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[jakonovski]

Jetta Schmetta.

Fiat 500 is where it's at:

Now I may be ever so slightly biased because I just ordered one, but still...

 

[akachan ningen]

Jetta Schmetta.

Fiat 500 is where it's at:

Now I may be ever so slightly biased because I just ordered one, but still...

Totally. That is what I'd buy. But they aren't available in America yet so I didn't mention it in this thread.

 

[flsh]

yeah, that's the main point. Even if you look at comparable fuel, it's still cheaper in america.

Comparing 91 to 95 wont work. That will be like comparing 95 to 99, or 87 to 91. The leap is quite big in both price and performance (if the car is made to run on a certain octane, which European cars are). Still though, comparing 95 to 83-87 is quite a stretch.

93 to 95, quite possibly is similar enough. How much does that cost right now? I know the premium is usually 91, though, so looking at pictures of gas stations wont really help. (Also, why the hell are they advertising in names and not the octane? Car books tell you to use a certain octane, and not having that information is annoying. Using the wrong fuel can seriously damage the reliability of certain engines \

Edit: God the 500 is sexy. Such a brilliant car in every possible way, and even has a brilliant sports version

 

[akachan ningen]

Comparing 91 to 95 wont work. That will be like comparing 95 to 99, or 87 to 91. The leap is quite big in both price and performance (if the car is made to run on a certain octane, which European cars are). Still though, comparing 95 to 83-87 is quite a stretch.

93 to 95, quite possibly is similar enough. How much does that cost right now? I know the premium is usually 91, though, so looking at pictures of gas stations wont really help. (Also, why the hell are they advertising in names and not the octane? Car books tell you to use a certain octane, and not having that information is annoying. Using the wrong fuel can seriously damage the reliability of certain engines \

Edit: God the 500 is sexy. Such a brilliant car in every possible way, and even has a brilliant sports version

no, you're on the wrong track. US and europe use different octane rating systems. our 87 is the same as your 91, so our 91 would be like your 95. So it's more like your minimum is our premium, since most stations here don't have anything past 91. but either way it's cheaper here for the same gas.

 

[flsh]

Wait, why are they using different systems for octane? I was sure the average between 2 tests is what determines the number in gas stations?

Haha, America will never be the same as the rest of the world :lol I stand corrected.
Yes, your gas is really cheap, you bastards :lol

 

[Cheeto]

cost of diesel is lower than gasoline too so if you can get similar mileage you can at least count on cheaper diesel as gas will probably go into the post-$3 range this summer.

Reliability wise? I dunno I've not seen much improvement in terns of Volkswagen reliability compared to the rest of car manufacturers.

Driving wise I hear the Jetta is fun to drive, Prius is obviously a bore.

Personally I'd probably go with the Prius for reliability sake since thats a type of car I'd drive to the ground.

Well, diesel prices go up in the winter, when everyone is using it for heating. So in the winter it's usually more expensive than gas, and in the summer its cheaper. Diesel motors for the most part are also inherently reliable, I don't know if things changed, but older diesel motors would easily give you well over 300k miles. I have an old('80ish) chevy truck I inherited with 425k miles on it.

Fake Edit:
Looks like its the same on the newer motors too
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztMzdk2KI6A

 

[KamikazeChick]

Does anyone have any real-world experience with these two cars in terms of gas mileage?

I know the EPA says that the Prius has the Jetta handedly beat in terms of fuel economy, but I have read reports that people are getting real-world performance that is equal to a Prius -- particularly on the highway, which is where probably 60% of my miles are driven.

The two cars are about the same price, but -- all other things being equal -- I would prefer a Jetta for two reasons: a.) it's a much nicer-looking car and b.) it doesn't contain hybrid technology, which means that I might be able to fix some minor things on my own or without high-priced Toyota labor.

Anybody have any thoughts?

