomed.

/googles how to make your own bunker
 

Auctopus

Member
I don't understand how anyone, not even a single person, who voted Remain could regret their vote given what the leave result has done/is doing.

That's because everything that has happened since has been an undeniable fact and that's the one thing Leavers don't listen to.
 
What the fuck at the response to put matters in the hands of ordinary people and not experts.

Do these people call the plumber or the local burger flipper at McDonald's when they have a boiler issue at home?

Do they want a pilot flying a plane they're on, or the guy from the pub who 'always wanted a go'?

When they end up in an accident, would they rather see someone with a day first aid certificate or a professional doctor with a medical degree?

Because I bet the answers they'd give to those questions wouldn't match the one they gave here. Bloody morons.
 

T-Rex.

Banned
This is infuriating. It's not as if the consequences of Brexit were unknown; it was said repeatedly that the £ would struggle, jobs would go, prices would rise, and to then still make the decision to vote to leave and then say you regret it afterwards... Fuck off.
 

Hazzuh

Member
What the fuck at the response to put matters in the hands of ordinary people and not experts.

Do these people call the plumber or the local burger flipper at McDonald's when they have a boiler issue at home?

Do they want a pilot flying a plane they're on, or the guy from the pub who 'always wanted a go'?

When they end up in an accident, would they rather see someone with a day first aid certificate or a professional doctor with a medical degree?

Because I bet the answers they'd give to those questions wouldn't match the one they gave here. Bloody morons.

From the POV of a leave voter.. why would you trust the economic and political "experts" who have failed at pretty much everything they've tried to do for the past decade at least? Iraq, Syria, Libya, the 2008 crash, failing to reduce immigration, failing to cut the deficit. Then there is stuff like the expenses scandal and the phone hacking scandal which makes the political elites seem not only incompetent but corrupt and self serving.

The origin of populism is the failure of political elites to justify their own existence.
 
FWIW, Blair's 1997 landslide was with 43% of the vote share. A boundary change later and there'll be - metaphorical - bloodshed all over marginals and not-even-that-marginals.

Edit: Dunno if anyone saw Amol Rajan on Question Time last night dropping bombs (appropriately, given they were in the RAF Museum) but he pointed out that the majority of marginals are in England, where the gap between them is 24 points. OUCH.
 

Bumhead

Banned
It's the Brexit stuff that takes the headlines here, but look at the way the voting intention sits between Tory and Labour.

The Labour Party, in its current state, is a fucking embarrassment and absolutely incapable of winning a general election. How bad does this situation have to get before Corbyn and his supporters acknowledge it's just NOT working for Labour?
 

Audioboxer

Member
Vote Tory get Tory.

Its crazy how badly people of the UK complain but go running in droves to vote for the government they are complaining about.

I mean I know Labour is a mess right now but I'd have voted Milliband and even Corbyn in in a heartbeat if it meant ending the current Tory reign.
 
It's the Brexit stuff that takes the headlines here, but look at the way the voting intention sits between Tory and Labour.

The Labour Party, in its current state, is a fucking embarrassment and absolutely incapable of winning a general election. How bad does this situation have to get before Corbyn and his supporters acknowledge it's just NOT working for Labour?

The only way Corbyn goes is after an election defeat so damaging that enough of the new members either change their minds or just fuck off, such that a leadership challenge becomes viable.

He's never going to step-down, even after an election defeat.
 

Plum

Member
From the POV of a leave voter.. why would you trust the economic and political "experts" who have failed at pretty much everything they've tried to do for the past decade at least? Iraq, Syria, Libya, the 2008 crash, failing to reduce immigration, failing to cut the deficit. Then there is stuff like the expenses scandal and the phone hacking scandal which makes the political elites seem not only incompetent but corrupt and self serving.

The origin of populism is the failure of political elites to justify their own existence.

Experts aren't the political elites, most are underpaid university lecturers whose best hopes is selling their own book when they're 60 or getting their papers published so bored university students can skim over them.

Also, I'd love to know how voting leave harmed any of the actual elites. Cameron left, sure, but he's still rich as fuck and will have a cushy advisory job for the rest of his life. The vote's made Britain a pseudo-one party system for the next 10 years at the very least. Voting leave to spite the elites is the definition of cutting off your nose to spite your face.
 

sammex

Member
I don't get this graph, surely you shouldn't be able to select multiple?

It took me a second glance to work it out too.

Basically it's saying, of the group that Strongly Agrees with the statement, 80% of them were leave voters.

So of the people who Strongly Disagreed, less than 20% voted leave.
 

SKINNER!

Banned
It isn't necessarily too late for regrets. Lots of people changing their minds opens the door for a closer relationship with the EU. At this point I'd be happy if we end up in a position that is basically the same as right now just a little worse.

001.jpg



How pathetically British.
 

Eusis

Member
Something like Brexit is heavy enough that it should have been a 66% to pass. You need a huge portion of the country to want it, not roughly half the people because that really fucks over the other half.

But then it sounds like it's been a god damn clown show for quite awhile in the U.K.
 

spekkeh

Banned
It took me a second glance to work it out too.

Basically it's saying, of the group that Strongly Agrees with the statement, 80% of them were leave voters.

So of the people who Strongly Disagreed, less than 20% voted leave.
Ah that makes more sense, thanks!
They should've had an alternative color for the Bremain voters to fill up the 100%.
 

Foffy

Banned
Them trusting ordinary people over experts depresses the shit out of me.

The masses are always ignorant at something, and one would rather lean on them for information? Why? Because they're dumb as fuck, and you feel like an equal? :/
 

Audioboxer

Member
Something like Brexit is heavy enough that it should have been a 66% to pass. You need a huge portion of the country to want it, not roughly half the people because that really fucks over the other half.

