The term 'girl gamer'

I don't really care about girl gamers and whether they're "true gamers" or whatever. Something I do find annoying though is how easy it is for attractive women to make a living off of streams even if they don't offer anything beyond being hot. The few streams I follow are ran by interesting men or women who work very hard to get and maintain a loyal, if small, group of regular viewers while some model or pornstar gets thousands of viewers and flooded with donations with minimal effort.

Guess this translates to other areas of gaming culture (indie vs AAA) and life in general too though.
 
I don't really care about girl gamers and whether they're "true gamers" or whatever. Something I do find annoying though is how easy it is for attractive women to make a living off of streams even if they don't offer anything beyond being hot. The few streams I follow are ran by interesting men or women who work very hard to get and maintain a loyal, if small, group of regular viewers while some model or pornstar gets thousands of viewers and flooded with donations with minimal effort.

Guess this translates to other areas of gaming culture (indie vs AAA) and life in general too though.

Sounds like thinly-veiled envy with a side of slut-shaming from over here. Don't despair. You can be pretty, too, if you want. Maybe you could check out some Youtube tutorials on makeup and styling, set up your bedroom to look nice and convey the desired tone, and get in on that streaming cash cow. It's not like the people spending their time and money on people who focus on their presentation would otherwise be fanfrothing over your preferred differently-specialized podcasts.
 
Why does it bother you that an attractive person runs a successful stream? And why does their success have to be 100% from their appearance and not because their stream is actually good?
 
People of both sexes will do things for attention in all walks of life. I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with this. Some of the people using girl gamer as a label are doing this. Nothing wrong with that at all. There's an audience for it, and they just take advantage of it. If you are mad at them for doing this, you must be mad about the people giving them attention for it also?

Also some people are using the term just to let you know they exist. I hold nothing against them for this. It just paints a sad state of affairs that they feel they have to do this. As time goes by I'm sure it will become less of a big deal that there are women playing games and maybe they will no longer feel the need to have a gendered term to describe themselves due to a feeling of invisibility.

I feel disgusted at some of the harassment women receive from men purely down to their sex online. I can't blame some of them choosing to not disclose this fact in order to protect themselves. I can also understand that for a lot of women it can be annoying to be refereed to as a he online. At the same time I can see that making themselves invisible rather than embracing their gender can help to spread the idea that women don't play games. It's a tricky situation that would ultimately be helped if men just accepted them.

It's not particularly surprising that the women I have seen discussing this subject in this thread can have different opinions. There is not just one homogeneous opinion held by all women, just like there isn't for all men. Sometimes people like to pretend that there is, or that their view is the only legitimate one.
 
He perceives that women are using looks and sexuality to earn money, and he's upset by that and declares them unworthy in comparison to his niche streams. What would you call it?

Never said this. I did say that they are at an advantage on streaming sites by default due to their appearance. Don't really care about the specific reason for streaming. Just annoyed that if you took a few of the streams I follow and kept everything the same except swapped the average man/woman with a model then they wouldn't be struggling for partnership.
 
OP's avatar foreshadowed what was to come.

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I personally find it bizarre that the OT regards the relatively greater success of conventionally 'attractive' on screen presenters to those less traditionally so as surprising. Does anyone think that PewDiePie's success is solely down to his witty banter or does his being an attractive 24 year old guy form a large part of it?

On screen presenters always skew to the attractive side because overall as a species we are damned shallow and conventionally 'attractive' people do better across every social factor (likeability, trustworthiness, etc, etc). The fact that they chose to highlight attractive women as somehow enjoying an especial advantage here says more about them than 'girl gamers'.

Personally I hate the term 'girl gamers' as it implies that the default gender for gamer is male which is as daft as claiming that 'viewer' or 'reader' implies a male or female. Also it uses 'girl' in a reductive sense in the same way that my love of high end hifi is referred to as "boy's toys".
 
Never said this. I did say that they are at an advantage on streaming sites by default due to their appearance. Don't really care about the specific reason for streaming. Just annoyed that if you took a few of the streams I follow and kept everything the same except swapped the average man/woman with a model then they wouldn't be struggling for partnership.