I love my TDI - recently converted her into a VeggieMobile so she drives on recycled veggie oil from the Chinese food place down the street. I pay like $150 in diesel for the year because I still have to heat up the engine. Otherwise, she smells like fries

Best car I've owned.

 

[Zapages]

I just checked VW's website and they have the Jetta TDI around 41 miles per hour??? What happened to the 58 miler per gallon version of the car???

 

[loosus]

I just checked VW's website and they have the Jetta TDI around 41 miles per hour??? What happened to the 58 miler per gallon version of the car???

41 MPG is the EPA rating, but VW (and some actual owners of the car) claim that they are realistically getting nearly 58 MPG on the highway, which is why I'd even consider the car.

 

[flsh]

The EPA rating is nearly always inaccurate, for better and for worse. I've seen cars do much lower and much, much higher than it is suggested. Best thing to do is listen to people who own the cars. Also, the more you drive on the motorway the better the average is, the more you drive the car in the city the worse it will be - so take that into consideration.
God knows how they make that rating so it's so useless, but the lesson is always use it as a guideline and base most information on anecdotal evidence, as troublesome as that may be.

There are a few Top Gear events where they test to see if cars are actually as economical as suggested (fifth gear has one as well which is also worth a view) and the results vary a bit from the "official" ratings.

Edit: actually, just crossed my mind. You can have the DSG which is a brilliant transmission system with great fuel efficiency and performance and it'll sell better than a Manuel in America when you want to get a different car. Will cost extra, but might be worth it.

 

[Limedust]

If you plan to keep the vehicle for more than 5 years, then I suggest the diesel Jetta. And get the manual.

 

[loosus]

Here is what Consumer Reports says (top 10 new sedans):

Nissan Altima V6
-Score: 89/100
-MPG: 23
-Recommended: Yes

Honda Accord V6
-Score: 88/100
-MPG: 21
-Recommended: Yes

Honda Accord 4-cyl. MT
-Score: 88/100
-MPG: 26
-Recommended: Yes

Toyota Camry V6
-Score: 87/100
-MPG: 23
-Recommended: Yes

Volkswagen Passat 4-cyl.
-Score: 87/100
-MPG: 24
-Recommended: No

Nissan Altima 4-cyl.
-Score: 85/100
-MPG: 25
-Recommended: Yes

Volkswagen Jetta TDI
-Score: 84/100
-MPG: 33
-Recommended: No

Toyota Camry Hybrid
-Score: 84/100
-MPG: 34
-Recommended: Yes

Hyundai Sonata V6
-Score: 83/100
-MPG: 22
-Recommended: Yes

Chevrolet Malibu V6
-Score: 83/100
-MPG: 20
-Recommended: Yes

 

[gcubed]

Here is what Consumer Reports says (top 10 new sedans):

Nissan Altima V6
-Score: 89/100
-MPG: 23
-Recommended: Yes

Honda Accord V6
-Score: 88/100
-MPG: 21
-Recommended: Yes

Honda Accord 4-cyl. MT
-Score: 88/100
-MPG: 26
-Recommended: Yes

Toyota Camry V6
-Score: 87/100
-MPG: 23
-Recommended: Yes

Volkswagen Passat 4-cyl.
-Score: 87/100
-MPG: 24
-Recommended: No

Nissan Altima 4-cyl.
-Score: 85/100
-MPG: 25
-Recommended: Yes

Volkswagen Jetta TDI
-Score: 84/100
-MPG: 33
-Recommended: No

Toyota Camry Hybrid
-Score: 84/100
-MPG: 34
-Recommended: Yes

Hyundai Sonata V6
-Score: 83/100
-MPG: 22
-Recommended: Yes

Chevrolet Malibu V6
-Score: 83/100
-MPG: 20
-Recommended: Yes

is there a reason why they didnt like the VWs?

 

[loosus]

is there a reason why they didnt like the VWs?

The realiability is a bit on the lower end, but so was Nissan and Altima. I'm just guessing that price was a consideration?

