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"Virtua Fighter will never be online."

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Sega being morons again, Street Fighter third strike totally destroys their argument. I can parry and do everything i can do offline perfectly fine on xbl. Nothing prevents them from adding online support for 'the barbarians who like to play online'.

The leet tournament players wannabe people can continue playing offline and travelling accross the country to get any kind of decent competition going on.

It's just that Sega are being totaly fucking tools when it comes to anything online, again
 
I'm not buying VF5 because it wont be online. Too bad. I frigging bought the goddamn MK games because they were online. Nobody here plays fighters, online is the only way for me to get any type of competition. I'm not bothering with offline only fighters

Hajiki said:
Yay, crap online games in favour of good ofline games.

Sigh.
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You do realise that having an online mode wont change a thing at all to the single player experience, right? It has no effects at all? Some Dev teams also have a WHOLE SEPARATE CREW of people working on the online segment?
 
God forbid a designer wanting to make a game that suits his needs and not the unwashed masses. :rolleyes.


Why shouldn't there be a fighter that focuses on tight gameplay and really good (non-cheap) AI ? Why is that a sin?
 
Not all games need to be online to be great. Agreed. Fighting games, however, really can be a blast online. Especially if you play "quarters" and have a lobby of people watching as you and others battle out while you wait. This news is disappointing and considering viable alternatives in the fighting genre are already available, I think this makes their inability to get this to work online look worse than it actually is.
 
DenogginizerOS said:
How is the fighting game genre on the PC, Borys?
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992811736-00.jpg


Never forget.
 
ToxicAdam said:
God forbid a designer wanting to make a game that suits his needs and not the unwashed masses. :rolleyes.


Why shouldn't there be a fighter that focuses on tight gameplay and really good (non-cheap) AI ? Why is that a sin?
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:rolleyes

Enabeling online mode will not break offline mode. Some of you people :lol
 
Hajiki said:
Yay, crap online games in favour of good ofline games.

Sigh.
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Somehow the addition of an online mode suddenly made GG suck? Why was I not informed?

And get this through your head! I CAN'T have good games offline! I have no friends that play fighters as hardcore as I do (let alone like VF4), plus have such shitty arcades that I have NEVER seen a 3rd Strike arcade machine ever. The one place I know in my city that has a VF4 machine, guess what? No one touches it. So yes, online is a necessity to have any fun with fighters in this day in age.
 
Shompola said:
:rolleyes

Enabeling online mode will not break offline mode. Some of you people :lol
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exactly. and nearly noone would notice the difference in a "lag free" online match versus the truly lag free offline mode anyways.

VF is king, and i will buy this (whenever it hits whatever), but no online makes me sad
 
ToxicAdam said:
God forbid a designer wanting to make a game that suits his needs and not the unwashed masses. :rolleyes.


Why shouldn't there be a fighter that focuses on tight gameplay and really good (non-cheap) AI ? Why is that a sin?
Click to expand...
It's not. But why totally leave out the option of online play in the process? The "it wont be perfect" excuse is lame as fuck. Of course it wont replicate playing someone on an arcade machine or someone sittin right next to you. No one is expecting that anyway.

They could at least put it out there and let those who want to enjoy it that way have the option.
 
shuri said:
Sega being morons again, Street Fighter third strike totally destroys their argument. I can parry and do everything i can do offline perfectly fine on xbl. Nothing prevents them from adding online support for 'the barbarians who like to play online'.

The leet tournament players wannabe people can continue playing offline and travelling accross the country to get any kind of decent competition going on.

It's just that Sega are being totaly fucking tools when it comes to anything online, again
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Yes, yes, the performance of a 7 year old 2D fighter online really proves what idiots they are thinking their next-gen 3D fighter would not perform as intended online.
 
Maybe SEGA should release two versions.. One for hardcore people without online mode and the other for retards with online mode. :D
 
PhatSaqs said:
It's not. But why totally leave out the option of online play in the process? The "it wont be perfect" excuse is lame as fuck. Of course it wont replicate playing someone on an arcade machine or someone sittin right next to you. No one is expecting that anyway.

They could at least put it out there and let those who want to enjoy it that way have the option.
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QFT - also, this is a rare thread where two sets of folks who both love a game are fighting with each other.
 