I'm not sure that's entirely accurate.

Sure, you can get extra viewers with sex appeal, but there's a limit to how much more traffic that actually brings you. You have to be entertaining as well to get significant numbers.

As far as i know, the most popular streamers are all male (and if there are exeptions i'm pretty sure those women do a lot more than just acting cute).
 
Never said this. I did say that they are at an advantage on streaming sites by default due to their appearance. Don't really care about the specific reason for streaming. Just annoyed that if you took a few of the streams I follow and kept everything the same except swapped the average man/woman with a model then they wouldn't be struggling for partnership.

You said the only trait they have to offer is their hotness, and that it's a recipe for near-effortless success that hard-work from average-looking people could never hope to touch. You didn't say it 'offered an advantage', you implied that women's appearances wrecked the whole playing field in a manner not dissimilar to corporate sponsorship of politicians.
 
Type Girl Gamer into google and look at images, that's exactly what's wrong with the term....

I just think that the whole "omg girl gamer" is so attention seeking and just a desperate attempt to become some form of " japanese Idol" sort of thing, I have little respect for them as they're essentially just trying to put themselves into a unicorn like state amongst the gaming community, they're also the worst at all the MLG events I used to both attend and participate in.

The best story I can think of was when I was playing in a Halo competition at a local Game for the release of number 4, I was playing and chatting with friends, then suddenly out of no where some girl comes up and starts being super loud and fake laughing at what I was saying, I was talking about just general Halo 4 stuff like how nice it was that the BR was back, then she was interrupt and just say "no I'm a DMR girl," but basically to put it short she corrected me on everything I said, Giggled and was loud and shouted boom headshot when I killed someone a lot, although that was "nice" I can tell when someone is being fake, and it was apparent she'd had a little too much monster and didn't truly get why it was inappropriate to be constantly shouting in games right next to my ear.

A girl that plays games is just a gamer, like the male counterpart.

Maybe we should list ourselves as "BOY GAMERS"

*Insert tacky peace sign here with controller/keyboard*

My girl friend plays games sometimes, but she doesn't act like omg I'm a girl gamer give me attention, she just simply states she plays games and have fun whilst playing with them, Which is good for me as if she was the type to be OMG I'm such a gamer girl, I doubt very much that she would be together.
 
Type Girl Gamer into google and look at images, that's exactly what's wrong with the term....

I just think that the whole "omg girl gamer" is so attention seeking and just a desperate attempt to become some form of " japanese Idol" sort of thing, I have little respect for them as they're essentially just trying to put themselves into a unicorn like state amongst the gaming community, they're also the worst at all the MLG events I used to both attend and participate in.

Did you...did you read the thread at all...?
 
You said the only trait they have to offer is their hotness, and that it's a recipe for near-effortless success that hard-work from average-looking people could never hope to touch. You didn't say it 'offered an advantage', you implied that women's appearances wrecked the whole playing field in a manner not dissimilar to corporate sponsorship of politicians.

Never said that either. Sure, I didn't use the word "advantage" specifically in my first post but it was much more implied than whatever you just typed.

You seem pretty passionate about this to the point of seeing only what you want to see so further discussion seems pointless.
 
Never said that either. Sure, I didn't use the word "advantage" specifically in my first post but it was much more implied than whatever you just typed.

Explicitly, you said:

Something I do find annoying though is how easy it is for attractive women to make a living off of streams even if they don't offer anything beyond being hot. The few streams I follow are ran by interesting men or women who work very hard to get and maintain a loyal, if small, group of regular viewers while some model or pornstar gets thousands of viewers and flooded with donations with minimal effort.

How you feel about the people involved in this discussion is pretty apparent.
 
A girl that plays games is just a gamer, like the male counterpart.

Maybe we should list ourselves as "BOY GAMERS"

Even if you meant it sarcasticly, I guess that would help. The problem is that the term "gamer" is usually immediately associated with a male gamer.
 
Even if you meant it sarcasticly, I guess that would help. The problem is that the term "gamer" is usually immediately associated with a male gamer.

