Has anyone ever worked for them? They are supposed to be like a marketing company or something that sells Cutco knives. And they recruit college students and shit. My brother just got a job there, but he says he's about to quit because he is spending more money on gas ( going to in-home appointments with customers) than he is making.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Vector Marketing?
- Thread starter Dreamfixx
- Start date
- Status
WHOAguitarninja
Member
I've talked to people that have worked for them. They had some positive things and some negative things to say about them. It's been a long time so I don't remember exactly what they said, but I wasn't really left with the feeling that it was somewhere I personally would like to work.
Kabuki Waq
Member
:lol These ppl are scam artists DO NOT fall for this shit.
aoi tsuki said:
Well, a lot of companies do that, even reputable ones. IBM, Disney, and Apple in particular have pretty extensive college programs. The question is what positions they're going to fill with the new college recruits. If it's nothing but sales positions, that's when the red flags need to be raised.
enjoy bell woods
Banned
The key is to prey on poor people and know how to peddle garbage.
Watch Salesman, the documentary.
Watch Salesman, the documentary.
To call it a scam is very unfair. There's really nothing deceptive or fraudulent about it. It is better described as "a really shitty job with a high turnover rate"....which is why they are always hiring.
It's like any other sales job -- if you are very good at it and you get the right leads/contacts, you can make a ton of money. If you are not very good at it you are wasting your time and will feel more and more humiliated with each sales pitch. It's a pyramid system, so if you work your way up the line you can make crazy money by doing hardly anything. As a grunt you really have to work your ass off, but managers make comission just on the sales of their underlings.
Cutco confuses the hell out of me. It's like they are stuck in some kind of time warp. They refuse to sell their product over the internet or through catalogs or through TV mail-order. Probably 20-30% of each sale goes towards commission for the managing sales rep his underlings....they could be making a real killing if they would just set up a website. Yet they don't...
It's like any other sales job -- if you are very good at it and you get the right leads/contacts, you can make a ton of money. If you are not very good at it you are wasting your time and will feel more and more humiliated with each sales pitch. It's a pyramid system, so if you work your way up the line you can make crazy money by doing hardly anything. As a grunt you really have to work your ass off, but managers make comission just on the sales of their underlings.
Cutco confuses the hell out of me. It's like they are stuck in some kind of time warp. They refuse to sell their product over the internet or through catalogs or through TV mail-order. Probably 20-30% of each sale goes towards commission for the managing sales rep his underlings....they could be making a real killing if they would just set up a website. Yet they don't...
enjoy bell woods
Banned
Gotta be a smart salesperson.
Yeah, that's what's ridiculous. Not only does the company refuse to set up a website, but if any of their salesmen try to sell stuff over the web then they get shut down and fired. It's like paying people to try and start a fire with two sticks when there's a book of matches in your pocket.
I think their main problem is that through the whole recruitment process they try and give the impression that it's an easy everyday job, when it's really very difficult. It requires a lot of humility. There's no cold calling, but you have to call up people you know and beg for a sales appointment. Once that appointment is over, you have to beg the same people for numbers of other people that would want to buy knives (and most folks are very reluctant to hand out the phone numbers of friends and families). Once you get entrenched in everything it can be very easy, but it's a nightmare until then. Most salemen think they're golden if they just know a bunch of rich people, but most people got to be rich by being smart....and they won't just buy a bunch of flashy expensive knives if they don't need them. The trick is finding people that love to cook....those are the ones that really pay top dollar.
To their credit, Cutco knives really are the best knives I've ever encountered. The cut smoothly perfectly, never go dull, and are guaranteed for life. They don't sell "crap", and probably the only comfort you can take in the job is that you're pitching a truly excellent product.