 

[Zapages]

The realiability is a bit on the lower end, but so was Nissan and Altima. I'm just guessing that price was a consideration?

I doubt that, because Altima is pretty pricey. :|

Anyway thanks for the advice about EPA thing...

 

[captive]

Here is what Consumer Reports says (top 10 new sedans):
Volkswagen Jetta TDI
-Score: 84/100
-MPG: 33
-Recommended: No

Who the hell was driving this, mario andretti?
I dont think i've ever gotten lower than 35 mpg in just city driving.

 

[Phobophile]

They got pretty shitty mileage on all those cars. Were they driving it during rush hour with the AC at max?

 

[iidesuyo]

Don't know if they are sold in the US, but if so you should consider the Seat Leon.

Same platform as VW Golf/Jetta, but cheaper and - in my opinion - better looking. And of course available with TDI engines.

The new Golf GTD is pretty nice, too

 

[HocusPocus]

VW's are built a lot more solid as they are made for the European market primarily. Equivalent Honda Accords for example in Europe cost twice as much as their USA counterparts, but the cars also drive better to compete in the market. The major disadvantage when driving a hybrid car is the battery issue when it comes time to replace it. The battery itself is a major environmental negative if you truly want to be green.

 

[donkey show]

^ Those are Euro only.

So is it a Golf now or is it still a Rabbit (US wise anyway)? I r confused.

I'm still waiting for the new 2010 Mazdaspeed3s though. >=)

 

[CharlieDigital]

Anybody have any thoughts?

I drove a Prius...and I liked it.

I wasn't expecting that.

To preface, I drive a Nissan Frontier pickup truck as a daily driver and my wife drives a gas-guzzling, 303 HP, 16/21 MPG '09 Infiniti FX35.

On Friday, I arrived in Tampa International for a wedding for one of my wife's high school friends. We had decided to make a vacation out of the trip and rented a car for the trip. The original car was a Mitsu Galant, but I asked for alternatives as soon as I heard that

Turns out that a Prius had just come in. I had never driven a hybrid and it was available at the same rate that I booked at so I took it.

Great decision. My observations:

• First of all, mileage was phenomenal. I'm glad I took the Prius given the amount of driving we ended up doing and visiting some family friends some 80 miles away from where we were staying. I'd take a hybrid rental for any personal trips I take given the fuel savings. We drove some 250+ miles and only paid $17 for fuel before we returned it. I could get used to that kind of savings (but perhaps my perspective is skewed from commuting in a pickup truck 70 miles a day...).
• The driving experience was...engaging. I don't know about the Jetta, but watching the feedback from the onboard computer and sensors was fascinating and engaging. It totally changed my driving style and made me far more aware of the traffic around me and the road itself. Over a 5 minute period while driving into downtown Tampa, I even averaged over 100 MPG. That was surprisingly fun (though possibly frustrating for the drivers behind me :lol)
• The Prius was surprisingly roomy inside for such a small car on the outside. I was tasked with driving the bride and three bridesmaids from the hotel to the reception and everyone fit in fine. The trunk space was also very generous.
• There's a serious perception issue around this car. A few of the groomsmen had snickered when discussing cars (the groom is an auction buyer for a large chain dealership) assuming that the Prius was mine (apparently, they didn't know they had them as rentals). I dunno...I didn't feel less of a man for driving it; it was fun to drive in a very different way.
• With the fans off, the car is dead silent at a stop. It's a bit surprising and takes a while to get used to. Overall, for the price, the comforts of the car are pretty good. Very quiet, rides well, good visibility all around, great windshield wipers, and very spacious. The air conditioning was more than adequate for the weather and did a good job of keeping everyone sweat free.
• The park mode is engaged with a button. This confounded me for the first two days as I could not figure out how to put it in park :lol I just kept shutting it off and turning it on.

 

[Foxtastical]

I have a 06' Jetta TDI. It's a blast to drive, even after coming off an 05' Evo. There's enough juice there.