Yeah I get that the stereotype for a "gamer" is just being a guy.

I'd be more than happy to say "boy gamer" or work toward the stance being changed so anyone who wants to play games, can if they want to just be unified under one sector as gamer.
 
Explicitly, you said:



How you feel about the people involved in this discussion is pretty apparent.

Both imply that I believe that can and does happen. The first bolded part had an "even if" which you decided to ignore since that changes the point you're trying to make.
 
There's a magazine called "Gamer Girls"... I can't believe anyone would buy that. That's just reinforcing the image of "girl gamers" as purely sex objects that do something that is typically considered a "guy thing". I'm not saying that there's something wrong with a beautiful woman making money that way, the fault lies with the guys that pay for it. But yeah, different tastes for everyone.
 
hED1DCCEC


Personally, I've never found girls that play games to be a rarity. Every girl I've dated played games without me intentionally seeking that out. I find it just an easy way to get attention no different than sarcastic gamer or annoyed gamer or gaymer. People seek out a certain quality in their media consumption. The problem tends to occur for me when they become co-opted as a quasi softcore thing, as have happened to a bunch of "gurl" clans.

Overall, the term doesn't bother me nor interests me.
 
The term 'Gamer' in general just annoys me. You don't see other medium users labeling themselves. What do we call someone who watches movies? Movier?

This. Look I understand, "gamer" is simple, it's descriptive, it rolls right off the tongue. It's quick and easy. I truly think it's to our detriment though, and one day we are all going to realize, far too late, that the convenience just wasn't worth it.
 
The only time my gender has been apparent is with my avatar on the 360. And I could be lying as really I am a 30 stone 50-year-old greasy male who is living at home with MOTHER. My tags / IDs never allude to my gender.

I don't like the term girl gamer as it is being used to draw attention; it is nauseating as if it makes someone special to be female AND to play games.

I only ever once divulged my gender in a game lobby (Hawken) because I'd had one too many whiskeys and an opposition player made homophobic comments to a team mate / online friend (who knew my gender). It is a bit of a long and not very interesting story.
 
Here's my experience with the whole girl gamer thing.

I played games since around 5-8, tried different systems by accident, enjoyed them more than hanging out with kids, moved to a different country, ended up playing games again at the age of 10-11, discovered the internet around 13-14 and things really started around that age.

Before discovering the internet, I'd read magazines and see links to forums that were inviting for game minded people. I felt like sharing my passion somewhere and getting more involved. I've discovered some Nintendo forums and first lurked for a while instead of becoming a member straight away. What became apparent during that time is how girl gamers are talked about often like they didn't exist. This was really odd to me at the time, being told that I don't exist. So when creating an account, I ironically decided to call myself Girlgamer just to prove a point, that girls do in fact exist. It was a very sincere thought without hoping to get any attention out of it. To my surprise, I got TONS of attention. In my world people where very nice to me, welcoming, sweet and inviting. It was the best feeling ever. I never knew girl gamers were treated that way before. I never showed pics either, just the nickname was enough. Eventually I got used to that kind of attention, it was to be expected, kind of like demanding it in a way. Eventually though, random forum members wanted to meet me. I felt so odd to have people ask me that, from strangers nonetheless. I would make up excuses to not hurt their feelings. The reason was to protect myself, I might have been young, but I was very protective over any potential danger. Eventually I disappeared from those 2 forums due to all the pressure of showing up in person. It was hard to say no.

After around that time, I started growing up, noticing how games were very sexual in nature and started being bothered about how reading magazines felt very sexist at the time. They are game magazines, yet they showed pics of real women in bikini as a ''reward'' when male readers wrote something to the magazine, talked from a male perspective during news sections, mentioned the parties that were had during conventions and talking about the chick they got or jokes along those lines, having a topic dedicated to booth babes ranking, keep hitting on the female writers they had as a joke, showing some naked women through various ways once in a while. After a while, I seriously started feeling disgusted.

Being the naive child that I was, I decided to make it a mission to fight for equal representation, the female demographics being treated like part of the gaming demographic and all of that. I would seriously get so heated in forums, try to make it known that yes I am a girl and correct anyone that would refer to me as a he.

