Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread 8: Put mii in, coach

Regarding the Chorus Kids:
He shut a lot of people up with his implementation of Little Mac, the Mii Fighters, and Pac-Man, so why not just wait and see what he did with the Chorus Kids?
See, I think Sakurai plans things out because people do not know what they want until they actual play it. Some ideas are bad and get thrown out quickly (Pichu), but others work. Marth became a fan favorite and stayed with the series. He has a vision for the Chorus Men and they will be fun to play. I did not know how Pac-Man would fight, but after the footage I seen ... I am totally going to play with him. Also, while I am not crazy about Shulk, he will probably be a good sword fighter. In short, I would say let Sakurai make his own game. If you want to nitpick it, then go somewhere else.
 
Could be. I am still going with my gut feeling we are only going to get 3 more characters until the 3DS release.

I just hope he doesn't do the slow unveil thing with other characters on the website once the 3DS version is out. Give it a week or two and then just show all of them.
 
qDxfc0X.jpg


Thought it was interesting.
 
Wonder if we'll have the every-once-in-awhile Friday reveal tonight.

Now that we have 3 full months until release (3 months as of tomorrow for japan), we could get 3 more veteran reveals. Probably non-unlockables.

Ganondorf, G&W, Rob, Ness, Captain Falcon, Jiggly have been unlockable either every time or most of the time, so they probably won't be revealed. I'm hoping Metaknight becomes unlockable so that kirby has an unlockable rep. Luigi is usually the mario franchise's unlockable, and I assume he will be here, too (but he was revealed for year of luigi).

That leaves Wario and Ice Climbers. Hoping they're each revealed before launch.
 
The voices of the community need to be unified behind a hastag or some other platform. Everyone is currently complaining online, but there really needs to be some unification behind the concerns so that the message can be effectively conveyed to Nintendo.

I wish if Prog posted more here. He'd be a good candidate to rally the troops with.
 
I think the air nerfs sound pretty bad, but hear me out on this alternative perspective. Just want to know what most people think is the focus on Melee, PM, and Brawl.

Would it be fair to say that the current meta is focused on the air? I think it is. You see many characters start something either with an aerial or with a grab. It isn't common seeing characters play on the ground, you would mostly see them using their ground stuff only for the kill, but even that is pretty rare with people using their air game to keep characters off stage.

So basically what I'm saying is this change (if unchanged till release) would mean a pretty big meta change as to how approaches and aerials are used. Though if the shield is too good, then it would be terrible.

I'm not saying you can't complain, or shouldn't, or not want change. Just looking at it in a way that where it won't change, but what it means.
 
Jumps retaining momentum is 100% fine in online for PM. I very seriously doubt they cut that out in Brawl because of online. I don't know how it works but that isn't a concern they should have at all. Smash hugely relies on tons of calculations for knockback and other physics-variables as it is. Momentum being retained during jumps would be such a small task to keep track of compared to everything else that the game has going on already.



Calling them 'whiners' doesn't make you look any better. You can keep that comment to yourself is all I'm saying. All you're doing is encouraging the idiocy.

I could keep it to myself. I choose not to. Difference is I'm not going to irrationally hate on a game that's in development still.
 
It's not about the graphical capabilities, the problem arises in Nana having her own AI. So it's not necessarily comparable to Chorus Men.


While this would be good as well, the monkeys are too generic for my tastes, its like adding Toad.

This doesn't make sense, this would mean that The Chior Kids are even more generic. The monkeys have different variations, the kids do not. Unless you count Marshal and his friends, which I'm fine with, because they to me are not the Chior Kids, I do not consider them the same characters.
 
This doesn't make sense, this would mean that The Chior Kids are even more generic. The monkeys have different variations, the kids do not. Unless you count Marshal and his friends, which I'm fine with, because they to me are not the Chior Kids, I do not consider them the same characters.
The Chorus Men are three characters. They're the Chorus Men. The chorus men in DS are the same ones in Wario Ware. Not generic. The monkeys are just various monkeys that show up. Once again, you don't seem to know what you're talking about.
 
I think the air nerfs sound pretty bad, but hear me out on this alternative perspective. Just want to know what most people think is the focus on Melee, PM, and Brawl.

Would it be fair to say that the current meta is focused on the air? I think it is. You see many characters start something either with an aerial or with a grab. It isn't common seeing characters play on the ground, you would mostly see them using their ground stuff only for the kill, but even that is pretty rare with people using their air game to keep characters off stage.

So basically what I'm saying is this change (if unchanged till release) would mean a pretty big meta change as to how approaches and aerials are used. Though if the shield is too good, then it would be terrible.