I think their main problem is that through the whole recruitment process they try and give the impression that it's an easy everyday job, when it's really very difficult. It requires a lot of humility. There's no cold calling, but you have to call up people you know and beg for a sales appointment. Once that appointment is over, you have to beg the same people for numbers of other people that would want to buy knives (and most folks are very reluctant to hand out the phone numbers of friends and families). Once you get entrenched in everything it can be very easy, but it's a nightmare until then. Most salemen think they're golden if they just know a bunch of rich people, but most people got to be rich by being smart....and they won't just buy a bunch of flashy expensive knives if they don't need them. The trick is finding people that love to cook....those are the ones that really pay top dollar.
To their credit, Cutco knives really are the best knives I've ever encountered. The cut smoothly perfectly, never go dull, and are guaranteed for life. They don't sell "crap", and probably the only comfort you can take in the job is that you're pitching a truly excellent product.
I worked for them for probably less than 2 weeks. It was awful. All that said, I still have the knives from my sales kit and they are my first choice everytime I need to cut a steak or slice up a turkey breast. They are great knives, and resharpening is free if you ever need it.
Another problem with their recruitment is that they advertise a "12.50/appointment" pay scale, but fail to mention that you probably won't be able to fit more than 3 or 4 appointments in a day. Commission is 10% so if you sell more than $120 worth of knives then you get more than $12.50 per appointment.....but how many people do you know that would spend more than $120 on fucking knives? The problem is that they recruit young people, but at that age you really don't know a lot of people that would make such a huge purchase. I imagine that you get sacked pretty quick if you aren't doing $120 in sales per appointment, but I never made it that far :lol
For a very small portion of kids, it is a great opportunity to make more money than they every could have hoped for with just a high school education. For the vast majority, it's a total waste of time that makes you feel like shit.
Another problem with their recruitment is that they advertise a "12.50/appointment" pay scale, but fail to mention that you probably won't be able to fit more than 3 or 4 appointments in a day. Commission is 10% so if you sell more than $120 worth of knives then you get more than $12.50 per appointment.....but how many people do you know that would spend more than $120 on fucking knives? The problem is that they recruit young people, but at that age you really don't know a lot of people that would make such a huge purchase. I imagine that you get sacked pretty quick if you aren't doing $120 in sales per appointment, but I never made it that far :lol
For a very small portion of kids, it is a great opportunity to make more money than they every could have hoped for with just a high school education. For the vast majority, it's a total waste of time that makes you feel like shit.
keeblerdrow
Member
I took all their sales training, gathered all their marketing techniques, made myself a super salesman with their help... then quit before I had to spend a single cent.
Now I have about $2000 worth of good sales training that I can market to any future employers. I suggest you do the same. But remember, quit before you have to buy your samples for your appointments.
Or, just click my tag.
Now I have about $2000 worth of good sales training that I can market to any future employers. I suggest you do the same. But remember, quit before you have to buy your samples for your appointments.
Or, just click my tag.
Okay I checked the Cutco website and to their credit it looks like you can order over the phone now. Congratulations to Cutco on making that leap into the 20th century :lol
They are still pushing home sales pretty hard, though. On one hand you kinda have to commend them for having a business model that gives work and benefits to many young and unskilled workers. On the other hand, they are locking people into a system that is probably bound to collapse sooner or later. They have excellently designed knives, but once their patents run out there will be a ton of competitors working with much lower overhead and Cutco will either have to cut back on staff or go out of business. On top of that, many people that they sucker in to going through training end up totally wasting their time. While there is much more earning potential than you'd see in other entry-level jobs, most people would be better off just working a $7/hour grind. All the training is unpaid, so to go through it you are essentially giving up $400 that you would have made working two weeks at some other job.
I will disagree with keeblerdrow in saying that I don't think their training is worth any money at all. They just want you to memorize a pre-written script and be able to adequately perform it. You don't really get anything that makes you a more marketable salesman for another company.