Now being 25, I've seen it all. Things have certainly improved, more girls are feeling comfortable to come out and talk about these things. The phase of me liking and expecting attention was a short lived one. Me having heated discussions on forums still happens, but it's less hostile, less frequent and I'm honestly tired of going on about it for too much. I'm honestly feeling relieved and happy to have more support and more girls discussing this topic on forums. Developers are more aware of female gamers even if it's still long ways to go until we are treated like any other gamers out there.

The moral of the story is, there are certainly girls who try to get attention by the fact that they play video games. Heck, a long time ago I used to get annoyed at the annoying ones without thinking too much about it. But not all girls who make themselves known do that out of attention. They do it because they want to make a statement.
 
^
Clearly you didn't read about the people who got banned over these type of comments in this thread. I would remove it quickly if I were you :(

Edit:

Too late...
 
Here's my experience with the whole girl gamer thing.

I played games since around 5-8, tried different systems by accident, enjoyed them more than hanging out with kids, moved to a different country, ended up playing games again at the age of 10-11, discovered the internet around 13-14 and things really started around that age.

Before discovering the internet, I'd read magazines and see links to forums that were inviting for game minded people. I felt like sharing my passion somewhere and getting more involved. I've discovered some Nintendo forums and first lurked for a while instead of becoming a member straight away. What became apparent during that time is how girl gamers are talked about often like they didn't exist. This was really odd to me at the time, being told that I don't exist. So when creating an account, I ironically decided to call myself Girlgamer just to prove a point, that girls do in fact exist. It was a very sincere thought without hoping to get any attention out of it. To my surprise, I got TONS of attention. In my world people where very nice to me, welcoming, sweet and inviting. It was the best feeling ever. I never knew girl gamers were treated that way before. I never showed pics either, just the nickname was enough. Eventually I got used to that kind of attention, it was to be expected, kind of like demanding it in a way. Eventually though, random forum members wanted to meet me. I felt so odd to have people ask me that, from strangers nonetheless. I would make up excuses to not hurt their feelings. The reason was to protect myself, I might have been young, but I was very protective over any potential danger. Eventually I disappeared from those 2 forums due to all the pressure of showing up in person. It was hard to say no.

After around that time, I started growing up, noticing how games were very sexual in nature and started being bothered about how reading magazines felt very sexist at the time. They are game magazines, yet they showed pics of real women in bikini as a ''reward'' when male readers wrote something to the magazine, talked from a male perspective during news sections, mentioned the parties that were had during conventions and talking about the chick they got or jokes along those lines, having a topic dedicated to booth babes ranking, keep hitting on the female writers they had as a joke, showing some naked women through various ways once in a while. After a while, I seriously started feeling disgusted.

Being the naive child that I was, I decided to make it a mission to fight for equal representation, the female demographics being treated like part of the gaming demographic and all of that. I would seriously get so heated in forums, try to make it known that yes I am a girl and correct anyone that would refer to me as a he.

Now being 25, I've seen it all. Things have certainly improved, more girls are feeling comfortable to come out and talk about these things. The phase of me liking and expecting attention was a short lived one. Me having heated discussions on forums still happens, but it's less hostile, less frequent and I'm honestly tired of going on about it for too much. I'm honestly feeling relieved and happy to have more support and more girls discussing this topic on forums. Developers are more aware of female gamers even if it's still long ways to go until we are treated like any other gamers out there.

The moral of the story is, there are certainly girls who try to get attention by the fact that they play video games. Heck, a long time ago I used to get annoyed at the annoying ones without thinking too much about it. But not all girls who make themselves known do that out of attention. They do it because they want to make a statement.

Hey, thanks for sharing that. I actually stopped gaming for about 10 years because of my ridiculous belief that it wasn't something a 'girl should do'. It's a huge relief to read posts like this and realise that not only is it something anyone can do but I'm also not alone.

It's all a bit OT now, but I can relate to the attention thing too. I wonder if it's a phase everyone goes through. It's part of the reason I don't 'self-declare' before a conversation has started. I get too easily freaked out and too easily 'polluted' by the numpties out there.
 
