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[The Shadow]

Long story short, I went over to my friends place (Jason) earlier today where a guy named Sam was talking to Jason's brother Daniel. Me and Jason were just talking casually about KotOR 2 and how we were looking forward to it when Sam and Daniel approached us to ask us advice.

Apparently Sam hasn't worked since he was 20 and he's 25 now. He wants to get work but wanted some advice on typing up a resume. I gave him some general advice and then asked how he might fill the gap. He had no idea and neither did I.

Sam's a friend of Jason and Daniel and I don't really know him all that well but he knew my name which kind of surprised me. Anyway, I just thought that was kind of incredible that he could be unemployed for so long and yet have a place to stay, a car of his own, and actually get decent play with women (he goes to clubs a lot). I learned this after he left, but the apartment he lives in is owned by an Uncle or his father (Daniel didn't know which) which is why he's been able to live on his own without working.

They were pretty down on him but I kinda felt sorry for him. At the very least, he's trying to get a job. I politely told him that he should probably just aim low, try to get a job that doesn't really require a resume like retail sales or something because of that huge gap. Don't know if that was good advice or not.

 

[fennec fox]

Well, hell, those are just about the most important working years of your life he didn't use there. I wouldn't know what to suggest either.

 

[DarienA]

Skeezin and Hoe Hoppin isn't a legit job listing?

<goes to edit resume>

 

[Gattsu25]

Just leave that time period out?

 

[Doth Togo]

Be honest.

 

[whytemyke]

say he travelled east asia for five years studying dance and the culinary arts of indochina.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

world travel. Just lie.

 

[bjork]

Freelance Street Preacher

 

[Baconäger]

Tell him to say he spent it serving hard time.

 

[Phoenix]

Tell them you got a job in the porn industry but didn't want to include that on your resume


Seriously though, just tell them what you did. Unless you were just sitting on your ass for 5 years, anything you tell them will likely be fine.

 

[Spike Spiegel]

Seriously though, just tell them what you did. Unless you were just sitting on your ass for 5 years, anything you tell them will likely be fine.

Uh oh...

*has a two-year "ass-sitting" gap on resume*

 

[Fresh Prince]

Don't use precise dates just give the year ie 1990 instead of 12/5/1995-1/1/1999. That atleast will be considered a well constructed white 'lie' when it comes to the interview.
As for the 5 year gap, I'd think what Phoeix said is partially true or if you friend can lie well tell him to say that he was OS but saying he was working odd jobs. It is important to stress what he learned overseas- good communication skills etc.
Go for a low skilled but atleast relatively high paying job ie labourer- basically you need to be strong and show that you are willing to slog it out for a 8 hour day.
He also try to get some qualification either as a forklift driver, security guard, in hospitality etc, that should help him show employees that he is prepared to work since he is learning new skills that are beneficial to them.

 

[way more]

Within in a coma. Now thats the sign of a survivor.

 

[Drensch]

Not that I'm the guy to go for for such advice, but i've read that it's best to explain it.

I.e, dress it up a bit. Like a domestic would say that they spent the time doing a variety of jobs such as child raising: various duties as such.

 

[xsarien]

Wow, and I thought my forced freelancing for about 18 months was bad. The best advice, in this case, is to write one of those "skill-based" resumes (or whatever they're called.) They're good at hiding dates, and instead focus on what you can do, instead of what you've done. But with that big a hole in the resume, even that may not produce much.

 

[The Shadow]

Tell them you got a job in the porn industry but didn't want to include that on your resume


Seriously though, just tell them what you did. Unless you were just sitting on your ass for 5 years, anything you tell them will likely be fine.

AFAIK, he was just sitting on his ass for 5 years. I don't think he even has a two year degree.

 

[WasabiKing]

what kind of job is he going for?

I've been out for a year, but it was a non-issue at my new gig.

 

[Dilbert]

Yeah, he DEFINITELY needs to get an entry-level job...and get SOME kind of a degree. As a potential employer, I would think the fact that a guy wanted to do nothing for five years wouldn't speak well to his potential for industriousness or responsibility.

Hopefully he volunteered somewhere or pursued a hobby or did SOMETHING which demonstrates that he can get things done on time and take direction...or else he might be in for a world of hurt.

 

[The Shadow]

I almost told him he should lie and say he tried to start a business during that time but it failed. Having "failed" on a resume doesn't look good but at least it looks like he tried something during those 5 years.

 

[beto]

Foreign Legion

 

[Mama Smurf]

Just lie. Make up a company, something small which isn't something you would have heard of if it exists. Write up a reference (go all out with quality paper and headings and stuff) and put a number on it of a friend or relative willing to help. Make sure that person knows the details of the lies, then if they're phoned up, they can be convincing.

Of course, he hasn't actually done this job, so it'll have to be something simple which he could get away with not really having experience in, but seeming like he does.

He could always just get a job at a factory or something where they wouldn't care. Do that for a while and get some volunteer work in at the same time and he'll be able to move onto something better.