They are still pushing home sales pretty hard, though. On one hand you kinda have to commend them for having a business model that gives work and benefits to many young and unskilled workers. On the other hand, they are locking people into a system that is probably bound to collapse sooner or later. They have excellently designed knives, but once their patents run out there will be a ton of competitors working with much lower overhead and Cutco will either have to cut back on staff or go out of business. On top of that, many people that they sucker in to going through training end up totally wasting their time. While there is much more earning potential than you'd see in other entry-level jobs, most people would be better off just working a $7/hour grind. All the training is unpaid, so to go through it you are essentially giving up $400 that you would have made working two weeks at some other job.
I will disagree with keeblerdrow in saying that I don't think their training is worth any money at all. They just want you to memorize a pre-written script and be able to adequately perform it. You don't really get anything that makes you a more marketable salesman for another company.
border said:
Really they probably aren't that dumb. Most likely the knives they sell through the multilevel marketing channel are the same knives as are sold under different brand names on home shopping TV channels and the like. The reason they shut down salesmen who try to sell online is very likely because they don't want their sales through other channels to go through someone they're paying a commission to. The people who buy online or through HSN are not the same people who will buy from Little Cousin Billy and His First Job, and they know it.
Anyway they probably make money just off of selling the sample knives to the 'salesmen'. I doubt they're losing on it, and I doubt they ever will be.
Someone I know who was looking for a job got hooked into doing one of their initiation seminars, was creeped out by the cultish way they tried to keep her there, and on her way home from their rather out of the way location, found a help wanted sign, went in, and got the (rather mundane, but steady) job within a couple of days. In a way, Vector Marketing got her a job.
You can tell Cutco apart from the others just by looking at the design of the blade itself (double serated, full tine). As far as I know, there is nothing similar being sold on the web or through home shopping networks. There's nothing else like it, and they hold a patent on the design. From what I can see, their only revenue source is this home marketing scheme. They might have other, crappier product lines but the only way to get the genuine product is through Cutco/Vector.
Sales kits are supposedly sold to salesmen "at cost", though whether or not that's true is probably up for debate.
The only other problem I meant to bring up was that their employees have a hard time wrestling with the idea that their job matters. I worked for Cutco in 1998 when "the Internet" was something most people had heard of rather than experienced.....and even then I felt like I was doing a mostly useless job. How does it feel today? Even a minimum wage burger flipper knows that he can't be replaced by some hyper-efficient robot. But the average Cutco employee must know that that he and his co-workers could be more than easily replaced by a Linux server....he pretty much has to realize that he is the company's charity case, and is only there because they chose to operate in a ridiculously outdated fashion. That's really gotta make you feel like shit. It'd be like getting hired to cut someone's lawn with a pair of scissors -- you are glad to have the work, but are probably infuriated knowing that everything would be done much faster if your superiors would just get with the times.
Sales kits are supposedly sold to salesmen "at cost", though whether or not that's true is probably up for debate.
The only other problem I meant to bring up was that their employees have a hard time wrestling with the idea that their job matters. I worked for Cutco in 1998 when "the Internet" was something most people had heard of rather than experienced.....and even then I felt like I was doing a mostly useless job. How does it feel today? Even a minimum wage burger flipper knows that he can't be replaced by some hyper-efficient robot. But the average Cutco employee must know that that he and his co-workers could be more than easily replaced by a Linux server....he pretty much has to realize that he is the company's charity case, and is only there because they chose to operate in a ridiculously outdated fashion. That's really gotta make you feel like shit. It'd be like getting hired to cut someone's lawn with a pair of scissors -- you are glad to have the work, but are probably infuriated knowing that everything would be done much faster if your superiors would just get with the times.
Cutco has been around too long for their patents to still be in force, as far as I can tell. The only patents they actually seem to hold according to the US Patent Office are for things other than their knives.
A FAQ that looks lifted off some version of their web site says their blade was never patented, only that it is supposedly difficult and expensive to produce. Frankly, I doubt that. This all sounds like terrible marketing fluff to me.
As for 'at cost,' it means whatever you want it to mean. In theory, it means a price that results in breaking even on that unit, but even if that weren't as slippery a concept as it is, breaking even on paper is not the same thing as breaking even on cash.