But then it sounds like it's been a god damn clown show for quite awhile in the U.K.

Quite honestly if they wanted to value the Union they should have had it at all Nations have to vote leave.

That way it would have been on the politicians to actually campaign equally across the UK. Not just write off say Scotland, because it was heavily trending to remain and focus time courting leave votes in specific areas. The FPTP system always fucks someone, but it's what we have, so yes, I fully believe a clause that all Nations needed to vote Leave was "fair". Or maybe we could say if the majority of Nations vote leave. That way what we have now, a tie, is still a null change. Basically NI and Scotland would have saved the UK.

Putting my "suggestions" aside at the very least it should have been asking for a minimum of say a 55 - 45 split. Not allowing a few % to rock the boat on such a major issue.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Quite honestly if they wanted to value the Union they should have had it at all Nations have to vote leave.

That way it would have been on the politicians to actually campaign equally across the UK. Not just write off say Scotland, because it was heavily trending to remain and focus time courting leave votes in specific areas. The FPTP system always fucks someone, but it's what we have, so yes, I fully believe a clause that all Nations needed to vote Leave was "fair". Or maybe we could say if the majority of Nations vote leave. That way what we have now, a tie, is still a null change. Basically NI and Scotland would have saved the UK.

Putting my "suggestions" aside at the very least it should have been asking for a minimum of say a 55 - 45 split. Not allowing a few % to rock the boat on such a major issue.


That's the first trip to American style deadlock where nothing ever happens because you have a zillion actors with veto rights, and a grossly unbalanced democracy because different-sized blocs are given equal powers. Why should someone in Scotland have a vote worth about 7 and a half times as much as someone in England? Or someone in Wales have a vote worth about twice as much as someone in Scotland? Democracy is one person one vote.

I'm as furious that we voted to Leave as anyone else, but I'm pretty worried at some of the anti-democratic sentiment from Remainers. You can't gerrymander procedures because you didn't get the outcome you wanted. It's little wonder that nobody trusts elites when this is the disdain elites have for them.
 

Tak3n

Banned
Something like Brexit is heavy enough that it should have been a 66% to pass. You need a huge portion of the country to want it, not roughly half the people because that really fucks over the other half.

But then it sounds like it's been a god damn clown show for quite awhile in the U.K.

And I can promise you this, if 67% voted to leave, we would still be getting the same reaction from remainers
 

Tak3n

Banned
Something like Brexit is heavy enough that it should have been a 66% to pass. You need a huge portion of the country to want it, not roughly half the people because that really fucks over the other half.

But then it sounds like it's been a god damn clown show for quite awhile in the U.K.

And I can promise you this, if 67% voted to leave, we would still be getting the same reaction from remain voters
 

Audioboxer

Member
That's the first trip to American style deadlock where nothing ever happens because you have a zillion actors with veto rights, and a grossly unbalanced democracy because different-sized blocs are given equal powers. Why should someone in Scotland have a vote worth about 7 and a half times as much as someone in England? Or someone in Wales have a vote worth about twice as much as someone in Scotland? Democracy is one person one vote.

I'm as furious that we voted to Leave as anyone else, but I'm pretty worried at some of the anti-democratic sentiment from Remainers. You can't gerrymander procedures because you didn't get the outcome you wanted. It's little wonder that nobody trusts elites when this is the disdain elites have for them.

If people like yourself value the Union so much why should Scotland just because it's a smaller nation have to bend the knee and do whatever "England" says?

It's a fact even if 100% of our population voted remain we'd be leaving the EU. That sits absolutely fine for you? Because what I'm hearing is you saying it would be unfair on the English/Welsh, but what about it being unfair on the Scottish?

Pretty much the reason I don't put any political value in the Union. A nation can be told fuck off just because it's "not big enough". The way it's setup just now is unfair, pretty much BECAUSE we have a Union. Otherwise it would just be England and Wales leaving. Which if you ask me that is how it should be over a decision this serious. Or there should be a clause about a majority of Nations voting leave being required.

Politicians should be required to work hard to convince the majority of the Union, not just pander to the largest country in the Union to railroad the others.
 

Sasie

Member
Something like Brexit is heavy enough that it should have been a 66% to pass. You need a huge portion of the country to want it, not roughly half the people because that really fucks over the other half.

But then it sounds like it's been a god damn clown show for quite awhile in the U.K.

A few countries have entered the EU on small margin that was under 55%. If big decisions were to require a super majority quite a few countries would not have joined the EU. Why should leaving the EU require higher majority then was required to join the union?

Democracy won't work if it only counts when the right side wins.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
If people like yourself value the Union so much why should Scotland just because it's a smaller nation have to bend the knee and do whatever "England" says?

Because, as long as we're in the union, we're not English or Scottish or Welsh or Northern Irish. We're British, and that means we do what Britain says. And Britain says leave. "Scotland" isn't being treated any more unfairly than anyone else anywhere in the United Kingdom who voted Remain - which, I want to stress, was 48% of all Britons. You're not some special story.

It's a fact even if 100% of our population voted remain we'd be leaving the EU. That sits absolutely fine for you? Because what I'm hearing is you saying it would be unfair on the English/Welsh, but what about it being unfair on the Scottish?

I don't think of it that way. There is no "our population" other than the British population, and all people in Britain ought to be treated equally - which includes the value of their vote.

Incidentally, that means if the vote had been 51/49 Remain, and votes in England gone very marginally to Leave and votes in Scotland had been the decisive factor for Remain, I would, rightly, be arguing that we should respect the results of the Remain vote. That's what democracy is.
 
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