I'm not saying you can't complain, or shouldn't, or not want change. Just looking at it in a way that where it won't change, but what it means.

The only thing is, I don't think a meta change is desired. In fact, most seem hostile to it. I wish more people would just wait to get the final game in their hands before feeling the need to go starting a campaign over it.

I mean, not liking things we've seen in the demo is fine, as is bringing them to Sakurai's attention, but I'm of the persuasion to just get the finished product and adapt the way I play to it. I get that this may not be the way most people play or see Smash Bros., but that's how I come at it.

High landing lag is kinda bleh, as is limited dash canceling and so-so movement options, but they won't break the way I play. But again, this isn't a one size fits all issue.

Hopefully the finished product can appeal to everyone. But, and I'm not trying to instigate here I swear, maybe everyone should just be a little more easygoing about it and if the final draft isn't perfect down to every frame, we can just forget about that and all enjoy it together.
 
I think the air nerfs sound pretty bad, but hear me out on this alternative perspective. Just want to know what most people think is the focus on Melee, PM, and Brawl.

Would it be fair to say that the current meta is focused on the air? I think it is. You see many characters start something either with an aerial or with a grab. It isn't common seeing characters play on the ground, you would mostly see them using their ground stuff only for the kill, but even that is pretty rare with people using their air game to keep characters off stage.

So basically what I'm saying is this change (if unchanged till release) would mean a pretty big meta change as to how approaches and aerials are used. Though if the shield is too good, then it would be terrible.

I'm not saying you can't complain, or shouldn't, or not want change. Just looking at it in a way that where it won't change, but what it means.

I definitely felt like the game wanted me to play on the ground, in 1 dimension. I felt like I gained no advantage (as link) by jumping to pull out my bomb or throw my boomerang. In fact, i felt like just staying on the ground and doing it had less of a penalty.

This could be because the game is now being balanced for the 'For Glory' mode and for Final Destination stages.
 
Marshal is not a chorus kid, they look similar but there are subtle differences which is why there was initially some debate whether the leaker got things mixed up, but with the Pokémon X/Y info we can assume he was given a list rather than saw things so confusing one white guy with another white guy is unlikely.
 
Does anyone want to create a seperate thread with links to all three Gematsu leaks so we can fully discuss the final roster?

Since its pretty much confirmed at this point (it was pretty much confirmed when the leak said Wii Fit Trainer) I feel like a full thread is needed. I would do it, but being on an iPad 1 its hard to copy and paste links without it contantly refreshing the page or even crashing ugh.

With how much hype every newcomer and even veteran reveal, I find it odd not more people are talking anout the last three newcomers...

Anywayz: I guess I lost that Ridley bet, now that its even more confirmed that the leak is all the characters we get. Whoever I betted, pm me the avatar you want me to use since I might miss it in this thread.

I really like all the newcomers revealed today. Love Palutena, and after seeing Pac-Man I want to main him so hard. Only thing I don't like is in bith the newcomer trailers, I'm pretty sure it shows custom moves being used. Makes it hard to tell what each actual move set is. As someone who is specifically playing random online, its annoying.

I sadly, don't really count Mii as a real character. Want to use em, but obviously they are banned with randoms. Maybe with some friend matches.
 
Have you thought about posting the suggested change list we made in FGW? Once we finalize a list for Sakurai, we should give it its own thread.

Maybe we should also request an adjustable "speed" setting for the gameplay. That would be fun for casuals and would make the competitive community happy.

IMO, it's important to keep the changes as minimal as possible. If it's just a few things, there's a bigger chance of them being done.
 
I think the air nerfs sound pretty bad, but hear me out on this alternative perspective. Just want to know what most people think is the focus on Melee, PM, and Brawl.

Would it be fair to say that the current meta is focused on the air? I think it is. You see many characters start something either with an aerial or with a grab. It isn't common seeing characters play on the ground, you would mostly see them using their ground stuff only for the kill, but even that is pretty rare with people using their air game to keep characters off stage.

So basically what I'm saying is this change (if unchanged till release) would mean a pretty big meta change as to how approaches and aerials are used. Though if the shield is too good, then it would be terrible.

I'm not saying you can't complain, or shouldn't, or not want change. Just looking at it in a way that where it won't change, but what it means.

I wish we could just have a huge 1 on 1 with Samurai, where he just goes in-depth on some of these changes (assuming any of them are final). He doesn't just do this without reason, thoughts go into all of his decisions to change things, and I'd like some insight from him. Unfortunately as the competitive crowd we are in the minority, and when journalist ask him question, they are fucking stupid ones.
 