A FAQ that looks lifted off some version of their web site says their blade was never patented, only that it is supposedly difficult and expensive to produce. Frankly, I doubt that. This all sounds like terrible marketing fluff to me.
As for 'at cost,' it means whatever you want it to mean. In theory, it means a price that results in breaking even on that unit, but even if that weren't as slippery a concept as it is, breaking even on paper is not the same thing as breaking even on cash.
Himuro said:
Just so you know, it isn't a real "interview." They will hire anyone, since it doesn't cost them anything to do so. In fact, they will even make money off of hiring you, because you have to buy your own set of knives to cart around and demonstrate with (or you can borrow a set, but you still have to put down a hefty deposit). That was the point where I went from skeptical to full-tilt run-for-your-life mode.
distantmantra
Member
border said:
Henkels are much nicer than Cutco.
Oh, read this:
http://www.geocities.com/cutcocomplaints/cutco_vector_alcas.html
Fragamemnon
Member
I cook all the time (to the point of scaring my roomate) and I've never even heard of Cutco. I got my forged Henckels imported from the Netherlands about four years ago and couldn't be happier.
I worked for Vector for half of a summer when I was in high school.
Everyone is right in that it is a terrible job. I will say that I sold a ridiculous amount of knives and made a couple of thousand dollars, but it was more effort than it was worth. Plus I felt like a slimeball after awhile because of how aggressive I got in trying to sell the knives to people who probably shouldn't have been dropping $600+ on knives. It felt so good to quit that job, though me and my friend were the only two people who were both dumb enough to sign on and yet still able to sell knives, so the manager for that district had to shut it down after another month. Poor guy made his commission based on how much we sold.
The knives are definitely high quality, but no better than most high end cooking knives. The scissors are the best though. I would say I got like 70% of the people to buy those things after I cut the penny in half. :lol Oh yeah, the Cutco pizza cutter is also really awesome. The one thing I always liked about Cutco knives is how comfortable they are. I still can't believe some people were willing to drop a grand on the biggest set we had back then. I wonder if the knives are still as expensive as they were back in 1994?
Everyone is right in that it is a terrible job. I will say that I sold a ridiculous amount of knives and made a couple of thousand dollars, but it was more effort than it was worth. Plus I felt like a slimeball after awhile because of how aggressive I got in trying to sell the knives to people who probably shouldn't have been dropping $600+ on knives. It felt so good to quit that job, though me and my friend were the only two people who were both dumb enough to sign on and yet still able to sell knives, so the manager for that district had to shut it down after another month. Poor guy made his commission based on how much we sold.
The knives are definitely high quality, but no better than most high end cooking knives. The scissors are the best though. I would say I got like 70% of the people to buy those things after I cut the penny in half. :lol Oh yeah, the Cutco pizza cutter is also really awesome. The one thing I always liked about Cutco knives is how comfortable they are. I still can't believe some people were willing to drop a grand on the biggest set we had back then. I wonder if the knives are still as expensive as they were back in 1994?
That article that was linked to really paints a much worse picture than I imagined. They pretty much "hire" you so they can sell to your leads, and when you get burned out they drop you (assuming you don't quit first). Nearly everyone quits within a couple months because they either hate it or can't make enough to live on. With so many people going through their revolving door the turnover rate doesn't matter, they've got all that it takes to post pretty massive sales.
That article did jog a couple things from my memory -- they are very secretive on the phone. They want to get you down to their office before you find anything out. They don't tell you that your manager is taking commission on your sales (though that should be obvious to pretty much anyone). They do give you the power to give discounts but you're not supposed to do it unless the customer refuses the full-priced package.
That article did jog a couple things from my memory -- they are very secretive on the phone. They want to get you down to their office before you find anything out. They don't tell you that your manager is taking commission on your sales (though that should be obvious to pretty much anyone). They do give you the power to give discounts but you're not supposed to do it unless the customer refuses the full-priced package.