I honestly don't understand the problem with calling someone who enjoys playing video games a gamer.

'So, what do you guys do for fun?'
'I really like basketball.'
'I'm more of a skateboarder, really.'
'Snowboarder here!'
'I'm a huge reader, I love a good book.'
'Dancer. Loving dancing.'
'I'm a gamer myself.'

Why is gamer bad when it's literally just describing one of your favorite hobbies?

Cause I think it's a unnecessary label. I broadcast games (not too much these days) and I never called myself such on stream. Others on youtube/twitch called themselves the "something" Gamer , I'm not going to. No need for a title when it's pretty obvious what I'm doing.

If people want to call me a gamer that's fine lol, I'm not going to label myself.
 
I believe females of any age can be referred to informally as girls, especially by other females or a male of similar age. Whether or not it's offensive, I guess depends on the person and the context. Boy on the other hand is a noun used almost exclusively for males under 18 or pre-pubescent.

this.

Guys should stop overreacting when they find out there's a girl playing a game, and girls should stop placing themselves on the girlgamer pedestal as an excuse to get attention.

I don't mind the attention seeking if that's the case.
 
I don't think anyone would label themselves or define themselves as a TV viewer though. I just find it odd that if someone plays video games the "gamer" label gets attached so easily.

Well as Fiction said, there's plenty reason why it makes sense. If you write a lot, it makes sense to call yourself a writer. If you play an instrument, you're a musician. If you like to sing and do it a lot, you're a singer, etc.

Being called a gamer isn't or shouldn't be seen as a generalization or insult, it's something you enjoy doing and it's something you do often. That's why there's people who deem themselves casual gamers instead of gamers or hardcore gamers.

I have issues with being called a girl gamer because it's almost like saying games are reserved for guys and therefore we have to be put into a separate category for some reason when that shouldn't be the case.

As I and many other girls have said in here, we've been playing for years and some of us weren't even called girl gamers during that time. We were and still are gamers and there's nothing wrong with that (no matter your gender). So why does our gender get used to either hold us up on a pedestal or deem us of lesser importance than our male counterparts?
 
Honestly. If you were trying to design an OP to grey as many folks as possible then I don't think you could do a better job then what the OP did.

Given that most views from blokes would be sexist in nature and the moderation rules on this site. It was basically charge of the Light Brigade.

Relative the the term 'girl gamer'. I don't have a view either way. Folks can call themselves what they want.
 
Never said this. I did say that they are at an advantage on streaming sites by default due to their appearance. Don't really care about the specific reason for streaming. Just annoyed that if you took a few of the streams I follow and kept everything the same except swapped the average man/woman with a model then they wouldn't be struggling for partnership.

Go on to twitch basically any time of the day and essentially all the top streamers are young white males. It's not even fucking close.

In terms of people being able to make a decent living just from being attractive, well it's not like that's a new thing and it isn't exclusive to gaming (or being a girl).
 
Honestly. If you were trying to design an OP to grey as many folks as possible then I don't think you could do a better job then what the OP did.

Given that most views from blokes would be sexist in nature and the moderation rules on this site. It was basically charge of the Light Brigade.

Relative the the term 'girl gamer'. I don't have a view either way. Folks can call themselves what they want.

Thanks. I obviously spent hours on the OP as part of my master plan and didn't want to discuss the topic at all. I'm just glad that victory was swift and just.

(More importantly, I thought there was some good discussion too. My position's changed a bit as a result and I'm still thinking more broadly about the issues raised.)
 
Well as Fiction said, there's plenty reason why it makes sense. If you write a lot, it makes sense to call yourself a writer. If you play an instrument, you're a musician. If you like to sing and do it a lot, you're a singer, etc.

Being called a gamer isn't or shouldn't be seen as a generalization or insult, it's something you enjoy doing and it's something you do often. That's why there's people who deem themselves casual gamers instead of gamers or hardcore gamers.

I have issues with being called a girl gamer because it's almost like saying games are reserved for guys and therefore we have to be put into a separate category for some reason when that shouldn't be the case.