 

[calder]

Agree 100% on travel. Come on, he must have gone SOMEWHERE. If he went 2 towns over for a kegger every so often I'd say good enough... but ideally he at least left the state for a bit once or twice. Throw in some volunteer work or a course at the learning annex in about year 3 and he could slide that by.

Just be ready to talk about it at the interview, and don't outright lie about it. If he just sat in a pool of his own filth and surfed for porn don't bother pretending your volunteered at a orphanage in Tibet. Just take any crappy temp job (basically, whoever'll hire his lazy ass) and put some time in till he gets something else to talk about to a real interviewer.

 

[Seth C]

I think the obvious answere here is that he should lie. Make something up. Maybe he worked at his brother's company? Or his uncle's? Some small computer shop they ran or something. It doesn't matter. Just make sure the job isn't directly related to the one he is applying for so he doesn't get stuck lying about needed experience he really doesn't have. He just wants to use it as employment history, NOT proof that he's qualified.

 

[Dilbert]

Lying is always a bad policy.

 

[The Shadow]

Lying is always a bad policy.

Agreed but then again, I don't know what else to tell him.

 

[xsarien]

Lying is always a bad policy.

Yeah. No matter how bad your resume looks, lying on it will only make you look *worse*.

 

[ShadowRed]

Long story short, I went over to my friends place (Jason) earlier today where a guy named Sam was talking to Jason's brother Daniel. Me and Jason were just talking casually about KotOR 2 and how we were looking forward to it when Sam and Daniel approached us to ask us advice.

Apparently Sam hasn't worked since he was 20 and he's 25 now. He wants to get work but wanted some advice on typing up a resume. I gave him some general advice and then asked how he might fill the gap. He had no idea and neither did I.

Sam's a friend of Jason and Daniel and I don't really know him all that well but he knew my name which kind of surprised me. Anyway, I just thought that was kind of incredible that he could be unemployed for so long and yet have a place to stay, a car of his own, and actually get decent play with women (he goes to clubs a lot). I learned this after he left, but the apartment he lives in is owned by an Uncle or his father (Daniel didn't know which) which is why he's been able to live on his own without working.

They were pretty down on him but I kinda felt sorry for him. At the very least, he's trying to get a job. I politely told him that he should probably just aim low, try to get a job that doesn't really require a resume like retail sales or something because of that huge gap. Don't know if that was good advice or not.

5 years with no job and he has a car, house and chicks. I think you guys should be asking him for advice. Anyhow just write up the resume the same as anypone else would. When he goes to interview they will ask him what's with the 5 year gap and he should tell them the truth. He moved into his uncles house who didn't require him to pay rent so he lived off saving or whatever. He should talk up the skills he has and assure them he is capable of doing the work.

 

[Dilbert]

Agreed but then again, I don't know what else to tell him.

What has changed so that now he needs to work?

His situation is no different than anyone else looking for a first job...except that he's about ten years older than the typical "no resumé" applicant. If he's looking for an entry-level job, then he just needs to emphasize the things he's done which mean that he's a better choice than a 16-year-old newbie. If he's looking for a more complicated job, then he's not going to get it unless he can point to stuff he's done in the last five years which prepared him for that job.

An employer is going to hire him based on trust and "feel" in the interview, so the single best thing he can do is practice sounding sincere about why he hasn't had to work, why he is now motivated to work, and why he's going to live up to the expectations placed on him. Lying or trying to exaggerate his qualifications is going to be the kiss of death if the interviewer picks up on it.

In short: he's selling himself as "good clay." Teach me what to do, and I'll get the job done right.

 

[gblues]

Just lie. Make up a company, something small which isn't something you would have heard of if it exists.

Just don't call it "Van deLay Industries" :lol

Nathan

 

[Pimpwerx]

Lying IS NOT a bad policy. People who say this are shortchanging themselves. Everyone lies on their resume. If not a little, then a lot. I mean, who doesn't inflate their credentials at least a little?

Those 5 years are gonna look worse than some made up facts IMO. Get creative and think of something he could have done "off the books" or those 5 years, b/c that's gonna be the biggest problem, overcoming the background check. They'll find a lack of tax records for those years, so I'd suggest something "freelance". I filled in parts of my resume with my brief work with PSX2.net. Skrewup and I used to do the news updates for a few months there, so that was my "freelance" work which filled in time. He could also claim to do private tutoring. Almost always paid with cash, so no records there. Make up some bullshit about "pursuing" a career in education, but decided it wasn't for him recently. Something along those line. Being out of the country is a great excuse too, and will easily account for the loss of time. But it might still show his residence during a bg check, so I don't know. Someone in HR will know all the tricks better, but I know these simple tricks have worked with IBM, ATI and various schoolboards. All he needs to do is lie enough to get the job, then he can build experience there once he gets his foot in the door. PEACE.

 

[Flynn]

It's called a sabbatical.