Dissapointing. Online matters more and more to me as it's becoming the only means of finding any competition to play against. Really a fighting game is only as good as the competition you have to play against.
 
ToxicAdam said:
Why shouldn't there be a fighter that focuses on tight gameplay and really good (non-cheap) AI ? Why is that a sin?
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Why can't it can focus on tight gameplay and good AI while still including online multiplayer for those who aren't worried about a few games being spoiled by lag. As others have mentioned in this thread, SF3: Third Strike is affected by lag, but not enough to ruin the experience. Why not tack on a half-decent online mode for those willing to sacrifice absolute perfection in the gameplay department?
 
No interest in an online VF that isn't perfect. No way to make it perfect, so fuck it. Why waste time on a bullshit half-working online mode that doesn't even feel like the real game? VF4's offline stuff was fantastic, some of the best AI in any fighter ever. Kumite and Quest Mode kept me playing far longer than anything in any of the Soul Calibur or Tekken games.

Yeah, I'm sorry so many people here seem to lack friends or whatever, but refusing to buy the best fighter in existence because it doesn't have a laggy online feature is ridiculous.
 
People forget that Japanese fighting game developers don't really give a shit about American gamers. Cause as a whole they just don't have what it takes to compete anyways, so why bother with online mode? Since the arcades will be packed in Japan cause of this game. No Japanese who play the online mode either, since home copies are just there to let you practice for where the real hardcores play at.
 
Srider said:
People forget that Japanese fighting game developers don't really give a shit about American gamers. Cause as a whole they just don't have what it takes to compete anyways, so why bother with online mode? Since the arcades will be packed in Japan cause of this game. No Japanese who play the online mode either, since home copies are just there to let you practice for where the real hardcores play at.
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Which is why many in this thread will not buy this game.
 
Hajiki said:
No Tekken, Soul Calibur, Guilty Gear etcetera for you then either?
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Guilty Gear's online already actually, at least on Xbox. I'd expect Namco to take the plunge next gen with T6 and SC4.


Hajiki said:
Aaaargh, we have some really really fun quotes from Kataoka (it was not FMM but hey) for something like that but since they havent even decided internally yet we sadly cant publish it right now.
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Fighting Vipers 3? Sonic Fighters 2?
 
Meh, this shit doesn't surprise me. Not implementing it because it isn't "perfect" is a pretty transparent excuse.

I'd like to see these guy's minds boggle if they ever tried to make an online mode for a 60 FPS fighter.
 
Let me be a little more clear so perhaps I don't get ignored again.

In northeast US based servers I generally get 20-30 ms latency with online PC games, with around 40 worst-case and 10 best-case (depending on specific location, how many players, etc.). The window of a frame in a 60 fps environment is ~16 ms.

Fishie's "15 frame" hyperbole is considering a 250 ms latency, which you're not going to get outside of narrowband or connecting to the other side of the world. Allow a latency filter for those who care, which should ideally be there in the first place, and you'd have to be pretty anal to not want an online mode included.
 
Shouta said:
Meh, this shit doesn't surprise me. Not implementing it because it isn't "perfect" is a pretty transparent excuse.

I'd like to see these guy's minds boggle if they ever tried to make an online mode for a 60 FPS fighter.
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DoA4. ;)
 
DenogginizerOS said:
Which is why many in this thread will not buy this game.
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yup.

And you know, a lot of my friends are the kind of people who might warm up to VF if it had an online mode. They're the kind of people who are decent at games, but never great, simply due to lack of time, dedication, and the overwhelming scope of most fighters these days. For them, slightly laggy matches wouldn't ruin the experience. Hell, they probably wouldn't even notice it for the most part, unless it got really bad.

The number of people who care about online play feeling exactly like single play is most likely dwarfed by the number of people who are willing to sacrifice precision for expanded opportunities gameplay- and challenge-wise. Other fighters have come close enough to replicating single player mode to be really fun online. SF3: Third Strike online sometimes makes parrying tough, but you work around it. It's not perfect, but it sure as hell is fun, and that's what really matters to most people.
 
MattKeil said:
No interest in an online VF that isn't perfect. No way to make it perfect, so fuck it. Why waste time on a bullshit half-working online mode that doesn't even feel like the real game? VF4's offline stuff was fantastic, some of the best AI in any fighter ever. Kumite and Quest Mode kept me playing far longer than anything in any of the Soul Calibur or Tekken games.