Does anyone want to create a seperate thread with links to all three Gematsu leaks so we can fully discuss the final roster?

I would be cool with a thread about roster predictions. I am making people mad predicting who got cut. ;)

Also, the roster selection would have to change due to Mii being banned in "With Anyone" mode. If I had to guess, most friend matches have 4 rows, the Miis take 3 and the random button 1 below. When "With Anyone" Mode, the Random Button takes up all 4 rows.
 
I wish we could just have a huge 1 on 1 with Samurai, where he just goes in-depth on some of these changes (assuming any of them are final). He doesn't just do this without reason, thoughts go into all of his decisions to change things, and I'd like some insight from him. Unfortunately as the competitive crowd we are in the minority, and when journalist ask him question, they are fucking stupid ones.

It was way more important that a competitive Smash Bros. player tell Sakurai he can tell him how to fix the game than ask him a question.
 
The only thing is, I don't think a meta change is desired. In fact, most seem hostile to it. I wish more people would just wait to get the final game in their hands before feeling the need to go starting a campaign over it.

I mean, not liking things we've seen in the demo is fine, as is bringing them to Sakurai's attention, but I'm of the persuasion to just get the finished product and adapt the way I play to it. I get that this may not be the way most people play or see Smash Bros., but that's how I come at it.

High landing lag is kinda bleh, as is limited dash canceling and so-so movement options, but they won't break the way I play. But again, this isn't a one size fits all issue.

Hopefully the finished product can appeal to everyone. But, and I'm not trying to instigate here I swear, maybe everyone should just be a little more easygoing about it and if the final draft isn't perfect down to every frame, we can just forget about that and all enjoy it together.

Here's the way I look at it: if we say nothing, the game is likely to stay the way it is. If we say something and bring a minor suggestion (i.e run -> crouch as an option, which could benefit Sakurai's vision for the game) then the game could become better. It could *only* become better if we voiced some concerns in a calm and collected manner.

Unfortunately, people are more ready to lash out than take a few days to mull over it and come up with a good way to give feedback to Nintendo.

Actually, personally, I just want to relay feedback to them. That's all I want to do. Whether they take it or not, is not my concern. My concern is whether I'm heard. I just want to be heard, have them consider it, and if they don't go through with it well... we tried!

Initial reactions are always going to be hostile. People have to relax and once they have I think people will be more willing to come together and realize we need a very small list of intuitive movement options in the game. Again, think stuff like run -> crouch rather than something as "outlandish" as wavedashing.
 
I'm not objecting to Chrom being in the game, but with that said, how would they implement another sword-user into the game who will be unique in his own way?

Shulk can obviously use his battle arts and monado powers. No issue here.

Finally, the Chorus Kids is a character(s) I'd want in Smash4 but wouldn't really know how they would get around using a 3-part character. However, I can see a single Chorus Kid (or Marshall) who's 2D like G&W and can utilize various items (and maybe characters) in his own moveset.
 
I didn't know Sheik was in the 3DS demo.

Do we know her Final Smash yet?

Edit: Haha Luigi's FS is awesome!

Edit 2: Aaaaand my question is answered. Same one.
 
Anyone knows if the controls are customizable for the 3DS version? Or is it safe to assume it is?

I much rather shield be L and grab be R.

Edit: E3 demo has shield as R and grab as L, which is not that convenient IMO.
 
Golden Plains is quite cool. Pauses for a bit then scrolls to the next bit, then pauses again and then scrolls.
 
Smash hardcore fans should go and play Melee if that's what they like. They could never be satisfied anyways.

Stop saying this, please, for the love of God. >_<

They *can* be satisfied.

I will just freaking quote my post I made earlier.

This is the kind of shit that's toxic. Stop it, you're not being any better than the people who are being overreactionary.

Look, let me explain this again: it has nothing to do with making the game like Melee. Melee is just the closest, no, the pinnacle example of a competitive game in the Smash series. People compare to it because they really don't know what to describe in it that makes it so good for competition. They just use it as an example because it's quick and easy. Oh and I should clarify, by they I mean the low-mid level players that are shitposting on smashboards and r/smashbros. The people who actually compete at tournaments could describe it very easily, describe what they'd want out of Smash 4 without using the word 'Melee'.