Well that shouldn't really be a surprise considering that they have like zero marketing outside their rotating army of suckers.Fragamemnon said:
Their Double-D serrated blades aren't made by anyone else, to my knowledge. And they kick as for cutting stuff up.
CabbageRed
Member
Quick video for those interested located at http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Amway/
http://cpserverp4.com/bo/dateline_quixtar.wmv
Tell your brother to find one of those places that sell cheaply framed prints. Tons of fun and decent money if you can adopt a "screw it" attitude.
http://cpserverp4.com/bo/dateline_quixtar.wmv
Tell your brother to find one of those places that sell cheaply framed prints. Tons of fun and decent money if you can adopt a "screw it" attitude.
evil solrac v3.0
Member
Himuro said:
you havent gottent the job yet. you gotta buy a package or something right?
was the chick hot? betcha they had a hot chick at the office.
evil solrac v3.0
Member
Himuro said:
[/MR BURNS] excellent. savor that moment, for it shall be your last.[/MR BURNS]
but, good luck and all that. and why havent you checked on craigslist? where do you live?
evil solrac v3.0
Member
LakeEarth said:
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
When I worked there the receptionist was the hot girl. She probably had a better job than anyone else in there besides the manager.
One amusing detail from my experience was that on day 1 they get you to make up a list of everyone you know that you might be able to pitch their product to. Well I ran out of names real fast, so I just started making shit up. I don't know why the hell I thought this was a good idea, because I was just left with some huge list of fake names and numbers to try and get my sales base started. Calling people that you only vaguely know (friends of parents, parents of friends, etc) and begging for an appointment is well....."humbling" might be a generous way to put it.
Himuro did mis the fact that it's probably impossible to do more than 4 appointments per day, unless you are either very lucky and a master of scheduling. Even if you get lucky and make 5 appointments that's only like $62 in a day. It's more like $8.30 an hour once you consider that the presentation takes about 60 minutes, but there's going to be at least 30 minutes of travel time to and from your appointments. So you can either stick with this rough job that has you working a ton of unpaid hours (there's all kinds of meetings and phone reports)....or you can make about the same in a crappy retail or manual labor job.
You really really have to sell the knives to make Cutco worth all the time and effort, but best of luck to Himuro. It might really be your thing -- my sister's roommate made a boatload with that company.
One amusing detail from my experience was that on day 1 they get you to make up a list of everyone you know that you might be able to pitch their product to. Well I ran out of names real fast, so I just started making shit up. I don't know why the hell I thought this was a good idea, because I was just left with some huge list of fake names and numbers to try and get my sales base started. Calling people that you only vaguely know (friends of parents, parents of friends, etc) and begging for an appointment is well....."humbling" might be a generous way to put it.
You're laughing at the wrong thing, though I think my original statement might have been misleading. You get $12.50 per appointment, no matter what....even if they don't buy a thing. If you sell more than $125 in merchandise then you get 10% of the final sale price.evil solrac v3.0 said:
Himuro did mis the fact that it's probably impossible to do more than 4 appointments per day, unless you are either very lucky and a master of scheduling. Even if you get lucky and make 5 appointments that's only like $62 in a day. It's more like $8.30 an hour once you consider that the presentation takes about 60 minutes, but there's going to be at least 30 minutes of travel time to and from your appointments. So you can either stick with this rough job that has you working a ton of unpaid hours (there's all kinds of meetings and phone reports)....or you can make about the same in a crappy retail or manual labor job.
You really really have to sell the knives to make Cutco worth all the time and effort, but best of luck to Himuro. It might really be your thing -- my sister's roommate made a boatload with that company.
Well you can write off gas costs on your taxes, but I'm not sure how it would work with the general cost of wear and tear on the car. They hire people as "contractors" so you have to work out your own taxes and will never get any kind of health insurance.....on the upside that at least means you get paid under the table.
- Status