Yeah, I'm sorry so many people here seem to lack friends or whatever, but refusing to buy the best fighter in existence because it doesn't have a laggy online feature is ridiculous.
Click to expand...

VF4 (especially Evo edition) had amazing offline content to be sure. What many really are asking though, is what is the sin in throwing a bone to both crowds? What's the point in buying the best fighter in existence if what you WANT is to play other people, and you're just not going to have anybody local? All the offline features in the world won't make a difference then.

Even as "forgiving" as DoA4 is, the elite players still consider offline and online to be different things and, hold on, revolutionary idea coming, just shrug and view it as two versions of the game.

I have upmost respect for Virtua Fighter's design ethic and gameplay system. I also have access to near zero VF players offline. If VF5 has no online mode, it's very possible it will be a lost sale for myself until it hits the bargain bin.
 
seems some people take their games too seriously and forget to realize that they are there for entertainment purposes. just put the damn game online.
 
I sold Tekken 5. I'm gonna trade in Soul Calibur III.
-1 sales for VF5 when it's released.

Fighting games: No online = no buy unless it's Street Fighter 4 for me. (Friends would actually play SF4 and there are still SF cabinets around here).
 
What I can't understand is the hostility from the crowd who explicitly don't want online play. You'd think it was ruining the single player experience for them...
 
*scratches Virtua Fighter off wanted list*

It would be a shame if they really go this route. Online play is what will actually make this thing really sell. The worse thing is having a fighting game that you like but no one to play with (unless you're in a dorm or such). For grown folks with a wife, kids, etc. Xbox Live is as good as it can get for multiplayer gaming.
 
Matlock said:
DoA4. ;)
Click to expand...

DOA4's timing isn't very strict though. I was thinking more along of the lines of Tobal and Tobal 2 which have timing that's a dirty whore and a half and makes VF4's timing look like an angelic virgin.
 
EviLore said:
Let me be a little more clear so perhaps I don't get ignored again.

In northeast US based servers I generally get 20-30 ms latency with online PC games, with around 40 worst-case and 10 best-case (depending on specific location, how many players, etc.). The window of a frame in a 60 fps environment is ~16 ms.

Fishie's "15 frame" hyperbole is considering a 250 ms latency, which you're not going to get outside of narrowband or connecting to the other side of the world. Allow a latency filter for those who care, which should ideally be there in the first place, and you'd have to be pretty anal to not want an online mode included.
Click to expand...

The 15 frame example is NOT hyperbole, you clearly misunderstood me.
Its the window in which a certain move has to be followed up by another move in order to link them up as a combo, or the window of time you have ingame to counter what the opponent is doing or whatever.
If the window of opportunity for a certain followup move or counter is 1 frame it means the player has to give his input within 1/60th of a second of his opponent.
So it works two ways and a 10 millisecond lag becomes 20 milliseconds.

Bottom line IT DOES NOT WORK.
 
maximum360 said:
*scratches Virtua Fighter off wanted list*

It would be a shame if they really go this route. Online play is what will actually make this thing really sell. The worse thing is having a fighting game that you like but no one to play with (unless you're in a dorm or such). For grown folks with a wife, kids, etc. Xbox Live is as good as it can get for multiplayer gaming.
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I am a proud member of this club and agree wholeheartedly.
 
MattKeil said:
Yeah, I'm sorry so many people here seem to lack friends or whatever, but refusing to buy the best fighter in existence because it doesn't have a laggy online feature is ridiculous.
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Yeah that's it, people who are bitching about the lack of online play have no friends. I'm the only "serious gamer" in my social circle, at best I've got friends who will play some Madden or Tony Hawk, but anything as invovled as Virtua Fighter? Forget it.

I used to have to barter games of Madden to get them to play some rounds in Street Fighter 3, but that ended years ago. Arcades are all but dead here, none of my friends play fighters...why is it such an alien concept to grasp that this some seriously dissappointing news for some? Deal breaking even?

A fighting game is only as good as the competition you have to play against, sorry if some of us aren't content collecting knick knacks, earning useless ranks and finding holes to poke in the A.I.'s routines.

Tekken V, Soulcalibur II, Soulcalibur III, Virtua Fighter 4, Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution...all great games that I bought, and quickly tired of because I had no one to play against.
 
