ethomaz
Banned
Mechanical discs are indeed the biggest bootleneck in games development for years already...now ssd is the key performance metric.
There dozen tricks used to try to cover that.
Mechanical discs are indeed the biggest bootleneck in games development for years already...now ssd is the key performance metric.
I guess SSD will continue being the slowest component of a gaming machine.That sounds pretty great but is there some kind of diminishing return, when it comes to read/write speeds? Is it possible that SSD speeds be bottlenecked by other components?
Mechanical discs are indeed the biggest bootleneck in games development for years already...
There dozen tricks used to try to cover that.
- No more pop in
- More objects in the screen
- Bigger and more detailed open world games
- Faster movement for character and camera
- More unique texture and assets (games reuse the same texture/asset in memory to not need to get a new one on disc)
It changes drastically what you can do in game development... be creative because you are not limited anymore by the texture/data streaming from the disc.
Dude, you had me thinking that I posted in here for a sec.If you can swap in a SSD drive of your own then this is of no concern to me. I'd install a 2tb SSD drive day 1 and just be flying high
Mechanical discs are indeed the biggest bootleneck in games development for years already...
There dozen tricks used to try to cover that.
That sounds pretty great but is there some kind of diminishing return, when it comes to read/write speeds? Is it possible that SSD speeds be bottlenecked by other components?
If PS4 and XB1 had a 3GB/s SSD as standard I've no doubt we would have see some games that look at least 2x better than the best of this gen.
Imagine like The Division gameplay reveal or W3 bullshot trailers.
You can find on google or do an IT university.Mechanical Disks are the BIGGEST bottleneck. Sure thing.
Please send me a doc that corroborates that.
You can find on google or do an IT university.
After installed on SSD all the data is there already and you doesn’t need the BD-drive anymore.Haven't you heard? The SSD is going to be bottlenecked by the Blu-Ray drive, so having an SSD is basically useless.
Refer to MiyazakiHatesKojima and Freedom Gate Co. for confirmation
So you should know that the biggest bootleneck in any compute hardware is the mechanical parts that didn’t envolve fast enough as the others components.... thr change from HDD to SSD was a movement that hardware companies where researching for decades because it was not possible to make substantial improvements in speeds with mecanical discs.I have two computer science degrees. Thats why im calling you out that what you said is utterly idiotic.
Now, i dont believe that is the case. How can Sony have a console thats 12 tflops with 2x better SSD and better ray tracing for the same price? However, if for some bizarre reason that is the case then we are going to start seeing differences pretty early on in first party games.
So you should know that the biggest bootleneck in any compute hardware is the mechanical parts that didn’t envolve fast enough as the others components.... thr change from HDD to SSD was a movement that hardware companies where researching for decades because it was not possible to make substantial improvements in speeds with mecanical discs.
The same apply for games... the mecanical discas are the biggest (or better the slowest part) bootleneck of game development.
That is true, they teach in university and your comment fill the utterly idiotic seal.
The HD isn't the biggest bottleneck because games are designed around the fact that the consoles have them, but the same can be said about the GPU & CPU too. Games are designed around the target spec, so in effect nothing is actually a bottleneck in that context.
Not just this generation lol
Not just this generation lol
It is a common bottleneck for decades already.
Mechanical drives speeds increased like 5x in the last 30 years.
CPUs and GPUs had it increased like 80x in the same same period.
I/O was always a serious issues for most company that had to rely in RAID mode and SCSI controllers to try to increase things a bit.
Mechanical drives technology are archaic yet because there is not so much you can do in terms of speed with a spinning disc.
Troll post? Seriously can't tell anymore nowadays.
Custom high speed SSD's will absolutely have a major impact in game design on consoles going forward. Alot of existing and older games use cutscenes and other trickery to mask loading in game assets. Crytek have come and stated that the SSD's are indeed a game changer. If you no longer need to hide asset loading behind stuff like cutscenes, then it absolutely changes the way you approach building games. And it abso-fucking-lutely will not be limited to exclusives. What a crock of shit.