Gas wise, I was getting like some odd crazy 750 miles to a tank when I was moving last year. There was a ton of highway driving then. Now it's around 500-600 miles to a tank because I've been doing a lot (a lot) of street driving the past months.

Oh, and yeah, manual tran. Can you get a Prius in manual?

 

[CharlieDigital]

Oh, and yeah, manual tran. Can you get a Prius in manual?

Nope. But if one is considering a car as a daily commuter in an urban/metro area, I can't see a manual being a mark in the "win" column.

There's a serious perception issue around this car. A few of the groomsmen had snickered when discussing cars (the groom is an auction buyer for a large chain dealership) assuming that the Prius was mine (apparently, they didn't know they had them as rentals). I dunno...I didn't feel less of a man for driving it; it was fun to drive in a very different way.

I want to expand on this a bit because I think that people are quick to judge based on your automobile of choice. Be prepared to be snickered at or stereotyped as a tree-hugging hippy if you step out of the driver's seat of a Prius. Only real men need apply.

 

[Get'sMad]

I don't know how good recent years VWs have been (like the last 5) in terms of reliability, but everyone I've ever known thats owned one had theirs go into a clusterfuck of electrical and mechanical problems at the 2-3 year mark.

 

[Foxtastical]

Nope. But if one is considering a car as a daily commuter in an urban/metro area, I can't see a manual being a mark in the "win" column.

I got sick of automatic and love manual, so it's a win for me. Even in shitty traffic or city.

 

[Cheeto]

My future brother in law has a prius, I drove it and I wanted to stab my eyeballs out with a soldering iron

 

[BreakyBoy]

On-topic: I've driven my sister's new '10 Prius and I was surprised at how much I enjoyed it as well.

Off-topic: What's with the year-old thread bump CharlieDigital? :lol

Edit: About the snickering, and "real man" comments -- I step out of an '06 Honda Civic coupe every day. I'm 6'1"/250 lbs. I'm aware it's pretty comical. Fuck that, I enjoy the car more than I would any SUV or truck.

 

[CharlieDigital]

On-topic: I've driven my sister's new '10 Prius and I was surprised at how much I enjoyed it as well.

Off-topic: What's with the year-old thread bump CharlieDigital? :lol

Wanted to share my experiences and this was the most relevant thread

 

[mrkgoo]

I had a prius for last week. I liked it. Mileage was probably something like 50 miles per gallon, although I can't really tell, because I didn't check how petrol I consumed.

I thought it drove pretty well. My only complaint is the gas gauge is way off.

 

[captive]

As someone who owns a 2006 VW Jetta TDI, i recognize im a little biased.
My family owns 3 TDI's, not a single issue among them, thankfully. But we also all get our cars serviced regularly.

What isn't biased is the 42mpg i'm getting in just city driving. On highway its ~50
Since i just hit 20k miles i've picked up a few mpg. The rep at the maintenance shop was telling me about another client that's over 100k and every 10-15k miles she was picking up more mpg from the engine breaking in.

I don't understand why anyone that does mostly highway driving would ever consider a prius over a jetta.
I dont understand why anyone that wants to be "clean" and "green" would every consider a prius over a new clean jetta tdi. The batteries alone make the prius not clean. and in 3-5 years you have to replace all of them. And in the prius you're still burning gasoline vs the jetta's clean diesel.

Not to mention with the prius you're supporting 2 systems, normal gas engine AND electric.

 

[YuriLowell]

Whoever said 318ti's look good has terrible taste.

Also fuck the Prius. I go faster and waste more gas every time I see one of those smug motherfuckers driving them.

 

[Vanillalite]

My last experience with a VW was terrible. Car broke down a lot, windows stopped working, in general a very unreliable car. That was about 6 years ago though so I'm not sure how much they've improved. I drive a Prius regularly and it's a great car. I mean it's not very exciting to drive but it's good and reliable. Has some nice features as well.