:lol :lol


Another instance of Sega doing what they do best...


Making stupid decisions
 
It's amazing that in this age of 10Mbit+ home connections (i'm on a 3Mbit line) we're still dealing with pretty much the same kind of lag and ping issues we had when we were on 28.8kbps. It reminds me of something Carmack wrote about when he was diving into cell phone programming:

Even the 9.8Kbit speed would be great for networked games. A wide variety of two player peer-to-peer games and multiplayer packet server based games could be implemented over this with excellent performance. Gamers generally have poor memories of playing over even the highest speed analog modems, but most of the problems are due to having far too many buffers and abstractions between the data producers/consumers and the actual wire interface. If you wrote eight bytes to the device and it went in the next damned frame (instead of the OS buffer, which feeds into a serial FIFO, which goes into another serial FIFO, which goes into a data compressor, which goes into an error corrector, and probably a few other things before getting into a wire frame), life would be quite good. If you had a real time scheduler, a single frame buffer would be sufficient, but since that isnÂ’t likely to happen, having an OS buffer with accurate queries of the FIFO positions is probably best. The worst gaming experiences with modems werenÂ’t due to bandwidth or latency, but to buffer pileup.
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I wonder if the same sort of overbuffering of data is done with PC and console multiplayer games...
 
OpinionatedCyborg said:
What I can't understand is the hostility from the crowd who explicitly don't want online play. You'd think it was ruining the single player experience for them...
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Exactly. Just don't play the broken, weakass, nonhardcore online. Shut the fuck up about it.

I and many others without access to local figher competition will love it. Otherwise you cap the sales potential at this point. But this is SEGA after all and they have no clue about sales.

MattKeil said:
No interest in an online VF that isn't perfect. No way to make it perfect, so fuck it. Why waste time on a bullshit half-working online mode that doesn't even feel like the real game? VF4's offline stuff was fantastic, some of the best AI in any fighter ever. Kumite and Quest Mode kept me playing far longer than anything in any of the Soul Calibur or Tekken games.

Yeah, I'm sorry so many people here seem to lack friends or whatever, but refusing to buy the best fighter in existence because it doesn't have a laggy online feature is ridiculous.
Click to expand...


Are you just dense or what? I have plenty of friends...many of which play games now and then. But NONE of them like to play fighters beyond a quick button mash session.
 
Hajiki said:
The 15 frame example is NOT hyperbole, you clearly misunderstood me.
Its the window in which a certain move has to be followed up by another move in order to link them up as a combo, or the window of time you have ingame to counter what the opponent is doing or whatever.
If the window of opportunity for a certain followup move or counter is 1 frame it means the player has to give his input within 1/60th of a second of his opponent.
So it works two ways and a 10 millisecond lag becomes 20 milliseconds.

Bottom line IT DOES NOT WORK.
Click to expand...

And the percentage of population that this matters to is WHAT?? This genre is tired and boring without the thrill of playing against people. 9 out of 10 times I play a multiplayer game in my house, I am online.
 
Hajiki said:
And it sucked
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And you know this because....you actually played it? I wouldn't be surprised if it was terribly laggy (never played it myself). Just wanted to point out that Sega did try VF online once since you were so sure "it lacks a feature it never had in the first place".
 
Hajiki said:
The 15 frame example is NOT hyperbole, you clearly misunderstood me.
Its the window in which a certain move has to be followed up by another move in order to link them up as a combo, or the window of time you have ingame to counter what the opponent is doing or whatever.
If the window of opportunity for a certain followup move or counter is 1 frame it means the player has to give his input within 1/60th of a second of his opponent.
So it works two ways and a 10 millisecond lag becomes 20 milliseconds.

Bottom line IT DOES NOT WORK.
Click to expand...

Sure it does. Netcode optimization?
 
PC Gaijin said:
And you know this because....you actually played it? I wouldn't be surprised if it was terribly laggy (never played it myself). Just wanted to point out that Sega did try VF online once since you were so sure "it lacks a feature it never had in the first place".
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VF5 lacks online play, so its a feature it never had in the first place once it comes to a home console.
Same with VF1 and Remix BTW.
Yeah they tried it with a version that had online, it sucked and sold like crap, doesnt change te fact it was a feature the game never had in the first place.
 
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