Loaded in memory, from where? How?aha, so you say that hd is the bottleneck of a piece of software that is preemptively loaded in memory?
Damn. I've just realized that this will be the first time that there is a possibility that PCs hold back console games, meaning that you can't design a multiplatform game around an SSD, because then you would lose a lot of sales with PC gamers who don't have it. Sure we can even see the benefit in those cases too (no pop-in etc.) but that's not the same as designing a game around that. Strange timea ahead.To get the same perfprmance boost, you need PCI gen 4.0. 99.5% of all PC gamers don't have a brand new AMD motherboard that supports this.
If the software have I/O ye. if not then no.aha, so you say that hd is the bottleneck of a piece of software that is preemptively loaded in memory?
Damn. I've just realized that this will be the first time that there is a possibility that PCs hold back console games, meaning that you can't design a multiplatform game around an SSD, because then you would lose a lot of sales with PC gamers who don't have it. Sure we can even see the benefit in those cases too (no pop-in etc.) but that's not the same as designing a game around that. Strange timea ahead.
Probably need a synthetic benchmark to even measure it. This isn't going to be the bottleneck.Probably won't make a huge difference will it?
Sounds fair.The average PC gamer will have some upgrading to do post launch, but nothing out of the ordinary every generation.
If PS5 and XSX SSD are heavily customized and not able to be replicated on the PC side, PC always has the fall back of adding more system memory. More of the game will just have to be loaded in.
The HD isn't the biggest bottleneck because games are designed around the fact that the consoles have them, but the same can be said about the GPU & CPU too. Games are designed around the target spec, so in effect nothing is actually a bottleneck in that context.
If you want to argue about something more specific, like why more games aren't 60FPS, then you can point fingers and say: yes, the CPU is the bottleneck there. Or why do we still have massive loading times: The slow disk speeds is the answer there and the limitations of the interface.
So are SSDs basically the 2019 version of having a video cartridge from the 80s and 90s, but at 1 TB?
Cartridges back then had almost no loading times.
Xbox Is doomedAnd the implications of this are?
Seriously. I mean, I COULD bang Phil Spencer's wife next week. Will it happen? Maybe, maybe not. This is the worst part of months before console releases/spec announcements. So much (clickbait) speculation.Wait for official announcements FFS.
Speaking of NAND, Xbox One supposedly has 8gb of NAND ram on top of the 8gb of DDR3.Not quite; NAND still has to be addressed via pages, while old-school carts used ROM which are byte-addressable for reads and writes. And ROM is also more suitable for true random access than NAND.
Also a lot of older consoles used ROM as essentially an extension of their main memory like VRAM, only difference was that they couldn't write data to ROM since it's read-only.
Oh and to answer the other post...it really depends on how the SSDs are implemented. If these are just like off-the-shelf drives but they're pushing a fast controller for them to interface with, then at the end of the day they're just convenient small boosts but not in the same league as CPU, GPU, RAM, memory bandwidth or the such.
However, if they're going for a customized approach similar to AMD's SSG card line (signs seem to point to Sony and MS doing this), with the NAND soldered to the board (or a daughtercard connected through a card edge) directly and giving the OS means to memory-map the NAND so it can act as a cache, IF paired with sufficiently good bandwidth and speed through the controller and PCIe lane interfaces, then it becomes a lot more impressive and important.
Still not on the level of CPU, GPU, RAM or memory bandwidth but that kind of custom approach would make it more like CPU/GPU/RAM/Bandwidth >>> SSD versus CPU/GPU/RAM/Bandwidth >>>>>>>> SSD
It is a eMMC SD.Speaking of NAND, Xbox One supposedly has 8gb of NAND ram on top of the 8gb of DDR3.
Anyone know why even with this big honking extra amount of ram (I think it was meant for OS), the OS still runs like shit half the time?
That explains why series x already has three more teraflops. I guess it means this
1. Asian developers
That's three teraflops right there.
What are the benefits of having a faster SSD for gaming other than faster load times?