As I and many other girls have said in here, we've been playing for years and some of us weren't even called girl gamers during that time. We were and still are gamers and there's nothing wrong with that (no matter your gender). So why does our gender get used to either hold us up on a pedestal or deem us of lesser importance than our male counterparts?

I used to think that 'player' made more sense, in that somebody who views a television show is a viewer, and somebody who reads a book is a reader, but obviously 'player' has other connotations as well. The term I really dislike is using 'game' as in 'I gamed last night', but I think that's just a personal preference, it seems awkward to me. I play games, I don't 'game' in the same way that I didn't spend yesterday evening 'booking'.

Perhaps the problem is in people thinking that a description defines them, when it doesn't. I play games, swim rivers, read books, and enjoy trekking. I'm a regular gamer, swimmer, reader and trekker depending on which pastime I happen to be taking part in at the time, and, as an aside, each is probably a little more polite when being referred to in that way by service providers than 'customer' as they infer active engagement with the activity.

I wouldnt ever define myself as a gamer or swimmer as if it's something fundamental about me, it's just a shorthand description that works fine depending on context. When needing a term to describe a person or group that enjoys playing games, even if it's just a polite term for 'regular participants in x hobby' or 'consumers of x product', 'gamer' seems as reasonable a descriptive as any other.
 
Honestly. If you were trying to design an OP to grey as many folks as possible then I don't think you could do a better job then what the OP did.

Thanks. I obviously spent hours on the OP as part of my master plan and didn't want to discuss the topic at all. I'm just glad that victory was swift and just.

sploatee is a NeoGAF staff puppet/weapon designed to get as many people banned before E3 so that the servers might stay up ;_;
 
I always wondered why people care.

If you're a girl and you play games that's cool. I'm not going to go out of my way to call you a girl gamer or something stupid like that. You just play games and that's awesome.
 
Thanks. I obviously spent hours on the OP as part of my master plan and didn't want to discuss the topic at all. I'm just glad that victory was swift and just.

Yes. Borne to victory on the wings of the Valkyrie.

(More importantly, I thought there was some good discussion too. My position's changed a bit as a result and I'm still thinking more broadly about the issues raised.)[/QUOTE]

The reality is that a lot of folks can't give their true opinions on the subject without facing an immediate ban which does tend to narrow the responses to the topic somewhat.
 
I can't stand the ones who draw attention to themselves. I know a lot of guys give them the attention that they want but I can't do it. Even the "professional cosplayers" make me mad. I feel like they give women a bad name in the gaming community.
 
I can't stand the ones who draw attention to themselves. I know a lot of guys give them the attention that they want but I can't do it. Even the "professional cosplayers" make me mad. I feel like they give women a bad name in the gaming community.

What's wrong with cosplay?
 
Well, if their opinion is 'girl gamer=attention whore' there's not really a lot to discuss there.

First, there is a distinction that needs to be made here: between girls who play video games and the current topic which is the term "girl gamer"/"gurl gamer"/etc.
I think that girls who label themselves prominently as "girl gamers" are doing so to increase their popularity/view counts the same way boys who label themselves as "angry video game nerds"/"angry/raging gamer"/etc.
For example, Kaycetron seems to be very successful in leveraging the "gamer girl" stereotype to her advantage. I don't believe she represents girls who play video games. She just uses the term to get more views by acting(or "trolling") according to the stereotype.
A girl who plays video games isn't something special and I don't see a reason to draw more attention to the fact that she is a girl than to the video games themselves.
So basically I think the term "girl gamer" is usually used to draw attention.

Edit: So far I refrained from posting my opinion due to what cyberheater said.
 
If I stated my true thoughts on this subject I believe my GAF membership would be hanging by a thread. Like what Cyberheater stated above regarding opinions etc.

That's only the case if you can't express it without resorting to insults, bigotry, or completely ridiculous generalizations.
 
That's only the case if you can't express it without resorting to insults, bigotry, or completely ridiculous generalizations.

Let me just say that I have never been one for dressing up. And my description of
some
cosplayers or whatever you would call them would probably fall under vulgarity rules so I'll just keep it at that.
 
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