Sounds like we had similar cars. the VWs from the early 00s had a ton of issues, but from what I gather they've been straightened out. My buddy has a new jetta and it's totally fine.

 

[CharlieDigital]

Also fuck the Prius. I go faster and waste more gas every time I see one of those smug motherfuckers driving them.

That's a pretty ignorant attitude to take, IMO.

I'm plenty sure that lots of folks buy it for the economics (tax rebates and savings on fuel costs) rather than any sense of "smugness".

 

[kharma45]

Have VW dumped the ancient 1.9 diesel over in the States yet?

God it's an old engine now, 18 years it's been around if I remember right.

 

[Archer]

The new TDIs are great vehicles for long distance highway cruising.

The Prius is a good car for city commuting and short ventures.

Both are good, though I prefer the TDI.

 

[Souldriver]

I really struggle to understand all the VW 'reliability' issues that Americans seem to harp on about (assuming those talking about reliability in this thread are in the US) - is it to do with the style of driving in the US, or are your VW's built somewhere different?

I've owned two VW's and neither of them have failed me, not ever. VW also has a great reputation here for quality and reliability. Both my VW's have been GTI's so built in Germany not Brazil/Mexico/wherever the cheaper ones are built - maybe that has something to do with it?

ANYHOO, long story short I would definitely go with the Jetta. It's sexier, safer and more fun than a Jap-crap Prius. Also, hybrids scare me as they're silent in carparks.

Indeed. In Europe VW has the image of being a very reliable brand. It funny and weird to see how in America its image in totally the opposite.

Is it really just an image difference, or also a factual difference (different production lines and quality requirements in both continents, ...)?





(Edit: just saw it's a bumped old thread)

 

[YuriLowell]

That's a pretty ignorant attitude to take, IMO.

I'm plenty sure that lots of folks buy it for the economics (tax rebates and savings on fuel costs) rather than any sense of "smugness".

Savings on fuel are almost non existent because of the extra cost of a prius compared to most other cars.

 

[CharlieDigital]

Savings on fuel are almost non existent because of the extra cost of a prius compared to most other cars.

The base Prius is $22,800 before any tax rebates, manufacturer rebates, dealer negotiations, and so on.

That's not expensive by any means.

 

[ChanHuk]

The Ford Fiesta gets 40MPG and doesn't look like a turd.

 

[Archer]

Indeed. In Europe VW has the image of being a very reliable brand. It funny and weird to see how in America its image in totally the opposite.

Is it really just an image difference, or also a factual difference (different production lines and quality requirements in both continents, ...)?





(Edit: just saw it's a bumped old thread)

The MK4 Jetta, for North America, as are newer models, are built in Mexico. This factory is notorious for poor build quality. The VWs that were/are built in Europe, on the other hand, are of a much better build quality.

 

[Vanillalite]

Indeed. In Europe VW has the image of being a very reliable brand. It funny and weird to see how in America its image in totally the opposite.

Is it really just an image difference, or also a factual difference (different production lines and quality requirements in both continents, ...)?





(Edit: just saw it's a bumped old thread)

This happens alot actually in terms of what Europe gets verses what NA gets in terms of a bunch of different car models and manufacturers. You'd seriously be surprised.

 

[YuriLowell]

The base Prius is $22,800 before any tax rebates, manufacturer rebates, dealer negotiations, and so on.

That's not expensive by any means.

Yes that is expensive. Go find a base prius. You wont find one, Toyota sells almost all they produce regardless of options. So its more akin to a 25k dollar car.

 

[CharlieDigital]

Yes that is expensive. Go find a base prius. You wont find one, Toyota sells almost all they produce regardless of options. So its more akin to a 25k dollar car.

I drove a base Prius...

No, $22,800 is not expensive to me at least.

I'm not here to debate on Prius vs Jetta TDI; I don't have a stake in either - I just wanted to share my experience with the Prius. But I'm not sure why you're so keen to shit on the Prius.