Let me tell you what makes Melee competitive: movement options out the wazoo. Your dash/run can be stopped by crouching, this gives you access to both your down smash and down tilt as approach options. From a crouch, you could then switch to standing instead and use a different tilt or even a different smash attack. That is just one example of the kind of movement option that makes Melee what it is. And that, again, is not even wavedashing. It is an intuitive option that even a casual player can benefit from knowing, just as much as a casual player benefits from being able to shield the end of their run to gain access to their grounded moves.

And I guarantee you that run -> crouch was intentionally programmed in Melee, just like run -> shield works in all the games. It's something you can do out of your run just like you can do an Usmash out of your run with the C-stick. It doesn't hurt casual players at all to have this option in the game yet Sakurai took it out.

All people want are intuitive, non-glitch, movement options. And an ability to use those options to expand the game at a higher level -- whether that's through combos, mind games, etc etc. That is seriously it. And if you somehow have qualms with people being able to crouch out of their run, you have some serious issues on this.

Again, that is just one example of a movement option. Another example that wouldn't hurt casual players is one that exists in all platformers: momentum being carried from your run into your jump. What that does is it allows characters with faster running speeds to leap across the stage to approach a character. What happens right now in Brawl and seemingly Smash 4 is this momentum is not carried and therefore your character essentially is awkwardly moving in the air as if they just jumped from a standing position. It is logical physics, as well, because when you run in any platformer (hell, even Mario games) you carry the momentum from your jump. It was amazing to have this in Melee and not just because it was in Melee but because every character could make use of it and it helped them in various ways to put up an offense on someone.

But it seems to be absent from Smash 4, again. Taking that particular option out only hurts characters that have speed built-in with them in mind such as Captain Falcon, Fox, Sonic, etc etc. You might say that's a good thing but again look at how Captain Falcon was in Brawl. He was terrible. A large part of that was because of the lack of this option existing in Brawl. Secondly, it might appear good because it makes the fast characters on the same playing field as the slower characters but in actuality the slower characters could make use of it this just as much. Characters like Mario, DK, and even Ganondorf had really good approach options just from this physics-related option that was in the game. And you can even see how they benefit from this in Project M, as PM re-added it.

If you have zero understanding of what makes competitive Smash, you shouldn't shit on people who do. There are definitely people who are overreacting and expressing themselves on gut reactions because they really don't want a game that will likely not advance the community forward. People want to like and play this game seriously but they can't if the game doesn't offer these kinds of options and from what people played and saw, the options aren't there. It's frustrating to, once again, not get heard from the developer of the series you love. You think after all these years, with so much tournament footage available on Youtube, they would have an understanding of what the competitive players are looking for: intuitive movement options.

I hope this post has been enlightening to some degree because man, I am so tired of posts like the above. It is not healthy for the entire community whatsoever. If you have nothing good to say, don't say it at all.

That is *all* it takes to make everyone happy. I am serious. Those things are important to have and would make the game play better for you, too.

Edit: An example of a comp. Melee player who went to E3 and had hands-on time with the game: https://twitter.com/tafokints/status/477147732763627520

He feels the *exact* same way as I described above. They can be satisfied.
 
Beetle is 1hitKO
V0sVMmX.gif


poltergust final smash:
4kod2PX.gif


Light arrow:
NMPRXAs.gif


Weegeeeee:
UxHhEYF.gif


Grenade vacuum:
pvo8ARJ.gif


jetpack also hits opponents on top of you when it's done.
 
Something I noticed: Mega Man's final smash before the cutscene is Black Hole Bomb from MM9. The weight of constant cancellations have collapsed on itself and created a soul-crushing singularity of despair.

My hype for the 3DS version currently surpasses that of the Wii U version. Cannot wait for it and I hear only good things about how it controls

I wasn't super thrilled for the 3DS version until they showed equipment and items and clarified that all of that *will* carry over. I'm still more excited for the Wii U version, but 3DS went from day eventually to day one.
 
It was way more important that a competitive Smash Bros. player tell Sakurai he can tell him how to fix the game than ask him a question.

That guy went about it the wrong way, and represented the community terribly. Part of me wishes Sakurai said yes and kicked his ass, but I've seen him play Smash and know that probably wouldn't have happened lol. Some people are saying it was a light hearted joke, but you can never tell with this community.

To me, it is incredibly disrespectful to act like you can tell Sakurai how to do his job, or do a better job than he can. Especially if you have no experience in such a field.

Sakurai has never directed a terrible Smash game, regardless of what anyone thinks of Brawl. When people are in line for 2 hours to play your game for 2 minutes, then you're doing something right. I don't always agree with his decisions, but am always interested in his logic behind them. Even if they're a bit much lol.

If you can't tell I like Samurai more than I should. And love all the Smashes.
 
Top Bottom