 

[Mama Smurf]

Assuming he has SOME sort of knowledge of Word and Excel (just Word might do even) I'm sure he can get away with lying and saying he was an office junior somewhere. Office junior jobs are so varied, he could say he filed, photocopied, answered the phone, typed up anything which needed typing up etc. Unless he's a complete moron, those are things he's going to be able to do anyway and if anything problematic comes up, he can just say "Oh, the filing system I used to work at was nothing like this" or whatever.

Or as he's made it this far without money coming in, he could get off his ass and do various voluntary jobs for a while.

 

[Dilbert]

Lying IS NOT a bad policy. People who say this are shortchanging themselves. Everyone lies on their resume. If not a little, then a lot. I mean, who doesn't inflate their credentials at least a little?

There is a massive difference between highlighting your achievements in a way which helps a potential employer see you as desirable and a good fit for the role, and misrepresenting your experience and capability to do the job. I'm proud to say that I have not (and will not) lie on a resumé or an interview merely to get something I want. Keeping your integrity is far more important than any particular job.

 

[Mama Smurf]

In most cases I'd say not to lie too....but 5 years! No one's going to give you a job after that. Well, like I say, you could get a factory job, but that's about it.

That's not as bad as you might think though. It'll almost certainly be monotonous, it won't pay fantastically (though better than some entry level jobs that's for sure), it won't be fulfilling and good look spinning it when meeting girls (though he managed to get girls without doing anything, so maybe he could do it), but you can meet some great people doing factory work. I've done it (only temporarily) and sometimes you're lucky enough to be on the line with really cool people, and you can have a great laugh. It's not a stressful job either, just boring.

So basically there are options. Hell, my uncle was a garbageman once for a few years, and he says that's the best job he's ever had. And he's done a lot of different stuff.

 

[Pimpwerx]

There is a massive difference between highlighting your achievements in a way which helps a potential employer see you as desirable and a good fit for the role, and misrepresenting your experience and capability to do the job. I'm proud to say that I have not (and will not) lie on a resumé or an interview merely to get something I want. Keeping your integrity is far more important than any particular job.

Meh, until you get that paper, I figure you do what you gotta. I inflate my experience on a resume. It's the difference between the call-back pile and the circular file sometimes, especially at a job fair. Just shmoozing isn't enough in most situations, those guys see a million candidates a day, they need something tangible. I agree that you don't want to take a job that you can't do, but that's common sense. But if you need to embelish a bit to get in the door, more power to you. If you lie and get a job you can do easily and build experience with, then you still win, right? I'm sorry, I have no scrupples. PEACE.

 

[calder]

er, wrong thread.

 

[The Shadow]

In most cases I'd say not to lie too....but 5 years! No one's going to give you a job after that. Well, like I say, you could get a factory job, but that's about it.

That's not as bad as you might think though. It'll almost certainly be monotonous, it won't pay fantastically (though better than some entry level jobs that's for sure), it won't be fulfilling and good look spinning it when meeting girls (though he managed to get girls without doing anything, so maybe he could do it), but you can meet some great people doing factory work. I've done it (only temporarily) and sometimes you're lucky enough to be on the line with really cool people, and you can have a great laugh. It's not a stressful job either, just boring.

So basically there are options. Hell, my uncle was a garbageman once for a few years, and he says that's the best job he's ever had. And he's done a lot of different stuff.

But he's not stuck doing stuff like that for the rest of his life, is he? I think that's what he's most worried about. I told him that's what he should do, get an entry-level job and then move up.

Don't know what happened that got him to change his mind about his life though. All I know is that he wants an honest to god career now.

 

[Mama Smurf]

I don't think he'd be stuck, not if he really tried.

I'll tell you what he could do. Get a factory job, and use it to fund a course to qualify for something else. He could do night school if he liked, though that in addition to a job would be tiring, espcially after 5 years of doing nothing, or find one he can do from home.

For example, I've done a proofreading course in the past. It was in the UK, so I'm not sure if there's a similar thing in the US, but it cost me about 200 pounds and I could do it all from home. At my own pace too. Now I don't know your friend, maybe he'd be no good at that, but it's just an example of the different choices out there.

 

[Dilbert]

But he's not stuck doing stuff like that for the rest of his life, is he? I think that's what he's most worried about. I told him that's what he should do, get an entry-level job and then move up.

Don't know what happened that got him to change his mind about his life though. All I know is that he wants an honest to god career now.

He needs to start working on two fronts:

1) Get some kind of job now to establish workplace skills and SOMETHING on a resumé.

2) Get a degree or training to prepare him for his ultimate job. If he can volunteer or get an internship in that field while he's studying, that would be even better.

If he can pull this off, he will have one hell of a story to tell an employer in his "ultimate" job: "I made a decision, against all odds, to get in a position to pursue this career, and I accomplished _____ and ______." That ought to impress SOMEBODY. In the meantime...yeah, it's not going to be a thrilling first job, but hopefully school is invigorating for him.

 

[royale]

Tell him to apply for a job as a Videogame Tester.

"What have you been doing for the past 5 years?"

- Playing videogames.